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Re: CPU Speed, Heat, etc. (was Re: [NTO] Math MB > GB)

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  • Len
    Hi Jody, All; ... The hottest I ve seen my PIII 667 MHz run is about 25 deg F above the ambient temperature. I have standard PS, Case and CPU fans. I use
    Message 1 of 20 , May 6, 2002
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      Hi Jody, All;

      >FWIW, my CPU seems to run at about 140+ degrees F. I though that
      >was pretty hot myself.

      The hottest I've seen my PIII 667 MHz run is about 25 deg F above
      the ambient temperature. I have standard PS, Case and CPU fans.
      I use MBProbe http://mbprobe.livewiredev.com/
      to monitor the voltages, fan speeds and temps.

      Based on what I've read, AMD CPUs do run hotter than Intel units
      and AMD gurus recommend using higher output CPU fans than those
      normally used by system builders.

      Now, for anyone who cares :-))

      Scientific Standards
      1 teraX (10 E12) = 1000 gigaX 1 tHz (tera hertz)
      1 gigaX (10 E9) = 1000 megaX 1 gHz
      1 megaX (10 E6) = 1000 kiloX 1 mHz
      1 kiloX (10 E3) = 1000 X 1 kHz

      Computer nomenclature
      1 teraX (1024 ^4) = 1024 gigaX 1 TB (1 tera bytes)
      1 gigaX (1024 ^3) = 1024 megaX 1 GB
      1 megaX (1024 ^2) = 1024 kiloX 1 MB
      1 kiloX (1024 ^1) = 1024 X 1 KB

      10 Exx = 10 to the power xx or exponent xx
      1024 ^x = 1024 to the power x or exponent x
      The computer nomenclature is generally accepted but not a standard.
    • Jody
      Hi DA and Len, Thanks for the replies! We normally keep the house at 74-78 degrees with a 1 degree A/C kick-in difference. (It s strange how we keep our
      Message 2 of 20 , May 6, 2002
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        Hi DA and Len,

        Thanks for the replies!

        We normally keep the house at 74-78 degrees with a 1 degree A/C
        kick-in difference. (It's strange how we keep our houses in the
        winter/summer. We make it fairly cold in the summer all the way
        down to 74, but in the winter, we like it 80-82. ;)

        I've had the sides off my tower since day one and also got the
        large one for better air circulation. I have a PII ball bearing
        fan for my CPU, but did not get the others yet to mount on the
        back of the case. I'll try putting a full size floor fan by its
        side. My ceiling fan circulates enough air, but then I have to
        put up with the "cold" and papers blowing around.

        Off-topic...
        In the long distance telephone switches I use to work in we had
        to keep the A/C at 68 degrees which blew up from an A/D'd tile
        floor with large fans at the top of each bay, shelves for PCB's
        about 1' x 3' x 6' in metal cabinets about 3' deep. There were
        rows and rows of them. Man, it was always cold on the
        graveyard/maintenance shift. (We could only do maintenance from
        12:00 to 4-5:00am unless of course the whole switch went down -
        which happened in very rare cases due to redundancy.) Out of
        over 10 years of that work I never had one full outage. :)
        Companies like MCI have a fit when they start loosing 5 million
        an hour in billing revenue. <g>

        >I think the temperature is borderline, but acceptable. One of
        >the things to keep in mind is: What happens when the ambient
        >temperature goes up in the summer? My server has a thermostatic
        >fan, and you can really hear it kick in when the weather is hot.
        >(I don't have air conditioning) The higher temperatures usually
        >don't result in immediate failure, but reduce the life of the cpu
        >and all the other components too.


        Happy Topics,
        Jody

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      • Jim Hall
        Len,Jody, et al, ... FWIW The PIII will shut itself down if it over heats. The PIV will slow itself down until the temp is within normal operating range. The
        Message 3 of 20 , May 6, 2002
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          Len,Jody, et al,

          At 09:28 AM 5/6/2002 -0700, you wrote:
          >Hi Jody, All;
          >
          >>FWIW, my CPU seems to run at about 140+ degrees F. I though that
          >>was pretty hot myself.
          >
          >The hottest I've seen my PIII 667 MHz run is about 25 deg F above
          >the ambient temperature. I have standard PS, Case and CPU fans.
          >I use MBProbe http://mbprobe.livewiredev.com/
          >to monitor the voltages, fan speeds and temps.
          >
          >Based on what I've read, AMD CPUs do run hotter than Intel units
          >and AMD gurus recommend using higher output CPU fans than those
          >normally used by system builders.


          FWIW

          The PIII will shut itself down if it over heats.

          The PIV will slow itself down until the temp is within normal operating range.

          The AMD's just burn themselves up (smoke and fire both).

          You can see the test results here:

          http://www4.tomshardware.com/cpu/01q3/010917/heatvideo-01.html

          WATCH YOUR HEATSINKS & FANS

          BTW the thermal paste between your heatsink and processor will dry out in time and will not be as effective.

          It is a good idea to replace it every year or so, especially with these high speed/temperature processors.

          http://www.electronics-cooling.com/Resources/EC_Articles/SEP96/sep96_01.htm

          http://www.overclockers.com/articles531/

          Obviously, dirty fans are not good either.

          Just my 2 cents worth.

          Regards,

          Jim
        • Nicholas Kormanik
          I ve had the sides off my tower since day one and also got the large one for better air circulation. How in the world can you stand the noise? I m, in fact,
          Message 4 of 20 , May 6, 2002
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            "I've had the sides off my tower since day one and also got the large
            one for better air circulation."

            How in the world can you stand the noise? I'm, in fact, thinking of
            covering/boxing my own tower with some thick noise insulation material
            --- I love silence!

            Nicholas



            -----Original Message-----
            From: Jody [mailto:av1611@...]
            Sent: Monday, May 06, 2002 11:28 AM
            To: ntb-OffTopic@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: CPU Speed, Heat, etc. (was Re: [NTO] Math MB > GB)


            Hi DA and Len,

            Thanks for the replies!

            We normally keep the house at 74-78 degrees with a 1 degree A/C kick-in
            difference. (It's strange how we keep our houses in the winter/summer.
            We make it fairly cold in the summer all the way down to 74, but in the
            winter, we like it 80-82. ;)

            I've had the sides off my tower since day one and also got the large one
            for better air circulation. I have a PII ball bearing fan for my CPU,
            but did not get the others yet to mount on the back of the case. I'll
            try putting a full size floor fan by its side. My ceiling fan
            circulates enough air, but then I have to put up with the "cold" and
            papers blowing around.

            Off-topic...
            In the long distance telephone switches I use to work in we had to keep
            the A/C at 68 degrees which blew up from an A/D'd tile floor with large
            fans at the top of each bay, shelves for PCB's about 1' x 3' x 6' in
            metal cabinets about 3' deep. There were rows and rows of them. Man,
            it was always cold on the graveyard/maintenance shift. (We could only
            do maintenance from 12:00 to 4-5:00am unless of course the whole switch
            went down - which happened in very rare cases due to redundancy.) Out
            of over 10 years of that work I never had one full outage. :) Companies
            like MCI have a fit when they start loosing 5 million an hour in billing
            revenue. <g>

            >I think the temperature is borderline, but acceptable. One of the
            >things to keep in mind is: What happens when the ambient temperature
            >goes up in the summer? My server has a thermostatic fan, and you can
            >really hear it kick in when the weather is hot. (I don't have air
            >conditioning) The higher temperatures usually don't result in
            >immediate failure, but reduce the life of the cpu and all the other
            >components too.


            Happy Topics,
            Jody

            The NoteTab Off-Topic List mailto:ntb-OffTopic-Subscribe@yahoogroups.com
            mailto:ntb-OffTopic-UnSubscribe@yahoogroups.com





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          • DA
            Hi Jody, ... Just something to watch out for: I had a computer that would overheat the disk drives if I removed the cover because the fans then couldn t draw
            Message 5 of 20 , May 6, 2002
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              Hi Jody,

              > I've had the sides off my tower since day one and also got the
              > large one for better air circulation.

              Just something to watch out for:
              I had a computer that would overheat the disk drives if I removed
              the cover because the fans then couldn't draw air over the drives.
              Removing the sides/cover upsets the air flow pattern.

              DA
            • Jody
              Hi DA and Nick, ... I ve been listening to machines making background noise for near 30 years now. It is when I don t hear it that I start getting concerned.
              Message 6 of 20 , May 6, 2002
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                Hi DA and Nick,

                >> I've had the sides off my tower since day one and also got the
                >> large one for better air circulation.

                > How in the world can you stand the noise? I'm, in fact,
                > thinking of covering/boxing my own tower with some thick noise
                > insulation material --- I love silence!

                I've been listening to machines making background noise for near
                30 years now. It is when I don't hear it that I start getting
                concerned. ;)

                Off topic warning... (DA, I replied to you below.)
                In large computer rooms, well outside the room itself somewhere,
                there are huge rectifiers which convert AC (480) to DC. The
                equipment I worked on varied but most of it had 24 huge batteries
                (about 1' across x 2' high x 2' deep). Each of those was a cell
                like in a car battery, the total making up the battery itself.
                The battery system was of course used as back up power, but also
                used to filter the DC from the rectifier outputs which would
                still have an AC ripple riding on the DC which is straight lined,
                at least on an Oscilloscope. The output of them is a pure -48VDC
                and was fed into each frame's power supplies having the shelves
                of large PCB's and then split up into the various low DC voltages
                needed. Anyhow, all that equipment makes a humming noise.

                Do you know why the rectifiers hum?


                scroll down


                down


                down


                Because they forgot the words, silly. ;)

                >Just something to watch out for:
                >I had a computer that would overheat the disk drives if I removed
                >the cover because the fans then couldn't draw air over the
                >drives. Removing the sides/cover upsets the air flow pattern.

                That makes good sense if one has all the fans installed he
                should. I have an onboard fan on my video card, one on the CPU,
                and one inside my pwr supply which sucks out. I hooked up my
                $8.98 floor/window fan from WalMart on the side of my computer.
                The pwr supply no longer has hot air blowing out the back, my
                hard drives cooled down considerably, and there is cool air
                flowing out the other side of the computer. (I have to check the
                CPU in CMOS.)

                Off topic warning...
                In the old days we had to have a number of those big fans on
                stands (like in public schools) to help keep the equipment cooled
                down because AC was not always there <g> so we sometimes had to
                go to emergency procedures 'cause the batteries were only good
                for so long, and one switch I was at in the Army did not have
                reliable generators. Civilians kept them up, so it was sort of
                out of our hands. Those were the good 'ol days when there were
                always problem to troubleshoot and quite a challenge to keep up
                and running. Some military Autovon switches back then would go
                down for days at a time. ;)

                Happy Topics,
                Jody

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              • DA
                Hi Jody, I ve done that WalMart trick too. It sounds like you have everything thermal under control. DA
                Message 7 of 20 , May 6, 2002
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                  Hi Jody,

                  I've done that WalMart trick too. It sounds like you have
                  everything thermal under control.

                  DA

                  > I hooked up my
                  > $8.98 floor/window fan from WalMart on the side of my computer.
                • Jody
                  Hi DA, You know, if they do not sell them, I bet a fella in the A/C and Heating could fabricate a small A/C unit that could mount wherever and really have it
                  Message 8 of 20 , May 7, 2002
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                    Hi DA,

                    You know, if they do not sell them, I bet a fella in the A/C and
                    Heating could fabricate a small A/C unit that could mount
                    wherever and really have it done right then. ;)

                    (Silly me forgot that the fax stuff on the other thread was a
                    matter of making the fax the default printer, or selected printer
                    when fax'n. I would image all the guy would have to do is setup
                    his DUN (if not already, connect, go through the fax motions
                    including picking the fax for the printer, and it should fly.)

                    >I've done that WalMart trick too. It sounds like you have
                    >everything thermal under control.
                    >
                    >DA
                    >
                    >> I hooked up my $8.98 floor/window fan from WalMart on the side
                    >> of my computer.


                    Happy Topics,
                    Jody

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                  • hsavage
                    ... Hi Jody, DA, Overclockers and other experimenters have already Been there, Done that . Thermoelectric cooling units, and even, water(fluid) cooling units
                    Message 9 of 20 , May 7, 2002
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                      On 5/7/02 9:42 AM, Jody wrote:
                      > Hi DA,
                      >
                      > You know, if they do not sell them, I bet a fella in the A/C and
                      > Heating could fabricate a small A/C unit that could mount
                      > wherever and really have it done right then. ;)
                      >

                      Hi Jody, DA,

                      Overclockers and other experimenters have already "Been there, Done
                      that". Thermoelectric cooling units, and even, water(fluid) cooling
                      units have been adapted to CPU's for quite a while now.

                      The thermo-units are a solid state devices that has been around for some
                      time that mounts on the cpu just like a cpu-fan, the fluid units are
                      like a car radiator. A reservoir that water is circulated through is
                      physically attached to the cpu.

                      The water is circulated through the reservoir, just as an engine block,
                      then out through a radiator to dissipate heat.

                      hrs
                    • Jim Hall
                      Jody, ... The old Cray SuperComputers had the CPU s and Ram in a refrigerator.:-) You can get cases today that come with A/C units. COOL is the word!! Jim
                      Message 10 of 20 , May 7, 2002
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                        Jody,

                        At 09:42 AM 5/7/2002 -0500, you wrote:
                        >Hi DA,
                        >
                        >You know, if they do not sell them, I bet a fella in the A/C and
                        >Heating could fabricate a small A/C unit that could mount
                        >wherever and really have it done right then. ;)

                        The old Cray SuperComputers had the CPU's and Ram in a refrigerator.:-)

                        You can get cases today that come with A/C units.

                        COOL is the word!!

                        Jim
                      • Jody
                        Hi Jim, ... ARGH! That is as bad as my rectifiers humming because they forgot the words. ;) Happy Topics, Jody The NoteTab Off-Topic List
                        Message 11 of 20 , May 7, 2002
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                          Hi Jim,

                          >The old Cray SuperComputers had the CPU's and Ram in a refrigerator.:-)
                          >
                          >You can get cases today that come with A/C units.
                          >
                          >COOL is the word!!

                          ARGH! That is as bad as my rectifiers humming because they
                          forgot the words. ;)


                          Happy Topics,
                          Jody

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                        • DA
                          Hi Jody/Jim, I don t think Jim was joking, were you Jim? DA
                          Message 12 of 20 , May 7, 2002
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                            Hi Jody/Jim,

                            I don't think Jim was joking, were you Jim?

                            DA

                            Jody wrote:
                            >
                            > Hi Jim,
                            >
                            > >The old Cray SuperComputers had the CPU's and Ram in a refrigerator.:-)
                            > >
                            > >You can get cases today that come with A/C units.
                            > >
                            > >COOL is the word!!
                            >
                            > ARGH! That is as bad as my rectifiers humming because they
                            > forgot the words. ;)
                            >
                            > Happy Topics,
                            > Jody
                            >
                            > The NoteTab Off-Topic List
                            > mailto:ntb-OffTopic-Subscribe@yahoogroups.com
                            > mailto:ntb-OffTopic-UnSubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                          • Jim Hall
                            DA, Nope, I was as serious as a heart attack, they really did.
                            Message 13 of 20 , May 7, 2002
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                              DA,

                              Nope, I was as serious as a heart attack, they really did.

                              At 09:59 PM 5/7/2002 -0700, you wrote:
                              >Hi Jody/Jim,
                              >
                              >I don't think Jim was joking, were you Jim?
                              >
                              >DA
                              >
                              >Jody wrote:
                              >>
                              >> Hi Jim,
                              >>
                              >> >The old Cray SuperComputers had the CPU's and Ram in a refrigerator.:-)
                              >> >
                              >> >You can get cases today that come with A/C units.
                              >> >
                              >> >COOL is the word!!
                              >>
                              >> ARGH! That is as bad as my rectifiers humming because they
                              >> forgot the words. ;)
                              >>
                            • Jody
                              Hi Jim, I certainly believed they have/had the units. What I was talking about was what I thought was a play on words. The refrigerators were certainly cool,
                              Message 14 of 20 , May 8, 2002
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                                Hi Jim,

                                I certainly believed they have/had the units. What I was talking
                                about was what I thought was a play on words. The refrigerators
                                were certainly cool, but they are "way too kewl" (COOL) also. ;)
                                Or, is COOL an acronym?

                                I think it was Harvey that mentioned they already had some type
                                of thermal control units. I was thinking more on the lines of an
                                everyday (miniature though) A/C unit say the size of a pwr supply
                                that would mount right inside a tower case where a pwr supply
                                would go. It would cool big time, and also draw the moisture
                                out of the air and help with corrosion. A long time NoteTabber,
                                Dr. ??? in Hawaii, told me that they had to buy new computers
                                every two years because of the humidly and salty air destroying
                                them.

                                >>I don't think Jim was joking, were you Jim?
                                >>
                                >>DA
                                >>
                                >>Jody wrote:
                                >>>
                                >>> Hi Jim,
                                >>>
                                >>>>The old Cray SuperComputers had the CPU's and Ram in a refrigerator.:-)
                                >>>>
                                >>>>You can get cases today that come with A/C units.
                                >>> >
                                >>> >COOL is the word!!
                                >>>
                                >>> ARGH! That is as bad as my rectifiers humming because they
                                >>> forgot the words. ;)


                                Happy Topics,
                                Jody

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