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  • Bruce
    just acquired reflux still. would like to make corn wiskey. this is what i have firgured out so far. would like to have people let me know if i am on the
    Message 1 of 11 , Nov 9, 2010
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      just acquired reflux still. would like to make corn wiskey. this is what i have firgured out so far. would like to have people let me know if i am on the right track. sprout corn to root size of approx 2in. let corn dry. remove root. grind corn in meal. place meal in fermenter. add boil water. add yeast. let ferment. strain. place remaining fluid in fermenter and distill. would like comment. thanks. blrott. real new to distilling.
    • jamesonbeam1
      Hello Bruce, Welcome aboard to the real distillers world. Wish I could tell ya your right on the money, but whatever book your reading or wherever you got
      Message 2 of 11 , Nov 9, 2010
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        Hello Bruce,

        Welcome aboard to the real distillers' world.   Wish I could tell ya your right on the money, but whatever book your reading or wherever you got that information from - throw it away.....

        First off, corn whiskey is distilled in pot stills or reflux stills that have been de-refluxed with the packing taken out and run in pot still fashion, or as Ian Smiley states - in a low seperation mode where there are not so many distillations going on in a single run.  This is critical if you want to maintain the corn and grain flavors without ending up with a neutral alcohol.

        Secondly,  malted corn (or trying to malt your own corn) does not have anywhere near the enzyme power or cabability (called diastatic power) to convert starches to sugars that 6 row or 2 row malted barley has.   You'll be much better of just buying a couple of pounds of malted barley instead of wasting your time trying to malt your own corn...

        Thirdly, the technique of mashing the grains to convert the starch chains to sugars using the alpha and beta enzymes in malted barley, does not require boiling at all, but letting the grains steep in water that is no hotter then around 170 F for an hour or more.  This is called the Saccharification Rest. Any temps over 170 F will distroy the enzymatic activity.

        Finally, you never add yeast to a fermentation that is hotter then around 78 F.  The yeast we use works best in the mid-70 F range....

        Before you begin your first journey into distilling, I would definitly take some time and read thru Tony Ackland's Homedistillers site at http://www.homedistiller.org/  Especially the theory, introduction and the section on malting and mashing grains...  This will explain all about the enzyme activity in breaking down starch chains and how the different amalyse enzymes work. 

        To be honest with ya, as a beginner, I would first start off with a simple sugar wash, like a MUM wash, or if you want to try a corn likker recipe, go with a non-cook type recipe like the famous Uncle Jesse's Simple Sour Mash Recipe *UJSSM  which many beginners have started with at http://wiki.homedistiller.org/index.php/Uncle_Jesse's_Simple_Sour_Mash_Method 

        But please before you attempt an all grain mashing experience, please do some reading and get an better understanding of this process.  Will save you and us all a hell of alot of headaches - believe me my friend, I speaketh from experience...... ;)

        JB.  aka Waldo aka Moderator.



        --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce" <blrott@...> wrote:
        >
        > just acquired reflux still. would like to make corn wiskey. this is what i have firgured out so far. would like to have people let me know if i am on the right track. sprout corn to root size of approx 2in. let corn dry. remove root. grind corn in meal. place meal in fermenter. add boil water. add yeast. let ferment. strain. place remaining fluid in fermenter and distill. would like comment. thanks. blrott. real new to distilling.
        >

      • Michael Sisco
        http://homedistiller.org/wash-grain.htm   this link will tell you all you want to know about grain mashes   I have been distilling about a year and I am
        Message 3 of 11 , Nov 9, 2010
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          this link will tell you all you want to know about grain mashes
           
          I have been distilling about a year and I am working doing all grain mashes but haven't been sucsessful with one yet
           
          I use the UJSSM recipe that is the link below
           

        • jamesonbeam1
          Thanks Michael for backing up my observations. But what problems have you been running into doing an all grain mash? After all, it aint rocket science.. lol.
          Message 4 of 11 , Nov 10, 2010
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            Thanks Michael for backing up my observations. But what problems have
            you been running into doing an all grain mash? After all, it aint
            rocket science.. lol. Please let us know and maybe we can help.

            JB.


            --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, Michael Sisco <siscoweb@...>
            wrote:
            >
            > http://homedistiller.org/wash-grain.htm
            >
            > this link will tell you all you want to know about grain mashes
            >
            > I have been distilling about a year and I am working doing all grain
            mashes but haven't been sucsessful with one yet
            >
            > I use the UJSSM recipe that is the link below
            >
            >
            http://www.homedistiller.org/wiki/index.php/Uncle_Jesse%27s_Simple_Sour_\
            Mash_Method
            >
          • missouri_bootlegger
            My biggest problem has been conversion rates the recipes say they get 1.070-1.090sg and I get 1.020-1.030sg I don t get much alcohol from a 5 gal mash. So I
            Message 5 of 11 , Nov 11, 2010
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              My biggest problem has been conversion rates the recipes say they get 1.070-1.090sg and I get 1.020-1.030sg I don't get much alcohol from a 5 gal mash. So I have invested in a bigger pot and fermenter. I have done one 10 gal mash using flaked wheat I got 1.034sg but used an old turbo the yeast was dead and I got a bacteria in it while I was waiting for it to start I repitched it but too late. I had to throw it out.
              The sugar washes I have no problem with and I have been spending lots of time getting better reflux distilling and pot distilling rum and JUSSM.
              I have a grinder and some corn now and I and going to do a corn mash next week. I do have a question what recipe would you start with?

              Thanks Michael
            • Ric Cunningham
              Sounds like you are not getting very good extract conversion in the original mash. You will need a few pounds of malted barley for diastatic enzymes to get
              Message 6 of 11 , Nov 11, 2010
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                Sounds like you are not getting very good extract conversion in the original mash. You will need a few pounds of malted barley for diastatic enzymes to get good conversion of starches to sugar. 

                On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 11:16 AM, missouri_bootlegger <siscoweb@...> wrote:
                 

                My biggest problem has been conversion rates the recipes say they get 1.070-1.090sg and I get 1.020-1.030sg I don't get much alcohol from a 5 gal mash. So I have invested in a bigger pot and fermenter. I have done one 10 gal mash using flaked wheat I got 1.034sg but used an old turbo the yeast was dead and I got a bacteria in it while I was waiting for it to start I repitched it but too late. I had to throw it out.
                The sugar washes I have no problem with and I have been spending lots of time getting better reflux distilling and pot distilling rum and JUSSM.
                I have a grinder and some corn now and I and going to do a corn mash next week. I do have a question what recipe would you start with?

                Thanks Michael


              • tgfoitwoods
                Michael, Have you used the iodine test to see if you have starch remaining in your mash? It sure sounds like you must have a lot. You didn t say, but what are
                Message 7 of 11 , Nov 12, 2010
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                  Michael,

                  Have you used the iodine test to see if you have starch remaining in your mash? It sure sounds like you must have a lot. You didn't say, but what are the sources of your enzymes to convert the starch to sugar? Many malts, especially barley malts, will provide the enzymes you need, and malted corn may provide enough enzymes to convert its own starches, but no more than that. When I'm concerned about conversion, I use bottled enzymes from my LHBS, and they work beautifully.

                  Another critical pair of factors in enzyme-catalyzed conversion is temperature and time. 150F and 2 hours usually does a great job, but if you get it too hot, you "kill" your enzymes and get bad conversion. Too cold, and it converts very slowly.

                  Compared to conversion, the importance of a particular grain recipe is minor; any of the common grains, in just about any ratios, will make a fine spirit, if you do your part. If you've got corn and a grinder, a pure corn whiskey is wonderful. With corn, adjust the grinder to just open up the kernel, and boil it to gelatinize the starch, then cool to 150F and add whatever enzymes you choose. You'll probably have to dilute your cooked corn so you can deal with that goop.

                  If I were you, I'd stay away from turbo yeast if you want your whiskey to taste good. It's expensive and you don't need it, and much of it has artificial chickenshit (urea) in it. A good ale yeast (I like Danstar Nottinhham) does a fine job with a bit of yeast nutrient. Hell, right now, at 1.030 you could use baker's yeast. I keep all my yeasts in a baggie in the kitchen refrigerator, and they last a long time.

                  Zymurgy Bob, a simple potstiller

                  --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "missouri_bootlegger" <siscoweb@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > My biggest problem has been conversion rates the recipes say they get 1.070-1.090sg and I get 1.020-1.030sg I don't get much alcohol from a 5 gal mash. So I have invested in a bigger pot and fermenter. I have done one 10 gal mash using flaked wheat I got 1.034sg but used an old turbo the yeast was dead and I got a bacteria in it while I was waiting for it to start I repitched it but too late. I had to throw it out.
                  > The sugar washes I have no problem with and I have been spending lots of time getting better reflux distilling and pot distilling rum and JUSSM.
                  > I have a grinder and some corn now and I and going to do a corn mash next week. I do have a question what recipe would you start with?
                  >
                  > Thanks Michael
                  >
                • jamesonbeam1
                  Mike, Listen to ZB. I think you would be well off to make sure the corn (that is dried and very hard) is cooked good and the starches are nicely gelatinized
                  Message 8 of 11 , Nov 13, 2010
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                    Mike,

                    Listen to ZB. I think you would be well off to make sure the corn (that
                    is dried and very hard) is cooked good and the starches are nicely
                    gelatinized before mashing. Watch the mashing temp closely and dont go
                    over about 165 F or so. An hour or 2 rest with towels wrapped around
                    the pot should do the trick. Definitely use the iodine test to make
                    sure all the starches have been converted.

                    A nice recipe is about 6 parts corn, 2 parts rye (or wheat if you want a
                    Maker's Mark style) and 2 parts good high disastatic barley malt (never
                    hurts to add more barley malt).

                    See Tony's section on this for the breakdown.

                    JB.

                    However, dont expect more then a 7 to 8% ABV fermentation, tis wise to
                    invest in a larger boiler the way ZB did. Note: For higher yield, you
                    can alwasys cheat and add some additional sugar prior to fermentation
                    (Maltose or Dextrose (Glucose) is best). Just dont forget to save the
                    backset for Sour Mash.


                    --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "missouri_bootlegger"
                    <siscoweb@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > My biggest problem has been conversion rates the recipes say they get
                    1.070-1.090sg and I get 1.020-1.030sg I don't get much alcohol from a 5
                    gal mash. So I have invested in a bigger pot and fermenter. I have done
                    one 10 gal mash using flaked wheat I got 1.034sg but used an old turbo
                    the yeast was dead and I got a bacteria in it while I was waiting for it
                    to start I repitched it but too late. I had to throw it out.
                    > The sugar washes I have no problem with and I have been spending lots
                    of time getting better reflux distilling and pot distilling rum and
                    JUSSM.
                    > I have a grinder and some corn now and I and going to do a corn mash
                    next week. I do have a question what recipe would you start with?
                    >
                    > Thanks Michael
                    >
                  • nancy pevnick
                    Any ideas on where to get reasonable priced non gmo corn near St. Louis? Nancy
                    Message 9 of 11 , Nov 12, 2013
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                      Any ideas on where to get reasonable priced non gmo corn near St. Louis?
                      Nancy
                    • wzuccarello
                      If you re going to distill the product of the corn I don t think it matters GMO or not. All the bad stuff is left behind in the boiler . ... Any ideas on where
                      Message 10 of 11 , Nov 12, 2013
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                        If you're going to distill the product of the corn I don't think it matters GMO or not. All the bad stuff is left behind in the boiler .



                        ---In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, <npevnick@...> wrote:

                        Any ideas on where to get reasonable priced non gmo corn near St. Louis?
                        Nancy
                      • RLB
                        Drive out of the city, and look for a a real feed store that sells bulk grains.  The bulk feed store in my area stocks 50 lbs bags of  whole corn, barley,
                        Message 11 of 11 , Nov 12, 2013
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                          Drive out of the city, and look for a a real feed store that sells bulk grains.  The bulk feed store in my area stocks 50 lbs bags of  whole corn, barley, rye, wheat, oats, and buckwheat.  I am malting grain to sell, and they do ask a lot of questions why I am buying a half a ton of grain.  You may want to purchase grain at different store.  Another way is to purchase grain directly from the farmer. 


                          From: "wzuccarello@..." <wzuccarello@...>
                          To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                          Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 11:12 PM
                          Subject: [new_distillers] RE: corn

                           
                          If you're going to distill the product of the corn I don't think it matters GMO or not. All the bad stuff is left behind in the boiler .


                          ---In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, <npevnick@...> wrote:

                          Any ideas on where to get reasonable priced non gmo corn near St. Louis?
                          Nancy


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