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Re: [NTO] re-writable CDs

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  • Ray Shapp
    Hi Christopher and Carl, Thanks for the info re CD-RW for routine use in backups. I wasn t aware that the media are speed-specific! I have one multi-speed CD
    Message 1 of 25 , Mar 5, 2002
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      Hi Christopher and Carl,

      Thanks for the info re CD-RW for routine use in backups.

      I wasn't aware that the media are speed-specific! I have one multi-speed CD
      disk which is labeled 1x, 2x, 4x. I wrote onto it several batches of files
      (about twenty files) and read them back on a different computer using a
      read-only CD drive with no problem. Is there any chance this 18-month old
      read-only CD drive would have a problem reading a 10x CD?

      I'll look for "My Own Backup v2.1", but right now, I'm planning to use the
      Windows backup utility or WinZip. Can you expand a little on what you mean
      by>>>>

      >>>> I created target zip files onto my backup CD, directed the backup
      software to run specific sets for each zip file, and turn it loose every
      Wednesday.<<<<<<<

      Thanks again for the help,

      Ray Shapp
      Watchung, NJ
    • Jody
      Hi Ray, ... They are good if used on the same CD writer or the newer CD drives. A lot of the older CD drives cannot read the CD-RW format. At the time that
      Message 2 of 25 , Mar 6, 2002
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        Hi Ray,

        >Are re-writable CDs suitable media for use in backups of PC files?

        They are good if used on the same CD writer or the newer CD
        drives. A lot of the older CD drives cannot read the CD-RW
        format. At the time that those CDs were made there was no such
        thing as CD-RW. Things might have improved over that last year
        or so with the CD Writers and CD-RWs so that they work on any CD
        drive now. I always use CDRs since I can get 100 for about 35
        cents each and I know they work on all CD drives (provided the CD
        is good of course;).

        I use an HP CD Writer Plus (9200i I believe) and out of over 500
        CDs burned only about 5 were bad and that could have been due to
        a bad batch of CDs since they were all in one of the 100 spindle
        packs I buy. It is best to not do any other activity on your
        computer when burning them also. That may have attributed to the
        few I had bad. I make it a point know to just let it go until I
        hear the CD tray eject (working on another computer).

        Happy Topics,
        Jody

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      • Ray Shapp
        Thanks to all who replied. As suggested by Carl Swann, I downloaded the freeware program, My Own Backups, and have been experimenting with a relatively new
        Message 3 of 25 , Mar 6, 2002
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          Thanks to all who replied.

          As suggested by Carl Swann, I downloaded the freeware program, My Own
          Backups, and have been experimenting with a relatively new CD-RW drive and a
          1x, 2x, 4x re-writable disk. The MOB program is able to incorporate WinZip
          seamlessly. I'm even considering using a NT clip to invoke MOB to run
          specific backup sets.

          On a second computer which contains an 18-month-old read-only CD drive, I
          can access the previously written files and folders using Win98 Explorer.
          This could be an ideal setup for my needs.

          I'd now like to know whether anyone has first hand experience with an
          external CD-RW drive connected to a PC through the USB port. I'm
          considering buying one for the second PC (mentioned above) to give it RW
          capability. I intend to stick with 1x, 2x, 4x media, therefore, I'd like to
          know whether the I/O speed of an external CD_RW drive would be appreciably
          slower than an internal unit.

          Again, thanks for the help.

          Ray Shapp
          Watchung, NJ
        • Ray Shapp
          Jody said I use an HP CD Writer Plus (9200i I believe) and out of over 500 CDs burned only about 5 were bad It is best to not do any other
          Message 4 of 25 , Mar 6, 2002
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            Jody said >>>>>>I use an HP CD Writer Plus (9200i I believe) and out of over
            500
            CDs burned only about 5 were bad <snip> It is best to not do any other
            activity on your
            computer when burning them also. <<<<<<

            I've had similar experience with CDR using a relatively new CD-RW drive.

            Thanks for the reply.

            Ray Shapp
            Watchung, NJ
          • Jody
            Hi Carl ... Will that software save to a file settings for a CD such as the files/folders you want to put on the CD and will it do it w/o altering the files or
            Message 5 of 25 , Mar 6, 2002
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              Hi Carl

              >For backup, I use a freeware program called "My Own Backup v2.1"
              >(original name, eh?) that's available on all the major freeware
              >sites on the web. For retrieval, I use PowerDesk 4.0 (also a
              >freeware program).

              Will that software save to a file settings for a CD such as the
              files/folders you want to put on the CD and will it do it w/o
              altering the files or putting them in a zip? Also, will the file
              for each set of files to burn, remember a label name such as
              Fookes_Software? :)

              I'll surely hunt for the link so I can use it till HP comes out
              with better software for XP. The freebie that came with it when
              I bought the drive now wants $99.00 for upgrades, so I burn my
              CDs on my Win98SE machine.

              Happy Topics,
              Jody

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            • Ray Shapp
              Hi Jody, The URL for My Own Backup is http://home4.swipnet.se/~w-42000/MOB/ I didn t test the features you mentioned, but MOB is handling CD-RW ok. The
              Message 6 of 25 , Mar 6, 2002
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                Hi Jody,

                The URL for My Own Backup is >>>
                http://home4.swipnet.se/~w-42000/MOB/

                I didn't test the features you mentioned, but MOB is handling CD-RW ok. The
                original tree structure is maintained if you backup without compression. If
                you do specify compression, you get everything in one zip file made by
                WinZip, therefore, it is in a standard format preserving the fully qualified
                file names.

                My only qualm is that the website and the program haven't been updated since
                November 1999. I wouldn't expect a lot of support but you sure can't beat
                the price!

                Ray Shapp
                Watchung, NJ
              • Jan Rosenstreich
                ... I am using a CDRW burner to backup my files. With compression, you can backup close to 1 Gig on a disk (depending on content - some files compress better
                Message 7 of 25 , Mar 7, 2002
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                  On Mon, 4 Mar 2002 17:37:57 -0500, you wrote:

                  >Are re-writable CDs suitable media for use in backups of PC files? When I
                  >last read about the technology, the re-writable media weren't reliable
                  >enough for many routine re-write cycles. Also, most re-writable CD burners
                  >couldn't append new files to a CD without destroying previous contents. In
                  >order to write 10 new megabytes to a CD that already had 100 MB, one had to
                  >copy the 100MB to the hard drive, and then write all 110 MB to the CD in a
                  >single, uninterrupted operation.

                  I am using a CDRW burner to backup my files. With compression, you can
                  backup close to 1 Gig on a disk (depending on content - some files
                  compress better than others). Your best bet is to find a backup program
                  that supports CDRW drives. Many of them now support Tapes, CDRW, Zip
                  disks, etc. A backup program will allow you to easily do full backups,
                  append new files, do a selective backup, backup only changed files, etc.
                  You can accomplish the above using other means, but I find a dedicated
                  backup program makes it easier.


                  >I'm currently using 250MB zip disks for backup, but I will install the
                  >re-writable CD burner if the earlier limitations have been overcome.

                  A 250 MB zip disk (even with compression) wouldn't to it for me. I hate
                  swapping disks and I have almost 1 GIG of data to routinely backup.

                  Jan
                  --
                  Jan Rosenstreich
                  Independent Distributor #130-646
                  Multi-Pure Drinking Water Filtration Systems
                  http://www.castle.net/~mystic/pages/multintr.html
                • Subscriber
                  Dear Jan,Your best bet is to find a backup program that supports CDRW drives. Many of them now support Tapes, CDRW, Zip disks, etc.Could you please
                  Message 8 of 25 , Mar 8, 2002
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                    Dear Jan,

                    >Your best bet is to find a backup program
                    >that supports CDRW drives. Many of them now support Tapes, CDRW, Zip
                    >disks, etc.

                    Could you please recommend one?

                    Wojciech



                    --

                    Okresl Swoje potrzeby - my znajdziemy oferte za Ciebie!
                    [ http://oferty.onet.pl ]
                  • Subscriber
                    Dear Ray,If you do specify compression, you get everything in one zip file made by WinZip, therefore, it is in a standard format preserving the fully
                    Message 9 of 25 , Mar 8, 2002
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                      Dear Ray,

                      >If
                      >you do specify compression, you get everything in one zip file made by
                      >WinZip, therefore, it is in a standard format preserving the fully
                      qualified
                      >file names.

                      Does it work also with WinRAR?

                      Wojciech




                      --

                      Okresl Swoje potrzeby - my znajdziemy oferte za Ciebie!
                      [ http://oferty.onet.pl ]
                    • Subscriber
                      Dear Ray,I d now like to know whether anyone has first hand experience with an external CD-RW drive connected to a PC through the USB port. I m
                      Message 10 of 25 , Mar 8, 2002
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                        Dear Ray,

                        >I'd now like to know whether anyone has first hand experience with an
                        >external CD-RW drive connected to a PC through the USB port. I'm
                        >considering buying one for the second PC (mentioned above) to give it RW
                        >capability. I intend to stick with 1x, 2x, 4x media, therefore, I'd like
                        to
                        >know whether the I/O speed of an external CD_RW drive would be appreciably
                        >slower than an internal unit.

                        I have been using Iomega external CD-RW "Predator" for about half a year
                        (bought for my laptop). It is connected through USB, version 1 (version 2 -
                        a new standard - is told to be much faster). I make major backups, store
                        archives, sometimes even use it as a second hard drive, and I am quite
                        satisfied. Only one remark: for some reasons it works OK with 2x speed, but
                        when set for 4x, the drive begins to behave in a strange manner and refuses
                        to write.

                        Best regards,

                        Wojciech




                        --

                        Okresl Swoje potrzeby - my znajdziemy oferte za Ciebie!
                        [ http://oferty.onet.pl ]
                      • Subscriber
                        Dear Carl,For backup, I use a freeware program called My Own Backup v2.1 (original name, eh?) that s available on all the major freeware sites on the
                        Message 11 of 25 , Mar 8, 2002
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                          Dear Carl,

                          >For backup, I use a freeware program called "My Own
                          >Backup v2.1" (original name, eh?) that's available on
                          >all the major freeware sites on the web. For
                          >retrieval, I use PowerDesk 4.0 (also a freeware
                          >program).
                          >
                          >I created target zip files onto my backup CD, directed
                          >the backup software to run specific sets for each zip
                          >file, and turn it loose every Wednesday.
                          >
                          >Works 100%. If you have specific questions, you may
                          >write me in private e-mail - or if it's a
                          >general-interest question, I'll try to field it here
                          >on Yahoo.

                          Could you please elaborate your backup strategy a little bit more?
                          Especially, why do you need another software for retrieval? What do you mean
                          by "target zip files"? Do you simply add new files to existing archives?

                          Best regards,

                          Wojciech



                          --

                          Okresl Swoje potrzeby - my znajdziemy oferte za Ciebie!
                          [ http://oferty.onet.pl ]
                        • Ray Shapp
                          Hi Wojciech, I have the type 1 USB. Can you give some speed estimate of reading and writing at 2x? Also, are reading and writing speeds the same? Thanks for
                          Message 12 of 25 , Mar 8, 2002
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                            Hi Wojciech,

                            I have the type 1 USB. Can you give some speed estimate of reading and
                            writing at 2x? Also, are reading and writing speeds the same?

                            Thanks for your help.

                            Ray Shapp
                            Watchung, NJ
                          • Carl Swann
                            ... Sorry for delay in replying... I m suffering worst computer crash ever, so I m lucky to be able to access e-mail right now... :-/ ... I wasn t clear there,
                            Message 13 of 25 , Mar 8, 2002
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                              Subscriber wrote:
                              >
                              > Dear Carl,
                              >
                              > >For backup, I use a freeware program called "My Own
                              > >Backup v2.1"
                              > >I created target zip files onto my backup CD, directed
                              > >the backup software to run specific sets for each zip
                              > >file, and turn it loose every Wednesday.

                              Sorry for delay in replying... I'm suffering worst computer crash
                              ever, so I'm lucky to be able to access e-mail right now... :-/

                              > Could you please elaborate your backup strategy a little bit more?
                              > Especially, why do you need another software for retrieval?

                              I wasn't clear there, sorry. MOB will restore the files just fine. I
                              was making reference to the fact that I'll often want to simply open a
                              file that's in the archive (such as a .doc file, just to read its
                              content for a project). I use Powerdesk 4.0, choose my CD drive in it,
                              go to the zip archive I want, look down the tree untill I find the
                              file I'm looking for, then double-click it in the Powerdesk tree
                              window. Powerdesk calls on WinWord to open the file and I read it. I
                              can even copy from it to paste into another open document if I wish.
                              When I'm through, I close the document, then close Powerdesk. Thus,
                              I've been able to access a file in the archive *without having to
                              restore it*.

                              >What do
                              > you mean
                              > by "target zip files"? Do you simply add new files to existing
                              > archives?

                              Correct - again, I wasn't very clear... sorry.

                              Hope this helps. (Now pray for me & my machine :-)

                              Carl
                            • Ray Shapp
                              Hi Wojciech ... I don t use WinRAR. I have no info about it. Sorry, Ray Shapp Watchung, NJ
                              Message 14 of 25 , Mar 8, 2002
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                                Hi Wojciech

                                >>>>>Does it work also with WinRAR?<<<

                                I don't use WinRAR. I have no info about it.

                                Sorry,

                                Ray Shapp
                                Watchung, NJ
                              • Marcus
                                ... You should be able to use any program because windows writes to your CD-RW via a packet writer (which you get included with current CD burning software),
                                Message 15 of 25 , Mar 8, 2002
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                                  On 08.03.02 at 21:58 Subscriber wrote:
                                  >>Your best bet is to find a backup program
                                  >>that supports CDRW drives. Many of them now support Tapes, CDRW, Zip
                                  >>disks, etc.
                                  >
                                  >Could you please recommend one?

                                  You should be able to use any program because windows writes to your
                                  CD-RW via a packet writer (which you get included with current CD
                                  burning software), so you can write to it like any other drive.

                                  Marcus
                                • Subscriber
                                  Hi Ray,I have the type 1 USB. Can you give some speed estimate of reading and writing at 2x? Also, are reading and writing speeds the same?To my
                                  Message 16 of 25 , Mar 9, 2002
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                                    Hi Ray,

                                    > I have the type 1 USB. Can you give some speed estimate of reading and
                                    > writing at 2x? Also, are reading and writing speeds the same?

                                    To my understanding 2x means two times faster than at the "base" speed,
                                    i.e.. 1x. In other words, if you need some 70 minutes to burn the whole CD
                                    (650 MB) at 1x, it takes 35 minutes at 2x, 17,5 at 4x and so on.

                                    Speed of reading and writing are definitely two different things. Reading is
                                    always much faster and does not depend on the speed with which given CD was
                                    written. All speeds are always indicated next to the drive name as three
                                    numbers. The first means the speed of writing the CD-Rs, the second - speed
                                    of writing the CD-RWs (usually the lowest), and the third - speed of reading
                                    (the highest). For example, my CD-RW has the following characteristics:
                                    4/4/6. It means that I can record CD-R and the CD-RW at the 4x, and read
                                    them at 6x.

                                    But there is also another parameter included, namely the speed of transfer
                                    of data between your computer and an external CD-RW drive. This exactly what
                                    depends on the type of connection. Briefly: the parallel port is the
                                    slowest, the USB is better, the Firewire is the best. As I mentioned, I have
                                    USB version 1, and this probably why I can use only 2x and not 4x speed for
                                    writing.

                                    But as long as one do not copy the whole CD but operates on archive or
                                    backup files of around 200-300 MB each, the 2x is OK, meaning that you need
                                    some 10-15 minutes for one file.

                                    Best regards,

                                    Wojciech



                                    --

                                    Okresl Swoje potrzeby - my znajdziemy oferte za Ciebie!
                                    [ http://oferty.onet.pl ]
                                  • Christopher J. & Jo-Ann J. Spilker
                                    ... drives. Many of them now support Tapes, CDRW, Zip disks, etc. ... your CD-RW via a packet writer (which you get included with current CD burning
                                    Message 17 of 25 , Mar 9, 2002
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                                      On 08.03.02 at 21:58 Subscriber wrote:
                                      >>Your best bet is to find a backup program that supports CDRW
                                      drives. Many of them now support Tapes, CDRW, Zip disks, etc.
                                      >
                                      >Could you please recommend one?

                                      >You should be able to use any program because windows writes to
                                      your CD-RW via a packet writer (which you get included with
                                      current CD burning >>software), so you can write to it like any
                                      other drive.

                                      I just wanted to add to the conversation that not ALL Packet
                                      Writers support writing to CD-R media (versus CD-RW media). In
                                      fact, this appears to be the NORM, not the exception.

                                      Also, I have used a 1999 edition of Veritas Backup Exec and it
                                      would NOT recognize my IDE CD-RW nor my USB ZIP drive. That was
                                      the last Veritas I intend to purchase; I absolutely could not
                                      determine from their retail box nor their web site what EXACTLY
                                      was supported as back up devices before purchase. It looked good
                                      to me. I was disappointed.

                                      Regards,
                                      Christopher J. Spilker
                                      mailto:chris-jo-ann-spilker@...
                                    • Marcus
                                      ... That s an important issue. With CD software you need to check that it supports your drive. I had an old version of CDRWin from April 2001, but it could
                                      Message 18 of 25 , Mar 9, 2002
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                                        On 09.03.02 at 12:40 Christopher J. & Jo-Ann J. Spilker wrote:
                                        >Also, I have used a 1999 edition of Veritas Backup Exec and it
                                        >would NOT recognize my IDE CD-RW nor my USB ZIP drive.

                                        That's an important issue. With CD software you need to check that it
                                        supports your drive. I had an "old" version of CDRWin from April 2001,
                                        but it could not know my new drive because it wasn't in production back
                                        then.

                                        Marcus
                                      • Jan Rosenstreich
                                        ... I use a program called Backup Executive. I don t recall the name of the company since it has changed twice since I originally purchased it. Jan -- Jan
                                        Message 19 of 25 , Mar 13, 2002
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                                          On Fri, 8 Mar 2002 21:58:03 +0100, <subscribergsf@...> wrote:

                                          >>Your best bet is to find a backup program
                                          >>that supports CDRW drives. Many of them now support Tapes, CDRW, Zip
                                          >>disks, etc.
                                          >
                                          >Could you please recommend one?

                                          I use a program called Backup Executive. I don't recall the name of the
                                          company since it has changed twice since I originally purchased it.

                                          Jan
                                          --
                                          Jan Rosenstreich
                                          Independent Distributor #130-646
                                          Multi-Pure Drinking Water Filtration Systems
                                          http://www.castle.net/~mystic/pages/multintr.html
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