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Re: [norse_course] álfr

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  • Michael Horgen
    Hi Sygyrd, The other words in the list ending in ur were pronounced correctly (the ones I looked at anyway). Perhaps she is reading a different form of the
    Message 1 of 7 , Oct 3, 2013
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      Hi Sygyrd,

      The other words in the list ending in ur were pronounced correctly (the ones I looked at anyway). Perhaps she is reading a different form of the word and it has been incorrectly matched with this one.

      I'm presuming you have a pronunciation guide for Icelandic and are using that site to practise with.
      In some respects the (reconstructed) pronunciations for ON in the grammar books are easier to follow than using modern Icelandic when reading. But of course it is handy having living speakers too.

      All the best,
      Michael

      Sent from Yahoo!7 Mail on Android



      From: Sygyrd Sygyrdson <sygyrd@...>;
      To: <norse_course@yahoogroups.com>;
      Subject: [norse_course] álfr
      Sent: Wed, Oct 2, 2013 9:59:34 PM

       

      So, I go to look up how to pronounce álfr / álfur at
       
      and the lady there pronounces it with a "sh" sound at the end instead of an r... I ran into the same thing with a number of other words.  Does anyone have any idea what is going on here?  It doesn't seem to be consistent.

      -Sygyrd

    • Brian M. Scott
      At 5:59:34 PM on Wednesday, October 2, 2013, Sygyrd ... In that position Icelandic has a voiceless /r/. The actual realization varies. The man pronouncing
      Message 2 of 7 , Oct 4, 2013
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        At 5:59:34 PM on Wednesday, October 2, 2013, Sygyrd
        Sygyrdson wrote:

        > So, I go to look up how to pronounce álfr / álfur at
        > http://www.forvo.com/languages-pronunciations/is/alphabetically/page-11/

        > and the lady there pronounces it with a "sh" sound at the
        > end instead of an r... I ran into the same thing with a
        > number of other words. Does anyone have any idea what is
        > going on here? It doesn't seem to be consistent.

        In that position Icelandic has a voiceless /r/. The actual
        realization varies. The man pronouncing <átakanlegur> has a
        very clear voiceless trill; the voiceless trill at the end
        of <atkvæðisbær> isn’t quite so clear, but it’s still very
        readily identifiable. If you listen closely to the woman
        pronouncing <Ásgrímur>, you can still hear the trill, but
        it’s beginning to blur into an ‘eshy’ hiss. The man
        pronouncing <allrar> has a similar realization, the the
        woman pronouncing <álfur> has lost the trilling altogether:
        all that remains is a fricative similar (but not identical)
        to English \sh\.

        Brian
      • Ruarigh Dale
        It sounds like an aspirated ‘r’ to me. Icelandic aspirates many consonants, so it is not too surprising to hear it there. Different people will do this to
        Message 3 of 7 , Oct 5, 2013
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          It sounds like an aspirated ‘r’ to me. Icelandic aspirates many consonants, so it is not too surprising to hear it there. Different people will do this to varying extents, so perhaps her pronunciation is extreme compared to the other samples on the site, which is why it sounds odd (I cannot confirm this because I did not listen to others).

           

          Hope this helps,

          R

           


          From: Sygyrd Sygyrdson <sygyrd@...>;
          To: <norse_course@yahoogroups.com>;
          Subject: [norse_course] álfr
          Sent: Wed, Oct 2, 2013 9:59:34 PM

           

           

          So, I go to look up how to pronounce álfr / álfur at

           

          and the lady there pronounces it with a "sh" sound at the end instead of an r... I ran into the same thing with a number of other words.  Does anyone have any idea what is going on here?  It doesn&apos;t seem to be consistent.


          -Sygyrd

           

        • Brian M. Scott
          At 10:48:38 PM on Thursday, October 3, 2013, Michael Horgen ... No. Apparently you didn’t read my answer to Sygyrd. She’s pronouncing , and her
          Message 4 of 7 , Oct 5, 2013
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            At 10:48:38 PM on Thursday, October 3, 2013, Michael Horgen
            wrote:

            > The other words in the list ending in ur were pronounced
            > correctly (the ones I looked at anyway). Perhaps she is
            > reading a different form of the word and it has been
            > incorrectly matched with this one.

            No. Apparently you didn’t read my answer to Sygyrd. She’s
            pronouncing <álfur>, and her pronunciation is within the
            range of normal variation, though it is well towards one end
            of that range.

            Brian
          • David Simecek
            I think it is just unvoiced r which is a normal thing in final position (and also before unvoiced consonants like for example in erta ) David To:
            Message 5 of 7 , Oct 5, 2013
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              I think it is just unvoiced "r" which is a normal thing in final position (and also before unvoiced consonants like for example in "erta")
              David


              To: norse_course@yahoogroups.com
              From: ruarigh@...
              Date: Sat, 5 Oct 2013 19:45:36 +0100
              Subject: RE: [norse_course] álfr

               

              It sounds like an aspirated ‘r’ to me. Icelandic aspirates many consonants, so it is not too surprising to hear it there. Different people will do this to varying extents, so perhaps her pronunciation is extreme compared to the other samples on the site, which is why it sounds odd (I cannot confirm this because I did not listen to others).

               

              Hope this helps,

              R

               


              From: Sygyrd Sygyrdson <sygyrd@...>;
              To: <norse_course@yahoogroups.com>;
              Subject: [norse_course] álfr
              Sent: Wed, Oct 2, 2013 9:59:34 PM

               

               

              So, I go to look up how to pronounce álfr / álfur at

               

              and the lady there pronounces it with a "sh" sound at the end instead of an r... I ran into the same thing with a number of other words.  Does anyone have any idea what is going on here?  It doesn&apos;t seem to be consistent.


              -Sygyrd

               


            • Michael Horgen
              Thanks Brian, I d sent a reply earlier but it didn t appear until after your explanation. I haven t been around Icelandic speakers for a while, but will be
              Message 6 of 7 , Oct 5, 2013
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                Thanks Brian,

                I'd sent a reply earlier but it didn't appear until after your explanation. I haven't been around Icelandic speakers for a while, but will be listening for this pronunciation when I am.

                I find these variations in language interesting.

                All the best,
                Michael

                Sent from Yahoo!7 Mail on Android



                From: Brian M. Scott <bm.brian@...>;
                To: Michael Horgen <norse_course@yahoogroups.com>;
                Subject: Re: [norse_course] álfr
                Sent: Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:58:15 PM

                 

                At 10:48:38 PM on Thursday, October 3, 2013, Michael Horgen
                wrote:

                > The other words in the list ending in ur were pronounced
                > correctly (the ones I looked at anyway). Perhaps she is
                > reading a different form of the word and it has been
                > incorrectly matched with this one.

                No. Apparently you didn’t read my answer to Sygyrd. She’s
                pronouncing <álfur>, and her pronunciation is within the
                range of normal variation, though it is well towards one end
                of that range.

                Brian

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