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[NTB] Bug?

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  • Wren McMains
    There is a sequence which allows changes to .clb files to get lost, but I m having trouble finding a repeatable case. I ve seen it before, and it just
    Message 1 of 11 , Aug 25, 1998
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      There is a sequence which allows changes to .clb files to get
      lost, but I'm having trouble finding a repeatable case. I've
      seen it before, and it just happened with Final Beta 5b.

      I have a .clb file open for editing and this file is the active
      clip library. Normally saving the .clb updates the active
      library, but in this case it doesn't. (Upon more testing I now
      find that saving the changes never seems to update the active
      library now, although I know it did before -- is it suppose to?)

      Then you do something like changing the active library and it
      asks if you want to save the changes--you answer "yes" (even
      though the open .clb file doesn't think it has been edited.)
      At this point the open .clb file still has the changes you
      made--you can see them. However, if you close the .clb (no
      questions asked, because it doesn't think it has been edited)
      the edits are lost.

      I'm pretty sure it has something to do with moving a clip to
      the beginning of the library, but I can't seem to recreate the
      problem. (I think that somehow the

      = V5 MultiLine NoSorting TabWidth=30

      line gets lost in the active library, but it was still there in
      the backup of the .clb which had all my other edits so I'm not
      sure exactly what happened.)

      It would seem to me that it's a bug if you can see your changes,
      close your file, and they are gone when you re-open it. (However,
      I'm willing to believe this only happens if I've done something
      stupid first.)

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    • Dan Knight
      I ve have a similar if not the same problem.(beta 5) For example: if I change the spelling of a header in the active .clb file, when I save the change the
      Message 2 of 11 , Aug 25, 1998
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        I've have a similar if not the same problem.(beta 5)

        For example: if I change the spelling of a header in the active .clb file, when I save the change the change does not appear in the
        clipbook listing. Press F4 twice and the change is shown or switch to another .clb file and switch back and the change is shown.

        I,ve also noticed if I install beta5 with no existing ini file that this problem does not show up until after closing and restarting
        notetab.


        Another problem which may be related:
        Jody Adairs "Master Clip" (below) doesn't seem to work in Beta5. It works fine as is in Beta3. This problem seems to be centered on
        the first line of the clip if I remove that line and run the clip with the headers in the clipboard it works in Beta5.

        H="Master Clip"
        ^!KeyBoard Shift+F6 Shift+F10 B
        ^!ToolBar New Document
        ^!ToolBar Paste
        ^!InsertText ]
        ^!Replace "^p" >> "|" WAS
        ^!Jump Doc_Start
        ^!InsertText H="Do-A-Clip"^p^!Clip ?[Execute what clip==
        ^!Replace "?[" >> "?[(H=^?[What size do you want to make the list box=25])" WS
        ^!Find "?[" SB
        ^!Jump Select_Start
        ^!InsertText ^
        ^!Replace "|]" >> "]" S
        ^!Goto ^?[Do you want the blank spaces between your clips removed==_No^=Skip|Yes^=Next]
        ^!Replace "| |" >> "|" WAS
        ^!Goto ^?{Add it to the current Clipbook Library?=_Yes^=Next|No^=Close}
        ^!IfCancel Close
        ^!ToolBar Copy All
        ^!KeyBoard Shift+F6 Shift+F10 A
        :Close
        ^!^?{Discard the temporary document==_Yes^=Close Discard|No^=}

        Dan Knight




        -----Original Message-----
        From: Wren McMains <wren@...>
        To: notetab@... <notetab@...>
        Date: Tuesday, August 25, 1998 10:05 am
        Subject: [NTB] Bug?


        >There is a sequence which allows changes to .clb files to get
        >lost, but I'm having trouble finding a repeatable case. I've
        >seen it before, and it just happened with Final Beta 5b.
        >
        >I have a .clb file open for editing and this file is the active
        >clip library. Normally saving the .clb updates the active
        >library, but in this case it doesn't. (Upon more testing I now
        >find that saving the changes never seems to update the active
        >library now, although I know it did before -- is it suppose to?)
        >
        >Then you do something like changing the active library and it
        >asks if you want to save the changes--you answer "yes" (even
        >though the open .clb file doesn't think it has been edited.)
        >At this point the open .clb file still has the changes you
        >made--you can see them. However, if you close the .clb (no
        >questions asked, because it doesn't think it has been edited)
        >the edits are lost.
        >
        >I'm pretty sure it has something to do with moving a clip to
        >the beginning of the library, but I can't seem to recreate the
        >problem. (I think that somehow the
        >
        > = V5 MultiLine NoSorting TabWidth=30
        >
        >line gets lost in the active library, but it was still there in
        >the backup of the .clb which had all my other edits so I'm not
        >sure exactly what happened.)
        >
        >It would seem to me that it's a bug if you can see your changes,
        >close your file, and they are gone when you re-open it. (However,
        >I'm willing to believe this only happens if I've done something
        >stupid first.)
        >
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        >


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      • Kay Roath
        25.08.1998 9:04 AM Wren McMains wrote ... the = V5 line has to be at the top of your file in order for NoteTab to recognize it as a Clipbook library. Sounds
        Message 3 of 11 , Aug 25, 1998
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          25.08.1998 9:04 AM Wren McMains wrote

          > I'm pretty sure it has something to do with moving a clip to
          > the beginning of the library, but I can't seem to recreate the
          > problem. (I think that somehow the

          > = V5 MultiLine NoSorting TabWidth=30

          > line gets lost in the active library, but it was still there in
          > the backup of the .clb which had all my other edits so I'm not
          > sure exactly what happened.)

          the = V5 line has to be at the top of your file in order for
          NoteTab to recognize it as a Clipbook library. Sounds like
          you might have pasted something over it & then saved. In that
          case, you've created a file with the same name as your Library
          file but it's not a Clipbook anymore. NoteTab doesn't know what
          to do since the changes don't go with the active Clipbook. If
          you save the active Clipbook, you overwrite the text file you
          made. If you don't save the active Clipbook, you have a text
          file that won't be a Clipbook until you edit it & put the =V5
          line back in as the first line with a blank line under it.

          --- Grandma Kay - NoteTab Tips & Clips weekly Newsletter
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        • Jody Adair
          Hi Dan and Wren, ... I run into this when I do not have the Clip editor open at the same time as the .clb. I normally keep it open when editing .clb s, but if
          Message 4 of 11 , Aug 25, 1998
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            Hi Dan and Wren,

            >For example: if I change the spelling of a header in the active .clb file, when I save the change the change does not appear in the

            I run into this when I do not have the Clip editor open at the
            same time as the .clb. I normally keep it open when editing
            .clb's, but if not I switch to another .clb and answer yes to
            the "Save" question. Seems if I close the .clb before doing the
            save, then all is lost, but I have not looked at that close enough
            to see if it is fact.

            >Another problem which may be related:
            >Jody Adairs "Master Clip"
            >
            >H="Master Clip"
            >^!KeyBoard Shift+F6 Shift+F10 B

            It works fine in the latest beta for me. Copy back in from the
            post you sent and when it askes to replace existing say yes.
            Please snip out the parts of posts that are not needed for us to
            understand the thread.

            Happy NoteTabbin',
            Jody
            http://www.mindspring.com/~kjb1611/notetab/notetab.htm

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          • Dan Knight
            Everything seems normal whenever Clip Edit area is used. The behavior I refered to is when editing a .clb from the main editor area. When beta5 is installed,
            Message 5 of 11 , Aug 25, 1998
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              Everything seems normal whenever Clip Edit area is used. The behavior I refered to is when editing a .clb from the main editor area.

              When beta5 is installed, not exited yet, no ini file in NoteTab directory, it is just like it was in beta3. Exit program & restart
              its different.


              -----Original Message-----

              Date: Tuesday, August 25, 1998 4:57 pm
              Subject: Re[2]: [NTB] Bug?


              >
              >If you have Show Headers marked & make your changes in the Clip Edit area
              >(Clips tab), they don't show until you move to another clip. If you don't
              >have headers showing & use Edit Header, changes show up when you finish the
              >edit. Win95 fb5b
              >
              >>-----Original Message-----
              >>Date: Tuesday, August 25, 1998 4:47 pm
              >>Subject: Re: [NTB] Bug?
              >>
              >>I've have a similar if not the same problem.(beta 5)
              >>
              >>For example: if I change the spelling of a header in the active .clb file, when >>I save the change the change does not appear in
              the
              >>clipbook listing. Press F4 twice and the change is shown or switch to another >>.clb file and switch back and the change is shown.
              >>
              >>I,ve also noticed if I install beta5 with no existing ini file that this problem does not show up until after closing and
              restarting
              >>notetab.
              >>Another problem which may be related:
              >>Jody Adairs "Master Clip" (below) doesn't seem to work in Beta5. It works fine as is in Beta3. This problem seems to be centered
              on
              >>the first line of the clip if I remove that line and run the clip with the headers in the clipboard it works in Beta5.
              >>
              >>H="Master Clip"
              >>^!KeyBoard Shift+F6 Shift+F10 B
              >>^!ToolBar New Document
              >>^!ToolBar Paste
              >>.......
              >>
              >>Dan Knight
              >>
              >>>-----Original Message-----
              >>>Date: Tuesday, August 25, 1998 10:05 am
              >>>Subject: [NTB] Bug?
              >>>
              >>>There is a sequence which allows changes to .clb files to get
              >>>lost, but I'm having trouble finding a repeatable case. I've
              >>>seen it before, and it just happened with Final Beta 5b.
              >>>
              >>>I have a .clb file open for editing and this file is the active
              >>>clip library. Normally saving the .clb updates the active
              >>>library, but in this case it doesn't. (Upon more testing I now
              >>>find that saving the changes never seems to update the active
              >>>library now, although I know it did before -- is it suppose to?)
              >>>
              >>>Then you do something like changing the active library and it
              >>>asks if you want to save the changes--you answer "yes" (even
              >>>though the open .clb file doesn't think it has been edited.)
              >>>At this point the open .clb file still has the changes you
              >>>made--you can see them. However, if you close the .clb (no
              >>>questions asked, because it doesn't think it has been edited)
              >>>the edits are lost.
              >>>



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            • Dan Knight
              I think I finally understand. If I close NoteTab with a .clb open in the editor, when I restart NoteTab the .clb file in the editor window is treated as a
              Message 6 of 11 , Aug 25, 1998
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                I think I finally understand.

                If I close NoteTab with a .clb open in the editor, when I restart NoteTab the .clb file in the editor window is treated as a
                docunent until I use "Edit Clip" from the shortcut menu or "Open As Document" from the combo box. Then it acts, as what I was
                calling normal, in my previous post.

                Your patience with this NoteTab newbe is appreciated:

                Thanks
                Dan Knight


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              • Jody Adair
                Hi Dan, ... It it reopens because it is open when you clsoe NoteTab and under the General tab in options you are optioned to have your files do that. :) When
                Message 7 of 11 , Aug 25, 1998
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                  Hi Dan,

                  >If I close NoteTab with a .clb open in the editor, when I
                  >restart NoteTab the .clb file in the editor window is treated
                  >as a docunent until I use "Edit Clip" from the shortcut menu
                  >or "Open As Document" from the combo box. Then it acts, as
                  >what I was calling normal, in my previous post.

                  It it reopens because it is open when you clsoe NoteTab and
                  under the General tab in options you are optioned to have your
                  files do that. :)

                  When the .clb file is open in the editor window, that is, when
                  you see its name on the tab bar, it is opened as a document.

                  When you are in the Clipbook and you do an "Edit clip..." the
                  "Clip Editor" opens which has its own tab that says "Clip" or
                  something to that effect. The clip that you see in main edit
                  window is a part of the .clb, also known as a Library, or
                  clipbook Library.

                  Now, it is possible to have both the .clb open as a document,
                  that is the whole file just like you would open about any file,
                  and the "Clip Editor" at the same time. The latter being a
                  portion of the first. That is what I do when I am editing the
                  .clb so I can make sure the changes are being made, well it helps
                  ensure me when I see the "Clip" tab changed colours when saved. :)

                  Hope this helped.

                  Happy NoteTabbin',
                  Jody
                  http://www.mindspring.com/~kjb1611/notetab/notetab.htm

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                • Wren McMains
                  Thanks Dan, I m glad you took this thread over since I can only attach to the net this week via long distance phone call. ... Haven t tried this as yet, but it
                  Message 8 of 11 , Aug 26, 1998
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                    Thanks Dan, I'm glad you took this thread over since I can only
                    attach to the net this week via long distance phone call.

                    > If I close NoteTab with a .clb open in the editor, when I
                    > restart NoteTab the .clb file in the editor window is treated as a
                    > docunent until I use "Edit Clip" from the shortcut menu or
                    > "Open As Document" from the combo box. Then it acts, as what I was
                    > calling normal, in my previous post.

                    Haven't tried this as yet, but it certainly sounds consistent
                    with what I noted in the latest beta -- it was nicer in beta3.

                    Eric: comments? Were we cheating in the past? I almost never
                    used "Edit Clip" and was very happy -- if I saved a .clb file which
                    was active, the library was updated. We can learn to behave ourselves
                    if you tell us how, but you know we always use the technique
                    involving the fewest mouse clicks, or keystrokes.

                    There is still some case related to all this where you can totally
                    lose all your edits to a .clb file (the old version becomes current
                    and the edited version becomes the .BAK file) -- the good news is
                    now that I know this, I can quickly rename the .BAK file and I
                    won't loose anything again.

                    -Wren

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                  • Michael Gerholdt
                    Hi, T Church, I use NoteTab Pro for hours a day, virtually every day, on NT4 Server at work and Win98 (Win95 in the past) at home. I have never had the
                    Message 9 of 11 , Jun 29, 2000
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                      Hi, T Church,

                      I use NoteTab Pro for hours a day, virtually every day, on NT4 Server at
                      work and Win98 (Win95 in the past) at home.

                      I have never had the experience you are describing.

                      Perhaps you could provide more information about your computer - operating
                      system, CPU, RAM, disk space still free, etcetera. How many apps do you have
                      open when this is happening and what might they be?

                      Someone else might have experinced this in some particular cases.

                      Regards,
                      Michael Gerholdt

                      churcht wrote:

                      > I have just started using Note Tab. I will be editing a document,
                      > when the line I am editing will get corrupted and the entire computer
                      > locks up. Any ideas what could be causing this?
                    • churcht@bellatlantic.net
                      ... operating ... you have ... I am using a celeron 300A overclocked to 450 Mhz, 128 Megs of RAM, over 1 gig free on the partion that notetab is on. The only
                      Message 10 of 11 , Jul 4, 2000
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                        --- In notetab@egroups.com, "Michael Gerholdt" <gerholdt@f...> wrote:

                        > Perhaps you could provide more information about your computer -
                        operating
                        > system, CPU, RAM, disk space still free, etcetera. How many apps do
                        you have
                        > open when this is happening and what might they be?
                        >
                        > Someone else might have experinced this in some particular cases.
                        >

                        I am using a celeron 300A overclocked to 450 Mhz, 128 Megs of RAM,
                        over 1 gig free on the partion that notetab is on. The only other
                        app loaded the last time this happened was Internet Explorer
                        5.00.2014.0216 I was bouncing back and forth to check out how the
                        changes looked.
                      • Jody
                        Hi Churcht, ... Although there are a number of reasons that could cause what you are experiencing, I would start looking into a video problem myself.
                        Message 11 of 11 , Jul 4, 2000
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                          Hi Churcht,

                          > I have just started using Note Tab. I will be editing a
                          > document, when the line I am editing will get corrupted and the
                          > entire computer locks up. Any ideas what could be causing
                          > this?
                          >
                          > I am using a celeron 300A overclocked to 450 Mhz, 128 Megs of
                          > RAM, over 1 gig free on the partion that notetab is on. The
                          > only other app loaded the last time this happened was Internet
                          > Explorer 5.00.2014.0216 I was bouncing back and forth to check
                          > out how the changes looked.

                          Although there are a number of reasons that could cause what you
                          are experiencing, I would start looking into a video problem
                          myself. Sometimes a thorough Scandisk and Defrag will clear
                          things up. I suggested to one user to turn down his hardware
                          acceleration a notch and that cleared the problem he was having
                          (which was not the same as you). It turned out that he had
                          multiple monitors (3) and it was a Diamond Viper V550 (which is
                          based on the nVIDIA RIVA TNT video controller according to him)
                          that was turned down a notch.

                          I understand you only had IE5 and NoteTab running at the time,
                          but here is some general experiences of mine. I do know I start
                          getting strange display problems when my resources get low and
                          programs will even lock up on me. A prime example is when I am
                          working with graphics in PSP using the browse mode with large
                          folders of images, browsing in Windows Explorer in folders that
                          have a large amount of .bmp/.ico that both display the image
                          here, and viewing web pages with images bouncing back and forth
                          between them all. My system will get real sluggish and the next
                          thing I usually see happen it something does not crash (which is
                          fairly rare) is all my icons in Windows Explorer the system tray,
                          etc. all start changing to different images, usually all to the
                          same one.

                          Eric wrote in various posts the past:

                          Windows has basically three types of memories: RAM, Virtual Memory
                          (your hard disk), and a small section of RAM used for storing
                          Windows object handles. When Windows runs out of system resources,
                          it may have plenty of RAM left, but it runs out of space for
                          storing handles. This is often when funny things start happening
                          like the tab bar displaying blank tabs, or the Toolbar showing no
                          icons.

                          Only libraries open in the Clipbook window will occupy RAM. The
                          more items, and the larger the Clips, the more RAM it uses up.
                          Running Clips that create variables will take another chunk from
                          RAM. Closing the Clipbook window will free several handles which
                          occupy the third type of memory.

                          Large amounts of Favorites and long lists slow down the loading
                          of NoteTab and use up a fair amount of RAM.

                          A large Undo limit size. What is considered large is largely
                          dependant on how many documents you open. Should rarely be a
                          problem if you open less than 50 documents at a time.

                          A large number of Libraries on the button bar would also take up
                          extra resources. Each button requires a Windows handle. Tools on
                          the Toolbar and the Clipbar also use the mentioned handles.

                          Display problems is usually the first visible sign of being low on
                          the resources it takes to paint the different objects in a window.
                          Sometimes, a better video card with more memory can help or better
                          drivers.

                          Happy NoteTab'n,
                          Jody Adair

                          The NoteTabbers Assistant Page
                          http://www.sureword.com/notetab

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