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Thanks, Brian!

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  • Fred and Grace Hatton
    Thanks for your help, Brian. The original Old Norse texts that you send are becoming scrambled by gremlins in cyberspace. I get the norse course via email
    Message 1 of 83 , Sep 15, 2010
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      Thanks for your help, Brian. The original Old Norse texts that you send are
      becoming scrambled by gremlins in cyberspace.
      I get the norse course via email digest and this is how it is coming
      through. It makes it much more difficult to see the corrections.
      Grace

      Brian wrote:

      > Hefir hún það í hug sér að gera þá hluti nokkura er honum
      > þætti eigi betur.

      > She has that in her mind to do then some things which
      > to-him was thought not better.

      > She has in her mind to do then some things which to him
      > seemed not better.

      > She has that in her mind to do then certain things which
      > would-seem to him not better (ie that he would rather she
      > did not do).

      Rob & Grace: The <-i> ending of <þætti> combined with the
      front umlaut of <ó> in <þótta> to <æ> (ON <Å">) shows that it
      has to be a subjunctive, specifically, the past subjunctive,
      Alan's 'would-seem'.

      > Skip stóð uppi á Borðeyri í Hrútafirði.

      > A ship was-laid-up-ashore at Plank-gravelbank in
      > Hrut's-firth.

      > A ship was laid up at Bordeyri in Hrut's Firth.

      > A ship was-laid-up ashore at Borðeyrr in Hrútafjörðr
      > (Ramsâ?T Fjord).

      If it were 'Hrút's firth', the first element would have to
      be the genitive of the name <Hrútr>, which is <Hrúts>.
      <Hrúta> is, as Alan translated it, the gen. plur. of the
      common noun <hrútr> 'a ram'. An explanation of both names
      is given in 'Vatnsdæla saga':

      Hann fór norðr um sumarit í landaleitun, ok fór upp
      Norðrárdal ok kom ofan í eyðifjörð einn; ok um daginn, er
      þeir fóru með þeim firði, þá hlupu ór fjalli at þeim tveir
      sauðir. Ãzat váru hrútar. Ãzá mælti Ingimundur: 'Ãzat mun
      vel fallit at þessi fjörðr heiti Hrútafjörðr'. Síðan komu
      þeir í fjörðinn ok gerði þá þoku mikla. Ãzeir komu á eyri
      eina, fundu þeir þar borð stórt nýrekit. Ãzá mælti
      Ingimundr: 'Ãzat mun ætlat at vér skylim hér örnefni gefa,
      ok mun þat haldast, ok köllum eyrina Borðeyri'.

      In the summer he travelled north on a voyage of discovery,
      and went up Norðrárdal and came down into a certain
      desolate fjord; and during the day, when they travelled
      along the fjord, two sheep ran towards them from a fell.
      They were rams. Then Ingimund said: 'It would be fitting
      that this fjord be called Rams' Fjord'. After that they
      came into the fjord, and then a great fog came up. They
      came to a certain gravel-bank and found there a large
      plank recently drifted ashore. Then Ingimund said: 'That
      will signify that we should bestow a place-name here, and
      it will last, and we'll call the gravel-bank Plank Bank'.

      Of course it's not at all unlikely that the explanations
      were devised after the fact to explain the names.
      (<Borðeyri> certainly sounds better than 'Plank Bank'!)

      > Melkorka talar við Ã"laf son sinn þá er þau finnast að hún
      > vill að hann fari utan að vitja frænda sinna göfugra "því
      > að eg hefi það satt sagt að Mýrkjartan er að vísu faðir
      > minn og er hann konungur Íra.

      > Melkora speaks with her son Olaf then when they
      > meet-one-another that she wants that he go away to visit
      > his noble kinsmen "because I had that true said that
      > Myrkjartan is surely my father and he is an Irish king.
      > (Z. vitja - v. frænda sinna, to visit one's kinsmen)

      > Melkorka talks with Olaf her son then when they meet that
      > she wants that he go abroad and visit his more noble
      > kinsmen "because I have told truly that Myrkjartan is
      > certainly my father and he is king of Ireland.

      The <r> in <göfugra> is inflectional, not a sign of the
      comparative: in this usage <vitja> takes the genitive, and
      <göfugra> is the masc. gen. plur. of <göfugr>. The
      comparative shows syncope (of the <u>): <gofgari>.

      > Melkorka talks to Ã"lafr, her son, when they
      > meet-each-other that she wants that he goes abroad to
      > visit his noble kinsmen â?obecause I have truly said that,
      > that Mýrkjartan is assuredly my father and he is King of
      > (the) Irish.


      > Og ef það nemur við förinni að þú þykist hafa fé of lítið
      > þá mun eg heldur það til vinna að giftast Ãzorbirni ef þú
      > ræðst þá til ferðar heldur en áður því að eg ætla að hann
      > leggi fram vöruna svo sem þú kannt þér þörf til ef hann
      > náir ráðahag við mig.

      > And if that is-a-hindrance-to that it seems to you (to)
      > have too little money then I will get-married to Thorbirn
      > if you are resolved then to journey previously so that I
      > intend that he put forward wares so that you can need to
      > if he get marriage with me.

      > And if it is a hindrance (Z nema 8) with the journey that
      > you think yourself to have too little money, then I will
      > rather that to work to marry Thorbjorn if you decided then
      > for (the) journey rather than before?? because I intend
      > that he pays for the wares in advance?? such as you know
      > you (have) need of if he gets marriage with me.

      > And if that is a hindrance to the journey that you
      > bethink-yourself to have too little property, then I will
      > be all-the-more ready to marry Ãzorbjörn if you then
      > undertake (the) journey than before, because I expect that
      > he would-put forward the wares (goods) such as you know of
      > a need for yourself (?), if he gets marriage with me.

      I'd go with Rob's and Grace's 'money' for <fé> here, or
      possibly a more general 'means'.

      The part starting with <þá mun eg heldur> is a bit of a
      bear. Another edition of the saga punctuates it like this:

      ... þá mun ek heldr þat til vinna at giptast Ãzorbirni, ef
      þú ræðst þá til ferðar, heldr en áðr; ...

      Here the editor seems to take <heldr en áðr> as a repetition
      and extension of the earlier <heldr>:

      ... then I will be more ready to do that, to marry
      Ãzorbjörn, if you then undertake [the] journey, more
      [ready] than before; ...

      This makes sense, since she refused him before. The rest:

      því at ek ætla at hann leggi fram vöruna, svá sem þú kannt
      þér þörf til, ef hann náir ráðahag við mik; ...

      Zoëga s.v. <kunna> (6), <kunna sér e-t> 'to understand, have
      clear knowledge of (something as concerning oneself or
      touching one's own interest)', does seem to fit here, though
      I'd translate that bit a little differently even when trying
      to be pretty literal:

      for I expect that he would put forward [= supply] such
      wares as you know for yourself a need of, if he obtains
      marriage with me.

      More idiomatically, 'for I expect that he would supply
      whatever you know yourself to need'.

      Brian

      Fred and Grace Hatton
      Hawley Pa
    • Brian M. Scott
      At 7:24:40 AM on Thursday, June 23, 2011, Fred & Grace ... It s very much my pleasure; it helps me keep my hand in, and I ve learned a great deal from working
      Message 83 of 83 , Jun 23, 2011
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        At 7:24:40 AM on Thursday, June 23, 2011, Fred & Grace
        Hatton wrote:

        > Thank you for all your help with Laxdaela Saga and Star
        > Wars!

        It's very much my pleasure; it helps me keep my hand in, and
        I've learned a great deal from working on the tricky bits.

        Brian
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