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Re: [NTO] Mail to a List

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  • Greg Chapman
    Hi Ray, ... I wonder if you are recommending that they visit the Yahoo web site, and signup via that. That can present hurdles for the computer naive as it
    Message 1 of 13 , Jun 1, 2007
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      Hi Ray,

      On 01 Jun 07 19:33 Ray Shapp <ras45@...> said:
      > others will not
      > navigate successfully the hurdles that Yahoo imposes

      I wonder if you are recommending that they visit the Yahoo web site,
      and signup via that. That can present hurdles for the computer naive
      as it forces you into the business of registering for all the web
      services provided by YahooGroups (photos, files, calendar, polls,
      etc).

      However, even the most un-netsavvy should be able to send an email to:

      <listname>-subscribe@yahoogroups.com

      and then reply to the auto-response, without too much difficulty.
      That is sufficient to notification e-mails from the list that you
      generate.

      Greg
    • Dave
      Hi I assume you open Outlook express and when you click on the your list of emails addresses you select say eight and then click to and the box fills with the
      Message 2 of 13 , Jun 2, 2007
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        Hi
        I assume you open Outlook express and when you click on the your list of
        emails addresses
        you select say eight and then click to and the box fills with the eight
        addresses ??
        THANKYOU DAVE M

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "Ray Shapp" <ras45@...>
        To: <ntb-OffTopic@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Saturday, June 02, 2007 4:33 AM
        Subject: [NTO] Mail to a List


        > To All,
        >
        > How to send mail to a list of addresses?
        >
        > I am editing a newsletter for an amateur astronomy club (
        > www.asterism.org ).
        > I want to send notification to about a hundred members when each new issue
        > goes online. Some members have subscribed to a Yahoo group which I created
        > for
        > this purpose, and they get notification via that channel, but others will
        > not
        > navigate successfully the hurdles that Yahoo imposes. Others do get onto
        > the
        > Y! group, but then select "no mail" for their delivery option. IOW,
        > notifications via Y! are not working well.
        >
        > When I send a single email to more than about 8 or 10 members, the ISP of
        > one
        > or more of them will reject my message as spam, and sometimes none of the
        > other people on the copy list don't get my message either when one ISP
        > bounces
        > me.
        >
        > My current solution is to query the Membership database (it is in
        > Microsoft
        > Access) to get a list of current email addresses, then I cut and paste
        > five
        > addresses at a time into the "Bcc" line in my Outlook Express email
        > client.
        > This works, but it requires sending about 20 copies of the same email each
        > month to cover 100 members.
        >
        > Can anyone suggest a mail handling application that will do this job for
        > me?
        > Freeware, of course is best, but I am authorized to purchase software if
        > necessary. The club, however, wants to avoid using any service that will
        > require a monthly fee.
        >
        > Only the members who give me their explicit consent go onto my list,
        > therefore, they definitely don't regard these mailings as spam.
        >
        > Thank you for your help.
        >
        > Ray Shapp
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        >
        >
        >
      • Ray Shapp
        HI Alice, Greg, Dave: Thanks for the replies. My responses are interspersed below. No cPanel.
        Message 3 of 13 , Jun 2, 2007
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          HI Alice, Greg, Dave:

          Thanks for the replies. My responses are interspersed below.

          <<Does your webhost for asterism.org use cPanel? >>

          No cPanel.


          <<If your webhost doesn't offer cPanel, do they offer mailing lists with the
          webhosting package?>>

          Yes, however, we have had bad experiences with that. This ISP tags some of our
          messages (seemingly randomly) as spam or as potentially containing malware. We
          send only plain text, and never add attachments, but they block some of our
          outgoing email anyway. Strangely, some messages are treated differently when
          the content is identical, and only the addressees differ.


          << look around for a webhost that does use cPanel and move your domain there -
          depends on how much hassle that is.>>

          Major hassle. Would do that only as last resort.


          <<I wonder if you are recommending that they visit the Yahoo web site, and
          signup via that.>>

          No. After I secure permission from a member, I use the "Invite" feature within
          the Y! group. A recipient of an invitation needs only to follow the prompts.
          About half of my invitations expire before the member can read, understand,
          and act on the directions. Even hand-holding by phone is a major project with
          some of these computer-phobes. Another problem is that some members who
          finally get established are unable to update their email address if that
          becomes necessary. Y! itself causes problems even for experienced users
          because Yahoo will sometimes stop delivery because they claim the member's
          email is bouncing. It even happens to me occasionally.

          I'm looking for a list manager that allows me to update addresses, doesn't
          require setting "Marketing Preferences" or any special opt-out procedure for
          avoiding spam, and doesn't falsely freeze an account because of non-existent
          bouncing.


          <<I assume you open Outlook express and when you click on the your list of
          emails addresses>>

          I have used two methods, and both are unsatisfactory for similar reasons. One
          way is to create ten or a dozen "Groups" in the Outlook Express address book.
          Then I send the identical message one-at-a-time to each of the groups. That
          usually works, but it's a repetitive chore, and I am left with ten or a dozen
          separate mail lists to maintain.

          The second option is to store five or six addresses per line in a text file,
          each address separated from the others by commas. I then re-size outlook
          Express and NoteTab so they will co-exist on the monitor screen, then I cut
          and paste each line into a separate email.

          As I said in my original email (and repeated above), I'm looking for a list
          manager that I can control locally. Does anyone know of freeware, shareware,
          or a retail application that will fill my need?

          Thanks for the help.

          Ray Shapp
          www.asterism.org
        • Axel Berger
          ... If get a a mail address for yourself with gmx, then you can create a sort of pseudo mailing that only you can write to. That should solve your problem.
          Message 4 of 13 , Jun 2, 2007
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            Ray Shapp wrote:
            > I'm looking for a list manager that allows me to update addresses, doesn't
            > require setting "Marketing Preferences" or any special opt-out procedure for
            > avoiding spam, and doesn't falsely freeze an account because of non-existent
            > bouncing.

            If get a a mail address for yourself with gmx, then you can create a
            sort of pseudo mailing that only you can write to. That should solve
            your problem. Only thing is, I've no idea if there is a gmx.com or only
            gmx.de and if the latter if they have any interface other than German.

            Axel
          • fw7oaks
            ... need? have a look at http://www.download.com/PostCast-Server-Free-Edition/3000-2369_4-10332410.html used it and had no problems, moved on to the Pro
            Message 5 of 13 , Jun 2, 2007
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              > As I said in my original email (and repeated above), I'm looking
              > for a list manager that I can control locally. Does anyone know of
              > freeware, shareware, or a retail application that will fill my
              need?

              have a look at

              http://www.download.com/PostCast-Server-Free-Edition/3000-2369_4-10332410.html

              used it and had no problems, moved on to the 'Pro' version

              fw
            • alice ttlg
              ... It s likely that has nothing to do with your list, it may be other customers of your webhost on the same server who are sending out spam or viruses. Your
              Message 6 of 13 , Jun 2, 2007
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                On 6/2/07, Ray Shapp <ras45@...> wrote:
                > <<If your webhost doesn't offer cPanel, do they offer mailing lists with the
                > webhosting package?>>
                >
                > Yes, however, we have had bad experiences with that. This ISP tags some of our
                > messages (seemingly randomly) as spam or as potentially containing malware. We
                > send only plain text, and never add attachments, but they block some of our
                > outgoing email anyway. Strangely, some messages are treated differently when
                > the content is identical, and only the addressees differ.

                It's likely that has nothing to do with your list, it may be other
                customers of your webhost on the same server who are sending out spam
                or viruses. Your mail goes out from the same IP address as those
                people and gets tagged for that reason, not because of your actual
                content.

                You could also try this service here - I know virtually nothing about
                it except that they're trying to offer an alternative to Yahoogroups
                and Google Groups and they offer both free and pay levels - you could
                try the free version, see how it works out, set up a list, get a
                couple people to join, test out sending messages, etc.

                > No. After I secure permission from a member, I use the "Invite" feature within
                > the Y! group. A recipient of an invitation needs only to follow the prompts.

                Actually they can join by email which doesn't need an invite and would
                keep them from setting to NoMail. All they have to do is hit reply on
                the invitation - don't click on the link, just hit reply and that will
                get them on the list set to individual emails.

                You can put that instruction - to just hit reply, not click on the
                link - in the text of your invitation. If you put it in all caps,
                most people would likely see it and follow it.

                > finally get established are unable to update their email address if that
                > becomes necessary.

                You could unsub them and directly add them when they change email
                addresses - since that would only be an occasional one here and there,
                you could do that. Just tell your list members to let you know when
                they need to change their email address.

                --
                alice ttlg

                LJ: http://alicettlg.livejournal.com/
                Vox Populli: http://www.populli.org/
              • Ray Shapp
                Hi Axel, fw, and Alice. The PostCast Server looks like it might do the job. I have installed it and am sending this to you through it now. In a day or so, I
                Message 7 of 13 , Jun 2, 2007
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                  Hi Axel, fw, and Alice.

                  The PostCast Server looks like it might do the job. I have installed it and am
                  sending this to you through it now. In a day or so, I will compose a test list
                  and will see if it works with more than just a few addressees.

                  PostCast at>>>

                  http://www.download.com/PostCast-Server-Free-Edition/3000-2369_4-10332410.html

                  Many thanks for your help.

                  Ray Shapp
                • Robert Romberger
                  ... Hello Ray, I ve been reading the replies and your responses to this problem. One of the things I think is going to continue to cause you problems is your
                  Message 8 of 13 , Jun 3, 2007
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                    On 1 Jun 2007 at 14:33, Ray Shapp wrote:

                    > How to send mail to a list of addresses?

                    Hello Ray,

                    I've been reading the replies and your responses to this problem. One of the things I
                    think is going to continue to cause you problems is your outgoing mail ISP. Unless you have
                    an ISP that will allow you to send to multiple recipients at the same time, you may find that
                    you can't send out messages to more than say 25 people at one time. This is due to the way
                    many ISP check the To: and Cc: fields. They may even be keying in on the mailer in use - in
                    your case, Outlook Express. A list manager that you control locally may get you around the
                    ISP mail limit I mentioned before, if it allows you to use the bcc: method of sending list mail.

                    I've been using Pegasus Mail (http://www.pmail.com) for many years now as my
                    main mail program. One of the things it does well is to set up and send out distribution lists
                    (mailing lists just like you describe). Check it out, it may well do what you want.

                    --
                    Robert
                    http://www.mystickeep.com
                    Simply pushing harder within the old boundaries will not do. K Weick
                  • Axel Berger
                    ... I m, pretty convinced it won t. Every decent mailer can do that, but whatever program you use, your own ISP, i.e. the one whose SMTP you use, will always
                    Message 9 of 13 , Jun 3, 2007
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                      Robert Romberger wrote:
                      > One of the things it does well is to set up and send out
                      > distribution lists (mailing lists just like you describe).
                      > Check it out, it may well do what you want.

                      I'm, pretty convinced it won't. Every decent mailer can do that, but
                      whatever program you use, your own ISP, i.e. the one whose SMTP you use,
                      will always see the complete list of recipients whatever field they are
                      placed into. Which is why I suggested using another SMTP by another
                      prvider for the purpose of those mails.

                      Axel
                    • Ray Shapp
                      Hi Robert and Axel Thank you for the replies. The PostCast Server that was suggested here contains a local SMTP server. It works with many mail clients
                      Message 10 of 13 , Jun 4, 2007
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                        Hi Robert and Axel

                        Thank you for the replies.

                        The PostCast Server that was suggested here contains a local SMTP server. It
                        works with many mail clients including Outlook Express. I'm using MSOE and
                        PostCast Server now to send you this message.

                        PostCast Server is free, however that company's flagship product, PostCast, is
                        not free. As soon as I finish with my next newsletter, I will download the
                        trial version of PostCast and see for myself whether it performs as I
                        understand it to do. Our membership DB is in MS Access. The PostCast website
                        says PC and PC Server will work together with MS Access to send what appear to
                        be individual emails to each of the members who meet the criteria of Access
                        queries I define.

                        That sounds ideal because I will then need to maintain only one DB, and
                        through the use of custom queries, I can send email to our whole roster or to
                        various subsets.

                        The Pro version costs $100, but if it performs as advertised, I will purchase
                        it for the club.

                        I'll report back after I use it.

                        Thanks again.

                        Ray Shapp
                      • Robert Romberger
                        ... RTFM. There is a difference between sending out a list with one message and many recipients (multiple To:, Cc:, and/or Bcc:) and a list that puts out one
                        Message 11 of 13 , Jun 4, 2007
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                          On 3 Jun 2007 at 20:01, Axel Berger wrote:

                          > Robert Romberger wrote:
                          > > One of the things it does well is to set up and send out
                          > > distribution lists (mailing lists just like you describe).
                          > > Check it out, it may well do what you want.
                          >
                          > I'm, pretty convinced it won't. Every decent mailer can do that, but
                          > whatever program you use, your own ISP, i.e. the one whose SMTP you use,
                          > will always see the complete list of recipients whatever field they are
                          > placed into. Which is why I suggested using another SMTP by another
                          > prvider for the purpose of those mails.

                          RTFM. There is a difference between sending out a list with one message and many
                          recipients (multiple To:, Cc:, and/or Bcc:) and a list that puts out one message per recipient.
                          That is a distribution list in Pegasus - one message per recipient of the list. To the ISP, you
                          are sending out a bunch of individual e-mails. What you did was write one message and
                          send it to your distribution list. Each recipient receives the message addressed to them
                          without seeing the rest of the distribution list addresses. Yes, Pegasus has a simple SMTP
                          component built in.

                          --
                          Robert
                          http://www.mystickeep.com
                          To be a well favored man is the gift of fortune, but to write or read comes by nature. William
                          Shakespeare
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