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Re: Recipe as simple as it gets

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  • rye_junkie1
    ... I just tried the Brewhaus turbo 48. 15 lbs of sugar, total volume 6.5 gallons. Fermented down to 990 in 36hrs. Letting it clear now. You are correct on
    Message 1 of 9 , Jun 2, 2008
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      --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "chevisn7" <chevisn7@...> wrote:
      >
      > Did not have anything to do so I thought I would try the recipe as it
      > is written on the package of Pure Turbo 24 yeast.
      > 6 gallons of purified water
      > 15 Lbs Sugar
      > Dissolve sugar in water
      > Cool to under 104 degrees I cooled to 86 degrees
      > Aerate water for 2 hours while cooling
      > Add Yeast Packet and stir
      > Aerate water for an additional 3 hours
      > Fermentation took only 48 hours resulted in 18% ABV
      > Kept fermentation temperature below 85%
      > Settling took 48 hours.
      > Results were very favorable.
      > First Distillation "no packing" very clean taste 65%ABV
      > Second Distillation (Reflux 2 drops per second Packing Installed)
      > Absolutely pure no after taste (92 to 95% ABV
      > "Note" do not steer in the middle of fermentation unless you have at
      > least 6 inches of clearance for the liquid to expand. It erupts like
      > a volcano. Be sure to keep fermentation temperature below the maximum
      > listed on the package for a pure fermentation. I noted a rise of about
      > 5 degrees during fermentation. I controled this by placing the
      > fermentation container in a tub of cool water.
      >
      > ChevisN7
      >

      I just tried the Brewhaus turbo 48. 15 lbs of sugar, total volume
      6.5 gallons. Fermented down to 990 in 36hrs. Letting it clear now.
      You are correct on the stirring and flare up. I only stirred it at
      990 and thought I was going to have to find a towel. Very clean smell
      to the wash. I plan on doing 2 of these and refluxing the low wines
      as you did. I am just not getting the Clean vodka flavor that I want
      for essences by using some of the botched XX pot grain/cereal wash
      ferments I have been using.

      Mason
    • billy.turf
      Hi Mason, I thought that if you ran the still right (slow and enough reflux) that it would strip the flavor out of pretty much anything. What are you getting
      Message 2 of 9 , Jun 2, 2008
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        Hi Mason,
        I thought that if you ran the still right (slow and enough reflux) that
        it would strip the flavor out of pretty much anything. What are you
        getting for a taste? Did the wash have a bad taste before you started,
        or did some trub get into the boiler?

        I saw some stuff just this evening on a site that claimed it was clean
        enough before distilling to use with essences even though it claims to
        finish at 24%
        Billy

        > >
        >
        > I just tried the Brewhaus turbo 48. 15 lbs of sugar, total volume
        > 6.5 gallons. Fermented down to 990 in 36hrs. Letting it clear now.
        > You are correct on the stirring and flare up. I only stirred it at
        > 990 and thought I was going to have to find a towel. Very clean smell
        > to the wash. I plan on doing 2 of these and refluxing the low wines
        > as you did. I am just not getting the Clean vodka flavor that I want
        > for essences by using some of the botched XX pot grain/cereal wash
        > ferments I have been using.
        >
        > Mason
        >
      • KM Services
        _____ From: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com [mailto:new_distillers@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of billy.turf Sent: Tuesday, 3 June 2008 8:17 a.m. To:
        Message 3 of 9 , Jun 2, 2008
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          From: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com [mailto: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of billy.turf
          Sent: Tuesday, 3 June 2008 8:17 a.m.
          To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [new_distillers] Re: Recipe as simple as it gets



          I saw some stuff just this evening on a site that claimed it was clean enough before distilling to use with essences even though it claims to finish at 24%
          Billy
          Mate, What you probably have seen is the marketing ( To get around the Law ) of the  turbo 23 for use without distilling ie: just using the low wines to make liqueurs where home distilling is Illegal.

          This is my opinion and if I am wrong I will be corrected I am sure...

          Cheers

          Ken Mc

           

        • rye_junkie1
          ... I have started to compare my Neutral to Store bought vodka. Even at 90% I am still getting some tastes and smells that let me know what the original wash
          Message 4 of 9 , Jun 2, 2008
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            --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "billy.turf" <billy.turf@...>
            wrote:
            >
            > Hi Mason,
            > I thought that if you ran the still right (slow and enough reflux) that
            > it would strip the flavor out of pretty much anything. What are you
            > getting for a taste? Did the wash have a bad taste before you started,
            > or did some trub get into the boiler?
            >
            > I saw some stuff just this evening on a site that claimed it was clean
            > enough before distilling to use with essences even though it claims to
            > finish at 24%
            > Billy

            I have started to compare my Neutral to Store bought vodka. Even at
            90% I am still getting some tastes and smells that let me know what
            the original wash was. Normally my senses are about as sharp as a
            marble but more and more every day over the last few weeks they seem
            to be becoming more aware so to speak. What I get is an honest 90% at
            60F with the hydrometer. I always do a stripping run and then
            reflux/spirit run. Its still good spirit mind you but not perfection.
            I make a fairly generous heads cut and run at about 600-700ml/hour.
            The spirit is crystal clear and the smells and tastes that I am
            getting are definitely not tails. I let the column equalize for at
            least an hour under full reflux with the valve closed and the boiler
            is charged with at least 3 gallons of low wines at 40-50%.
            Ken, This is basically what i have been trying to bug you in private
            about.

            Mason
            Heading Home
            Catch up to you guys in a hour or so.
          • Harry
            ... reflux) that ... you ... started, ... clean ... claims to ... at ... perfection. ... 700ml/hour. ... private ... Mason, There are contaminants dissolved in
            Message 5 of 9 , Jun 2, 2008
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              --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "rye_junkie1" <rye_junkie@...>
              wrote:
              >
              > --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "billy.turf" <billy.turf@>
              > wrote:
              > >
              > > Hi Mason,
              > > I thought that if you ran the still right (slow and enough
              reflux) that
              > > it would strip the flavor out of pretty much anything. What are
              you
              > > getting for a taste? Did the wash have a bad taste before you
              started,
              > > or did some trub get into the boiler?
              > >
              > > I saw some stuff just this evening on a site that claimed it was
              clean
              > > enough before distilling to use with essences even though it
              claims to
              > > finish at 24%
              > > Billy
              >
              > I have started to compare my Neutral to Store bought vodka. Even at
              > 90% I am still getting some tastes and smells that let me know what
              > the original wash was. Normally my senses are about as sharp as a
              > marble but more and more every day over the last few weeks they seem
              > to be becoming more aware so to speak. What I get is an honest 90%
              at
              > 60F with the hydrometer. I always do a stripping run and then
              > reflux/spirit run. Its still good spirit mind you but not
              perfection.
              > I make a fairly generous heads cut and run at about 600-
              700ml/hour.
              > The spirit is crystal clear and the smells and tastes that I am
              > getting are definitely not tails. I let the column equalize for at
              > least an hour under full reflux with the valve closed and the boiler
              > is charged with at least 3 gallons of low wines at 40-50%.
              > Ken, This is basically what i have been trying to bug you in
              private
              > about.
              >
              > Mason
              > Heading Home
              > Catch up to you guys in a hour or so.
              >


              Mason,

              There are contaminants dissolved in high-strength spirit (even in
              azeotrope ethanol, 95.6%). There are two ways to achieve good
              separation.

              1. Dilute the boiler charge to below 30% a/v. This allows any
              dissolved fusels to come out of solution. Fusels dissolve well in
              alcohol but not so well in water, so lower the charge percentage as a
              first step. Skim the top layer (oils float) and throw it in the
              feints receiver for recycling. Then use the rest of it as your
              charge for the reflux still (you can't make true neutral or vodka
              without refluxing).

              2. Polish your NEUTRAL spirit with carbon to remove any possible
              contaminants that may still be left (dissolved fusels, carbs, gases).

              DO NOT confuse NEUTRAL alcohol with AZEOTROPE. Read this thread
              starting with this message...
              http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Distillers/message/42630

              True vodka (US definition: no smell, no taste) is extremely hard to
              achieve. That's why commercial outfits have several rectifying
              columns to clean it up.


              Slainte!
              regards Harry
            • rye_junkie1
              What I get is an honest 90% ... Thanks for the advice Harry. Pint and I discussed shortly last week on the use of carbon and I have some decent 45% sitting on
              Message 6 of 9 , Jun 2, 2008
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                What I get is an honest 90%
                > at
                > > 60F with the hydrometer. I always do a stripping run and then
                > > reflux/spirit run. Its still good spirit mind you but not
                > perfection.
                > > I make a fairly generous heads cut and run at about 600-
                > 700ml/hour.
                > > The spirit is crystal clear and the smells and tastes that I am
                > > getting are definitely not tails. I let the column equalize for at
                > > least an hour under full reflux with the valve closed and the boiler
                > > is charged with at least 3 gallons of low wines at 40-50%.
                > > Ken, This is basically what i have been trying to bug you in
                > private
                > > about.
                > >
                > > Mason
                > > Heading Home
                > > Catch up to you guys in a hour or so.
                > >
                >
                >
                > Mason,
                >
                > There are contaminants dissolved in high-strength spirit (even in
                > azeotrope ethanol, 95.6%). There are two ways to achieve good
                > separation.
                >
                > 1. Dilute the boiler charge to below 30% a/v. This allows any
                > dissolved fusels to come out of solution. Fusels dissolve well in
                > alcohol but not so well in water, so lower the charge percentage as a
                > first step. Skim the top layer (oils float) and throw it in the
                > feints receiver for recycling. Then use the rest of it as your
                > charge for the reflux still (you can't make true neutral or vodka
                > without refluxing).
                >
                > 2. Polish your NEUTRAL spirit with carbon to remove any possible
                > contaminants that may still be left (dissolved fusels, carbs, gases).
                >
                > DO NOT confuse NEUTRAL alcohol with AZEOTROPE. Read this thread
                > starting with this message...
                > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Distillers/message/42630
                >
                > True vodka (US definition: no smell, no taste) is extremely hard to
                > achieve. That's why commercial outfits have several rectifying
                > columns to clean it up.
                >
                >
                > Slainte!
                > regards Harry
                >

                Thanks for the advice Harry. Pint and I discussed shortly last week
                on the use of carbon and I have some decent 45% sitting on some now at
                1/4 cup/liter. I did not know about the first suggestion though. How
                long before you get an oil slick on top to skim. Is this reaction
                almost immediate or does it need to rest for a bit. "True Vodka" is
                not what I am trying to achieve really as I realize what you have
                pointed out. I am just sure that I can achieve better and more
                NEUTRAL than what I have thats all.

                Mason
                And here I was worried that I might finish the day
                without learning something new.
              • rye_junkie1
                ... I did not know about the first suggestion though. How ... Harry, You never got back to me about this. Mason
                Message 7 of 9 , Jun 4, 2008
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                  > > Mason,
                  > >
                  > > There are contaminants dissolved in high-strength spirit (even in
                  > > azeotrope ethanol, 95.6%). There are two ways to achieve good
                  > > separation.
                  > >
                  > > 1. Dilute the boiler charge to below 30% a/v. This allows any
                  > > dissolved fusels to come out of solution. Fusels dissolve well in
                  > > alcohol but not so well in water, so lower the charge percentage as a
                  > > first step. Skim the top layer (oils float) and throw it in the
                  > > feints receiver for recycling. Then use the rest of it as your
                  > > charge for the reflux still (you can't make true neutral or vodka
                  > > without refluxing).

                  > > Slainte!
                  > > regards Harry
                  > >
                  >
                  > Thanks for the advice Harry.
                  I did not know about the first suggestion though. How
                  > long before you get an oil slick on top to skim. Is this reaction
                  > almost immediate or does it need to rest for a bit. "True Vodka" is
                  > not what I am trying to achieve really as I realize what you have
                  > pointed out. I am just sure that I can achieve better and more
                  > NEUTRAL than what I have thats all.
                  >
                  > Mason

                  Harry,
                  You never got back to me about this.

                  Mason
                • Harry
                  ... ........Don t think that you have fusels automatically just because you have funky distillate. There are many reasons for off tastes and smells. You
                  Message 8 of 9 , Jun 4, 2008
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                    --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "rye_junkie1" <rye_junkie@...>
                    wrote:
                    >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > Thanks for the advice Harry.
                    > I did not know about the first suggestion though. How
                    > > long before you get an oil slick on top to skim. Is this reaction
                    > > almost immediate or does it need to rest for a bit.


                    ........Don't think that you have fusels automatically just because
                    you have 'funky' distillate. There are many reasons for 'off' tastes
                    and smells. You only get an oil slick if there's dissolved fusels,
                    which are mostly the higher alcohols that don't dissolve well in
                    water, but do in ethanol. It shows up on the surface of the still
                    charge pretty quick after you dilute it under 30%. But you may not
                    have dissolved fusels. You may instead have residual protein and
                    dissolved gases, which obviously won't show up as a 'oil slick'. Or
                    you may have all of the above.

                    Again, dilution brings these out of solution because they are more
                    capable of dissolving in ethanol than water. Fusels will float,
                    gases will dissipate, solids (proteins) will settle out
                    (precipitate). Both fusels and gases can be removed with carbon in a
                    finished distillate. But not the proteins. They require filtering
                    with a .5 micron or less filter.

                    The proteins are a common cause of that fluffy white sediment you see
                    in bottles left standing undisturbed for any length of time. The
                    protein is not visible at high strength, but visible after diluting
                    and bottling.

                    "True Vodka" is
                    > > not what I am trying to achieve really as I realize what you have
                    > > pointed out. I am just sure that I can achieve better and more
                    > > NEUTRAL than what I have thats all.

                    .............. There is no 'quick & easy' cure-all. But if you
                    attack each possible contaminant source, one by one, you will greatly
                    improve your distillate.

                    May I also suggest you read Kris Berglund's "Artisan Distilling" in
                    my Library. There's a few remedies for distillate faults in there
                    also, some of which have not been mentioned in these groups, probably
                    because we're now getting into the advanced distilling area rather
                    than just learning & doing the basics.


                    HTH
                    Slainte!
                    regards Harry
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