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Question Methanol dangers using a fractionating Still

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  • Jeremy McCoy
    I am in the middle of building a fractionating still. What are the dangers of no disposing of the methanol first created. My understanding is the vapour will
    Message 1 of 3 , Aug 31, 2006
      I am in the middle of building a fractionating still. What are the
      dangers of no disposing of the methanol first created. My
      understanding is the vapour will likely hit the pot scrubbers and
      condence down the coloum again, therefore the methanol remains. Is
      this correct
    • Link D'Antoni
      Jeremy, This is an over simplification of the process. Everything vaporizes (turns to vapor)at different temperatures. Water at sea level turns to vapor @ 212
      Message 2 of 3 , Sep 1, 2006
        Jeremy,
        This is an over simplification of the process.
        Everything vaporizes (turns to vapor)at different
        temperatures. Water at sea level turns to vapor @ 212
        F (100c). Methanol at, i believe, @ 168 F and Ethyl
        Alcohol @ 172 F. As the lower boiling (lighter)
        components boil off the temp will them move up.
        Methanol will vaporize just ahead of the Ethanol and
        will condense just ahead of the Ethanol. That is why
        we pull off the first .10% (fore-shot) after the
        initial condensation. I personally pull off .2%

        Example: In a 5 gallon wash
        3790 ml x 5 = 19,950 ml x .2% = 38 ml
        I will pull off 38 - 40 ml of the first to drip from
        the condenser.
        I have not gotten brain damage yet... which is
        debatable.

        I hope that this helps some.

        Link



        --- Jeremy McCoy <realmccoy333@...> wrote:

        > I am in the middle of building a fractionating
        > still. What are the
        > dangers of no disposing of the methanol first
        > created. My
        > understanding is the vapour will likely hit the pot
        > scrubbers and
        > condence down the coloum again, therefore the
        > methanol remains. Is
        > this correct
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >


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      • miciofelice2003
        Hi Link and Jeremy. In my opinion isn t possible to fix the quantity of methanol without knowing the type of still you have. I mean: by using a pot still
        Message 3 of 3 , Sep 1, 2006
          Hi Link and Jeremy.

          In my opinion isn't possible to fix the quantity of methanol without
          knowing the type of still you have.

          I mean: by using a pot still you'll have some quantity of methylic
          alcohol, by using a fractionnating refluxed column the quantity will
          be different.

          That quantity depends also from the alcoholic percentage of mash you
          are using.

          Let me say, also, that isn't true that methanol is completely
          eliminated with the "heads": it will accompany the distillation till
          the end (at decreasing rate, of course) because a physical law say
          it.

          In fact the boiling point of a mash depend from the alcohol
          percentage: gradually the alcohol evaporate and so the mash boiling
          point increase because the quantity of alcohol into the mash
          decrease.
          At a certain point the boiling temperature will reach the boling
          point of ethylic alcohol, so also it will start to boil; but this
          fact doesn't mean the end of methanol, no: it is still into the
          vapours (at low concentration, of course).

          If you have a fractionnating refluxed column you don't take any
          risks: the reflux will be able to separate very well the heads, but
          if you have a pot still things are a little bit different.

          In this case you can only count of the capability of your pot still
          to reflux down the ethylic alcohol in the beginning of the
          distillation: in this case the percentage you wrote (about 0.2%)
          is , in my opinion, a little bit optimistic.

          Anyway we have a godd judge that help us a lot: our nose and our
          tong.

          Till you fill a biting smell you don't have to collect: it's the
          ethyl acetate, that give the sensation of a lot of needles into your
          nose.
          This component follow the meth and is immediately before the ethylic
          alcohol, but is still belonging to heads so you don't have to
          collect.


          Hoping to have given some help.

          micio felice




          --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, Link D'Antoni <link2d@...>
          wrote:
          >
          > Jeremy,
          > This is an over simplification of the process.
          > Everything vaporizes (turns to vapor)at different
          > temperatures. Water at sea level turns to vapor @ 212
          > F (100c). Methanol at, i believe, @ 168 F and Ethyl
          > Alcohol @ 172 F. As the lower boiling (lighter)
          > components boil off the temp will them move up.
          > Methanol will vaporize just ahead of the Ethanol and
          > will condense just ahead of the Ethanol. That is why
          > we pull off the first .10% (fore-shot) after the
          > initial condensation. I personally pull off .2%
          >
          > Example: In a 5 gallon wash
          > 3790 ml x 5 = 19,950 ml x .2% = 38 ml
          > I will pull off 38 - 40 ml of the first to drip from
          > the condenser.
          > I have not gotten brain damage yet... which is
          > debatable.
          >
          > I hope that this helps some.
          >
          > Link
          >
          >
          >
          > --- Jeremy McCoy <realmccoy333@...> wrote:
          >
          > > I am in the middle of building a fractionating
          > > still. What are the
          > > dangers of no disposing of the methanol first
          > > created. My
          > > understanding is the vapour will likely hit the pot
          > > scrubbers and
          > > condence down the coloum again, therefore the
          > > methanol remains. Is
          > > this correct
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
          >
          > __________________________________________________
          > Do You Yahoo!?
          > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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