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Starting NewsML G2

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  • tcbbcm
    Hello all, We (BBC Monitoring) are planning to use NewsMl G2 as the native format for our new content management system. As such I d like to air ten questions
    Message 1 of 7 , Oct 16, 2008
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      Hello all,

      We (BBC Monitoring) are planning to use NewsMl G2 as the native format
      for our new content management system.

      As such I'd like to air ten questions that have come up. These are
      mostly real newbie stuff, so pointers to appropriate documentation would
      be fine. Any comments on any of them would be really helpful.

      Partly here I would like to provoke public discussion on how one would
      do a "cold start" on NewsML G2.

      1) Firstly, in the introductory section on NewsML, there is a reference
      to a glossary (page 225). Unfortunately, I can't work out which
      document this refers to.

      2) In addition to ingesting and producing news items, we maintain
      persistent information (eg personality profiles and source information).

      So these are slowly aggregating and changing stores of information,
      rather than the more transient news item material.

      From looking at the documentation, these seem to map on to NewsML
      concept and knowledge items.

      So how would these map to a personalities store, which would be a
      timeline of key points in that person's life? I'm assuming one would
      use concept to be a person and he knowledge item would be the whole
      store. Is that the model?

      Can concepts be nested to represent the "key points"?

      Are the time validity attributes for links relevant here? eg could
      represent "Putin was president 2000-2008".

      3) Our supplier was questioning what toolsets are available to handle
      NewsML/Java and what the stage of maturity is?

      4) What is the model for exchange of News items. Is it done via a
      wrapper or is there transformation involved?

      5) What are the key differences between the core and power versions of
      the standard?

      6) Is it possible to represent hierarchies with qcodes eg
      cities:france:paris?

      7) Are there recommendations for versioning NewsML G2? I understand
      that the standard is now fairly stable with changes being minor and
      optional. If one were to adopt a (legacy, current, future) ie (n-1, n,
      n+1) versioning model, what would the likely timings be?

      Similarly, what's the cycle time if we feed back enhancement requests
      and errata to IPTC?

      8) If you have a qcode representing, say, Madrid, and you give it a
      <name>Madrid</name> element, how would you deal with the language
      dependence. Supposing you wanted it in Russian, or in both?

      9) How does one handle an analysis piece, where different paragraphs
      have different copyright clearance. Would that be a package of different
      items?

      10) Can package items have inline content, or just links?

      Apologies for the length of this, and look forward to the insights on
      any or all of this that people can offer!

      Tony.
    • Misha Wolf
      Hi Tony, I ll tackle your Q6 and Q8 ... 6) Is it possible to represent hierarchies with qcodes eg cities:france:paris? A QCode identifies a Concept. For
      Message 2 of 7 , Oct 16, 2008
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        Hi Tony,

        I'll tackle your Q6 and Q8 ...

        6) Is it possible to represent hierarchies with qcodes eg
        cities:france:paris?

        A QCode identifies a Concept. For example, the QCodes:
        ISO-3166-1-Alpha-2:HK
        ISO-3166-1-Alpha-3:HKG
        ISO-3166-1-Numeric-3:344
        ISO-3166-2:CN91
        all identify Hong Kong.

        To express that Hong Kong is part of the People's Republic
        of China or that HK is a member of APEC, you would use
        relationships. Optionally, you would time-qualify these
        relationships, eg to indicate when HK became part of the
        PRC.

        8) If you have a qcode representing, say, Madrid, and you give it a
        <name>Madrid</name> element, how would you deal with the language
        dependence. Supposing you wanted it in Russian, or in both?

        Names in different languages are differentiated using @xml:lang.

        Misha


        -----Original Message-----
        From: newsml-g2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:newsml-g2@yahoogroups.com] On
        Behalf Of tcbbcm
        Sent: 16 October 2008 17:46
        To: newsml-g2@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [newsml-g2] Starting NewsML G2

        Hello all,

        We (BBC Monitoring) are planning to use NewsMl G2 as the native format
        for our new content management system.

        As such I'd like to air ten questions that have come up. These are
        mostly real newbie stuff, so pointers to appropriate documentation would

        be fine. Any comments on any of them would be really helpful.

        Partly here I would like to provoke public discussion on how one would
        do a "cold start" on NewsML G2.

        1) Firstly, in the introductory section on NewsML, there is a reference
        to a glossary (page 225). Unfortunately, I can't work out which
        document this refers to.

        2) In addition to ingesting and producing news items, we maintain
        persistent information (eg personality profiles and source information).

        So these are slowly aggregating and changing stores of information,
        rather than the more transient news item material.

        From looking at the documentation, these seem to map on to NewsML
        concept and knowledge items.

        So how would these map to a personalities store, which would be a
        timeline of key points in that person's life? I'm assuming one would
        use concept to be a person and he knowledge item would be the whole
        store. Is that the model?

        Can concepts be nested to represent the "key points"?

        Are the time validity attributes for links relevant here? eg could
        represent "Putin was president 2000-2008".

        3) Our supplier was questioning what toolsets are available to handle
        NewsML/Java and what the stage of maturity is?

        4) What is the model for exchange of News items. Is it done via a
        wrapper or is there transformation involved?

        5) What are the key differences between the core and power versions of
        the standard?

        6) Is it possible to represent hierarchies with qcodes eg
        cities:france:paris?

        7) Are there recommendations for versioning NewsML G2? I understand
        that the standard is now fairly stable with changes being minor and
        optional. If one were to adopt a (legacy, current, future) ie (n-1, n,
        n+1) versioning model, what would the likely timings be?

        Similarly, what's the cycle time if we feed back enhancement requests
        and errata to IPTC?

        8) If you have a qcode representing, say, Madrid, and you give it a
        <name>Madrid</name> element, how would you deal with the language
        dependence. Supposing you wanted it in Russian, or in both?

        9) How does one handle an analysis piece, where different paragraphs
        have different copyright clearance. Would that be a package of different

        items?

        10) Can package items have inline content, or just links?

        Apologies for the length of this, and look forward to the insights on
        any or all of this that people can offer!

        Tony.


        ------------------------------------

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        Intellectual Property Policy of the IPTC, available at
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      • Misha Wolf
        Hi Tony, ... The most recent Glossary I can find on the IPTC Web site is: NAR_1.0-doc-Glossary_2.pdf at: http://www.iptc.org/std/NAR/1.0/documentation/ I
        Message 3 of 7 , Oct 16, 2008
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          Hi Tony,

          Let's look at your Q1:

          > 1) Firstly, in the introductory section on NewsML, there is
          > a reference to a glossary (page 225). Unfortunately, I can't
          > work out which document this refers to.

          The most recent Glossary I can find on the IPTC Web site is:
          NAR_1.0-doc-Glossary_2.pdf
          at:
          http://www.iptc.org/std/NAR/1.0/documentation/

          I suspect that this may need to be updated as it was issued
          at the start of 2007.

          Misha


          -----Original Message-----
          From: newsml-g2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:newsml-g2@yahoogroups.com] On
          Behalf Of tcbbcm
          Sent: 16 October 2008 17:46
          To: newsml-g2@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [newsml-g2] Starting NewsML G2

          Hello all,

          We (BBC Monitoring) are planning to use NewsMl G2 as the native format
          for our new content management system.

          As such I'd like to air ten questions that have come up. These are
          mostly real newbie stuff, so pointers to appropriate documentation would

          be fine. Any comments on any of them would be really helpful.

          Partly here I would like to provoke public discussion on how one would
          do a "cold start" on NewsML G2.

          1) Firstly, in the introductory section on NewsML, there is a reference
          to a glossary (page 225). Unfortunately, I can't work out which
          document this refers to.

          2) In addition to ingesting and producing news items, we maintain
          persistent information (eg personality profiles and source information).

          So these are slowly aggregating and changing stores of information,
          rather than the more transient news item material.

          From looking at the documentation, these seem to map on to NewsML
          concept and knowledge items.

          So how would these map to a personalities store, which would be a
          timeline of key points in that person's life? I'm assuming one would
          use concept to be a person and he knowledge item would be the whole
          store. Is that the model?

          Can concepts be nested to represent the "key points"?

          Are the time validity attributes for links relevant here? eg could
          represent "Putin was president 2000-2008".

          3) Our supplier was questioning what toolsets are available to handle
          NewsML/Java and what the stage of maturity is?

          4) What is the model for exchange of News items. Is it done via a
          wrapper or is there transformation involved?

          5) What are the key differences between the core and power versions of
          the standard?

          6) Is it possible to represent hierarchies with qcodes eg
          cities:france:paris?

          7) Are there recommendations for versioning NewsML G2? I understand
          that the standard is now fairly stable with changes being minor and
          optional. If one were to adopt a (legacy, current, future) ie (n-1, n,
          n+1) versioning model, what would the likely timings be?

          Similarly, what's the cycle time if we feed back enhancement requests
          and errata to IPTC?

          8) If you have a qcode representing, say, Madrid, and you give it a
          <name>Madrid</name> element, how would you deal with the language
          dependence. Supposing you wanted it in Russian, or in both?

          9) How does one handle an analysis piece, where different paragraphs
          have different copyright clearance. Would that be a package of different

          items?

          10) Can package items have inline content, or just links?

          Apologies for the length of this, and look forward to the insights on
          any or all of this that people can offer!

          Tony.


          ------------------------------------

          Any member of this IPTC moderated Yahoo group must comply with the
          Intellectual Property Policy of the IPTC, available at
          http://www.iptc.org/goto/ipp. Any posting is assumed to be submitted
          under the conditions of this IPTC IP Policy.
          Yahoo! Groups Links





          This email was sent to you by Thomson Reuters, the global news and information company.
          Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifically states them to be the views of Thomson Reuters.
        • Michael Steidl (IPTC)
          Tony a few quick responses below, not overlapping with what Misha has already addressed. ... The NewsML-G2 2.0 Specification document has 232 pages, the
          Message 4 of 7 , Oct 16, 2008
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            Tony

            a few quick responses below, not overlapping with what Misha has already addressed.

            On 16 Oct 2008 at 16:46  tcbbcm wrote:

            > Hello all,
            >
            > We (BBC Monitoring) are planning to use NewsMl G2 as the native format
            > for our new content management system.
            >
            > As such I'd like to air ten questions that have come up. These are
            > mostly real newbie stuff, so pointers to appropriate documentation would
            > be fine. Any comments on any of them would be really helpful.
            >
            > Partly here I would like to provoke public discussion on how one would
            > do a "cold start" on NewsML G2.
            >
            > 1) Firstly, in the introductory section on NewsML, there is a reference
            > to a glossary (page 225). Unfortunately, I can't work out which
            > document this refers to.

            The NewsML-G2 2.0 Specification document has 232 pages, the Glossary section starts at page 225. (Be careful: The link in Misha's email is pointing to an outdated document!)

            >
            > 2) In addition to ingesting and producing news items, we maintain
            > persistent information (eg personality profiles and source
            > information).
            >
            > So these are slowly aggregating and changing stores of information,
            > rather than the more transient news item material.
            >
            > From looking at the documentation, these seem to map on to NewsML
            > concept and knowledge items.
            >
            > So how would these map to a personalities store, which would be a
            > timeline of key points in that person's life? I'm assuming one would
            > use concept to be a person and he knowledge item would be the whole
            > store. Is that the model?

            One person should be represented by one concept item. You can aggregate many other items, e.g. a news item with an extensive biography or photos, by using <link>s from the concept item.

            The knowledge item is actually a box where you can put in many concepts primarily for distribution to other parties. E.g. a set of "celebrities divorced in 2008" ;-)

            >
            > Can concepts be nested to represent the "key points"?

            What exactly do you have in mind?

            >
            > Are the time validity attributes for links relevant here? eg could
            > represent "Putin was president 2000-2008".

            Yes, this is exactly what they have been made for.

            >
            > 3) Our supplier was questioning what toolsets are available to handle
            > NewsML/Java and what the stage of maturity is?
            >
            > 4) What is the model for exchange of News items. Is it done via a
            > wrapper or is there transformation involved?

            The News Message is the wrapper provided by the IPTC, but the specs say explicity that it is not mandatory, you can also use any other wrapper, e.g. SOAP.

            >
            > 5) What are the key differences between the core and power versions of
            > the standard?

            The sets of metadata is highly equivalent, only a few more properties at the Power level, but the datatypes for the properties are much richer at the Power level: more attributes, alternatives for storing the value.

            >
            > 6) Is it possible to represent hierarchies with qcodes eg
            > cities:france:paris?
            >

            > 7) Are there recommendations for versioning NewsML G2? I understand
            > that the standard is now fairly stable with changes being minor and
            > optional. If one were to adopt a (legacy, current, future) ie (n-1, n,
            > n+1) versioning model, what would the likely timings be?
            >
            > Similarly, what's the cycle time if we feed back enhancement requests
            > and errata to IPTC?

            Errata should be fixed quickly.

            Enhancement will be discussed and we will proceed with updates like we discussed it in Nice: public updates only once a year, interim developer updates more frequently.

            >
            > 8) If you have a qcode representing, say, Madrid, and you give it a
            > <name>Madrid</name> element, how would you deal with the language
            > dependence. Supposing you wanted it in Russian, or in both?
            >
            > 9) How does one handle an analysis piece, where different paragraphs
            > have different copyright clearance. Would that be a package of different
            > items?

            <rightsInfo> may point at parts of content, read item 2.6 in the specs. The @idrefs should point to the XML elements this rights expression applies to.


            > 10) Can package items have inline content, or just links?

            No inline content, just only links. The content MUST be in news items, only they can be managed.

            Michael

            >
            > Apologies for the length of this, and look forward to the insights on
            > any or all of this that people can offer!
            >
            > Tony.
            >
            >
            > ------------------------------------
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            ==================================================
            Sent by:
            Michael Steidl
            Managing Director of the IPTC <mdirector@...>
            International Press Telecommunications Council
            "Information Technology for News"
            Visit us on the web at  http://www.iptc.org
             
          • Neil Padgen
            Hi, I m a colleague of Tony s; allow me to follow up on some of his points. ... the ... We maintain a large set of information on key personalities of the
            Message 5 of 7 , Oct 17, 2008
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              Hi,

              I'm a colleague of Tony's; allow me to follow up on some of his points.

              --- In newsml-g2@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Steidl (IPTC)" <mdirector@...> wrote:
              >
              > Tony
              >
              > a few quick responses below, not overlapping with what Misha has already addressed.
              >
              > On 16 Oct 2008 at 16:46 tcbbcm wrote:
              >

              > > So how would these map to a personalities store, which would be a
              > > timeline of key points in that person's life? I'm assuming one would
              > > use concept to be a person and he knowledge item would be the whole
              > > store. Is that the model?
              >
              > One person should be represented by one concept item. You can aggregate many other
              > items, e.g. a news item with an extensive biography or photos, by using <link>s from
              the
              > concept item.
              >
              > The knowledge item is actually a box where you can put in many concepts primarily for
              > distribution to other parties. E.g. a set of "celebrities divorced in 2008" ;-)
              >
              > >
              > > Can concepts be nested to represent the "key points"?
              >
              > What exactly do you have in mind?

              We maintain a large set of information on key personalities of the world, sourced from
              news items. For example, we might have:

              PUTIN, Vladimir Vladimirovitch
              Known as: Vladimir Vladimirovitch Putin
              Summary: Became Russian prime minister after serving two terms of office as President.
              Background:
              Born 7 October 1952 [*]
              Place of birth: Leningrad (St Petersburg) [*]
              Speaks fluent German [*]
              Timeline:
              9 August 1999: Becomes Russia's fifth Prime Minister in fifteen months [*]
              31 December 1999: Becomes acting President, following Boris Yeltsin's surprise
              resignation [*]
              26 March 2000: Elected as president [*]
              7 May 2008: Succeeded as president by Dmitriy Medvedev [*]
              Career:
              Ex-Prime Minister (08-1999 to 05-2000)
              Appointed in acting capacity 9 August 1999 [*]
              Appointment confirmed by Duma 17 August 1999 [*]
              Ex-President of the Russian Federation (05-2000 to 05-2008)
              Appointed in acting capacity 31 December 1999 [*]
              Sworn in 7 May 2000 [*]
              Re-elected 14 March 2004 [*]
              Sworn in 7 May 2004 [*]
              Succeeded 7 May 2008 by Dmitriy Medvedev
              Prime Minister of Russia (05-2008 to present)
              Endorsed by Duma 8 May 2008 [*]

              All the lines marked with [*] would have a reference to the source and date which
              produced that news item. (Maybe would be another newsItem in future).

              What would be the best way to construct this? I can't work out how to store this all in a
              conceptItem. A knowledgeItem might work but I can't understand how to get the various
              bits of info related correctly. Having 24 separate conceptItems for this information, all
              wrapped up in packageItems, seems like it would be a nightmare to manage (especially
              since we have thousands of these biographies, and Putin's biography above is very heavily
              truncated).

              I've also looked at EventsML to see if that would be a sensible format for the Career or
              Timeline sections, but that seems to be designed for conferences and the like.

              > >
              > > Are the time validity attributes for links relevant here? eg could
              > > represent "Putin was president 2000-2008".
              >
              > Yes, this is exactly what they have been made for.

              Does this also cover things like "Putin has been prime minister since 2008"?

              Thanks

              -- Neil
            • Laurent LE MEUR
              I would represent in a NML2 structure the core information about the person (names, definition = summary) and create extended properties (in another
              Message 6 of 7 , Oct 30, 2008
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                I would represent in a NML2 <concept> structure the core information about the person (names, definition = summary) and create extended properties (in another namespace) for the timeline and career at the bottom of this concept structure.

                Note that these two complex properties could be added to NML2 if agreed as useful for everybody.

                Laurent

                -----Message d'origine-----
                De : newsml-g2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:newsml-g2@yahoogroups.com] De la part de Neil Padgen
                Envoyé : vendredi 17 octobre 2008 15:36
                À : newsml-g2@yahoogroups.com
                Objet : [newsml-g2] Re: Starting NewsML G2

                Hi,

                I'm a colleague of Tony's; allow me to follow up on some of his points.

                --- In newsml-g2@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Steidl (IPTC)" <mdirector@...> wrote:
                >
                > Tony
                >
                > a few quick responses below, not overlapping with what Misha has already addressed.
                >
                > On 16 Oct 2008 at 16:46 tcbbcm wrote:
                >

                > > So how would these map to a personalities store, which would be a
                > > timeline of key points in that person's life? I'm assuming one would
                > > use concept to be a person and he knowledge item would be the whole
                > > store. Is that the model?
                >
                > One person should be represented by one concept item. You can aggregate many other
                > items, e.g. a news item with an extensive biography or photos, by using <link>s from
                the
                > concept item.
                >
                > The knowledge item is actually a box where you can put in many concepts primarily for
                > distribution to other parties. E.g. a set of "celebrities divorced in 2008" ;-)
                >
                > >
                > > Can concepts be nested to represent the "key points"?
                >
                > What exactly do you have in mind?

                We maintain a large set of information on key personalities of the world, sourced from
                news items. For example, we might have:

                PUTIN, Vladimir Vladimirovitch
                Known as: Vladimir Vladimirovitch Putin
                Summary: Became Russian prime minister after serving two terms of office as President.
                Background:
                Born 7 October 1952 [*]
                Place of birth: Leningrad (St Petersburg) [*]
                Speaks fluent German [*]
                Timeline:
                9 August 1999: Becomes Russia's fifth Prime Minister in fifteen months [*]
                31 December 1999: Becomes acting President, following Boris Yeltsin's surprise
                resignation [*]
                26 March 2000: Elected as president [*]
                7 May 2008: Succeeded as president by Dmitriy Medvedev [*]
                Career:
                Ex-Prime Minister (08-1999 to 05-2000)
                Appointed in acting capacity 9 August 1999 [*]
                Appointment confirmed by Duma 17 August 1999 [*]
                Ex-President of the Russian Federation (05-2000 to 05-2008)
                Appointed in acting capacity 31 December 1999 [*]
                Sworn in 7 May 2000 [*]
                Re-elected 14 March 2004 [*]
                Sworn in 7 May 2004 [*]
                Succeeded 7 May 2008 by Dmitriy Medvedev
                Prime Minister of Russia (05-2008 to present)
                Endorsed by Duma 8 May 2008 [*]

                All the lines marked with [*] would have a reference to the source and date which
                produced that news item. (Maybe would be another newsItem in future).

                What would be the best way to construct this? I can't work out how to store this all in a
                conceptItem. A knowledgeItem might work but I can't understand how to get the various
                bits of info related correctly. Having 24 separate conceptItems for this information, all
                wrapped up in packageItems, seems like it would be a nightmare to manage (especially
                since we have thousands of these biographies, and Putin's biography above is very heavily
                truncated).

                I've also looked at EventsML to see if that would be a sensible format for the Career or
                Timeline sections, but that seems to be designed for conferences and the like.

                > >
                > > Are the time validity attributes for links relevant here? eg could
                > > represent "Putin was president 2000-2008".
                >
                > Yes, this is exactly what they have been made for.

                Does this also cover things like "Putin has been prime minister since 2008"?

                Thanks

                -- Neil


                ------------------------------------

                Any member of this IPTC moderated Yahoo group must comply with the Intellectual Property Policy of the IPTC, available at http://www.iptc.org/goto/ipp. Any posting is assumed to be submitted under the conditions of this IPTC IP Policy.
                Yahoo! Groups Links



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              • Paul Harman
                From: newsml-g2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:newsml-g2@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Laurent LE MEUR ... I d like to register PA s interest in G2 standardising an
                Message 7 of 7 , Oct 30, 2008
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                  From: newsml-g2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:newsml-g2@yahoogroups.com] On
                  Behalf Of Laurent LE MEUR
                  > I would represent in a NML2 <concept> structure the core
                  > information about the person (names, definition = summary)
                  > and create extended properties (in another namespace) for
                  > the timeline and career at the bottom of this concept
                  > structure.
                  >
                  > Note that these two complex properties could be added to NML2
                  > if agreed as useful for everybody.


                  I'd like to register PA's interest in G2 standardising an encoding for
                  people - and organisations - having a biographical time-line.

                  A formal mechanism akin to one's employment history on LinkedIn, for
                  example.

                  Paul

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