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Re: [NH] Special Characters: Sanskrit!

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  • Ian Rastall
    ... There are two different Unicode numbers on that chart. The first is in hexidecimal, and the second is in decimal. You want the one that s in decimal. So
    Message 1 of 24 , May 31, 2002
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      On Fri, 31 May 2002 15:00:22 -0400, you wrote:

      >By using the codes on http://www.fsnow.com/pali/fonts/roman-table/, I can
      >find the characters I need!
      >However, for example, an A with a Macron on top is 0100. But if I put in
      >d I get the letter "d."

      There are two different Unicode numbers on that chart. The first is in
      hexidecimal, and the second is in decimal. You want the one that's in
      decimal. So the A with a macron would be Ā

      HTH
      Ian
      --
      Mixture Mild in a Bjarne...wait, wait,
      I ain't got a Bjarne. The bjarne's where
      I keep my gjoats. (Kendal)

      http://www.aspipes.org/
    • Albert (athiel)
      Christine, I suspect that the reason is that you are using the Western collation in the browser so that regular English text comes out normally but that does
      Message 2 of 24 , Jun 1, 2002
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        Christine,

        I suspect that the reason is that you are using the Western collation in
        the browser so that regular English text comes out normally but that
        does not let the Sanskrit or Pali characters appear the way they should.

        You could try using CSS and create Divisions or Spans in which you use
        the Sanskrit and define that Span or Div as using whatever the ISO
        number is for the font you are using and set the Div and or spans for
        the English to ISO Western European. I am not sure that it will work but
        with CSS so much can be done that it is worth a try I think.

        Good books on CSS can be found at Barnes or Borders, or some other large
        store. I use Core CSS2.

        The alternative is to make your characters gifs or bmp's or images and
        then just place them on the page as img's

        FWIW

        Albert





        -----Original Message-----
        From: Christine F. Muehling [mailto:CF_Muehling@...]
        Sent: Friday, May 31, 2002 8:00 PM
        To: ntb-html@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: RE: [NH] Special Characters: Sanskrit!


        Well.
        I'm stumped.
        I've installed every Unicode set I can find. I've installed every font
        that supposedly handles Sanskrit letters I can find (27 at last count).
        No matter how I set up the Unicode numbers they don't work. I have had
        some luck where the Unicode didn't give me the letter it said it was,
        but it did give me something else I needed!

        Most of them default to an ASCII number (Alt+xxxx) or are just squares.
        Some of them offer me ASCII numbers that although I'm looking at a D
        with an underdot, the ASCII code it offers (and the description at the
        bottom) is that of another character.

        <sigh>
        Kill me -- or any thoughts first?

        Christine





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        http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
      • Christine F. Muehling
        Just wanted you to know that although I m getting NOWHERE with the Sanskrit special characters, I m LOVING the CSS! I m going to be working to fine tune this
        Message 3 of 24 , Jun 4, 2002
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          Just wanted you to know that although I'm getting NOWHERE with the Sanskrit
          special characters, I'm LOVING the CSS!
          I'm going to be working to fine tune this for the entire site. What a
          blessing!

          Now.... any one know how to create oh, say, a block of information in one
          file, like the credits links or stuff like that. Then to simply add a code
          reference into the 100s of other pages so I don't have to reenter it on all
          of them? I could update that one block of text and it would automatically
          show on the subsequent pages? Am I dreaming?

          Thanks!

          Christine

          -----Original Message-----
          From: Christine [mailto:CF_Muehling@...]
          Sent: Thursday, May 30, 2002 13:13
          To: NoteTab HTML
          Subject: [NH] Special Characters: Sanskrit!


          Does anyone know where I can find the HTML coding for these?
          I would even settle for a Character Set so I could create documents, then
          upload images of them, but I'd prefer to use the HTML codes.

          I know someone was working hard on character clips. Did it happen to
          include Sanskrit?

          Thanks,
          Christine


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
        • stephen riddle
          Hi Christine, There are ways and ways and ways. . . One way: use server side includes. This is very good if your webHost supports it. (I am not an expert but
          Message 4 of 24 , Jun 4, 2002
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            Hi Christine,
            There are ways and ways and ways. . .
            One way: use server side includes. This is very good if your webHost supports
            it. (I am not an expert but ther are lots of them on the list.) What this
            would do is to include other documents into the html page.
            Another way is to use the iframe html element which works for Netscape 5+ and
            IE 5+ and Opera 5+, Netscape 4 (with lots of users) would use its proprietary
            layer (or ilayer) element.
            Modern browsers (with varying degrees of success) also can use another
            document for the source of a div, or use another document for the source of
            an object element.
            I have ended up using a externalJavascript file and the document.write
            statement to insert easily editable stuff into a wide variety of pages. This
            works well for a lot of short discrete statements, but would not be any fun
            at all for large blocks of text. (eMail me private if you'd like to look at
            the site I use this for, and specifics on how I do it.)
            Good luck,
            Stephen
            > Now.... any one know how to create oh, say, a block of information in one
            > file, like the credits links or stuff like that. Then to simply add a code
            > reference into the 100s of other pages so I don't have to reenter it on all
            > of them? I could update that one block of text and it would automatically
            > show on the subsequent pages? Am I dreaming?
            >
            > Thanks!
            >
            > Christine
            >
          • Ian Rastall
            ... Hi Christine. Here s something I just wrote to test out the sanskrit stuff at (http://www.fsnow.com/pali/fonts/roman-table/) :
            Message 5 of 24 , Jun 5, 2002
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              On Tue, 04 Jun 2002 17:16:58 -0400, you wrote:

              >Just wanted you to know that although I'm getting NOWHERE with the Sanskrit
              >special characters

              Hi Christine. Here's something I just wrote to test out the sanskrit
              stuff at (http://www.fsnow.com/pali/fonts/roman-table/) :

              <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN"
              "http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-transitional.dtd">
              <html xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml">
              <head>
              <title>Unicode Sanskrit Stuff</title>
              <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8" />
              <body>
              <p>Ñ ñ Ā ā Ī ī Ś ś Ū
              ū Ḍ ḍ Ḥ ḥ Ḷ ḷ Ṃ ṃ
              Ṅ ṅ Ṇ ṇ Ṛ ṛ Ṣ ṣ
              Ṭ ṭ</p>
              </body>
              </html>

              All the numbers between 200 and 400 worked, and all the numbers
              between 7000 and 8000 didn't work. I'm using Win 2000, IE 5.0.

              Don't know what else to say. You might want to investigate "embedded
              fonts". That would be the first place I'd look.

              >Now.... any one know how to create oh, say, a block of information in one
              >file, like the credits links or stuff like that. Then to simply add a code
              >reference into the 100s of other pages so I don't have to reenter it on all
              >of them?

              The simplest way is to use SSI (Server Side Includes). You have to
              find out if your ISP allows it, though most do.

              Take the part of your file you want to appear in all files, and remove
              it, putting it on its own as a text file. Name the file, say, foo.txt.

              Then in its place, on all pages, write:

              <!--#include file="foo.txt" -->

              or, if it's in a directory different than the file,

              <!--#include virtual "../foo.txt" -->

              or

              <!--#include virtual "bar/foo.txt" -->

              or whatever. There are other includes, but those are the two basic
              ones.

              Once you decide to use includes, you have to change your .html
              extensions to .shtml

              Some ISP's will let you keep your .html extension by changing the
              htacess doohickey in your web folder, but ask them about that.
              Basically, you have to test to see if you have SSI on your server. Try
              doing one, with an .shtml extension. If it doesn't work, write to
              them. Ask them if they allow Server Side Includes.

              HTH
              Ian
              --
              If you're smoking Barbary Coast, you're already smoking well.
              But if you're smoking Borkum Riff or something like gooseberry-Oreo-creme,
              then you're in my prayers. (Ronald S. Ipock)

              http://www.aspipes.org/
            • Wright, John - Textron Financial
              Stephen, I, too, am looking for a ISP/browser independent method of including the same code in multiple web pages. I would be interested in seeing an example
              Message 6 of 24 , Jun 5, 2002
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                Stephen,

                I, too, am looking for a ISP/browser independent method of including the
                same code in multiple web pages. I would be interested in seeing an example
                of your "externalJavascript file and the document.write statement" method.

                -----Original Message-----
                From: stephen riddle [mailto:stephen@...]
                Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 12:26 AM
                To: ntb-html@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: Re: [NH] Special Characters: Sanskrit! and other wishes.


                Hi Christine,
                There are ways and ways and ways. . .
                One way: use server side includes. This is very good if your webHost
                supports
                it. (I am not an expert but ther are lots of them on the list.) What this

                would do is to include other documents into the html page.
                Another way is to use the iframe html element which works for Netscape 5+
                and
                IE 5+ and Opera 5+, Netscape 4 (with lots of users) would use its
                proprietary
                layer (or ilayer) element.
                Modern browsers (with varying degrees of success) also can use another
                document for the source of a div, or use another document for the source of
                an object element.
                I have ended up using a externalJavascript file and the document.write
                statement to insert easily editable stuff into a wide variety of pages. This

                works well for a lot of short discrete statements, but would not be any fun
                at all for large blocks of text. (eMail me private if you'd like to look at
                the site I use this for, and specifics on how I do it.)
                Good luck,
                Stephen
                > Now.... any one know how to create oh, say, a block of information in one
                > file, like the credits links or stuff like that. Then to simply add a
                code
                > reference into the 100s of other pages so I don't have to reenter it on
                all
                > of them? I could update that one block of text and it would automatically
                > show on the subsequent pages? Am I dreaming?
                >
                > Thanks!
                >
                > Christine
                >

                Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
                <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
              • Don Passenger
                A page might look like this:
                Message 7 of 24 , Jun 5, 2002
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                  A page might look like this:
                  <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN"
                  "http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-transitional.dtd">
                  <html xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml">
                  <head>
                  <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1" />
                  <meta name="generator" content="NoteTab Pro" />
                  <title>*** External JavaScript Footer ***</title>
                  </head>
                  <body>

                  <h3>How to Get a Boiler Plate Footer</h3>

                  <p>First: you need a page.</p>

                  <p>Second: you need a javascript file.</p>


                  <p align="center">
                  <script language="JavaScript">
                  document.write('<script language="JavaScript" src="temp.js"><\/SCRIPT>');
                  </script>
                  <script language="JavaScript">
                  printMessage();
                  </script>
                  </p>
                  </body>
                  </html>

                  --
                  Don Passenger
                  mailto:dpasseng@...
                  home: http://www.iserv.net/~dpasseng
                  work: http://www.grcourt.org
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: "Wright, John - Textron Financial" <JWright@...>
                  To: <ntb-html@yahoogroups.com>
                  Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 7:31 AM
                  Subject: RE: [NH] Special Characters: Sanskrit! and other wishes.


                  > Stephen,
                  >
                  > I, too, am looking for a ISP/browser independent method of including the
                  > same code in multiple web pages. I would be interested in seeing an
                  example
                  > of your "externalJavascript file and the document.write statement" method.
                • Don Passenger
                  Your External JS file might look like this: function printMessage() { document.write ( Hey this footer will appear ); } -- Don Passenger
                  Message 8 of 24 , Jun 5, 2002
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                    Your External JS file might look like this:
                    function printMessage() {
                    document.write ("Hey this footer will appear");
                    }

                    --
                    Don Passenger
                    mailto:dpasseng@...
                    home: http://www.iserv.net/~dpasseng
                    work: http://www.grcourt.org
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: "Wright, John - Textron Financial" <JWright@...>
                    To: <ntb-html@yahoogroups.com>
                    Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 7:31 AM
                    Subject: RE: [NH] Special Characters: Sanskrit! and other wishes.


                    > Stephen,
                    >
                    > I, too, am looking for a ISP/browser independent method of including the
                    > same code in multiple web pages. I would be interested in seeing an
                    example
                    > of your "externalJavascript file and the document.write statement" method.
                  • Christine F. Muehling
                    I tried your code, but only got the first 10 characters, then they become boxes. I ve looked at your page before, which is where I got the codes I ve
                    Message 9 of 24 , Jun 5, 2002
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                      I tried your code, but only got the first 10 characters, then they become
                      boxes. <sigh>
                      I've looked at your page before, which is where I got the codes I've been
                      testing.
                      I tried the Unicode format on all of the alpha/numeric codes (x.....;)
                      but got nice squares, the x, then the alpha/numeric code and a final
                      semicolon.

                      I got the hang of SSI right away. I will be changing my pages to shtml with
                      a bunch of redirect scripts. <sigh> But what the heck, right!?

                      Thanks for trying to help, Ian. This is a toughie.

                      Christine


                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: Ian Rastall [mailto:idrastall@...]
                      Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 03:31
                      To: ntb-html@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: Re: [NH] Special Characters: Sanskrit! and other wishes.


                      On Tue, 04 Jun 2002 17:16:58 -0400, you wrote:

                      >Just wanted you to know that although I'm getting NOWHERE with the Sanskrit
                      >special characters

                      Hi Christine. Here's something I just wrote to test out the sanskrit
                      stuff at (http://www.fsnow.com/pali/fonts/roman-table/) :

                      <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN"
                      "http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-transitional.dtd">
                      <html xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml">
                      <head>
                      <title>Unicode Sanskrit Stuff</title>
                      <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8" />
                      <body>
                      <p>Ñ ñ Ā ā Ī ī Ś ś Ū
                      ū Ḍ ḍ Ḥ ḥ Ḷ ḷ Ṃ ṃ
                      Ṅ ṅ Ṇ ṇ Ṛ ṛ Ṣ ṣ
                      Ṭ ṭ</p>
                      </body>
                      </html>

                      All the numbers between 200 and 400 worked, and all the numbers
                      between 7000 and 8000 didn't work. I'm using Win 2000, IE 5.0.

                      Don't know what else to say. You might want to investigate "embedded
                      fonts". That would be the first place I'd look.

                      >Now.... any one know how to create oh, say, a block of information in one
                      >file, like the credits links or stuff like that. Then to simply add a code
                      >reference into the 100s of other pages so I don't have to reenter it on all
                      >of them?

                      The simplest way is to use SSI (Server Side Includes). You have to
                      find out if your ISP allows it, though most do.

                      Take the part of your file you want to appear in all files, and remove
                      it, putting it on its own as a text file. Name the file, say, foo.txt.

                      Then in its place, on all pages, write:

                      <!--#include file="foo.txt" -->

                      or, if it's in a directory different than the file,

                      <!--#include virtual "../foo.txt" -->

                      or

                      <!--#include virtual "bar/foo.txt" -->

                      or whatever. There are other includes, but those are the two basic
                      ones.

                      Once you decide to use includes, you have to change your .html
                      extensions to .shtml

                      Some ISP's will let you keep your .html extension by changing the
                      htacess doohickey in your web folder, but ask them about that.
                      Basically, you have to test to see if you have SSI on your server. Try
                      doing one, with an .shtml extension. If it doesn't work, write to
                      them. Ask them if they allow Server Side Includes.

                      HTH
                      Ian
                      --
                      If you're smoking Barbary Coast, you're already smoking well.
                      But if you're smoking Borkum Riff or something like gooseberry-Oreo-creme,
                      then you're in my prayers. (Ronald S. Ipock)

                      http://www.aspipes.org/
                    • Ian Rastall
                      ... I got the boxes too. This really goes beyond my level. Perhaps if you did something with embedded fonts, that might work. Never tried them myself, but as
                      Message 10 of 24 , Jun 5, 2002
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                        On Wed, 05 Jun 2002 22:54:19 -0400, you wrote:

                        >I tried your code, but only got the first 10 characters, then they become
                        >boxes. <sigh>

                        I got the boxes too. This really goes beyond my level. Perhaps if you
                        did something with embedded fonts, that might work. Never tried them
                        myself, but as far as I know, they're font packages that you attach to
                        your HTML, which the user downloads the first time they view the page.
                        Here's a few links:

                        http://hotwired.lycos.com/webmonkey/98/01/index3a.html?tw=design

                        http://builder.cnet.com/webbuilding/pages/Authoring/Typography/ss01.html

                        http://www.devshed.com/Client_Side/DHTML/EmbeddedFonts/page1.html

                        HTH
                        Ian
                        --
                        If you're smoking Barbary Coast, you're already smoking well.
                        But if you're smoking Borkum Riff or something like gooseberry-Oreo-creme,
                        then you're in my prayers. (Ronald S. Ipock)

                        http://www.aspipes.org/
                      • Christine F. Muehling
                        I was going to ask more about embedded fonts. I know what they are in a regular document... I was considering making graphics of the words, but my page alone
                        Message 11 of 24 , Jun 6, 2002
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                          I was going to ask more about embedded fonts. I know what they are in a
                          regular document...

                          I was considering making graphics of the words, but my page alone has 100s
                          of Sanskrit words on it. I have other priorities with this site. But it
                          does disappoint me! The darned letters I need the most (h, n, and m
                          under/overdot) are the ones I can't find or make work.

                          I'll experiment with the embedded fonts and keep you posted!
                          Thanks for helping, Ian! (everyone!)

                          Christine

                          -----Original Message-----
                          From: Ian Rastall [mailto:idrastall@...]
                          Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2002 00:04
                          To: ntb-html@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: Re: [NH] Special Characters: Sanskrit! and other wishes.


                          On Wed, 05 Jun 2002 22:54:19 -0400, you wrote:

                          >I tried your code, but only got the first 10 characters, then they become
                          >boxes. <sigh>

                          I got the boxes too. This really goes beyond my level. Perhaps if you
                          did something with embedded fonts, that might work. Never tried them
                          myself, but as far as I know, they're font packages that you attach to
                          your HTML, which the user downloads the first time they view the page.
                          Here's a few links:

                          http://hotwired.lycos.com/webmonkey/98/01/index3a.html?tw=design

                          http://builder.cnet.com/webbuilding/pages/Authoring/Typography/ss01.html

                          http://www.devshed.com/Client_Side/DHTML/EmbeddedFonts/page1.html

                          HTH
                          Ian
                          --
                        • Christine F. Muehling
                          You re kidding.. Between your two messages to the list it seems you ve taken much of the mystery out of it! I m going to give this a shot, too. Are there
                          Message 12 of 24 , Jun 6, 2002
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                            You're kidding..
                            Between your two messages to the list it seems you've taken much of the
                            mystery out of it!

                            I'm going to give this a shot, too.
                            Are there advantages of using this over the simple SSI text files?

                            Christine

                            -----Original Message-----
                            From: Don Passenger [mailto:dpasseng@...]
                            Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 09:33
                            To: ntb-html@yahoogroups.com
                            Subject: Re: [NH] Special Characters: Sanskrit! and other wishes.


                            Your External JS file might look like this:
                            function printMessage() {
                            document.write ("Hey this footer will appear");
                            }

                            --
                            Don Passenger
                          • Don Passenger
                            The advantages of using javascript for boilerplate insertion are: 1. that it works if you don t have ssi/php/asp/etc as a alternative 2. you can preview it on
                            Message 13 of 24 , Jun 6, 2002
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                              The advantages of using javascript for boilerplate insertion are:
                              1. that it works if you don't have ssi/php/asp/etc as a alternative
                              2. you can preview it on your own machine (vs the others which need to be
                              parsed on the server)

                              The disadvantage are:
                              1. that if javascript is disabled (which it generally isn't -- but with
                              pop-up's some disable it) you don't get the boilerplate
                              2. its a programming language thing that might be more confusing than a
                              simple include

                              --
                              Don Passenger
                              mailto:dpasseng@...
                              home: http://www.iserv.net/~dpasseng
                              work: http://www.grcourt.org
                              ----- Original Message -----
                              From: "Christine F. Muehling" <CF_Muehling@...>
                              To: <ntb-html@yahoogroups.com>
                              Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2002 12:18 PM
                              Subject: RE: [NH] Special Characters: Sanskrit! and other wishes.


                              > You're kidding..
                              > Between your two messages to the list it seems you've taken much of the
                              > mystery out of it!
                              >
                              > I'm going to give this a shot, too.
                              > Are there advantages of using this over the simple SSI text files?
                              >
                              > Christine
                              >
                              > -----Original Message-----
                              > From: Don Passenger [mailto:dpasseng@...]
                              > Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 09:33
                              > To: ntb-html@yahoogroups.com
                              > Subject: Re: [NH] Special Characters: Sanskrit! and other wishes.
                              >
                              >
                              > Your External JS file might look like this:
                              > function printMessage() {
                              > document.write ("Hey this footer will appear");
                              > }
                              >
                              > --
                              > Don Passenger
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                              >
                              >
                            • Ian Rastall
                              ... I agree about the disadvantage. The thing about anything server-side, is that you know up front if you can use it. For instance, if your server allows PHP,
                              Message 14 of 24 , Jun 6, 2002
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                                On Thu, 6 Jun 2002 12:30:16 -0400, you wrote:

                                >The advantages of using javascript for boilerplate insertion are:
                                >1. that it works if you don't have ssi/php/asp/etc as a alternative
                                >2. you can preview it on your own machine (vs the others which need to be
                                >parsed on the server)
                                >
                                >The disadvantage are:
                                >1. that if javascript is disabled (which it generally isn't -- but with
                                >pop-up's some disable it) you don't get the boilerplate
                                >2. its a programming language thing that might be more confusing than a
                                >simple include

                                I agree about the disadvantage. The thing about anything server-side,
                                is that you know up front if you can use it. For instance, if your
                                server allows PHP, then you know you can use PHP, and all your users
                                will be able to see it. Same with SSI. As long as SSI is allowed on
                                your server, it will always work for every user. Not everyone uses JS
                                (although it's not as much of an issue as it used to be).

                                I don't think it's a JS vs. SSI thing, I think it's a client-side vs.
                                server-side thing, and I would tend more towards server-side (if I
                                knew any bloody server-side languages.) :)

                                Ian
                                --
                                That's just my Buzzian theory. (Buzz Ruppelt)

                                http://www.aspipes.org/
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