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RE: [newsml] NewsML 1.2 XML Schema and namespace

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  • Laurent LE MEUR
    Did this question had some conclusion? Could the following alternative solution be studied? Because moving all elements of NewsML 1.x to a namespace is
    Message 1 of 5 , Sep 24, 2007
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      Did this question had some conclusion?

      Could the following alternative solution be studied?

      Because moving all elements of NewsML 1.x to a namespace is practically making the implementation non backward compatible, the result of the move is called NewsML 1.3.

      We know that - formally speaking, because it is not backward compatible - it should be called 2.0, but the ambiguity with NewsML-G2 stops us choosing such version number.

      Laurent


      > -----Message d'origine-----
      > De : newsml@yahoogroups.com [mailto:newsml@yahoogroups.com] De la part de
      > Jayson Lorenzen
      > Envoyé : lundi 4 juin 2007 20:47
      > À : newsml@yahoogroups.com
      > Objet : [newsml] NewsML 1.2 XML Schema and namespace
      >
      > This post is partially in response to messages 2443 and 2444 partially
      > a request for input from the community. We have been working on an XML
      > Schema for NewsML 1.2, yet have an issue reported by early testers
      > regarding the use of an XML namespace. There was a lengthy
      > conversation regarding this issue at our meeting this past week in
      > Tokyo Japan, though it remains unresolved and any input or assistance
      > is welcome.
      >
      > So first, in response to the two recent messages, yes the namespace,
      > should it be adopted would be:
      >
      > http://iptc.org/std/NewsML/2003-10-10/
      >
      > However there seems to be a compatibility issue when this is used, as
      > instances created with the namespace are technically not the same as
      > instances created without the namespace. The early testers of the XML
      > Schema found that if a database schema is generated using the XML
      > Schema with the namespace, instance documents created without the
      > namespace are not able to be insert into this database schema without
      > errors.
      >
      > Several options for the release of this XML schema have been
      > discussed, including:
      >
      > - release the schema without a namespace
      > - release the schema with a namespace
      > - release the schema with a namespace and provide an XSL Template to
      > add the namespace to instance documents
      >
      > We are interested in hearing of your experiences and in receiving any
      > input you have regarding this issue.
      >
      > Thank you
      >
      > Jayson
      >
      >
      >
      > Find more on NewsML at http://www.newsml.org
      >
      > Any member of this IPTC moderated Yahoo group must comply with the
      > Intellectual Property Policy of the IPTC, available at
      > http://www.iptc.org/goto/ipp. Any posting is assumed to be submitted under
      > the conditions of this IPTC IP Policy.
      >
      > Yahoo! Groups Links
      >
      >
      >



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    • Jayson Lorenzen
      This is one of the reasons Takahiro and I have been against adding the Namespace, but there is a push within the IPTC to have all of our XSD include a
      Message 2 of 5 , Sep 24, 2007
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        This is one of the reasons Takahiro and I have been against adding the Namespace, but there is a push within the IPTC to have all of our XSD include a namespace and therefore the only way to release one for NewsML1.x

        And no, there has been no feedback from outside the WP or the initial test group, and the conclusion, well that may or may not be presented at the Fall meeting. We are waiting for some results to come in from some re-testing with the namespace after we provided an XSL for the test group to update instances created using the DTD, when persisting in storage created using the XSD.

        We hope to provide the results of this testing at the fall meeting during the NewsML1.x MWP session.

        Regarding 1.3, we had talked about it but could not see us getting much support for this as the current attention is in releasing the G2 standards.

        Would this 1.3 be an XML Schema only version? Will we not have the same issue with compatibility?

        j

        >>> laurent.lemeur@... 09/24/07 7:32 AM >>>
        Did this question had some conclusion?

        Could the following alternative solution be studied?

        Because moving all elements of NewsML 1.x to a namespace is practically making the implementation non backward compatible, the result of the move is called NewsML 1.3.

        We know that - formally speaking, because it is not backward compatible - it should be called 2.0, but the ambiguity with NewsML-G2 stops us choosing such version number.

        Laurent


        > -----Message d'origine-----
        > De : newsml@yahoogroups.com [mailto:newsml@yahoogroups.com] De la part de
        > Jayson Lorenzen
        > Envoyé : lundi 4 juin 2007 20:47
        > À : newsml@yahoogroups.com
        > Objet : [newsml] NewsML 1.2 XML Schema and namespace
        >
        > This post is partially in response to messages 2443 and 2444 partially
        > a request for input from the community. We have been working on an XML
        > Schema for NewsML 1.2, yet have an issue reported by early testers
        > regarding the use of an XML namespace. There was a lengthy
        > conversation regarding this issue at our meeting this past week in
        > Tokyo Japan, though it remains unresolved and any input or assistance
        > is welcome.
        >
        > So first, in response to the two recent messages, yes the namespace,
        > should it be adopted would be:
        >
        > http://iptc.org/std/NewsML/2003-10-10/
        >
        > However there seems to be a compatibility issue when this is used, as
        > instances created with the namespace are technically not the same as
        > instances created without the namespace. The early testers of the XML
        > Schema found that if a database schema is generated using the XML
        > Schema with the namespace, instance documents created without the
        > namespace are not able to be insert into this database schema without
        > errors.
        >
        > Several options for the release of this XML schema have been
        > discussed, including:
        >
        > - release the schema without a namespace
        > - release the schema with a namespace
        > - release the schema with a namespace and provide an XSL Template to
        > add the namespace to instance documents
        >
        > We are interested in hearing of your experiences and in receiving any
        > input you have regarding this issue.
        >
        > Thank you
        >
        > Jayson
        >
        >
        >
        > Find more on NewsML at http://www.newsml.org
        >
        > Any member of this IPTC moderated Yahoo group must comply with the
        > Intellectual Property Policy of the IPTC, available at
        > http://www.iptc.org/goto/ipp. Any posting is assumed to be submitted under
        > the conditions of this IPTC IP Policy.
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        >
        >



        This e-mail, and any file transmitted with it, is confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed. If you have received this email in error, please contact the sender and delete the email from your system. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this email.

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      • Michael Steidl (IPTC)
        Laurent I feel this is not backward compatible conclusion is too far reaching: We discuss having XML Schemas and DTDs in parallel already for some - but as
        Message 3 of 5 , Sep 28, 2007
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          Laurent

          I feel this "is not backward compatible" conclusion is too far reaching:
          We discuss having XML Schemas and DTDs in parallel already for some - but
          as a DTD will never have a namespace this actually could not be done if we
          are 110% strict, but this was never brought up in the discussion. My
          approach is: a standard specification defines names and functionality, and
          that is actually the same for DTD and XML Schema.

          Michael


          On 24 Sep 2007 at 16:32 Laurent LE MEUR wrote:

          > Did this question had some conclusion?
          >
          > Could the following alternative solution be studied?
          >
          > Because moving all elements of NewsML 1.x to a namespace is practically
          > making the implementation non backward compatible, the result of the move
          > is called NewsML 1.3.
          >
          > We know that - formally speaking, because it is not backward compatible -
          > it should be called 2.0, but the ambiguity with NewsML-G2 stops us
          > choosing such version number.
          >
          > Laurent
          >
          >
          > > -----Message d'origine-----
          > > De : newsml@yahoogroups.com [mailto:newsml@yahoogroups.com] De la part
          > de
          > > Jayson Lorenzen
          > > Envoyé : lundi 4 juin 2007 20:47
          > > À : newsml@yahoogroups.com
          > > Objet : [newsml] NewsML 1.2 XML Schema and namespace
          > >
          > > This post is partially in response to messages 2443 and 2444
          > partially
          > > a request for input from the community. We have been working on an
          > XML
          > > Schema for NewsML 1.2, yet have an issue reported by early testers
          > > regarding the use of an XML namespace. There was a lengthy
          > > conversation regarding this issue at our meeting this past week in
          > > Tokyo Japan, though it remains unresolved and any input or assistance
          > > is welcome.
          > >
          > > So first, in response to the two recent messages, yes the namespace,
          > > should it be adopted would be:
          > >
          > > http://iptc.org/std/NewsML/2003-10-10/
          > >
          > > However there seems to be a compatibility issue when this is used, as
          > > instances created with the namespace are technically not the same as
          > > instances created without the namespace. The early testers of the XML
          > > Schema found that if a database schema is generated using the XML
          > > Schema with the namespace, instance documents created without the
          > > namespace are not able to be insert into this database schema without
          > > errors.
          > >
          > > Several options for the release of this XML schema have been
          > > discussed, including:
          > >
          > > - release the schema without a namespace
          > > - release the schema with a namespace
          > > - release the schema with a namespace and provide an XSL Template to
          > > add the namespace to instance documents
          > >
          > > We are interested in hearing of your experiences and in receiving any
          > > input you have regarding this issue.
          > >
          > > Thank you
          > >
          > > Jayson
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Find more on NewsML at http://www.newsml.org
          > >
          > > Any member of this IPTC moderated Yahoo group must comply with the
          > > Intellectual Property Policy of the IPTC, available at
          > > http://www.iptc.org/goto/ipp. Any posting is assumed to be submitted
          > under
          > > the conditions of this IPTC IP Policy.
          > >
          > > Yahoo! Groups Links
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
          >
          >
          > This e-mail, and any file transmitted with it, is confidential and
          > intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom it is
          > addressed. If you have received this email in error, please contact the
          > sender and delete the email from your system. If you are not the named
          > addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this email.
          >
          > For more information on Agence France-Presse, please visit our web site
          > at http://www.afp.com
          >
          >
          >
          > Find more on NewsML at http://www.newsml.org
          >
          > Any member of this IPTC moderated Yahoo group must comply with the
          > Intellectual Property Policy of the IPTC, available at
          > http://www.iptc.org/goto/ipp. Any posting is assumed to be submitted
          > under the conditions of this IPTC IP Policy.
          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >


          ==================================================
          Sent by:
          Michael Steidl
          Managing Director of the IPTC <mdirector@...>
          International Press Telecommunications Council
          "Information Technology for News"
          Visit us on the web at http://www.iptc.org
        • Laurent LE MEUR
          ... same ... [llm : ] either it would be a schema only version or there would be problems with compatibility. So yes this may not be the best solution in fact.
          Message 4 of 5 , Oct 1, 2007
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            >
            > Would this 1.3 be an XML Schema only version? Will we not have the
            same
            > issue with compatibility?
            >
            [llm : ] either it would be a schema only version or there would be
            problems with compatibility. So yes this may not be the best solution in
            fact.
            Laurent



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