Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: [new_distillers] Higher Alcohols

Expand Messages
  • Jason Schnapp
    +1 use them for anything you would use acetone or white gas for Sent via my Samsung Galaxy Prevail from Boost Mobile
    Message 1 of 11 , Apr 30, 2012
    • 0 Attachment
      +1 use them for anything you would use acetone or white gas for

      Sent via my Samsung Galaxy Prevail from Boost Mobile

      White Bear <sha_man_1@...> wrote:

      >Gavin-
      >  These "Higher Alcohols" or Fore-shots, are poisonous.  They contain acetone, phenols, methanol and other nasties in proportion to the type and amount of mash made.  They are found in grain and fruit based mashes and are best cut from any of the alcohol collected for re-distillation or use.

      >  A good use for the fore-shots is to start camp fires, inside a lighter, weed killer etc.  By all means do not drink them.  Be well
      >White Bear
      >
      >--- On Mon, 4/30/12, gavinflett <gavin_flett@...> wrote:
      >
      >
      >From: gavinflett <gavin_flett@...>
      >Subject: [new_distillers] Higher Alcohols
      >To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
      >Date: Monday, April 30, 2012, 12:04 AM
      >
      >
      >

      >
      >
      >
      >What do you guys do with your Propanol portions as they come off the still. Are these supposed to be drinkable? Or do they get used as weed killer?
      >
      >I have mine separated and they don'e smell quite like the ethanol that came off. I'm wondering if I should be filtering these along with the ethanol or not.
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
    • Jason Schnapp
      Anything after hearts is tails. You can collect on a reflux run to about 40%. these will have bad odor and taste. You can recycle these into the next wash or
      Message 2 of 11 , Apr 30, 2012
      • 0 Attachment
        Anything after hearts is tails. You can collect on a reflux run to about 40%. these will have bad odor and taste. You can recycle these into the next wash or toss them in the trash.


        From: gavinflett <gavin_flett@...>
        To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Monday, April 30, 2012 10:39 AM
        Subject: [new_distillers] Re: Higher Alcohols

         
        Ok, again there is a mix up in terminology. Forget what I said about higher alcohols, I want to know about the Propanols 1&2, the part that comes of after the ethanol.

        --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, White Bear <sha_man_1@...> wrote:
        >
        > Gavin-
        >   These "Higher Alcohols" or Fore-shots, are poisonous.  They contain acetone, phenols, methanol and other nasties in proportion to the type and amount of mash made.  They are found in grain and fruit based mashes and are best cut from any of the alcohol collected for re-distillation or use.
        >  
        >   A good use for the fore-shots is to start camp fires, inside a lighter, weed killer etc.  By all means do not drink them.  Be well
        > White Bear
        >
        > --- On Mon, 4/30/12, gavinflett <gavin_flett@...> wrote:
        >
        >
        > From: gavinflett <gavin_flett@...>
        > Subject: [new_distillers] Higher Alcohols
        > To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
        > Date: Monday, April 30, 2012, 12:04 AM
        >
        >
        >
        >  
        >
        >
        >
        > What do you guys do with your Propanol portions as they come off the still. Are these supposed to be drinkable? Or do they get used as weed killer?
        >
        > I have mine separated and they don'e smell quite like the ethanol that came off. I'm wondering if I should be filtering these along with the ethanol or not.
        >



      • White Bear
        Gavin-   attached is the description of Propanols 1 & 2 from Wikipedia.  I had to look it up myself to be sure the proper identification. White Bear ...
        Message 3 of 11 , Apr 30, 2012
        • 1 Attachment
        • 175 KB
        Gavin-
          attached is the description of Propanols 1 & 2 from Wikipedia.  I had to look it up myself to be sure the proper identification.
        White Bear

        --- On Mon, 4/30/12, gavinflett <gavin_flett@...> wrote:

        From: gavinflett <gavin_flett@...>
        Subject: [new_distillers] Re: Higher Alcohols
        To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
        Date: Monday, April 30, 2012, 10:39 AM

         
        Ok, again there is a mix up in terminology. Forget what I said about higher alcohols, I want to know about the Propanols 1&2, the part that comes of after the ethanol.

        --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, White Bear <sha_man_1@...> wrote:
        >
        > Gavin-
        >   These "Higher Alcohols" or Fore-shots, are poisonous.  They contain acetone, phenols, methanol and other nasties in proportion to the type and amount of mash made.  They are found in grain and fruit based mashes and are best cut from any of the alcohol collected for re-distillation or use.
        >  
        >   A good use for the fore-shots is to start camp fires, inside a lighter, weed killer etc.  By all means do not drink them.  Be well
        > White Bear
        >
        > --- On Mon, 4/30/12, gavinflett <gavin_flett@...> wrote:
        >
        >
        > From: gavinflett <gavin_flett@...>
        > Subject: [new_distillers] Higher Alcohols
        > To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
        > Date: Monday, April 30, 2012, 12:04 AM
        >
        >
        >
        >  
        >
        >
        >
        > What do you guys do with your Propanol portions as they come off the still. Are these supposed to be drinkable? Or do they get used as weed killer?
        >
        > I have mine separated and they don'e smell quite like the ethanol that came off. I'm wondering if I should be filtering these along with the ethanol or not.
        >

      • gavinflett
        Thanks White bear. I looked it up myself and specifically I meant Propanol-2 with a boiling point of 82.5C. So I understand from Wikipedia that this gets
        Message 4 of 11 , Apr 30, 2012
        • 0 Attachment
          Thanks White bear.

          I looked it up myself and specifically I meant Propanol-2 with a boiling point of 82.5C. So I understand from Wikipedia that this gets separated from the ethanol by adding basically some form of salt. How do I know which layer is the Propanol-2 and which is the Ethanol.

          If some Propanol gets in with my ethanol, should I get it out? Can I get it out? How do I do that?

          --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, White Bear <sha_man_1@...> wrote:
          >
          > Gavin-
          >   attached is the description of Propanols 1 & 2 from Wikipedia.  I had to look it up myself to be sure the proper identification.
          > White Bear
          >
          > --- On Mon, 4/30/12, gavinflett <gavin_flett@...> wrote:
          >
          >
          > From: gavinflett <gavin_flett@...>
          > Subject: [new_distillers] Re: Higher Alcohols
          > To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
          > Date: Monday, April 30, 2012, 10:39 AM
          >
          >
          >
          >  
          >
          >
          >
          > Ok, again there is a mix up in terminology. Forget what I said about higher alcohols, I want to know about the Propanols 1&2, the part that comes of after the ethanol.
          >
          > --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, White Bear <sha_man_1@> wrote:
          > >
          > > Gavin-
          > >   These "Higher Alcohols" or Fore-shots, are poisonous.  They contain acetone, phenols, methanol and other nasties in proportion to the type and amount of mash made.  They are found in grain and fruit based mashes and are best cut from any of the alcohol collected for re-distillation or use.
          > >  
          > >   A good use for the fore-shots is to start camp fires, inside a lighter, weed killer etc.  By all means do not drink them.  Be well
          > > White Bear
          > >
          > > --- On Mon, 4/30/12, gavinflett <gavin_flett@> wrote:
          > >
          > >
          > > From: gavinflett <gavin_flett@>
          > > Subject: [new_distillers] Higher Alcohols
          > > To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
          > > Date: Monday, April 30, 2012, 12:04 AM
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >  
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > What do you guys do with your Propanol portions as they come off the still. Are these supposed to be drinkable? Or do they get used as weed killer?
          > >
          > > I have mine separated and they don'e smell quite like the ethanol that came off. I'm wondering if I should be filtering these along with the ethanol or not.
          > >
          >
        • tonyjones60@comcast.net
          I don t know what type of still you are running but I would ALWAYS set aside the foreshots (1st 50ml or so with a five gallon wash, using a pot still). Much of
          Message 5 of 11 , Apr 30, 2012
          • 0 Attachment
            I don't know what type of still you are running but I would ALWAYS set aside the foreshots (1st 50ml or so with a five gallon wash, using a pot still). Much of the  methanol and acetone will be contained in the first distillate to come out. Use that for lighter fluid. Then, collect "heads" in another container. I use a vapor management still. I start collecting that which I will drink when it stops smelling like my wife's nail polish remover. Using a vapor management still, I don't have much in the way of heads because of the manner in which the still operates. After foreshots, I usually collect another 200ml and set aside for my next run. With a pot still, you will probably need to collect more. There will always be trace amounts of nasties, even in the "hearts" of the run. The two things that I watch for are the temperature at the top of the column. I don't drink anything that comes out before 172 degrees. The other thing is to monitor the smell. I believe that I have finally come around to your question. When the temperature starts to rise out of the 170's, and into the 180's, start collecting spirits in smaller jars and continue until the distillate starts smelling like your great-uncle's sweaty feet. This will be the propanol and other fusils. You will know when it is time to shut the thing down, by the odor. This distillate is referred to as the "tails." You can keep this separate from the main product and run this part with the heads in the next batch.

            I hope that this helps.

            Regards


            From: "gavinflett" <gavin_flett@...>
            To: "new distillers" <new_distillers@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Monday, April 30, 2012 4:42:37 PM
            Subject: [new_distillers] Re: Higher Alcohols

             

            Thanks White bear.

            I looked it up myself and specifically I meant Propanol-2 with a boiling point of 82.5C. So I understand from Wikipedia that this gets separated from the ethanol by adding basically some form of salt. How do I know which layer is the Propanol-2 and which is the Ethanol.

            If some Propanol gets in with my ethanol, should I get it out? Can I get it out? How do I do that?

            --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, White Bear <sha_man_1@...> wrote:
            >
            > Gavin-
            >   attached is the description of Propanols 1 & 2 from Wikipedia.  I had to look it up myself to be sure the proper identification.
            > White Bear
            >
            > --- On Mon, 4/30/12, gavinflett <gavin_flett@...> wrote:
            >
            >
            > From: gavinflett <gavin_flett@...>
            > Subject: [new_distillers] Re: Higher Alcohols
            > To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
            > Date: Monday, April 30, 2012, 10:39 AM
            >
            >
            >
            >  
            >
            >
            >
            > Ok, again there is a mix up in terminology. Forget what I said about higher alcohols, I want to know about the Propanols 1&2, the part that comes of after the ethanol.
            >
            > --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, White Bear <sha_man_1@> wrote:
            > >
            > > Gavin-
            > >   These "Higher Alcohols" or Fore-shots, are poisonous.  They contain acetone, phenols, methanol and other nasties in proportion to the type and amount of mash made.  They are found in grain and fruit based mashes and are best cut from any of the alcohol collected for re-distillation or use.
            > >  
            > >   A good use for the fore-shots is to start camp fires, inside a lighter, weed killer etc.  By all means do not drink them.  Be well
            > > White Bear
            > >
            > > --- On Mon, 4/30/12, gavinflett <gavin_flett@> wrote:
            > >
            > >
            > > From: gavinflett <gavin_flett@>
            > > Subject: [new_distillers] Higher Alcohols
            > > To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
            > > Date: Monday, April 30, 2012, 12:04 AM
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >  
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > What do you guys do with your Propanol portions as they come off the still. Are these supposed to be drinkable? Or do they get used as weed killer?
            > >
            > > I have mine separated and they don'e smell quite like the ethanol that came off. I'm wondering if I should be filtering these along with the ethanol or not.
            > >
            >

          • White Bear
              It depends on what type of still you are using.  With a pot still, you will NOT be able to remove the Propanol s totally it s just not that efficient. 
            Message 6 of 11 , May 1, 2012
            • 0 Attachment
                It depends on what type of still you are using.  With a pot still, you will NOT be able to remove the Propanol's totally it's just not that efficient.  With much experience it is relatively easy to remove most of them by making cuts by nose and tossing the first 50ml - 100ml per 5gallons.  Things get easier with a reflux still and LM (liquid management) under total reflux.
                As to knowing which layer is Propanol and which is Ethanol - I go by volume and taste.  Through experience, you will develop a "Taste" for the cuts and a nose for the scent of ethanol.  Here I must remind you not to be greedy, if your cuts run into each other so-be-it, it's going to happen.  This will ensure you are getting the finest product that your still will allow.
              White Bear

              --- On Mon, 4/30/12, gavinflett <gavin_flett@...> wrote:

              From: gavinflett <gavin_flett@...>
              Subject: [new_distillers] Re: Higher Alcohols
              To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
              Date: Monday, April 30, 2012, 3:42 PM

               
              Thanks White bear.

              I looked it up myself and specifically I meant Propanol-2 with a boiling point of 82.5C. So I understand from Wikipedia that this gets separated from the ethanol by adding basically some form of salt. How do I know which layer is the Propanol-2 and which is the Ethanol.

              If some Propanol gets in with my ethanol, should I get it out? Can I get it out? How do I do that?

              --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, White Bear <sha_man_1@...> wrote:
              >
              > Gavin-
              >   attached is the description of Propanols 1 & 2 from Wikipedia.  I had to look it up myself to be sure the proper identification.
              > White Bear
              >
              > --- On Mon, 4/30/12, gavinflett <gavin_flett@...> wrote:
              >
              >
              > From: gavinflett <gavin_flett@...>
              > Subject: [new_distillers] Re: Higher Alcohols
              > To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
              > Date: Monday, April 30, 2012, 10:39 AM
              >
              >
              >
              >  
              >
              >
              >
              > Ok, again there is a mix up in terminology. Forget what I said about higher alcohols, I want to know about the Propanols 1&2, the part that comes of after the ethanol.
              >
              > --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, White Bear <sha_man_1@> wrote:
              > >
              > > Gavin-
              > >   These "Higher Alcohols" or Fore-shots, are poisonous.  They contain acetone, phenols, methanol and other nasties in proportion to the type and amount of mash made.  They are found in grain and fruit based mashes and are best cut from any of the alcohol collected for re-distillation or use.
              > >  
              > >   A good use for the fore-shots is to start camp fires, inside a lighter, weed killer etc.  By all means do not drink them.  Be well
              > > White Bear
              > >
              > > --- On Mon, 4/30/12, gavinflett <gavin_flett@> wrote:
              > >
              > >
              > > From: gavinflett <gavin_flett@>
              > > Subject: [new_distillers] Higher Alcohols
              > > To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
              > > Date: Monday, April 30, 2012, 12:04 AM
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >  
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > What do you guys do with your Propanol portions as they come off the still. Are these supposed to be drinkable? Or do they get used as weed killer?
              > >
              > > I have mine separated and they don'e smell quite like the ethanol that came off. I'm wondering if I should be filtering these along with the ethanol or not.
              > >
              >

            • Bob Glicksman
              It does not matter how your reflux is controlled -- LM, VM or CM. What matters is that you have some means - any means - to control the reflux ratio. I agree
              Message 7 of 11 , May 1, 2012
              • 0 Attachment
                It does not matter how your reflux is controlled -- LM, VM or CM.  What matters is that you have some means - any means - to control the reflux ratio.  I agree that starting at 100% reflux you bring the column into equilibrium and then the most volitile component will comprise the vapor at the still head.  You can slowly bleed off the foreshots and heads, if you wish, and then monitor the ethanol run until you decide that there is too much lower volitility stuff coming off and stop.

                -----Original Message-----
                From: White Bear <sha_man_1@...>
                To: new_distillers <new_distillers@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Tue, May 1, 2012 2:41 am
                Subject: Re: [new_distillers] Re: Higher Alcohols

                 
                  It depends on what type of still you are using.  With a pot still, you will NOT be able to remove the Propanol's totally it's just not that efficient.  With much experience it is relatively easy to remove most of them by making cuts by nose and tossing the first 50ml - 100ml per 5gallons.  Things get easier with a reflux still and LM (liquid management) under total reflux.
                  As to knowing which layer is Propanol and which is Ethanol - I go by volume and taste.  Through experience, you will develop a "Taste" for the cuts and a nose for the scent of ethanol.  Here I must remind you not to be greedy, if your cuts run into each other so-be-it, it's going to happen.  This will ensure you are getting the finest product that your still will allow.
                White Bear

                --- On Mon, 4/30/12, gavinflett <gavin_flett@...> wrote:

                From: gavinflett <gavin_flett@...>
                Subject: [new_distillers] Re: Higher Alcohols
                To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                Date: Monday, April 30, 2012, 3:42 PM

                 
                Thanks White bear.

                I looked it up myself and specifically I meant Propanol-2 with a boiling point of 82.5C. So I understand from Wikipedia that this gets separated from the ethanol by adding basically some form of salt. How do I know which layer is the Propanol-2 and which is the Ethanol.

                If some Propanol gets in with my ethanol, should I get it out? Can I get it out? How do I do that?

                --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, White Bear <sha_man_1@...> wrote:
                >
                > Gavin-
                >   attached is the description of Propanols 1 & 2 from Wikipedia.  I had to look it up myself to be sure the proper identification.
                > White Bear
                >
                > --- On Mon, 4/30/12, gavinflett <gavin_flett@...> wrote:
                >
                >
                > From: gavinflett <gavin_flett@...>
                > Subject: [new_distillers] Re: Higher Alcohols
                > To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                > Date: Monday, April 30, 2012, 10:39 AM
                >
                >
                >
                >  
                >
                >
                >
                > Ok, again there is a mix up in terminology. Forget what I said about higher alcohols, I want to know about the Propanols 1&2, the part that comes of after the ethanol.
                >
                > --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, White Bear <sha_man_1@> wrote:
                > >
                > > Gavin-
                > >   These "Higher Alcohols" or Fore-shots, are poisonous.  They contain acetone, phenols, methanol and other nasties in proportion to the type and amount of mash made.  They are found in grain and fruit based mashes and are best cut from any of the alcohol collected for re-distillation or use.
                > >  
                > >   A good use for the fore-shots is to start camp fires, inside a lighter, weed killer etc.  By all means do not drink them.  Be well
                > > White Bear
                > >
                > > --- On Mon, 4/30/12, gavinflett <gavin_flett@> wrote:
                > >
                > >
                > > From: gavinflett <gavin_flett@>
                > > Subject: [new_distillers] Higher Alcohols
                > > To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                > > Date: Monday, April 30, 2012, 12:04 AM
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >  
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > What do you guys do with your Propanol portions as they come off the still. Are these supposed to be drinkable? Or do they get used as weed killer?
                > >
                > > I have mine separated and they don'e smell quite like the ethanol that came off. I'm wondering if I should be filtering these along with the ethanol or not.
                > >
                >

              • Gavin Flett
                Ok, so even if the thermometer states that the temp is let s say 84C, if the distillate that comes out is 50-60%, this would still be considered hearts?
                Message 8 of 11 , May 1, 2012
                • 0 Attachment
                  Ok, so even if the thermometer states that the temp is let's say 84C, if the distillate that comes out is 50-60%, this would still be considered hearts? Doesn't the propanol taste horrible, I don't know if it does, I'm just guessing it would.


                  To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                  From: spdjnky_42@...
                  Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2012 12:01:06 -0700
                  Subject: Re: [new_distillers] Re: Higher Alcohols

                   

                  Anything after hearts is tails. You can collect on a reflux run to about 40%. these will have bad odor and taste. You can recycle these into the next wash or toss them in the trash.


                  From: gavinflett <gavin_flett@...>
                  To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Monday, April 30, 2012 10:39 AM
                  Subject: [new_distillers] Re: Higher Alcohols

                   
                  Ok, again there is a mix up in terminology. Forget what I said about higher alcohols, I want to know about the Propanols 1&2, the part that comes of after the ethanol.

                  --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, White Bear <sha_man_1@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Gavin-
                  >   These "Higher Alcohols" or Fore-shots, are poisonous.  They contain acetone, phenols, methanol and other nasties in proportion to the type and amount of mash made.  They are found in grain and fruit based mashes and are best cut from any of the alcohol collected for re-distillation or use.
                  >  
                  >   A good use for the fore-shots is to start camp fires, inside a lighter, weed killer etc.  By all means do not drink them.  Be well
                  > White Bear
                  >
                  > --- On Mon, 4/30/12, gavinflett <gavin_flett@...> wrote:
                  >
                  >
                  > From: gavinflett <gavin_flett@...>
                  > Subject: [new_distillers] Higher Alcohols
                  > To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                  > Date: Monday, April 30, 2012, 12:04 AM
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >  
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > What do you guys do with your Propanol portions as they come off the still. Are these supposed to be drinkable? Or do they get used as weed killer?
                  >
                  > I have mine separated and they don'e smell quite like the ethanol that came off. I'm wondering if I should be filtering these along with the ethanol or not.
                  >




                Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.