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[NTB] Re: Suggestions for next NoteTab upgrade.

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  • Michiel van Minnen
    Send reply to: notetab@egroups.com Date sent: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 10:14:01 -0500 To: notetab@egroups.com From: Mark Pulver
    Message 1 of 21 , Oct 18, 1999
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      Send reply to: notetab@egroups.com
      Date sent: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 10:14:01 -0500
      To: notetab@egroups.com
      From: Mark Pulver <mpulver@...>
      Subject: [NTB] Suggestions for next NoteTab upgrade.

      >
      > I have two that would make me just SOOOO happy...
      >
      >
      > - Columnar block marking. The only editor that I've used that does this
      > is Multi-Edit from American Cybernetics. It is indispensable for me
      > when doing markups and edits on columnar text like reports or even
      > directory listings.

      Have you tried the Block submenu on the Modify menu ? It doesn't handle tabs
      like I'd like it to, but I can cut and paste blocks just as well as in Multi-
      Edit (I've only seen an old version of that).
      >
      > - Virtual cursor (or another way to say this is "being able to cursor
      > into virtual space). Not having this is a good sized annoyance for me,
      > but I love so much else about NoteTab that I deal with it.

      Menu 'view', item 'Options', tabblad 'Document' item 'scroll past end of line'

      When I've checked that, I can move my cursor beyond the end of lines.
      I don't know if you mean that, although I've noticed this doesn't work right
      with Windows NT.

      Met vriendelijke groet,

      Michiel van Minnen
      --
      Bit-IC - driven by Interaction
      Rivium 1e Straat 35
      2909 LE Capelle aan den IJssel
      tel: (010) 2 350 350
      fax: (010) 2 350 399

      For more interaction: http://www.bit-ic.nl
    • Mark Pulver
      Jody (01:09 PM 10/18/1999) wrote: Hi Jody, ... Ummm.... Nothing personal, but... Yuk ... :) Although NoteTab is not capable of drawing rectangular selections,
      Message 2 of 21 , Oct 18, 1999
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        Jody (01:09 PM 10/18/1999) wrote:

        Hi Jody,

        >>- Columnar block marking. The only editor that I've used that does this
        >> is Multi-Edit from American Cybernetics.
        >
        >Another you have used that has it is NoteTab. :-) See Modify |
        >Block and Help. Block like you normally would and choose
        >Copy|Cut|Paste. The visable selection itself will not block
        >where you left your your "right mouse down" at, but NoteTab knows
        >where you blocked to.

        Ummm.... Nothing personal, but... "Yuk"... :)

        Although NoteTab is not capable of drawing rectangular selections, it
        determines the block coordinates based on the selection's start and end
        coordinates.

        [snip]

        this feature may be improved in a future version of the program.

        PLEASE!!!! :)


        The ideal here (for me) is to not have to head for the mouse at all.

        - set "Block Marking Mode"
        - The cursor location is a corner of the block
        - Move cursor to what will be the opposite corner, block is
        drawn appropriately.
        - Cut/Paste/Copy should "know" that I have a columnar block marked.
        I shouldn't have to use separate commands to define how I want to
        deal with the block.


        (love ya' Eric!)


        And, just to be accurate, I've since been told that Brief and CodeWright do
        this as well...


        Thanks for the consideration...

        Mark

        ________________________________________________________________
        Stuff: http://www.midiwall.com
      • Mark Pulver
        Michiel van Minnen (08:21 PM 10/18/1999) wrote: Hi Michiel, ... I just responded to Jody about this, but in short, I knew this was there... It s just not
        Message 3 of 21 , Oct 18, 1999
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          Michiel van Minnen (08:21 PM 10/18/1999) wrote:

          Hi Michiel,

          >> - Columnar block marking. The only editor that I've used that does this
          >> is Multi-Edit from American Cybernetics. It is indispensable for me
          >> when doing markups and edits on columnar text like reports or even
          >> directory listings.
          >
          >Have you tried the Block submenu on the Modify menu ? It doesn't handle tabs
          >like I'd like it to, but I can cut and paste blocks just as well as in Multi-
          >Edit (I've only seen an old version of that).

          I just responded to Jody about this, but in short, I knew this was there...
          It's just not intuitive (for me) because it takes special keystrokes and
          the highlighting drives me nuts. :(

          I's SOOOO close to being dead-on to what I personally would like to see...

          The Multi-Edit method is what I prefer... You can see the rectangular
          highlighting, and don't have to distinguish between cut/paste/delete for
          columnar or stream or line blocking.


          >> - Virtual cursor (or another way to say this is "being able to cursor
          >> into virtual space). Not having this is a good sized annoyance for me,
          >> but I love so much else about NoteTab that I deal with it.
          >
          >Menu 'view', item 'Options', tabblad 'Document' item 'scroll past end of
          >line'
          >
          >When I've checked that, I can move my cursor beyond the end of lines.
          >I don't know if you mean that, although I've noticed this doesn't work right
          >with Windows NT.

          Wow... Where has THAT been all my life!

          That was it... Thanks Michiel!


          Mark

          ________________________________________________________________
          Stuff: http://www.midiwall.com
        • Jody
          Hi Mark, ... It sure would save a lot of Yuk mail. ;-) c ya, jody I can only please one person a day. Today is obviously not your day. Tomorrow doesn t look
          Message 4 of 21 , Oct 18, 1999
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            Hi Mark,

            > Ummm.... Nothing personal, but... "Yuk"... :)
            >
            > Although NoteTab is not capable of drawing rectangular
            > selections... this feature may be improved in a future version
            > of the program.
            >
            > PLEASE!!!! :)

            It sure would save a lot of "Yuk" mail. ;-)

            c ya,
            jody

            I can only please one person a day.
            Today is obviously not your day.
            Tomorrow doesn't look good either. 8?D

            http://www.sureword.com/sojourner/
          • Jody
            Hi Mark, ... Perhaps I am missing something here, but how would NoteTab now if I wanted a block or the whole selection without me telling it I was in block
            Message 5 of 21 , Oct 18, 1999
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              Hi Mark,

              > The Multi-Edit method is what I prefer... You can see the
              > rectangular highlighting, and don't have to distinguish between
              > cut/paste/delete for columnar or stream or line blocking.

              Perhaps I am missing something here, but how would NoteTab now if
              I wanted a block or the whole selection without me telling it I
              was in block mode? That would still be nice though to go into
              block mode then use there regular Copy/Cut/Paste. And... of
              course we would need compliment scripting code too. Well, as
              long as I'm dreaming... <bg>

              I believe though since it is "functional yukie" that there are
              other much more wished for items on the wish list to deal with.

              c ya,
              jody

              I can only please one person a day.
              Today is obviously not your day.
              Tomorrow doesn't look good either. 8?D

              http://www.sureword.com/sojourner/
            • Mark Pulver
              Hey Dere Again! ... Because of setting a specific block mode before marking the block. I had said this before: - set Block Marking Mode - The cursor location
              Message 6 of 21 , Oct 18, 1999
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                Hey Dere Again!

                >> The Multi-Edit method is what I prefer... You can see the
                >> rectangular highlighting, and don't have to distinguish between
                >> cut/paste/delete for columnar or stream or line blocking.
                >
                >Perhaps I am missing something here, but how would NoteTab now if
                >I wanted a block or the whole selection without me telling it I
                >was in block mode? That would still be nice though to go into
                >block mode then use there regular Copy/Cut/Paste. And... of
                >course we would need compliment scripting code too. Well, as
                >long as I'm dreaming... <bg>

                Because of setting a specific block mode before marking the block.

                I had said this before:

                - set "Block Marking Mode"
                - The cursor location is a corner of the block
                - Move cursor to what will be the opposite corner, block is
                drawn appropriately.
                - Cut/Paste/Copy should "know" that I have a columnar block marked.
                I shouldn't have to use separate commands to define how I want to
                deal with the block.

                But should of said this:

                - set "Columnar Block Marking Mode"
                - ...

                My apologies.


                In Multi-Edit, you declare up front how you want the editor to work with
                the block by how you mark the block. So, in my ME profile, I:

                ALT-C to start a column block
                ALT-L to start a line block (marks full lines at a time)
                SHIFT_CURSOR to mark a stream block (this is the normal "CUA" style
                marking)

                Multi-Edit is implemented within it's own compiled macro language, so it's
                easy to do stuff like this. For example, when the above is done, a global
                variable gets set defining the type of block that's marked. This is then
                later read by the cut/paste/delete macros so that they know up front how
                the block was marked, thus implying how to deal with the block.

                This extends past dealing with a single block. You can do things like
                cut/copy various types of blocks to numbered buffers, and then when you
                paste back from the buffers, the block type is preserved.

                Now, within the core of Multi-Edit, there *are* separate routines for
                handling the various block types, but all of that is abstracted by a common
                cut/paste/delete routine. For example, there's also the macro'd ability to
                "move" a block, which is just an abstracted cut/paste.


                You may ask why I don't just stay with ME... Well.. :) The ME UI is
                incredibly cluttered these days, and that's annoying for me. You can turn
                most everything off, but there is just SOOO much stuff buried in the menus
                and in places that you wouldn't think to look for it, and no way of
                globally setting some common things, that it's a nightmare trying to deal
                with it all.

                I moved to NoteTab a year ago or more, because it doesn't clutter, can deal
                with insane file sizes, understands HTML, and is pretty fast.

                I grew up with Wordstar 1.26 in non-document mode on CP/M. I'm not one for
                a lot of flash. :)


                >I believe though since it is "functional yukie" that there are
                >other much more wished for items on the wish list to deal with.

                Yeah, I know... :(


                Thanks for the chatter!

                Mark

                ________________________________________________________________
                Stuff: http://www.midiwall.com
              • Kay Roath
                10/18/1999 11:33 AM Mark Pulver wrote ... Also, if you do a block option without anything marked, you ll get a dialog that asks for row (already filled in with
                Message 7 of 21 , Oct 18, 1999
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                  10/18/1999 11:33 AM Mark Pulver wrote
                  > >>- Columnar block marking. The only editor that I've used that does this
                  > >> is Multi-Edit from American Cybernetics.
                  > >
                  > >Another you have used that has it is NoteTab. :-) See Modify |
                  > >Block and Help. Block like you normally would and choose
                  > >Copy|Cut|Paste. The visable selection itself will not block
                  > >where you left your your "right mouse down" at, but NoteTab knows
                  > >where you blocked to.

                  Also, if you do a block option without anything marked, you'll get a
                  dialog that asks for row (already filled in with current), # of chrs
                  across & # of columns down.

                  --- Grandma Kay ---
                • Kay Roath
                  10/18/1999 8:01 AM Scott Glasgow wrote ... I m sure we ll be able to do that fairly easily & I m anxiously awaiting the opportunity! I find that most of what
                  Message 8 of 21 , Oct 18, 1999
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                    10/18/1999 8:01 AM Scott Glasgow wrote

                    > I would like to chime in with a suggestion of my own. I'm currently using
                    > TreePad for multi-level outlining (primarily tracking phone traffic/follow
                    > ups over time). It would be nice if the new version of NoteTab provided a
                    > means to automatically convert TreePad outlines to the new NoteTab
                    > multi-level outline format.

                    I'm sure we'll be able to do that fairly easily & I'm anxiously awaiting
                    the opportunity! I find that most of what I need in tree form doesn't
                    easily transfer to TreePad so I currently convert to NoteTab outline & then
                    use a clip (posted to the clips list recently) to convert to TreePad. I'll
                    be SO happy when I can do it all in NoteTab!

                    --- Grandma Kay ---
                  • Kay Roath
                    10/18/1999 3:36 PM Mark Pulver wrote ... I don t know if this is implemented but NoteTab does have an option to use WordStar key mapping Options|Advanced|Key
                    Message 9 of 21 , Oct 18, 1999
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                      10/18/1999 3:36 PM Mark Pulver wrote
                      > In Multi-Edit, you declare up front how you want the editor to work with
                      > the block by how you mark the block. So, in my ME profile, I:

                      > ALT-C to start a column block
                      > ALT-L to start a line block (marks full lines at a time)
                      > SHIFT_CURSOR to mark a stream block (this is the normal "CUA" style
                      > marking)

                      I don't know if this is implemented but NoteTab does have an option to
                      use WordStar key mapping Options|Advanced|Key Mapping. Should be close to
                      a lot of Multi-Edit since they all copied WS :) I went from WS to Qedit &
                      could map all my keys too so don't remember just what WS keys did what but
                      wasn't much of a hassle to switch.

                      --- Grandma Kay ---
                    • Jody
                      Hi Mark, ... It s not as bad as it sounds. :) *My guess* is we have a slight chance for the next maintenance release, but a very good chance for the Gold and
                      Message 10 of 21 , Oct 19, 1999
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                        Hi Mark,

                        >I had said this before:
                        >
                        > - set "Block Marking Mode"

                        > >I believe though since it is "functional yukie" that there are
                        > >other much more wished for items on the wish list to deal with.
                        >
                        > Yeah, I know... :(

                        It's not as bad as it sounds. :) *My guess* is we have a slight
                        chance for the next maintenance release, but a very good chance
                        for the Gold and perhaps version 5.

                        Eric sent out on his announcement list: (my emphasis)

                        "Finally, we would like to thank you for your strong support.
                        NoteTab has become very popular over the years, especially as a
                        result of word-of-mouth recommendations from so many satisfied
                        users. Also, it is thanks to NoteTab users that NoteTab Pro has
                        won the "People's Choice" award two years in a row. *This really
                        encourages us to continue improving NoteTab so that it fulfills
                        the needs of our users*."

                        There's hope!-)
                      • Mark Pulver
                        ... Oh, I KNEW someone liked me! ... Thanks Jody! Mark
                        Message 11 of 21 , Oct 19, 1999
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                          Jody (02:19 PM 10/19/1999) wrote:

                          >Hi Mark,
                          >
                          >>I had said this before:
                          >>
                          >> - set "Block Marking Mode"
                          >
                          >> >I believe though since it is "functional yukie" that there are
                          >> >other much more wished for items on the wish list to deal with.
                          >>
                          >> Yeah, I know... :(
                          >
                          >It's not as bad as it sounds. :) *My guess* is we have a slight
                          >chance for the next maintenance release, but a very good chance
                          >for the Gold and perhaps version 5.

                          Oh, I KNEW someone liked me!


                          >Eric sent out on his announcement list: (my emphasis)
                          >
                          >"Finally, we would like to thank you for your strong support.
                          >NoteTab has become very popular over the years, especially as a
                          >result of word-of-mouth recommendations from so many satisfied
                          >users. Also, it is thanks to NoteTab users that NoteTab Pro has
                          >won the "People's Choice" award two years in a row. *This really
                          >encourages us to continue improving NoteTab so that it fulfills
                          >the needs of our users*."
                          >
                          >There's hope!-)

                          Thanks Jody!


                          Mark
                        • Michael Richards
                          mark pulver wrote ... This suggestion would mean you would need to do three steps to cut/copy etc a block rather than two with the
                          Message 12 of 21 , Feb 15, 2000
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                            mark pulver <mpulve-@...> wrote
                            >
                            > The ideal here (for me) is to not have to head for the mouse at all.
                            >
                            > - set "Block Marking Mode"
                            > - The cursor location is a corner of the block
                            > - Move cursor to what will be the opposite corner, block is
                            > drawn appropriately.
                            > - Cut/Paste/Copy should "know" that I have a columnar block marked.
                            > I shouldn't have to use separate commands to define how I want to
                            > deal with the block.
                            >
                            This suggestion would mean you would need to do three steps to cut/copy
                            etc
                            a block rather than two with the current method (which BTW does not
                            require the mouse). IMHO this seems like it would be slower to use.
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