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Loga saga - Chapter 1

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  • Haukur Þorgeirsson
    A few things I noticed - not that I could produce a better text :) ... Doesn t quite have the right ring to it and I m not sure if the syntax works... ...
    Message 1 of 8 , Dec 29, 2005
      A few things I noticed - not that I could
      produce a better text :)


      > Fyr löngu liðit
      > á leið vetrar
      > langt ok langt heðan...

      Doesn't quite have the right ring to it
      and I'm not sure if the syntax works...


      > Hér hefr upp skemmtiliga sögu um
      > Störnustríð ok er rituð eptir fornum myndum

      Excellent. Typo in "Stjörnustríð".


      > Jabbi hét konungr, er kallaðr var höttr.
      > Hann réð fyrir Tötvinjum, grimmr ok gráðugr.
      > Ekki var hann fríðr maðr at yfirlitum. Átti
      > fjölð þræla ok ambátta.

      Excellent.


      > Nass er ok konungr nefndr. Hann réð fyrir Gungnaríki.
      > Hann var ágætr ok einhvers konar marmennill. Djúpraddaðr
      > var hann ok frœkn ok mjök skapstyggr.

      Excellent.


      > Dróttning sú réð fyrir Nabbúi, er Amidala hét, allra kvenna
      > spökust ok fríðust sýnum. Vinsæl var hon alþýðu ok þótti
      > öllum langt at bera yfir flestum meyjum henni samtíða, bæði
      > um speki ok snjallræðum ok allsháttar atgørvi, er þá váru
      > göfgum konum tíð. Skjaldmær var hon ok, þá sem nauðr um stœði.
      > Hon var inn mesti skörungr.

      Exceptionally good. A joy to read. A few things I'm not sure about.
      I'm not used to seeing "vinsæl(l) alþýðu" without a preposition.

      "Hann var snauðr at fé ok eigi mjök vinsæll af alþýðu
      manna." - Hænsa-Þóris saga

      "Fór hann um vetrinn víða um landit ok vingaðist mjök við
      stórmennit, var hann ok vinsæll af alþýðu." - Heimskringla

      "Hann var ofrhugi mikill, vinsæll við alþýðu ok gamall
      at aldri." - Göngu-Hrólfs saga

      "Ok er Þórðr óx upp var hann mikill ok sterkr, vænn ok
      stórmannligr, harðgerr, óvæginn við alla þá sem honum var
      lítt við en vinsæll við alþýðu." - Þórðar saga hreðu

      I'm also used to "bera af" rather than "bera at".

      "[S]vá berr þat af öðrum sverðum sem þú berr
      af öðrum konungasonum." - Hjálmþés saga ok Ölvis


      > Í þann tíma var ósamþykki á milli Nabbúa, er mennskir
      > menn váru, ok Gungna. Ár áttu orrostur miklar þeira
      > á milli, en þat var fyrir löngu liðit, ok sátu nú um
      > kyrrt hvárirtveggja.

      Good. "Ár áttu orrostur miklar þeira á milli" seems a
      slightly weird way to put it.


      > Palpatínus hefir hersir heitit. Hann var lögsögumaðr
      > Koruskantþingis; þat er alþingi vetrarbrautarinnar.
      > Hann var ríkr maðr ok slœgr ok flærðsamr ok inn sterkasti
      > at þeim afli, er myrkhlið heitir; ok þat er sumra manna
      > sögn, at hann kynni mart fyrir sér. Berserkr sá var með
      > hirð hans, er Máli darðr hét.

      Excellent. "þeim afli" > "því afli"

      Kveðja,
      Haukur
    • llama_nom
      ... when I saw ... than a zip ... able to ... Thanks, Haukur, glad you liked it! The formulaic style of these sagas, especially when it comes to introductions
      Message 2 of 8 , Dec 30, 2005
        --- In norse_course@yahoogroups.com, Haukur Þorgeirsson
        <haukurth@h...> wrote:
        >
        > > http://www.oe.eclipse.co.uk/nom/dog.htm
        >
        > This is a stunning accomplishment. My jaw dropped to the floor
        when I saw
        > this. Would you be willing to put it up as an html file (rather
        than a zip
        > file) if we gave it a bit of a proof-read first? I'd like to be
        able to
        > point my friends to this.


        Thanks, Haukur, glad you liked it! The formulaic style of these
        sagas, especially when it comes to introductions and battles, makes
        it easy to cobble a story together from bits and pieces; that's all
        I did really. The reason I uploaded it as a zip file was so that
        Google wouldn't pick up on it and confuse people like me who might
        be searching for ON phrases. Then again, I'm sort of torn between
        mischief and sense of responsibility here. I wonder which will
        win... By the way, EB has suggested as alternative surnames:
        Himinfari or Loptgengill. I'm tempted to go with Lopt-, for
        aliteration, and -gengill to echo the official translation.


        > > Fyr löngu liðit
        > > á leið vetrar
        > > langt ok langt heðan...
        >
        > Doesn't quite have the right ring to it
        > and I'm not sure if the syntax works...


        (1) Trying to remember where this came from, my first thought
        was: "sveinn ok sveinn, hverjum ertu sveini um borinn" (as I´ve been
        going round menacing people with that all week)--but then it struck
        me: "sá hon vítt ok um vítt". But if it doesn´t work in this
        context, could we just use: langt, langt í brott? Google turns
        up "Endur fyrir löngu á fjarlægri vetrarbraut langt langt í
        burtu..." Are adjectives ever doubled in this way with no
        conjunction in ON for intensity? Otherwise, what about: "skammt
        vasa skeið heðan".

        (2) Is this any better: Vinsæl var hon af alþýðu ok þótti öllum
        langt (at?) bera af flestum meyjum henni samtíða,


        > "Ár áttu orrostur miklar þeira á milli" seems a
        > slightly weird way to put it.


        (3) How about: Fyrrum áttusk þeir við orrostur miklar,

        ok munu þeir eigask við orrostur
        (Sögubrot)

        Llama Nom
      • Haukur Þorgeirsson
        ... I agree. Loga saga loptgengils sounds good. ... It s Fyr löngu liðit which seems to me like an aberrant start of a sentence. I could be wrong. ...
        Message 3 of 8 , Dec 30, 2005
          > Thanks, Haukur, glad you liked it! The formulaic style of these
          > sagas, especially when it comes to introductions and battles, makes
          > it easy to cobble a story together from bits and pieces; that's all
          > I did really. The reason I uploaded it as a zip file was so that
          > Google wouldn't pick up on it and confuse people like me who might
          > be searching for ON phrases. Then again, I'm sort of torn between
          > mischief and sense of responsibility here. I wonder which will
          > win... By the way, EB has suggested as alternative surnames:
          > Himinfari or Loptgengill. I'm tempted to go with Lopt-, for
          > aliteration, and -gengill to echo the official translation.

          I agree. "Loga saga loptgengils" sounds good.


          > (1) Trying to remember where this came from, my first thought
          > was: "sveinn ok sveinn, hverjum ertu sveini um borinn" (as I´ve been
          > going round menacing people with that all week)--but then it struck
          > me: "sá hon vítt ok um vítt". But if it doesn´t work in this
          > context, could we just use: langt, langt í brott? Google turns
          > up "Endur fyrir löngu á fjarlægri vetrarbraut langt langt í
          > burtu..." Are adjectives ever doubled in this way with no
          > conjunction in ON for intensity? Otherwise, what about: "skammt
          > vasa skeið heðan".

          It's "Fyr löngu liðit" which seems to me like an aberrant start of a
          sentence. I could be wrong.


          > (2) Is this any better: Vinsæl var hon af alþýðu ok þótti öllum
          > langt (at?) bera af flestum meyjum henni samtíða,

          Yes. I'd say without the "at" but my tastes may be modern.


          > (3) How about: Fyrrum áttusk þeir við orrostur miklar,
          >
          > ok munu þeir eigask við orrostur
          > (Sögubrot)

          Okay!

          Kveðja,
          Haukur
        • llama_nom
          ... a ... Ah, I see, so langt ok langt heðan is okay? This is where I found it [ http://www.hi.is/~eybjorn/ugm/skindex/hll.html ], Barn at aldri þykkik
          Message 4 of 8 , Dec 30, 2005
            --- In norse_course@yahoogroups.com, Haukur Þorgeirsson
            <haukurth@h...> wrote:
            >
            > It's "Fyr löngu liðit" which seems to me like an aberrant start of
            a
            > sentence. I could be wrong.

            Ah, I see, so 'langt ok langt heðan' is okay? This is where I found
            it [ http://www.hi.is/~eybjorn/ugm/skindex/hll.html ],

            Barn at aldri
            þykkik brögnum vera,
            þó hefk forn tíðendi [fregit];
            Öðlinga sögur
            þykkjumk [inna kunna],
            fyr löngu liðit.

            ...although now I see on closer inspection that Finnur Jónsson has
            an alternate reading:

            öðlinga sögur
            þykkjumk [segja kunna]
            fyr löngu liðnar.

            Which I took to mean: "They considered me a child in years though I
            have heard ancient lore. Tales of kings I think I can tell [of
            events] long ago." (Or if it's an adjective describing the
            stories: "I think I can tell long ago tales of kings.") I just
            imagined it was a more emphatic way of saying 'fyrir löngu'.
            Otherwise, maybe take a leaf out of the "tree-man's" book and begin
            with:

            Þat var fyr löngu
            á leið vetrar
            langt ok langt heðan / í brott.
          • Haukur Þorgeirsson
            ... That s better :) I don t think í brott helps. And I m a bit skeptical about á leið vetrar though of course the grammar is fine. Eysteinn had some
            Message 5 of 8 , Dec 30, 2005
              > Which I took to mean: "They considered me a child in years though I
              > have heard ancient lore. Tales of kings I think I can tell [of
              > events] long ago." (Or if it's an adjective describing the
              > stories: "I think I can tell long ago tales of kings.") I just
              > imagined it was a more emphatic way of saying 'fyrir löngu'.
              > Otherwise, maybe take a leaf out of the "tree-man's" book and begin
              > with:
              >
              > Þat var fyr löngu
              > á leið vetrar
              > langt ok langt heðan / í brott.

              That's better :) I don't think "í brott" helps. And I'm a bit skeptical
              about "á leið vetrar" though of course the grammar is fine. Eysteinn had
              some suggestions which I assume he shared with you as well as me :)

              "vas þat fyr löngu" - Haustlöng

              As for the repetition with "ok" I'm sure that's fine. Certainly the phrase
              "æ ok æ" is well documented.

              "helldr til hins at þeir kveliz ok farizt æ ok æ" - Agnesar saga

              "En þair annsuaraþu þa, et ny ok niþar vari e ok e" - Guta saga

              Then there's this:

              "Vaki ok æ vaki vina höfuð" - Bjarkamál

              Kveðja,
              Haukur
            • llama_nom
              ... skeptical ... Eysteinn had ... About this verse? Not yet: I hope my cunning spam-interceptors aren t getting overzealous. Is the problem that it sounds
              Message 6 of 8 , Dec 31, 2005
                --- In norse_course@yahoogroups.com, Haukur Þorgeirsson
                <haukurth@h...> wrote:
                >
                > > Þat var fyr löngu
                > > á leið vetrar
                > > langt ok langt heðan / í brott.
                >
                > That's better :) I don't think "í brott" helps. And I'm a bit
                skeptical
                > about "á leið vetrar" though of course the grammar is fine.
                Eysteinn had
                > some suggestions which I assume he shared with you as well as me :)


                About this verse? Not yet: I hope my cunning spam-interceptors
                aren't getting overzealous. Is the problem that it sounds like the
                verb 'líða á'?

                Þat vas fyr löngu
                á leiðu sonar
                Vindsvals fjarri víðs.

                Thinks: 'á leiðu leiða línu leiðar' "on a way {of the irksomeness of
                the {rope of the way = snake} = winter} = galaxy" -- if that wasn't
                not much too alliterative and ambiguous.

                Ln
              • lille lilli
                Hi! I wonder if somebody is interested in runes... I have some problems with the Kensington Runestone and do not manage to find infos... Does anyone can help
                Message 7 of 8 , Jan 2 5:34 AM
                  Hi!
                  I wonder if somebody is interested in runes... I have some problems with the
                  Kensington Runestone and do not manage to find infos...

                  Does anyone can help me plz?

                  Thanks

                  Lilli Hel

                  _________________________________________________________________
                  Ricerche online più semplici e veloci con MSN Toolbar!
                  http://toolbar.msn.it/
                • Jakob Feddersen
                  Greetings Lilli, http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Aegean/6726/kensington/kensington.htm Try this link, gives you A LOT of info :) YIS, ISOLFR ... From:
                  Message 8 of 8 , Jan 2 7:52 AM
                    Greetings Lilli,


                    http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Aegean/6726/kensington/kensington.htm

                    Try this link, gives you A LOT of info :)

                    YIS,

                    ISOLFR

                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: norse_course@yahoogroups.com [mailto:norse_course@yahoogroups.com] On
                    Behalf Of lille lilli
                    Sent: Monday, January 02, 2006 6:35 AM
                    To: norse_course@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: [norse_course] runes

                    Hi!
                    I wonder if somebody is interested in runes... I have some problems with the
                    Kensington Runestone and do not manage to find infos...

                    Does anyone can help me plz?

                    Thanks

                    Lilli Hel

                    _________________________________________________________________
                    Ricerche online più semplici e veloci con MSN Toolbar!
                    http://toolbar.msn.it/



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