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single reducer and gas hotplate?

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  • alan
    Just about finished my single reducer still and looking for a suitable boiler, probably a beer keg. As the top of the condensor in Bob s plan has a small
    Message 1 of 6 , Aug 3, 2003
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      Just about finished my single reducer still and looking for a
      suitable boiler, probably a beer keg. As the top of the condensor in
      Bob's plan has a small breather hole im wondering how likely
      flamable fumes are to creep down to the fire as i would prefer to
      use gas than electricity. One I already have the equiptment and 2
      easier temp control. Also how much leakage can i expect around the 2
      unsoldered 50mm joiners that hold the various segments together,
      should i perhaps use a flour and water paste to make a tempory seal
      while retaining the ability to break down the still? Or is gas just
      a risky proposition with this design?

      I built both the single reducer head and the eleptical can i expect
      much variation in the running or performance between the designs?
      Also the eliptical plans didnt show a thermometer placing, i guessed
      placement beteen the colection and overhead plate, was this right?
      Cheers
      Alan
    • Raymond Massey
      hi, regarding the seals on your copper fittings. Use p.t.f.e. tape this is available very cheaply at all puming outlets and will seal the joint and allow easy
      Message 2 of 6 , Aug 4, 2003
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        hi, regarding the seals on your copper fittings. Use p.t.f.e. tape this is available very cheaply at all puming outlets and will seal the joint and allow easy dissasembly./ ray

        alan <falconsforge@...> wrote:
        Just about finished my single reducer still and looking for a
        suitable boiler, probably a beer keg. As the top of the condensor in
        Bob's plan has a small breather hole im wondering how likely
        flamable fumes are to creep down to the fire as i would prefer to
        use gas than electricity. One I already have the equiptment and 2
        easier temp control. Also how much leakage can i expect around the 2
        unsoldered 50mm joiners that hold the various segments together,
        should i perhaps use a flour and water paste to make a tempory seal
        while retaining the ability to break down the still? Or is gas just
        a risky proposition with this design?

        I built both the single reducer head and the eleptical can i expect
        much variation in the running or performance between the designs?
        Also the eliptical plans didnt show a thermometer placing, i guessed
        placement beteen the colection and overhead plate, was this right?
        Cheers
        Alan




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      • BOKAKOB
        There will be no imminent danger in leaving the top open, because theoretically nothing vapor should past the condenser. If it does then the heat input is
        Message 3 of 6 , Aug 4, 2003
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          There will be no imminent danger in leaving the top open, because theoretically nothing vapor should past the condenser. If it does then the heat input is wrong. I personally use gas to heat up my rig.

           

          There will not be any leakage if all joints are not disturbed and are in fine geometrical shape. Usually it is more difficult for vapors to push through the joint rather than peacefully proceeding upward for condensation.

           

          I do use a little of white Teflon tape at the bottom joint where pressure is a little more than at the top. Sometimes there is an occasional drop the size of a match head at the very top cap rolling down the condenser to be picked up be upward lip of the another joint. Certainly use flour if it would make the whole setup better for you. The gas is not a risky thing if proper supervision is there.

           

          There will be no difference in �elliptical� and �single reducer� separators. It is the same thing both of them are doing � separating the liquid from the rising vapors. As to the matter -- ALL of them are doing the same thing. Personally, I tend to minimize the use of reflux lately. I tend to make the heat as little as possible to minimize the coolant water flow. What I noticed is that the output dripping will not change at all if the proper temperature is maintained at the top of the column. My guess is that the output of any still is inherited characteristic of geometry, power input and column fillers. If I reduce the power input then the rising vapors are slower and separation is better for a given column. My guess is that the condenser on top is only needed for insurance against the overpowering the still. Perhaps I am not very correct, but it works for me.

           

          Placing the thermometer between both plates is a good choice. It should work fine.

           

          Good luck! and show the group the rig in photos�



          I can be wrong I must say
          Cheers, Alex...
          A


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        • alan
          Thanks Alex, both for the tips and the great designs, I particularly like the eliptical, very elegant and simple, It was also easier to build in some ways than
          Message 4 of 6 , Aug 4, 2003
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            Thanks Alex, both for the tips and the great designs, I particularly
            like the eliptical, very elegant and simple, It was also easier to
            build in some ways than the single reducer.


            >
            > There will be no imminent danger in leaving the top open, because
            theoretically nothing vapor should past the condenser. If it does
            then the heat input is wrong. I personally use gas to heat up my
            rig.

            Good to hear Im not the only pyromaniac, i think temp control has to
            be a lot easier with gas and i will trade the fire risk for the
            likelyhood of electrocuting myself being to cheap to buy commercial
            equiptment.

            With the overhead condensor what sort of flow rate do you use, im
            presuming its somewhat less than the commercial designs that use the
            water to control the distillate process. Am i correct in assuming
            the water in these designs is primarily to provide condensate with
            temp control via the hotplate. Also column height recomendations for
            this design in 50mm copper would be helpful, i have a few lengths to
            experiment with otherwise. I plan on insulating the column, any
            figures on the trade off for height and runtime? I have s/steel
            potscrubbers for the column but would love to find a aussie source
            for the structured mesh the amphora society guys are using.

            >
            >
            >
            > There will not be any leakage if all joints are not disturbed and
            are in fine geometrical shape. Usually it is more difficult for
            vapors to push through the joint rather than peacefully proceeding
            upward for condensation.


            Fine geometric shape LOL well unless anyone has some good tips for
            improving the post construction geometrics i think i will go a
            couple of turns of tape just to be sure. Im not sure it was all true
            to start with and my tinkering hasnt helped:) I think i will invest
            in a pipe cutter rather than a hacksaw next time.

            What sort of output valves are people using, i almost chocked when
            tradelink quoted me $50 for a 1/4 needle valve and went the $5 ball
            valve instead, im hoping it will give me sufficient control.

            I will take some happy snaps once i finish pickling the bits.

            Cheers
            Alan
            >
            >
          • nanosleep
            I ve used a copper cap on the top of my old head (offset NS style). I didn t use anything to seal the cap. A good trick I ve found is to lap the joint.
            Message 5 of 6 , Aug 4, 2003
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              I've used a copper cap on the top of my old head (offset NS style). I
              didn't use anything to seal the cap. A good trick I've found is to
              'lap' the joint. You need to get some grit paste. You put a bit of
              it on the end of the column where the cap fits over. Then you put the
              cap on and spin it round and round. The grit will wear down any
              places that stick out more than the others. This makes the mating
              surfaces of the column and cap very smooth and very tight tolerance.
              My cap is virtually air tight. It will push the cap up before any
              vapor leaks. With the open topped condenser it will never build
              enough pressure to lift the weight of the cap, therefore it never
              leaks. This procedure may also work for pipe-to-pipe joiners. It may
              not work for joiners which have only 'tits' to stop the pipe passing
              all the way through. I have some joiners which have a reduced
              diameter 'ring' inside. These would seal well with this technique.

              I use 1/4 inch needle valves from the local home improvement store.
              They are about $3 each. You might try to find a kit for hooking up a
              refrigerator with an automatic ice maker.

              --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "alan" <falconsforge@e...>
              wrote:
              > > There will not be any leakage if all joints are not disturbed and
              > are in fine geometrical shape. Usually it is more difficult for
              > vapors to push through the joint rather than peacefully proceeding
              > upward for condensation.
              >
              >
              > Fine geometric shape LOL well unless anyone has some good tips for
              > improving the post construction geometrics i think i will go a
              > couple of turns of tape just to be sure. Im not sure it was all
              true
              > to start with and my tinkering hasnt helped:) I think i will invest
              > in a pipe cutter rather than a hacksaw next time.
              >
              > What sort of output valves are people using, i almost chocked when
              > tradelink quoted me $50 for a 1/4 needle valve and went the $5 ball
              > valve instead, im hoping it will give me sufficient control.
              >
            • BOKAKOB
              In my opinion temperature control is as easy as with stove top or hot plate. However, the startup cost is higher. I would use electric heating control, but the
              Message 6 of 6 , Aug 5, 2003
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                In my opinion temperature control is as easy as with stove top or hot plate. However, the startup cost is higher. I would use electric heating control, but the gas is free where I live. Also I was impatient to wait. If I could get the pot and the controller as easy as to set up stove-top pot I would definitely do that.
                The coolant water flow is very-very slow. Sometimes it is not flowing but just dripping. The take-off rate is about 400mL/hour. The trick is to adjust heat input to a rate that does not produce much vapors.

                By saying that all parts should be in fine geometrical condition I meant that surfaces should be smooth, no burrs, nicks and bents.

                Good luck and thank you for a kind word.



                alan <falconsforge@...> wrote:
                Thanks Alex, both for the tips and the great designs, I particularly
                like the eliptical, very elegant and simple, It was also easier to
                build in some ways than the single reducer.


                >
                > There will be no imminent danger in leaving the top open, because
                theoretically nothing vapor should past the condenser. If it does
                then the heat input is wrong. I personally use gas to heat up my
                rig.

                Good to hear Im not the only pyromaniac, i think temp control has to
                be a lot easier with gas and i will trade the fire risk for the
                likelyhood of electrocuting myself being to cheap to buy commercial
                equiptment.

                With the overhead condensor what sort of flow rate do you use, im
                presuming its somewhat less than the commercial designs that use the
                water to control the distillate process. Am i correct in assuming
                the water in these designs is primarily to provide condensate with
                temp control via the hotplate. Also column height recomendations for
                this design in 50mm copper would be helpful, i have a few lengths to
                experiment with otherwise. I plan on insulating the column, any
                figures on the trade off for height and runtime? I have s/steel
                potscrubbers for the column but would love to find a aussie source
                for the structured mesh the amphora society guys are using.

                >

                >
                > There will not be any leakage if all joints are not disturbed and
                are in fine geometrical shape. Usually it is more difficult for
                vapors to push through the joint rather than peacefully proceeding
                upward for condensation.


                Fine geometric shape LOL well unless anyone has some good tips for
                improving the post construction geometrics i think i will go a
                couple of turns of tape just to be sure. Im not sure it was all true
                to start with and my tinkering hasnt helped:) I think i will invest
                in a pipe cutter rather than a hacksaw next time.

                What sort of output valves are people using, i almost chocked when
                tradelink quoted me $50 for a 1/4 needle valve and went the $5 ball
                valve instead, im hoping it will give me sufficient control.

                I will take some happy snaps once i finish pickling the bits.

                Cheers
                Alan
                >
                >



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                new_distillers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                New Distillers group archives are at http://archive.nnytech.net/
                FAQ and other information available at http://homedistiller.org



                Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


                I can be wrong I must say
                Cheers, Alex...
                A


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