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Re: [NTO] Mail to a List

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  • alice ttlg
    ... Does your webhost for asterism.org use cPanel? (a webhosting control panel for the user to do various things such as create email addresses, etc.) If so,
    Message 1 of 13 , Jun 1, 2007
      On 6/1/07, Ray Shapp <ras45@...> wrote:
      > To All,
      >
      > How to send mail to a list of addresses?
      >
      > I am editing a newsletter for an amateur astronomy club ( www.asterism.org ).
      > I want to send notification to about a hundred members when each new issue

      Does your webhost for asterism.org use cPanel? (a webhosting control
      panel for the user to do various things such as create email
      addresses, etc.) If so, cPanel includes Mailman, a mailing list
      software which is easy to use and you'd be able to export the
      addresses at Yahoogroups and directly add them to a new list in the
      Mailman list software.

      If your webhost doesn't offer cPanel, do they offer mailing lists with
      the webhosting package? Some do, it's worth asking to see if you
      already have an alternative in what you're paying for.

      If no on both accounts, you might look around for a webhost that does
      use cPanel and move your domain there - depends on how much hassle
      that is.

      --
      alice ttlg

      LJ: http://alicettlg.livejournal.com/
      Vox Populli: http://www.populli.org/
    • Greg Chapman
      Hi Ray, ... I wonder if you are recommending that they visit the Yahoo web site, and signup via that. That can present hurdles for the computer naive as it
      Message 2 of 13 , Jun 1, 2007
        Hi Ray,

        On 01 Jun 07 19:33 Ray Shapp <ras45@...> said:
        > others will not
        > navigate successfully the hurdles that Yahoo imposes

        I wonder if you are recommending that they visit the Yahoo web site,
        and signup via that. That can present hurdles for the computer naive
        as it forces you into the business of registering for all the web
        services provided by YahooGroups (photos, files, calendar, polls,
        etc).

        However, even the most un-netsavvy should be able to send an email to:

        <listname>-subscribe@yahoogroups.com

        and then reply to the auto-response, without too much difficulty.
        That is sufficient to notification e-mails from the list that you
        generate.

        Greg
      • Dave
        Hi I assume you open Outlook express and when you click on the your list of emails addresses you select say eight and then click to and the box fills with the
        Message 3 of 13 , Jun 2, 2007
          Hi
          I assume you open Outlook express and when you click on the your list of
          emails addresses
          you select say eight and then click to and the box fills with the eight
          addresses ??
          THANKYOU DAVE M

          ----- Original Message -----
          From: "Ray Shapp" <ras45@...>
          To: <ntb-OffTopic@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Saturday, June 02, 2007 4:33 AM
          Subject: [NTO] Mail to a List


          > To All,
          >
          > How to send mail to a list of addresses?
          >
          > I am editing a newsletter for an amateur astronomy club (
          > www.asterism.org ).
          > I want to send notification to about a hundred members when each new issue
          > goes online. Some members have subscribed to a Yahoo group which I created
          > for
          > this purpose, and they get notification via that channel, but others will
          > not
          > navigate successfully the hurdles that Yahoo imposes. Others do get onto
          > the
          > Y! group, but then select "no mail" for their delivery option. IOW,
          > notifications via Y! are not working well.
          >
          > When I send a single email to more than about 8 or 10 members, the ISP of
          > one
          > or more of them will reject my message as spam, and sometimes none of the
          > other people on the copy list don't get my message either when one ISP
          > bounces
          > me.
          >
          > My current solution is to query the Membership database (it is in
          > Microsoft
          > Access) to get a list of current email addresses, then I cut and paste
          > five
          > addresses at a time into the "Bcc" line in my Outlook Express email
          > client.
          > This works, but it requires sending about 20 copies of the same email each
          > month to cover 100 members.
          >
          > Can anyone suggest a mail handling application that will do this job for
          > me?
          > Freeware, of course is best, but I am authorized to purchase software if
          > necessary. The club, however, wants to avoid using any service that will
          > require a monthly fee.
          >
          > Only the members who give me their explicit consent go onto my list,
          > therefore, they definitely don't regard these mailings as spam.
          >
          > Thank you for your help.
          >
          > Ray Shapp
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >
          >
        • Ray Shapp
          HI Alice, Greg, Dave: Thanks for the replies. My responses are interspersed below. No cPanel.
          Message 4 of 13 , Jun 2, 2007
            HI Alice, Greg, Dave:

            Thanks for the replies. My responses are interspersed below.

            <<Does your webhost for asterism.org use cPanel? >>

            No cPanel.


            <<If your webhost doesn't offer cPanel, do they offer mailing lists with the
            webhosting package?>>

            Yes, however, we have had bad experiences with that. This ISP tags some of our
            messages (seemingly randomly) as spam or as potentially containing malware. We
            send only plain text, and never add attachments, but they block some of our
            outgoing email anyway. Strangely, some messages are treated differently when
            the content is identical, and only the addressees differ.


            << look around for a webhost that does use cPanel and move your domain there -
            depends on how much hassle that is.>>

            Major hassle. Would do that only as last resort.


            <<I wonder if you are recommending that they visit the Yahoo web site, and
            signup via that.>>

            No. After I secure permission from a member, I use the "Invite" feature within
            the Y! group. A recipient of an invitation needs only to follow the prompts.
            About half of my invitations expire before the member can read, understand,
            and act on the directions. Even hand-holding by phone is a major project with
            some of these computer-phobes. Another problem is that some members who
            finally get established are unable to update their email address if that
            becomes necessary. Y! itself causes problems even for experienced users
            because Yahoo will sometimes stop delivery because they claim the member's
            email is bouncing. It even happens to me occasionally.

            I'm looking for a list manager that allows me to update addresses, doesn't
            require setting "Marketing Preferences" or any special opt-out procedure for
            avoiding spam, and doesn't falsely freeze an account because of non-existent
            bouncing.


            <<I assume you open Outlook express and when you click on the your list of
            emails addresses>>

            I have used two methods, and both are unsatisfactory for similar reasons. One
            way is to create ten or a dozen "Groups" in the Outlook Express address book.
            Then I send the identical message one-at-a-time to each of the groups. That
            usually works, but it's a repetitive chore, and I am left with ten or a dozen
            separate mail lists to maintain.

            The second option is to store five or six addresses per line in a text file,
            each address separated from the others by commas. I then re-size outlook
            Express and NoteTab so they will co-exist on the monitor screen, then I cut
            and paste each line into a separate email.

            As I said in my original email (and repeated above), I'm looking for a list
            manager that I can control locally. Does anyone know of freeware, shareware,
            or a retail application that will fill my need?

            Thanks for the help.

            Ray Shapp
            www.asterism.org
          • Axel Berger
            ... If get a a mail address for yourself with gmx, then you can create a sort of pseudo mailing that only you can write to. That should solve your problem.
            Message 5 of 13 , Jun 2, 2007
              Ray Shapp wrote:
              > I'm looking for a list manager that allows me to update addresses, doesn't
              > require setting "Marketing Preferences" or any special opt-out procedure for
              > avoiding spam, and doesn't falsely freeze an account because of non-existent
              > bouncing.

              If get a a mail address for yourself with gmx, then you can create a
              sort of pseudo mailing that only you can write to. That should solve
              your problem. Only thing is, I've no idea if there is a gmx.com or only
              gmx.de and if the latter if they have any interface other than German.

              Axel
            • fw7oaks
              ... need? have a look at http://www.download.com/PostCast-Server-Free-Edition/3000-2369_4-10332410.html used it and had no problems, moved on to the Pro
              Message 6 of 13 , Jun 2, 2007
                > As I said in my original email (and repeated above), I'm looking
                > for a list manager that I can control locally. Does anyone know of
                > freeware, shareware, or a retail application that will fill my
                need?

                have a look at

                http://www.download.com/PostCast-Server-Free-Edition/3000-2369_4-10332410.html

                used it and had no problems, moved on to the 'Pro' version

                fw
              • alice ttlg
                ... It s likely that has nothing to do with your list, it may be other customers of your webhost on the same server who are sending out spam or viruses. Your
                Message 7 of 13 , Jun 2, 2007
                  On 6/2/07, Ray Shapp <ras45@...> wrote:
                  > <<If your webhost doesn't offer cPanel, do they offer mailing lists with the
                  > webhosting package?>>
                  >
                  > Yes, however, we have had bad experiences with that. This ISP tags some of our
                  > messages (seemingly randomly) as spam or as potentially containing malware. We
                  > send only plain text, and never add attachments, but they block some of our
                  > outgoing email anyway. Strangely, some messages are treated differently when
                  > the content is identical, and only the addressees differ.

                  It's likely that has nothing to do with your list, it may be other
                  customers of your webhost on the same server who are sending out spam
                  or viruses. Your mail goes out from the same IP address as those
                  people and gets tagged for that reason, not because of your actual
                  content.

                  You could also try this service here - I know virtually nothing about
                  it except that they're trying to offer an alternative to Yahoogroups
                  and Google Groups and they offer both free and pay levels - you could
                  try the free version, see how it works out, set up a list, get a
                  couple people to join, test out sending messages, etc.

                  > No. After I secure permission from a member, I use the "Invite" feature within
                  > the Y! group. A recipient of an invitation needs only to follow the prompts.

                  Actually they can join by email which doesn't need an invite and would
                  keep them from setting to NoMail. All they have to do is hit reply on
                  the invitation - don't click on the link, just hit reply and that will
                  get them on the list set to individual emails.

                  You can put that instruction - to just hit reply, not click on the
                  link - in the text of your invitation. If you put it in all caps,
                  most people would likely see it and follow it.

                  > finally get established are unable to update their email address if that
                  > becomes necessary.

                  You could unsub them and directly add them when they change email
                  addresses - since that would only be an occasional one here and there,
                  you could do that. Just tell your list members to let you know when
                  they need to change their email address.

                  --
                  alice ttlg

                  LJ: http://alicettlg.livejournal.com/
                  Vox Populli: http://www.populli.org/
                • Ray Shapp
                  Hi Axel, fw, and Alice. The PostCast Server looks like it might do the job. I have installed it and am sending this to you through it now. In a day or so, I
                  Message 8 of 13 , Jun 2, 2007
                    Hi Axel, fw, and Alice.

                    The PostCast Server looks like it might do the job. I have installed it and am
                    sending this to you through it now. In a day or so, I will compose a test list
                    and will see if it works with more than just a few addressees.

                    PostCast at>>>

                    http://www.download.com/PostCast-Server-Free-Edition/3000-2369_4-10332410.html

                    Many thanks for your help.

                    Ray Shapp
                  • Robert Romberger
                    ... Hello Ray, I ve been reading the replies and your responses to this problem. One of the things I think is going to continue to cause you problems is your
                    Message 9 of 13 , Jun 3, 2007
                      On 1 Jun 2007 at 14:33, Ray Shapp wrote:

                      > How to send mail to a list of addresses?

                      Hello Ray,

                      I've been reading the replies and your responses to this problem. One of the things I
                      think is going to continue to cause you problems is your outgoing mail ISP. Unless you have
                      an ISP that will allow you to send to multiple recipients at the same time, you may find that
                      you can't send out messages to more than say 25 people at one time. This is due to the way
                      many ISP check the To: and Cc: fields. They may even be keying in on the mailer in use - in
                      your case, Outlook Express. A list manager that you control locally may get you around the
                      ISP mail limit I mentioned before, if it allows you to use the bcc: method of sending list mail.

                      I've been using Pegasus Mail (http://www.pmail.com) for many years now as my
                      main mail program. One of the things it does well is to set up and send out distribution lists
                      (mailing lists just like you describe). Check it out, it may well do what you want.

                      --
                      Robert
                      http://www.mystickeep.com
                      Simply pushing harder within the old boundaries will not do. K Weick
                    • Axel Berger
                      ... I m, pretty convinced it won t. Every decent mailer can do that, but whatever program you use, your own ISP, i.e. the one whose SMTP you use, will always
                      Message 10 of 13 , Jun 3, 2007
                        Robert Romberger wrote:
                        > One of the things it does well is to set up and send out
                        > distribution lists (mailing lists just like you describe).
                        > Check it out, it may well do what you want.

                        I'm, pretty convinced it won't. Every decent mailer can do that, but
                        whatever program you use, your own ISP, i.e. the one whose SMTP you use,
                        will always see the complete list of recipients whatever field they are
                        placed into. Which is why I suggested using another SMTP by another
                        prvider for the purpose of those mails.

                        Axel
                      • Ray Shapp
                        Hi Robert and Axel Thank you for the replies. The PostCast Server that was suggested here contains a local SMTP server. It works with many mail clients
                        Message 11 of 13 , Jun 4, 2007
                          Hi Robert and Axel

                          Thank you for the replies.

                          The PostCast Server that was suggested here contains a local SMTP server. It
                          works with many mail clients including Outlook Express. I'm using MSOE and
                          PostCast Server now to send you this message.

                          PostCast Server is free, however that company's flagship product, PostCast, is
                          not free. As soon as I finish with my next newsletter, I will download the
                          trial version of PostCast and see for myself whether it performs as I
                          understand it to do. Our membership DB is in MS Access. The PostCast website
                          says PC and PC Server will work together with MS Access to send what appear to
                          be individual emails to each of the members who meet the criteria of Access
                          queries I define.

                          That sounds ideal because I will then need to maintain only one DB, and
                          through the use of custom queries, I can send email to our whole roster or to
                          various subsets.

                          The Pro version costs $100, but if it performs as advertised, I will purchase
                          it for the club.

                          I'll report back after I use it.

                          Thanks again.

                          Ray Shapp
                        • Robert Romberger
                          ... RTFM. There is a difference between sending out a list with one message and many recipients (multiple To:, Cc:, and/or Bcc:) and a list that puts out one
                          Message 12 of 13 , Jun 4, 2007
                            On 3 Jun 2007 at 20:01, Axel Berger wrote:

                            > Robert Romberger wrote:
                            > > One of the things it does well is to set up and send out
                            > > distribution lists (mailing lists just like you describe).
                            > > Check it out, it may well do what you want.
                            >
                            > I'm, pretty convinced it won't. Every decent mailer can do that, but
                            > whatever program you use, your own ISP, i.e. the one whose SMTP you use,
                            > will always see the complete list of recipients whatever field they are
                            > placed into. Which is why I suggested using another SMTP by another
                            > prvider for the purpose of those mails.

                            RTFM. There is a difference between sending out a list with one message and many
                            recipients (multiple To:, Cc:, and/or Bcc:) and a list that puts out one message per recipient.
                            That is a distribution list in Pegasus - one message per recipient of the list. To the ISP, you
                            are sending out a bunch of individual e-mails. What you did was write one message and
                            send it to your distribution list. Each recipient receives the message addressed to them
                            without seeing the rest of the distribution list addresses. Yes, Pegasus has a simple SMTP
                            component built in.

                            --
                            Robert
                            http://www.mystickeep.com
                            To be a well favored man is the gift of fortune, but to write or read comes by nature. William
                            Shakespeare
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