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Re: [nslu2-linux] Re: Not able to modify/delete backup jobs

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  • Jim Tucker
    On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 21:27:15 -0800 (PST), Nathan Ellsworth ... I have had problems with my backups getting stuck or locked for no apparent reason, and at least
    Message 1 of 14 , Mar 29, 2005
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      On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 21:27:15 -0800 (PST), Nathan Ellsworth
      <nathan@...> wrote:
      > Check in /mnt/backup. The old posting you quote helped
      > me out with the exact problem, except I had to do a
      > "find / -name backup" to discover where the backup
      > directory actually was.
      >
      > (This common backup problem should be in the FAQ or
      > the Wiki - Can anyone add to the FAQ or Wiki, or just
      > admins?)

      I have had problems with my backups getting stuck or locked for no
      apparent reason, and at least twice I have had to refer to this thread
      to find a solution. I agree that it's time to build a wiki or "how
      to" page on this topic. I looked for an obvious way to build a new
      wiki, but I found only a statement pointing me back to this group.

      Also, I would like to understand about prevention and not just the
      cure. Does anyone understand the common root causes of backup
      failure? That would be good material for the wiki, too.
    • Rod Whitby
      Anyone can edit the FAQ page. Just click the edit link at the top right or bottom left of the page. To create a new page, just enter the new page URL into
      Message 2 of 14 , Mar 29, 2005
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        Anyone can edit the FAQ page. Just click the "edit" link at the top
        right or bottom left of the page.

        To create a new page, just enter the new page URL into your browser
        and the page will be created automatically. Make sure you use a
        sensible name. For example, you can create a page just by clicking on
        this link:

        http://www.nslu2-linux.org/wiki/HowTo/DiagnoseAndFixBackupProblems

        When the page is ready, and you want it linked onto one of the
        top-level password-protected pages, then just post a link to the page
        here, and where you would like it added.

        -- Rod

        On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 18:07:50 -0800, Jim Tucker <rjtucker@...> wrote:
        > On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 21:27:15 -0800 (PST), Nathan Ellsworth
        > <nathan@...> wrote:
        > > Check in /mnt/backup. The old posting you quote helped
        > > me out with the exact problem, except I had to do a
        > > "find / -name backup" to discover where the backup
        > > directory actually was.
        > >
        > > (This common backup problem should be in the FAQ or
        > > the Wiki - Can anyone add to the FAQ or Wiki, or just
        > > admins?)
        >
        > I have had problems with my backups getting stuck or locked for no
        > apparent reason, and at least twice I have had to refer to this thread
        > to find a solution. I agree that it's time to build a wiki or "how
        > to" page on this topic. I looked for an obvious way to build a new
        > wiki, but I found only a statement pointing me back to this group.
        >
        > Also, I would like to understand about prevention and not just the
        > cure. Does anyone understand the common root causes of backup
        > failure? That would be good material for the wiki, too.
      • Jim Tucker
        ... Okay. I took the bait. Please add http://www.nslu2-linux.org/wiki/HowTo/DiagnoseAndFixBackupProblems to the Troubleshooting section of the wiki. Thanks.
        Message 3 of 14 , Mar 30, 2005
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          On Wed, 30 Mar 2005 11:52:05 +0930, Rod Whitby <list.yahoo@...> wrote:
          > Anyone can edit the FAQ page. Just click the "edit" link at the top
          > right or bottom left of the page.
          >
          > When the page is ready, and you want it linked onto one of the
          > top-level password-protected pages, then just post a link to the page
          > here, and where you would like it added.

          Okay. I took the bait.

          Please add http://www.nslu2-linux.org/wiki/HowTo/DiagnoseAndFixBackupProblems
          to the "Troubleshooting" section of the wiki.

          Thanks.
        • Jim Tucker
          ... Our slug backs up our Compaq desktop computer daily, but the backup job frequently hangs. I would like to find out what it causing the job to hang so
          Message 4 of 14 , Apr 9, 2005
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            On Mar 21, 2005 10:25 AM, Ian White <iandavidwhite@...> wrote:
            > It was while investigating this unslung f/w and trying to add more than 5 backup
            > jobs
            > that I first encountered the backup job lock-up/hang problem

            Our slug backs up our Compaq desktop computer daily, but the backup
            job frequently hangs. I would like to find out what it causing the
            job to hang so frequently. Here is a typical excerpt from the backup
            log:

            03/08 13:51:26 Backup: Job 'Presario' ended.
            03/08 13:51:26 Backup: Maximum errors occur in job 'Presario', job is aborted.
            03/08 13:50:26 Backup: Error occurs in job 'Presario', cannot access
            source file '//presario/forbackup/Installables/MS Publisher 2000/O9PB
            (E)/PFILES/MSOFF
            ...
            <<skipping nineteen similar errors>>
            ...
            03/08 12:30:31 Backup: Error occurs in job 'Presario', cannot access
            source file '//presario/forbackup/Installables/MS Publisher 2000/O9PB
            (E)/PFILES/MSOFF
            03/08 12:00:00 Backup: Job 'Presario' started.

            Can anyone please tell me what is causing the backup job to abort? Thanks.
          • minorroadskill
            ... than 5 backup ... is aborted. ... Thanks. Like a lot of backup routines, it seems to abort after hitting an error threshold, around 20. I don t know if
            Message 5 of 14 , Apr 10, 2005
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              --- In nslu2-linux@yahoogroups.com, Jim Tucker <rjtucker@g...> wrote:
              > On Mar 21, 2005 10:25 AM, Ian White <iandavidwhite@h...> wrote:
              > > It was while investigating this unslung f/w and trying to add more
              than 5 backup
              > > jobs
              > > that I first encountered the backup job lock-up/hang problem
              >
              > Our slug backs up our Compaq desktop computer daily, but the backup
              > job frequently hangs. I would like to find out what it causing the
              > job to hang so frequently. Here is a typical excerpt from the backup
              > log:
              >
              > 03/08 13:51:26 Backup: Job 'Presario' ended.
              > 03/08 13:51:26 Backup: Maximum errors occur in job 'Presario', job
              is aborted.
              > 03/08 13:50:26 Backup: Error occurs in job 'Presario', cannot access
              > source file '//presario/forbackup/Installables/MS Publisher 2000/O9PB
              > (E)/PFILES/MSOFF
              > ...
              > <<skipping nineteen similar errors>>
              > ...
              > 03/08 12:30:31 Backup: Error occurs in job 'Presario', cannot access
              > source file '//presario/forbackup/Installables/MS Publisher 2000/O9PB
              > (E)/PFILES/MSOFF
              > 03/08 12:00:00 Backup: Job 'Presario' started.
              >
              > Can anyone please tell me what is causing the backup job to abort?
              Thanks.

              Like a lot of backup routines, it seems to abort after hitting an
              error threshold, around 20. I don't know if this is configurable
              somehow, but I've never found a way. Of course, the slug software
              doesn't know the severity of the errors either, or have any way to be
              told what kind of errors to ignore.

              Your particular error seems to relate to file access privileges, or
              maybe files being locked or open on the Presario. The slug knows the
              file is there, but when it tries to read (copy) it, Windows is not
              letting it do so.

              For this kind of backup, you might find that using client-side backup
              software with a richer configuration interface to be more suitable.
              Windows has included one for ages, although it is not always
              installed by default, and can be manually installed from the Windows
              CD. To fully avoid file-locking issues in Windows-based backups,
              you'll need better, non-free backup software. For image backups
              performed entirely in Windows in the background, I highly recommend
              Acronis TrueImage.

              Also, if you're serious about ensuring no one nasty erases the backups
              on your NSLU2 disk, get a 2nd disk (same size or bigger) and set up
              the disk-to-disk function in the NSLU2 web admin. The 2nd disk will
              not be available to the network, only to the NSLU2. Treat the 2nd
              disk like a tape if you want to do rotations. The NSLU2 in this setup
              has to be the best backup solution available for so little money.

              MinorRoadsKill
            • Jim Tucker
              ... Actually, I was hoping to avoid client-side backup. Fully automated server-side backup was one of the selling points that prompted me to buy the NSLU2 in
              Message 6 of 14 , Apr 11, 2005
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                On Apr 10, 2005 10:31 AM, minorroadskill <minorroadskill@...> wrote:
                > For this kind of backup, you might find that using client-side backup
                > software with a richer configuration interface to be more suitable.

                Actually, I was hoping to avoid client-side backup. Fully automated
                server-side backup was one of the selling points that prompted me to
                buy the NSLU2 in the first place.


                > To fully avoid file-locking issues in Windows-based backups,
                > you'll need better, non-free backup software.

                Why should this be necessary? Shouldn't any backup software
                gracefully skip over the files it cannot read and (optionally) report
                errors to the appropriate log file and/or e-mail address?
              • minorroadskill
                ... Most file-based backups abort after a threshold, to avoid larger problems that could be potentially causing them to simply skip and report tons of files.
                Message 7 of 14 , Apr 15, 2005
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                  --- In nslu2-linux@yahoogroups.com, Jim Tucker <rjtucker@g...> wrote:
                  > On Apr 10, 2005 10:31 AM, minorroadskill <minorroadskill@y...> wrote:

                  > > To fully avoid file-locking issues in Windows-based backups,
                  > > you'll need better, non-free backup software.
                  >
                  > Why should this be necessary? Shouldn't any backup software
                  > gracefully skip over the files it cannot read and (optionally) report
                  > errors to the appropriate log file and/or e-mail address?

                  Most file-based backups abort after a threshold, to avoid larger
                  problems that could be potentially causing them to simply skip and
                  report tons of files. While some are more flexible than others,
                  NSLU2's is very unflexible, given it's primitive interface.

                  To solve the problem of locked files, image-based backups are usually
                  better than file-based backups (the slug's remote backups are
                  file-based). So, client-side image-based backup software is what's
                  needed, and unfortunately, none I know of are free.

                  Another approach is to more narrowly define what you want backed up by
                  the slug, trying to avoid files likely to be locked up (e.g. offline
                  data files). Non-data files are likely better left to image-based
                  backup anyway.

                  MinorRoadsKill
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