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RE: [NTB] Basic Clip "Move cursor position" question

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  • John Shotsky
    The menu commands can be tricky. The command is not necessarily the words in the menu, but what is shown in the balloon help for that command. That got me a
    Message 1 of 11 , Nov 22, 2012
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      The menu commands can be tricky. The command is not necessarily the words in the menu, but what is shown in the balloon
      help for that command. That got me a few times. It's very hard for me to remember to look at that first.

      Regards,
      John
      RecipeTools Web Site: <http://recipetools.gotdns.com/> http://recipetools.gotdns.com/

      From: notetab@yahoogroups.com [mailto:notetab@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Marcelo Bastos
      Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2012 16:21
      To: notetab@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [NTB] Basic Clip "Move cursor position" question


      Interviewed by CNN on 22/11/2012 21:48, Alec Burgess told the world:
      >
      > Most of them can be replaced with ^!Menu {main
      > entry}/{sub-entry}/sub-sub-entry (where entries containing blanks must
      > be enclosed in quotes.

      I suppose so. But then, I don't see what's the difference, conceptually,
      in accessing a feature that's not native to the Clip language via
      keyboard shortcut or via menus, in terms of reliability. I have vague
      memories of attempting to use ^!Menu and giving up that approach as
      unsatisfactory for some reason. I have to test it again to see if it's
      any improvement. I must say that I never had problems using keyboard
      shortcuts in clips...
      > For: Shift+DOWN (extend selection by one line) I think ^!Select nnn
      > and ^!Select +/-nnn specifically ^!Select +1 will do what you want.
      > Also don't forget ^!Toolbar tooltip-text eg. ^!Toolbar "Split Lines"
      > (not checked but assume it also requires quotes) (... later ... maybe
      > not per the examples in Help for ^!Toolbar)
      I don't think so. The help file is pretty specific about ^!Select +nnn
      enlarging the selection by nnn CHARACTERS, not lines.

      --
      MCBastos

      This message has been protected with the 2ROT13 algorithm. Unauthorized use will be prosecuted under the DMCA.
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      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Alec Burgess
      @John / @Marcello interspersed: ... @John - What is balloon help for the command ? I m not seeing this, unless you mean the text tooltips for Toolbar buttons.
      Message 2 of 11 , Nov 22, 2012
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        @John / @Marcello interspersed:
        On 2012-11-22 19:30, John Shotsky wrote:
        > The menu commands can be tricky. The command is not necessarily the words in the menu, but what is shown in the balloon
        > help for that command. That got me a few times. It's very hard for me to remember to look at that first.
        @John - What is "balloon help for the command"? I'm not seeing this,
        unless you mean the text tooltips for Toolbar buttons. Can you give an
        example where this causes confusion?
        >
        >
        > From: Marcelo Bastos
        > Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2012 16:21
        >
        >
        > Interviewed by CNN on 22/11/2012 21:48, Alec Burgess told the world:
        >> Most of them can be replaced with ^!Menu {main
        >> entry}/{sub-entry}/sub-sub-entry (where entries containing blanks must
        >> be enclosed in quotes.
        > I suppose so. But then, I don't see what's the difference, conceptually,
        > in accessing a feature that's not native to the Clip language via
        > keyboard shortcut or via menus, in terms of reliability. I have vague
        > memories of attempting to use ^!Menu and giving up that approach as
        > unsatisfactory for some reason. I have to test it again to see if it's
        > any improvement. I must say that I never had problems using keyboard
        > shortcuts in clips...
        @Marcello: I don't know how often ^!Keyboard commands cause problems and
        require delays but then again I almost never use them. If memory serves
        they are most often required when trying to send commands to other
        programs where a loop checking to see if focus has been gained is
        sometimes recommended.

        I guess it depends on the speed and load on the computer when the clip
        is run.
        >> For: Shift+DOWN (extend selection by one line) I think ^!Select nnn
        >> and ^!Select +/-nnn specifically ^!Select +1 will do what you want.
        >> Also don't forget ^!Toolbar tooltip-text eg. ^!Toolbar "Split Lines"
        >> (not checked but assume it also requires quotes) (... later ... maybe
        >> not per the examples in Help for ^!Toolbar)
        > I don't think so. The help file is pretty specific about ^!Select +nnn
        > enlarging the selection by nnn CHARACTERS, not lines.
        *You are absolutely correct about this*. I read the help about ^!select
        where nnn without sign defines number of lines but didn't read carefully
        enough. Perhaps something could be done with a combination of ^!SelectTo
        row:col and ^$getrow$ and a calc to increment but unless I was running
        into problems with my clip appearing to randomly fail I'd probably just
        go with ^!Keyboard DOWN too :-)
      • John Shotsky
        Yes, it is the balloon help for the toolbar buttons. I dug around and realize that I have only used one Menu command, all the rest are Toolbar commands. So, it
        Message 3 of 11 , Nov 22, 2012
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          Yes, it is the balloon help for the toolbar buttons. I dug around and realize that I have only used one Menu command,
          all the rest are Toolbar commands. So, it doesn't apply to Menu commands, but it does apply to toolbar commands.

          Regards,
          John
          RecipeTools Web Site: <http://recipetools.gotdns.com/> http://recipetools.gotdns.com/

          From: notetab@yahoogroups.com [mailto:notetab@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Alec Burgess
          Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2012 17:01
          To: notetab@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [NTB] Basic Clip "Move cursor position" question


          @John / @Marcello interspersed:
          On 2012-11-22 19:30, John Shotsky wrote:
          > The menu commands can be tricky. The command is not necessarily the words in the menu, but what is shown in the
          balloon
          > help for that command. That got me a few times. It's very hard for me to remember to look at that first.
          @John - What is "balloon help for the command"? I'm not seeing this,
          unless you mean the text tooltips for Toolbar buttons. Can you give an
          example where this causes confusion?
          >
          >
          > From: Marcelo Bastos
          > Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2012 16:21
          >
          >
          > Interviewed by CNN on 22/11/2012 21:48, Alec Burgess told the world:
          >> Most of them can be replaced with ^!Menu {main
          >> entry}/{sub-entry}/sub-sub-entry (where entries containing blanks must
          >> be enclosed in quotes.
          > I suppose so. But then, I don't see what's the difference, conceptually,
          > in accessing a feature that's not native to the Clip language via
          > keyboard shortcut or via menus, in terms of reliability. I have vague
          > memories of attempting to use ^!Menu and giving up that approach as
          > unsatisfactory for some reason. I have to test it again to see if it's
          > any improvement. I must say that I never had problems using keyboard
          > shortcuts in clips...
          @Marcello: I don't know how often ^!Keyboard commands cause problems and
          require delays but then again I almost never use them. If memory serves
          they are most often required when trying to send commands to other
          programs where a loop checking to see if focus has been gained is
          sometimes recommended.

          I guess it depends on the speed and load on the computer when the clip
          is run.
          >> For: Shift+DOWN (extend selection by one line) I think ^!Select nnn
          >> and ^!Select +/-nnn specifically ^!Select +1 will do what you want.
          >> Also don't forget ^!Toolbar tooltip-text eg. ^!Toolbar "Split Lines"
          >> (not checked but assume it also requires quotes) (... later ... maybe
          >> not per the examples in Help for ^!Toolbar)
          > I don't think so. The help file is pretty specific about ^!Select +nnn
          > enlarging the selection by nnn CHARACTERS, not lines.
          *You are absolutely correct about this*. I read the help about ^!select
          where nnn without sign defines number of lines but didn't read carefully
          enough. Perhaps something could be done with a combination of ^!SelectTo
          row:col and ^$getrow$ and a calc to increment but unless I was running
          into problems with my clip appearing to randomly fail I'd probably just
          go with ^!Keyboard DOWN too :-)



          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Robert Bull
          ... AB *You are absolutely correct about this*. I read the help about AB ^!select where nnn without sign defines number of lines but didn t AB read
          Message 4 of 11 , Nov 25, 2012
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            Friday, November 23, 2012, 1:00:35 AM, Alec Burgess wrote:

            >>> For: Shift+DOWN (extend selection by one line) I think ^!Select
            >>> nnn and ^!Select +/-nnn specifically ^!Select +1 will do what you

            >> I don't think so. The help file is pretty specific about ^!Select
            >> +nnn enlarging the selection by nnn CHARACTERS, not lines.

            AB> *You are absolutely correct about this*. I read the help about
            AB> ^!select where nnn without sign defines number of lines but didn't
            AB> read carefully enough. Perhaps something could be done with a
            AB> combination of ^!SelectTo row:col and ^$getrow$ and a calc to
            AB> increment but unless I was running into problems with my clip
            AB> appearing to randomly fail I'd probably just go with ^!Keyboard
            AB> DOWN too :-)

            I was using ^!Keyboard CTRL+HOME in certain clips, then discovered the
            JUMP command, ^!Jump DOC_START that does exactly the same thing. Does
            it achieve the same end by different means? It's detailed under the
            (dense) Help page "Select, Copy, and Insert Text" The full paragraph
            says:

            ---------
            ^!Jump nnn or ^!Jump +/-nnn or
            ^!Jump [LINE_START|LINE_END][SELECT_START|SELECT_END][TEXT_START|TEXT_END]

            Moves cursor to the indicated position. If the parameter is a number
            without a sign (+/-), the command will treat it as the line position
            from the start of the document. When a sign is used, the command will
            move the cursor a relative number of lines from the current position;
            a positive number moving it towards the end of the text and a negative
            number towards the start. If you don't specify a line number, you can
            use one of the following settings:
            LINE_START or LINE_END: places cursor at the beginning or end of the
            current line. This feature treats a line as if word wrap is turned
            off.
            SELECT_START or SELECT_END: places cursor at the beginning or end of
            the selection and unselects the text.
            TEXT_START or TEXT_END: moves to start or end of a plain document or
            the content of an Outline heading.
            DOC_START or DOC_END: moves to start or end of any kind of document.
            ---------

            which offers another approach to ^!KeyBoard DOWN


            --
            Regards,

            Robert Bull
            mailto:barlennan@...
          • John Shotsky
            ^!Jump 1 moves to the home position also. Regards, John RecipeTools Web Site: http://recipetools.gotdns.com/ From:
            Message 5 of 11 , Nov 25, 2012
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              ^!Jump 1 moves to the home position also.

              Regards,
              John
              RecipeTools Web Site: <http://recipetools.gotdns.com/> http://recipetools.gotdns.com/

              From: notetab@yahoogroups.com [mailto:notetab@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Robert Bull
              Sent: Sunday, November 25, 2012 12:56
              To: Alec Burgess
              Subject: Re: [NTB] Basic Clip "Move cursor position" question


              Friday, November 23, 2012, 1:00:35 AM, Alec Burgess wrote:

              >>> For: Shift+DOWN (extend selection by one line) I think ^!Select
              >>> nnn and ^!Select +/-nnn specifically ^!Select +1 will do what you

              >> I don't think so. The help file is pretty specific about ^!Select
              >> +nnn enlarging the selection by nnn CHARACTERS, not lines.

              AB> *You are absolutely correct about this*. I read the help about
              AB> ^!select where nnn without sign defines number of lines but didn't
              AB> read carefully enough. Perhaps something could be done with a
              AB> combination of ^!SelectTo row:col and ^$getrow$ and a calc to
              AB> increment but unless I was running into problems with my clip
              AB> appearing to randomly fail I'd probably just go with ^!Keyboard
              AB> DOWN too :-)

              I was using ^!Keyboard CTRL+HOME in certain clips, then discovered the
              JUMP command, ^!Jump DOC_START that does exactly the same thing. Does
              it achieve the same end by different means? It's detailed under the
              (dense) Help page "Select, Copy, and Insert Text" The full paragraph
              says:

              ---------
              ^!Jump nnn or ^!Jump +/-nnn or
              ^!Jump [LINE_START|LINE_END][SELECT_START|SELECT_END][TEXT_START|TEXT_END]

              Moves cursor to the indicated position. If the parameter is a number
              without a sign (+/-), the command will treat it as the line position
              from the start of the document. When a sign is used, the command will
              move the cursor a relative number of lines from the current position;
              a positive number moving it towards the end of the text and a negative
              number towards the start. If you don't specify a line number, you can
              use one of the following settings:
              LINE_START or LINE_END: places cursor at the beginning or end of the
              current line. This feature treats a line as if word wrap is turned
              off.
              SELECT_START or SELECT_END: places cursor at the beginning or end of
              the selection and unselects the text.
              TEXT_START or TEXT_END: moves to start or end of a plain document or
              the content of an Outline heading.
              DOC_START or DOC_END: moves to start or end of any kind of document.
              ---------

              which offers another approach to ^!KeyBoard DOWN

              --
              Regards,

              Robert Bull
              mailto:barlennan@... <mailto:barlennan%40yahoo.co.uk>



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