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Re: Rum spirits run advice appreciated...

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  • castillo.alex2008
    Hi Bill Answers in line ... Is it recommended to ... Yes it is. In your case, since your low wines are really low (mine use to be at around 60%ABV) you may go
    Message 1 of 19 , Nov 1, 2008
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      Hi Bill

      Answers in line

      --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "billfitz49" <billfitz@...> wrote:
      >
      > I stripped 3 molasses washes and now have 12 liters of 35% low wines. Is it recommended to
      > throw any dunder back in the boiler for the spirits run?

      Yes it is.  In your case, since your low wines are really low (mine use to be at around 60%ABV) you may go 50-50 your low wines and dunder for the spirits run.

      How much foreshots will I probably
      > get?

      The exact amount is problably unknown, but taking 25 mls per stripped litter could be ok.

      How would you experienced rum makers make the cuts?

      >

      For every 2 or 3 liters of stripped hooch I take 50 mls foreshots, 100 mls as heads, from there everything up to 85C as middle cut (hearts) and from there everything up to 95C as tails.  Many people go for taste, I don´t with good results so far, but you´ll get many answers for this question.  Read them all and use the one(s) that suit to you better.

      Buena suerte y que te diviertas!

      Alex

      > Thanks, Bill

      Any time

    • mavnkaf
      ... wines. Is it recommended to ... foreshots will I probably ... Hi Bill, I see Alex has already gave some advice which is good but like he said every one
      Message 2 of 19 , Nov 1, 2008
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        --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "billfitz49" <billfitz@...>
        wrote:
        >
        > I stripped 3 molasses washes and now have 12 liters of 35% low
        wines. Is it recommended to
        > throw any dunder back in the boiler for the spirits run? How much
        foreshots will I probably
        > get? How would you experienced rum makers make the cuts?
        > Thanks, Bill
        >


        Hi Bill, I see Alex has already gave some advice which is good but
        like he said every one has their own take on it, here's mine.

        For starters, dilute the low wines down to 27 % with your dunder, if
        this is your first spirit run for rum, you won't have any feints to
        add to the mix, other wise add them. The mix `might' look like this,
        1/3 feints, 1/3 low wines, 1/3 dunder but that's only a guide or
        starting point. You can change the amounts to suit your self.

        I can't help you with the fore shots question because that's like
        asking how long is a piece of string? For the question about cuts,
        first up have you got a parrot's beak? If not make one. They are very
        handy for reading the alcohol precentages.

        Some times I too wonder what is the best cuts for rum, so far the
        answer for me is, what ever I feel like!

        I have herd some people use 80%-60%, but I find that too nasty, my
        pot still only starts at 80%. Anyway, what I'm doing now is about
        75%-50% cuts. I have tried 75%-60% which I found to be a bit light
        in flavor but drinkable sooner. 75%-55% was good but for heavier
        flavor rum, you got to go deeper in the tails like the Arroyo's
        patent suggest.

        I won't try to explain it too much but this is what I did, start
        collecting at 75% to 50% then switch to the feints container, when
        the spirit is about 37% switch back to the spirit container or to a
        separate container if your not too sure about it, then run the still
        as far as you like or taste the spirit until you don't like it. I
        found using Arroyo's cut very heavy on the head if you got pissed on
        it, that might change if it was aged much longer, despite what I just
        said, it was very nice to drink.

        Also use the search engine in the distillers group paste in "Arroyo's
        patent", use other key words as well, the info is all there to read.
        There are some good rum e books t at Harry's web site

        http://tinyurl.com/aescm

        I hope this helps you, maybe others can chime in and tell of their
        experiences with cuts to suit rum.

        Cheers
        Marc
      • billfitz49
        Hi Marc and Alex, I appreciate all your good advice. I went ahead and did the spirit run without problems...the result of the middle run was about 4 liters of
        Message 3 of 19 , Nov 3, 2008
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          Hi Marc and Alex,
          I appreciate all your good advice. I went ahead and did the spirit run without
          problems...the result of the middle run was about 4 liters of 75 ABV. I threw out close to
          250 ml of foreshots, perhaps too much, and collected from 80 down to 65. Maybe I
          should have collected more before switching to tails but I didn't like the taste. Next time
          I'll go deeper into the tails like you suggest. I realize now I need to make a parrot's beak.
          My testing cylinder simply holds too much liquid. The product tastes slightly fruity and
          has a slightly bitter aftertaste. I think the bitterness comes from the blackstrap molasses.
          How do you guys improve the taste? Will it mellow with time or do you aerate and throw
          in oak chips? How long do you wait before trying it? Already started in on mine...
          Regards,
          Bill



          --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "mavnkaf" <mavnkaf@...> wrote:
          >
          > --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "billfitz49" <billfitz@>
          > wrote:
          > >
          > > I stripped 3 molasses washes and now have 12 liters of 35% low
          > wines. Is it recommended to
          > > throw any dunder back in the boiler for the spirits run? How much
          > foreshots will I probably
          > > get? How would you experienced rum makers make the cuts?
          > > Thanks, Bill
          > >
          >
          >
          > Hi Bill, I see Alex has already gave some advice which is good but
          > like he said every one has their own take on it, here's mine.
          >
          > For starters, dilute the low wines down to 27 % with your dunder, if
          > this is your first spirit run for rum, you won't have any feints to
          > add to the mix, other wise add them. The mix `might' look like this,
          > 1/3 feints, 1/3 low wines, 1/3 dunder but that's only a guide or
          > starting point. You can change the amounts to suit your self.
          >
          > I can't help you with the fore shots question because that's like
          > asking how long is a piece of string? For the question about cuts,
          > first up have you got a parrot's beak? If not make one. They are very
          > handy for reading the alcohol precentages.
          >
          > Some times I too wonder what is the best cuts for rum, so far the
          > answer for me is, what ever I feel like!
          >
          > I have herd some people use 80%-60%, but I find that too nasty, my
          > pot still only starts at 80%. Anyway, what I'm doing now is about
          > 75%-50% cuts. I have tried 75%-60% which I found to be a bit light
          > in flavor but drinkable sooner. 75%-55% was good but for heavier
          > flavor rum, you got to go deeper in the tails like the Arroyo's
          > patent suggest.
          >
          > I won't try to explain it too much but this is what I did, start
          > collecting at 75% to 50% then switch to the feints container, when
          > the spirit is about 37% switch back to the spirit container or to a
          > separate container if your not too sure about it, then run the still
          > as far as you like or taste the spirit until you don't like it. I
          > found using Arroyo's cut very heavy on the head if you got pissed on
          > it, that might change if it was aged much longer, despite what I just
          > said, it was very nice to drink.
          >
          > Also use the search engine in the distillers group paste in "Arroyo's
          > patent", use other key words as well, the info is all there to read.
          > There are some good rum e books t at Harry's web site
          >
          > http://tinyurl.com/aescm
          >
          > I hope this helps you, maybe others can chime in and tell of their
          > experiences with cuts to suit rum.
          >
          > Cheers
          > Marc
          >
        • castillo.alex2008
          Hey Bill Comments in line How do you guys improve the taste? Aging with oak is mandatory. Some good begginning could be 5 - 10grams per liter at 55 - 60% ABV.
          Message 4 of 19 , Nov 3, 2008
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            Hey Bill

            Comments in line

             How do you guys improve the taste?

            Aging with oak is mandatory.  Some good begginning could be 5 - 10grams per liter at 55 - 60% ABV.  In the other hand plenty of flavors may be added such as cloves, cinnamon, raisins, honey, etc.  Check previous messages.  I prepare my own macerations and add drops/mls. of each.  Take a look at message # 30068 here at new distillers.

            Will it mellow with time or do you aerate and throw

            > in oak chips?

            It will mellow with time, the more, the better.  I always wait at least a month for drinking it.  Recently, as Harry suggested I "burried" some of my hooch to be drank sometime next year, I´m planning to give from 6 to one year of aging.  I´ve never aerate so far, and these days is in fashion around here "natural aging without any external influence", but many people aerate, try both if you wish.

            How long do you wait before trying it?

            See above

            Already started in on mine...

            That´s normal when you´re begginning, but with time you´ll like more quality, more flavor, etc. so you´ll age longer.  That´s where the fun is I think; How will a 2 or 5 years old rum taste like? what if is spiced? How about using two different kinds of oak virgin and toasted? or American vs. French? etc.  So you see WE have a long road to walk...and we enjoy walking it, ain´t it?

            A!

          • billfitz49
            Do you toast your oak chips or buy them already toasted? Do you soak them in bourbon first before adding them to the rum or can you buy oak chips that are
            Message 5 of 19 , Nov 5, 2008
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              Do you toast your oak chips or buy them already toasted? Do you soak them in bourbon
              first before adding them to the rum or can you buy oak chips that are made from old
              whiskey barrels?
              Thanks,
              Bill

              --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "castillo.alex2008" <castillo.alex2008@...>
              wrote:
              >
              >
              >
              > Hey Bill
              >
              > Comments in line
              >
              > How do you guys improve the taste?
              >
              > Aging with oak is mandatory. Some good begginning could be 5 - 10grams
              > per liter at 55 - 60% ABV. In the other hand plenty of flavors may be
              > added such as cloves, cinnamon, raisins, honey, etc. Check previous
              > messages. I prepare my own macerations and add drops/mls. of each.
              > Take a look at message # 30068 here at new distillers.
              >
              > Will it mellow with time or do you aerate and throw
              > > in oak chips?
              >
              > It will mellow with time, the more, the better. I always wait at least
              > a month for drinking it. Recently, as Harry suggested I "burried" some
              > of my hooch to be drank sometime next year, I´m planning to give from
              > 6 to one year of aging. I´ve never aerate so far, and these days is
              > in fashion around here "natural aging without any external influence",
              > but many people aerate, try both if you wish.
              >
              > How long do you wait before trying it?
              >
              > See above
              >
              > Already started in on mine...
              >
              >
              > That´s normal when you´re begginning, but with time you´ll like
              > more quality, more flavor, etc. so you´ll age longer. That´s
              > where the fun is I think; How will a 2 or 5 years old rum taste like?
              > what if is spiced? How about using two different kinds of oak virgin and
              > toasted? or American vs. French? etc. So you see WE have a long road to
              > walk...and we enjoy walking it, ain´t it?
              >
              > A!
              >
            • mavnkaf
              ... soak them in bourbon ... are made from old ... Bill I ll do a deal with you, if you can tell me the Answer to Life, the Universe, and Everything, refering
              Message 6 of 19 , Nov 5, 2008
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                --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "billfitz49" <billfitz@...>
                wrote:
                >
                > Do you toast your oak chips or buy them already toasted? Do you
                soak them in bourbon
                > first before adding them to the rum or can you buy oak chips that
                are made from old
                > whiskey barrels?
                > Thanks,
                > Bill
                >

                Bill I'll do a deal with you, if you can tell me the Answer to Life,
                the Universe, and Everything, refering to the number (42) of course,
                I'll tell you all I know about flavoring rum and what you should do
                with your oak chips:)

                But really Bill, please try the search engine 'in' Harry's new
                distillers and distillers yahoo groups. I'm not trying to be mean,
                this subject has been talked about many times, and by gentlemen who
                can explain the art of flavoring rum much better than I.
                Try "flavoring rum" in the search tool. I know it may sound the same
                old, "read, read and read" but over time here, I have found the
                term "research" is becoming my best friend so to speak. If I'm
                thinking about a problem with distilling, it's problably already been
                answered, either here in the acrhives or the distillers group.

                Sorry for no easy answer Bill. But hey I'm still up for the 42
                question!

                Cheers
                Marc

                btw, if people don't know where the search engine/tool is, PLease
                ask Jim or Mason nicely.
              • rye_junkie1
                ... soak them in bourbon ... are made from old ... A good source for oak chips (if your in the US) is the Jack Daniels Barrel Chips (not pellets) found in the
                Message 7 of 19 , Nov 5, 2008
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                  --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "billfitz49" <billfitz@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Do you toast your oak chips or buy them already toasted? Do you
                  soak them in bourbon
                  > first before adding them to the rum or can you buy oak chips that
                  are made from old
                  > whiskey barrels?
                  > Thanks,
                  > Bill


                  A good source for oak chips (if your in the US) is the Jack Daniels
                  Barrel Chips (not pellets) found in the Barbecue section of some
                  stores. These are made from Chopped up Jack Daniels barrels and have
                  a strong whiskey small that carries over. Because they are chips a
                  lot of the pieces are only charred on one edge. I use half the way
                  they come from the bag and then Char the other half over my propane
                  stove or in the toaster oven.
                  http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2950589
                  The link shows price for 6 bags. They can be purchased one at a time.


                  Mason
                • castillo.alex2008
                  Hey Bill Answers in line 1.Do you toast your oak chips or buy them already toasted? I don´t toast my oak chips, I buy them already toasted. I use to get mine
                  Message 8 of 19 , Nov 5, 2008
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                    Hey Bill

                    Answers in line

                    1.Do you toast your oak chips or buy them already toasted?

                    I don´t toast my oak chips, I buy them already toasted.  I use to get mine at

                    http://www.piwine.com

                    I use heavy toast (chips and sawdust) and virgin oak sawdust 

                    2.Do you soak them in bourbon

                    > first before adding them to the rum

                    No, but I´m planning to, since most rums are aged in used american bourbon barrels.  I´ll do my own whiskey (working on it now) and later use that used oak.  In the other hand working with unused oak could be "as good as it gets"

                    3.or can you buy oak chips that are made from old

                    > whiskey barrels?

                    See Mason´s message.

                    > Thanks,

                    Any time!

                    A!

                     

                  • castillo.alex2008
                    Hey Mason, Interesting link Is it possible to order just one 2 lbs. pack? to be delivered by mail? Do these chips worth it? Have you tried ´em? Thanks, Alex
                    Message 9 of 19 , Nov 5, 2008
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                      Hey Mason,

                      Interesting link

                      Is it possible to order just one 2 lbs. pack?
                      to be delivered by mail?
                      Do these chips worth it?
                      Have you tried ´em?

                      Thanks,

                      Alex
                    • rye_junkie1
                      ... Hey Alex, Try this link. http://tinyurl.com/5w9kfz I have had a 1/2 gallon of Rum on these since early May. It has a beautiful dark color and now that I
                      Message 10 of 19 , Nov 5, 2008
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                        --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "castillo.alex2008"
                        <castillo.alex2008@...> wrote:
                        >
                        >
                        > Hey Mason,
                        >
                        > Interesting link
                        >
                        > Is it possible to order just one 2 lbs. pack?
                        > to be delivered by mail?
                        > Do these chips worth it?
                        > Have you tried ´em?
                        >
                        > Thanks,
                        >
                        > Alex

                        Hey Alex,
                        Try this link.
                        http://tinyurl.com/5w9kfz
                        I have had a 1/2 gallon of Rum on these since early May. It has a
                        beautiful dark color and now that I am letting it breath it is coming
                        around quite nicely. It has been in a half gallon Mason Jar and last
                        week after reading on the distillers list where a guy was aging with
                        cotton in the top of the Jar I decided to do the same except I just
                        screwed the lid Band down over a folded paper towel. After A week
                        its down 2% (still 60.5) but is pretty damn close to the bottle of
                        Appleton Estate Reserve I am comparing it to. Doing my best to keep
                        the taste tests to a minimum but so far its looking like I haven't
                        seen the last of that recipe. Gonna let it get to 50% and bottle it
                        for drinking. I have used them for A couple other small experiments
                        but cant really use those as a good test base. They are worth it so
                        far. Cant beat them for the price.

                        Mason
                      • castillo.alex2008
                        Hey Mason Really a cool link. In the past I´ve bought books from these people and they give good service. Taking a look at the other woods they show, have
                        Message 11 of 19 , Nov 5, 2008
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                          Hey Mason

                          Really a cool link. In the past I´ve bought books from these people
                          and they give good service. Taking a look at the other woods they show,
                          have you used them? are they safe to be used? (maple, cherry, apple). I
                          think Hickory will only be good for BBQ.

                          In the other hand I´ve been "sipping" some bottles of JW Green Label
                          and in the back of the box they refer to cedar wood and sandalwood as
                          responsible for some of the flavor. This whisky is a blend from 4 big
                          Scotish distilleries (Linkwood uses cedar wood and Cragganmore uses
                          sandalwood, according to what they say). Where can you find those?
                          It´ll be interesting to experiment aging the same hooch in different
                          wood and later blend them. Now I´m actively working in Scotch via
                          DME/LME and Dextrose as well as peated malt. Maybe Harry and Jim can
                          give us some more input. Looking forward your answers while "sipping"
                          the green

                          Thanks,

                          Alex

                          P.D. Why always I end up asking questions that must be for the
                          Distillers forum here at ND?

                          P.D. 2- Boy! It´s been my 5th bottle of green since August without
                          including my own hooch.

                          P.D. 3-Sipping rigth now, cool!
                        • rye_junkie1
                          ... You are right on the Hickory. Its a little oily for our purpose. As for the others I have not tried them. But hear are some results from a little
                          Message 12 of 19 , Nov 6, 2008
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                            --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "castillo.alex2008"
                            <castillo.alex2008@...> wrote:
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > Hey Mason
                            >
                            > Really a cool link. In the past I´ve bought books from these people
                            > and they give good service. Taking a look at the other woods they show,
                            > have you used them? are they safe to be used? (maple, cherry, apple). I
                            > think Hickory will only be good for BBQ.

                            You are right on the Hickory. Its a little oily for our purpose. As
                            for the others I have not tried them. But hear are some results from
                            a little research.
                            While oak is the overwhelming wood of choice for wood aging, mesquite,
                            hickory, pecan, apple, orange, and cherry wood can also contribute
                            unique qualities to wines aged with their chips or shavings.
                            Gotta find me a bottle of this stuff:
                            http://culinarytypes.blogspot.com/2008/09/whisky-master-of-rappahannock-county.html
                            He seems to have tried a bunch and settled on Applewood.


                            > In the other hand I´ve been "sipping" some bottles of JW Green Label
                            > and in the back of the box they refer to cedar wood and sandalwood as
                            > responsible for some of the flavor. This whisky is a blend from 4 big
                            > Scotish distilleries (Linkwood uses cedar wood and Cragganmore uses
                            > sandalwood, according to what they say). Where can you find those?
                            > It´ll be interesting to experiment aging the same hooch in different
                            > wood and later blend them. Now I´m actively working in Scotch via
                            > DME/LME and Dextrose as well as peated malt. Maybe Harry and Jim can
                            > give us some more input. Looking forward your answers while "sipping"
                            > the green

                            The Green is some good Stuff. A friend gave me one of the gift boxes
                            that had 200ml bottles of Red, Gold ,Green, And Oh yes the BLUE. From
                            time to time the local Liqour store puts JW Black on sale for 25 bucks
                            a fifth. I usually take advantage of that one. The Red however gives
                            me a headache. I am also working on a malt whiskey. Got tha mash
                            clearing now and will distill to low wines this weekend.
                            Harry seems to be the local Scotch Guru. Jim seems to be MIA.
                            > Thanks,
                            >
                            > Alex
                            >
                            > P.D. Why always I end up asking questions that must be for the
                            > Distillers forum here at ND?
                            I think this is a perfect subject for this group.
                            >
                            > P.D. 2- Boy! It´s been my 5th bottle of green since August without
                            > including my own hooch.

                            Some might call that a "problem" but I usually down a fifth to a liter
                            a week myself. When you do the math it works out to about 2-3 beers a
                            night which some studies I have read say is perfectly healthy and may
                            even help ward off things like Diabetes.
                            >
                            > P.D. 3-Sipping rigth now, cool!

                            At work right now. Only thing I am sipping on is Coffee, Hot!

                            Mason
                          • billfitz49
                            Hi Mason, For that aged rum that now tastes like Appleton Estate Reserve, what yeast did you use, and was it an all molasses wash? Thanks, Bill
                            Message 13 of 19 , Nov 8, 2008
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                              Hi Mason,
                              For that aged rum that now tastes like Appleton Estate Reserve, what yeast did you use,
                              and was it an all molasses wash?
                              Thanks,
                              Bill

                              --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "rye_junkie1" <rye_junkie@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "castillo.alex2008"
                              > <castillo.alex2008@> wrote:
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > Hey Mason,
                              > >
                              > > Interesting link
                              > >
                              > > Is it possible to order just one 2 lbs. pack?
                              > > to be delivered by mail?
                              > > Do these chips worth it?
                              > > Have you tried ´em?
                              > >
                              > > Thanks,
                              > >
                              > > Alex
                              >
                              > Hey Alex,
                              > Try this link.
                              > http://tinyurl.com/5w9kfz
                              > I have had a 1/2 gallon of Rum on these since early May. It has a
                              > beautiful dark color and now that I am letting it breath it is coming
                              > around quite nicely. It has been in a half gallon Mason Jar and last
                              > week after reading on the distillers list where a guy was aging with
                              > cotton in the top of the Jar I decided to do the same except I just
                              > screwed the lid Band down over a folded paper towel. After A week
                              > its down 2% (still 60.5) but is pretty damn close to the bottle of
                              > Appleton Estate Reserve I am comparing it to. Doing my best to keep
                              > the taste tests to a minimum but so far its looking like I haven't
                              > seen the last of that recipe. Gonna let it get to 50% and bottle it
                              > for drinking. I have used them for A couple other small experiments
                              > but cant really use those as a good test base. They are worth it so
                              > far. Cant beat them for the price.
                              >
                              > Mason
                              >
                            • rye_junkie1
                              ... yeast did you use, ... First let me qualify my statement. The Rum that I made and am Aging is close to tasting like the Bottle of Appleton Reserve I have
                              Message 14 of 19 , Nov 10, 2008
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                                --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "billfitz49" <billfitz@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > Hi Mason,
                                > For that aged rum that now tastes like Appleton Estate Reserve, what
                                yeast did you use,
                                > and was it an all molasses wash?
                                > Thanks,
                                > Bill


                                First let me qualify my statement. The Rum that I made and am Aging
                                is close to tasting like the Bottle of Appleton Reserve I have on
                                hand. The Bottle of Reserve is no Matusalem Solera Reserve by any
                                stretch though. Its Ok on the rocks or with 7up but not for sippin.
                                I like the Plain AE Jamaican Rum label better, and who knows, In a few
                                weeks I may have something more like that.
                                As for the recipe It was 3 pounds (2 bags) of Florida Crystals Organic
                                Brown Sugar http://mybrands.com/Product.aspx?pid=4837
                                The only place I have found this one is in Publix.
                                Also Four 12 oz jars of Grandmas Molasses original (yellow label)
                                http://www.grandmasmolasses.com/grandmas/grandmas_products.asp
                                and One 15oz jar of plantation brand Blackstrap molasses.
                                http://www.alliedoldenglish.com/plantation.php?flavor=blackstrap
                                Yeast was red star Yellow label.
                                The Grandmas stuff goes on sale down here in florida at wal mart this
                                time of year for 2.00/jar and makes it cheaper than buying a gallon
                                from say brewhaus and paying shipping.

                                Now for the process. I did 2 washes. The first was the above recipe
                                cut in half and eliminating the Blackstrap. Brought to an sg1.060.
                                Fermented it out let it clear and saved the dregs.
                                After I distilled the wash I immediately( while the wash was still
                                near boiling) took 2 gallons of the spent/cooked wash in the boiler
                                and added the above recipe in its entirety plus half the dregs, let
                                everything dissolve and disperse then topped up to 1.060 and added the
                                other half of the dregs/yeast. The top off with cold water got the
                                wash below 100F. When this one was done I did a strip run, Mixed the
                                2 runs together and did a Spirit run with some pretty tight cuts. The
                                half gallon i have aging was from the Very Middle.
                                Basically I did a Sweet Mash and then Sour mash and purposefully made
                                the first run small to obtain all the "Sour" ingredients. Right or
                                Wrong, so far it has worked.

                                Mason
                              • weisst69
                                I know there has been a lot of talk about dunder and a lot of talk about benefits of storing your wares in glass, but does dunder need to be sotred in glass?
                                Message 15 of 19 , Nov 10, 2008
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                                  I know there has been a lot of talk about dunder and a lot of talk
                                  about benefits of storing your wares in glass, but does dunder need to
                                  be sotred in glass? Can I store it in gallon milk jugs instead? That
                                  would free up a bunch of mason jars for aging, etc.

                                  Or would the milk jugs potentially leech chemicals into the dunder? I
                                  am just looking for an way to save larger amounts of the stuff without
                                  having a bunch of smaller containers running around everywhere.

                                  Thanks!
                                  T-
                                • mavnkaf
                                  ... to ... That ... I ... without ... Hi T, I ve been using plastic coke bottles for my dunder for long time now. I have not noticed any plastic taint,
                                  Message 16 of 19 , Nov 10, 2008
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                                    --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "weisst69" <toddweiss@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > I know there has been a lot of talk about dunder and a lot of talk
                                    > about benefits of storing your wares in glass, but does dunder need
                                    to
                                    > be sotred in glass? Can I store it in gallon milk jugs instead?
                                    That
                                    > would free up a bunch of mason jars for aging, etc.
                                    >
                                    > Or would the milk jugs potentially leech chemicals into the dunder?
                                    I
                                    > am just looking for an way to save larger amounts of the stuff
                                    without
                                    > having a bunch of smaller containers running around everywhere.
                                    >
                                    > Thanks!
                                    > T-
                                    >

                                    Hi T, I've been using plastic coke bottles for my dunder for long time
                                    now. I have not noticed any plastic taint, dunder is low in acid and
                                    ethanol, I can't see a problem. Also you can see the sediment at the
                                    bottom of the bottle which I leave out any wash or spirit run. As the
                                    milk bottles go in Australia they are HDPE rated which is good, I'd
                                    check the recycling logo to see what plastic its made of.

                                    Cheers
                                    Marc
                                  • billfitz49
                                    Mason, thanks for the detailed information. I like your Sweet mash, Sour mash system...I ll try it as I m not happy with my first few attempts. My second 2
                                    Message 17 of 19 , Nov 12, 2008
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                                      Mason, thanks for the detailed information. I like your Sweet mash, Sour mash system...I'll
                                      try it as I'm not happy with my first few attempts. My second 2 washes were pure
                                      blackstrap molasses and they only fermented out to a little over 5%. I thought the washes
                                      were stuck but it turned out this was due to the quality of the blackstrap molasses I
                                      bought from a local sugar factory (I live in Central America). What came out of the spirit
                                      run is slightly bitter (I cut out of the middle run at 65%). I hope it will mellow out with
                                      time. Anyways my next 2 washes are brown sugar with dunder added from the
                                      blackstrap runs, and in the future I want to use 'miel de cana' which is like a fancy grade,
                                      light molasses, and also try out cane juice. Anyways it's interesting experimenting with
                                      different mixtures.
                                      Regards,
                                      Bill
                                      --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "rye_junkie1" <rye_junkie@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "billfitz49" <billfitz@> wrote:
                                      > >
                                      > > Hi Mason,
                                      > > For that aged rum that now tastes like Appleton Estate Reserve, what
                                      > yeast did you use,
                                      > > and was it an all molasses wash?
                                      > > Thanks,
                                      > > Bill
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > First let me qualify my statement. The Rum that I made and am Aging
                                      > is close to tasting like the Bottle of Appleton Reserve I have on
                                      > hand. The Bottle of Reserve is no Matusalem Solera Reserve by any
                                      > stretch though. Its Ok on the rocks or with 7up but not for sippin.
                                      > I like the Plain AE Jamaican Rum label better, and who knows, In a few
                                      > weeks I may have something more like that.
                                      > As for the recipe It was 3 pounds (2 bags) of Florida Crystals Organic
                                      > Brown Sugar http://mybrands.com/Product.aspx?pid=4837
                                      > The only place I have found this one is in Publix.
                                      > Also Four 12 oz jars of Grandmas Molasses original (yellow label)
                                      > http://www.grandmasmolasses.com/grandmas/grandmas_products.asp
                                      > and One 15oz jar of plantation brand Blackstrap molasses.
                                      > http://www.alliedoldenglish.com/plantation.php?flavor=blackstrap
                                      > Yeast was red star Yellow label.
                                      > The Grandmas stuff goes on sale down here in florida at wal mart this
                                      > time of year for 2.00/jar and makes it cheaper than buying a gallon
                                      > from say brewhaus and paying shipping.
                                      >
                                      > Now for the process. I did 2 washes. The first was the above recipe
                                      > cut in half and eliminating the Blackstrap. Brought to an sg1.060.
                                      > Fermented it out let it clear and saved the dregs.
                                      > After I distilled the wash I immediately( while the wash was still
                                      > near boiling) took 2 gallons of the spent/cooked wash in the boiler
                                      > and added the above recipe in its entirety plus half the dregs, let
                                      > everything dissolve and disperse then topped up to 1.060 and added the
                                      > other half of the dregs/yeast. The top off with cold water got the
                                      > wash below 100F. When this one was done I did a strip run, Mixed the
                                      > 2 runs together and did a Spirit run with some pretty tight cuts. The
                                      > half gallon i have aging was from the Very Middle.
                                      > Basically I did a Sweet Mash and then Sour mash and purposefully made
                                      > the first run small to obtain all the "Sour" ingredients. Right or
                                      > Wrong, so far it has worked.
                                      >
                                      > Mason
                                      >
                                    • rye_junkie1
                                      ... Sour mash system...I ll ... washes were pure ... I thought the washes ... blackstrap molasses I ... came out of the spirit ... it will mellow out with ...
                                      Message 18 of 19 , Nov 12, 2008
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                                        --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "billfitz49" <billfitz@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > Mason, thanks for the detailed information. I like your Sweet mash,
                                        Sour mash system...I'll
                                        > try it as I'm not happy with my first few attempts. My second 2
                                        washes were pure
                                        > blackstrap molasses and they only fermented out to a little over 5%.
                                        I thought the washes
                                        > were stuck but it turned out this was due to the quality of the
                                        blackstrap molasses I
                                        > bought from a local sugar factory (I live in Central America). What
                                        came out of the spirit
                                        > run is slightly bitter (I cut out of the middle run at 65%). I hope
                                        it will mellow out with
                                        > time. Anyways my next 2 washes are brown sugar with dunder added
                                        from the
                                        > blackstrap runs, and in the future I want to use 'miel de cana'
                                        which is like a fancy grade,
                                        > light molasses, and also try out cane juice. Anyways it's
                                        interesting experimenting with
                                        > different mixtures.
                                        > Regards,
                                        > Bill

                                        Bill,
                                        What little I have read on black strap says a little goes a long way.
                                        I think all Black strap recipes were called "Monkey Rum" and the stuff
                                        was supposed to be pretty vile and Bitter as you say. I too will be
                                        trying Cane Juice here pretty soon. Since I will have an abundance of
                                        it I think I am going to try just plain cane juice and then also
                                        cooking some of it down and then adding water to lower the SG to 1.060
                                        and see if it really is worth it. My guess is it will be.
                                        I think if I can get enough cooked down to get 4-5 gallons of syrup I
                                        will be set for a few days.

                                        Mason
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