Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.
 

Wheat vodka disaster

Expand Messages
  • hypodyne
    Gday all Awhile ago I found a pdf All-grain wheat mash vodka. I have tried twice to make wheat vodka and failed both times. First time I used the wrong yeast.
    Message 1 of 20 , Nov 7, 2005
      Gday all

      Awhile ago I found a pdf All-grain wheat mash vodka. I have tried
      twice to make wheat vodka and failed both times.

      First time I used the wrong yeast.

      Second time I bought some yeast with AG which seem to ferment the
      mash okay. The mash being a mixture of 1.5 packets Farmland Whole
      wheat biscuit (1.8kg total) and wheat malt sryrup 1L. Once the yeast
      was added it seem to bubble away for a few days. By the 3rd day it
      began to smell a bit off.

      So I decide to distill it. First problem I had was to try to
      seperate the liquid from the solids. I used a silk pillowcase and
      poured the mixture in but the liquid would not pass through it.
      Deciding that the silk pillowcase must have been too fine I used a
      cotton one. Same problem, no liquid would pass through it even after
      suspending it. The bag was suspended over a container and out of the
      15L batch maybe one litre was in the bowl. Squeezing didnt work.

      So I decided to try to distill with the solids still in the mix. The
      solids just burnt on the bottom of the still and sent a burnt taste
      through the heads. I abandened the attempt after collecting 100mls.

      Any thoughts on where I went wrong.
    • Harry
      ... yeast ... after ... the ... The ... taste ... Plenty of thoughts, but first, point me to the pdf. Slainte! regards Harry Moderator
      Message 2 of 20 , Nov 7, 2005
        --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "hypodyne" <hypodyne@y...>
        wrote:
        >
        > Gday all
        >
        > Awhile ago I found a pdf All-grain wheat mash vodka. I have tried
        > twice to make wheat vodka and failed both times.
        >
        > First time I used the wrong yeast.
        >
        > Second time I bought some yeast with AG which seem to ferment the
        > mash okay. The mash being a mixture of 1.5 packets Farmland Whole
        > wheat biscuit (1.8kg total) and wheat malt sryrup 1L. Once the
        yeast
        > was added it seem to bubble away for a few days. By the 3rd day it
        > began to smell a bit off.
        >
        > So I decide to distill it. First problem I had was to try to
        > seperate the liquid from the solids. I used a silk pillowcase and
        > poured the mixture in but the liquid would not pass through it.
        > Deciding that the silk pillowcase must have been too fine I used a
        > cotton one. Same problem, no liquid would pass through it even
        after
        > suspending it. The bag was suspended over a container and out of
        the
        > 15L batch maybe one litre was in the bowl. Squeezing didnt work.
        >
        > So I decided to try to distill with the solids still in the mix.
        The
        > solids just burnt on the bottom of the still and sent a burnt
        taste
        > through the heads. I abandened the attempt after collecting 100mls.
        >
        > Any thoughts on where I went wrong.
        >



        Plenty of thoughts, but first, point me to the pdf.


        Slainte!
        regards Harry
        Moderator
      • Robert Thomas
        My guess: 1. using the silk pillow case without letting the wife know; 2. Having ruined that, moving on to the cotton on, again, without letting the wife know;
        Message 3 of 20 , Nov 7, 2005
          My guess:
          1. using the silk pillow case without letting the wife
          know;
          2. Having ruined that, moving on to the cotton on,
          again, without letting the wife know;
          3. Smelling the house out with burnt stench, this time
          the wife knew all about it!
          4. Not having any vodka to calm the now hostile and
          rather dangerous looking wife.

          I'd keep the porridgy mess you've been working with.
          It might be all the cooked food you'll get for a
          while.

          Cheers,
          Rob.



          --- hypodyne <hypodyne@...> wrote:

          > Gday all
          >
          > Awhile ago I found a pdf All-grain wheat mash vodka.
          > I have tried
          > twice to make wheat vodka and failed both times.
          >
          > First time I used the wrong yeast.
          >
          > Second time I bought some yeast with AG which seem
          > to ferment the
          > mash okay. The mash being a mixture of 1.5 packets
          > Farmland Whole
          > wheat biscuit (1.8kg total) and wheat malt sryrup
          > 1L. Once the yeast
          > was added it seem to bubble away for a few days. By
          > the 3rd day it
          > began to smell a bit off.
          >
          > So I decide to distill it. First problem I had was
          > to try to
          > seperate the liquid from the solids. I used a silk
          > pillowcase and
          > poured the mixture in but the liquid would not pass
          > through it.
          > Deciding that the silk pillowcase must have been too
          > fine I used a
          > cotton one. Same problem, no liquid would pass
          > through it even after
          > suspending it. The bag was suspended over a
          > container and out of the
          > 15L batch maybe one litre was in the bowl. Squeezing
          > didnt work.
          >
          > So I decided to try to distill with the solids still
          > in the mix. The
          > solids just burnt on the bottom of the still and
          > sent a burnt taste
          > through the heads. I abandened the attempt after
          > collecting 100mls.
          >
          > Any thoughts on where I went wrong.
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >


          Cheers,
          Rob.



          __________________________________
          Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click.
          http://farechase.yahoo.com
        • hypodyne
          The PDF is http://www.brewhaus.com/Wheat-Vodka-Recipe.pdf ... tried ... the ... Whole ... it ... and ... a ... 100mls.
          Message 4 of 20 , Nov 7, 2005
            The PDF is http://www.brewhaus.com/Wheat-Vodka-Recipe.pdf

            --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Harry" <gnikomson2000@y...>
            wrote:
            >
            > --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "hypodyne" <hypodyne@y...>
            > wrote:
            > >
            > > Gday all
            > >
            > > Awhile ago I found a pdf All-grain wheat mash vodka. I have
            tried
            > > twice to make wheat vodka and failed both times.
            > >
            > > First time I used the wrong yeast.
            > >
            > > Second time I bought some yeast with AG which seem to ferment
            the
            > > mash okay. The mash being a mixture of 1.5 packets Farmland
            Whole
            > > wheat biscuit (1.8kg total) and wheat malt sryrup 1L. Once the
            > yeast
            > > was added it seem to bubble away for a few days. By the 3rd day
            it
            > > began to smell a bit off.
            > >
            > > So I decide to distill it. First problem I had was to try to
            > > seperate the liquid from the solids. I used a silk pillowcase
            and
            > > poured the mixture in but the liquid would not pass through it.
            > > Deciding that the silk pillowcase must have been too fine I used
            a
            > > cotton one. Same problem, no liquid would pass through it even
            > after
            > > suspending it. The bag was suspended over a container and out of
            > the
            > > 15L batch maybe one litre was in the bowl. Squeezing didnt work.
            > >
            > > So I decided to try to distill with the solids still in the mix.
            > The
            > > solids just burnt on the bottom of the still and sent a burnt
            > taste
            > > through the heads. I abandened the attempt after collecting
            100mls.
            > >
            > > Any thoughts on where I went wrong.
            > >
            >
            >
            >
            > Plenty of thoughts, but first, point me to the pdf.
            >
            >
            > Slainte!
            > regards Harry
            > Moderator
            >
          • Harry
            ... day ... it. ... used ... of ... work. ... mix. ... Ok, first of all the author of that pdf is a very reputable person in distilling circles, one Ian
            Message 5 of 20 , Nov 7, 2005
              --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "hypodyne" <hypodyne@y...>
              wrote:
              >
              > The PDF is http://www.brewhaus.com/Wheat-Vodka-Recipe.pdf

              > > > Gday all
              > > >
              > > > Awhile ago I found a pdf All-grain wheat mash vodka. I have
              > tried
              > > > twice to make wheat vodka and failed both times.
              > > >
              > > > First time I used the wrong yeast.
              > > >
              > > > Second time I bought some yeast with AG which seem to ferment
              > the
              > > > mash okay. The mash being a mixture of 1.5 packets Farmland
              > Whole
              > > > wheat biscuit (1.8kg total) and wheat malt sryrup 1L. Once the
              > > yeast
              > > > was added it seem to bubble away for a few days. By the 3rd
              day
              > it
              > > > began to smell a bit off.
              > > >
              > > > So I decide to distill it. First problem I had was to try to
              > > > seperate the liquid from the solids. I used a silk pillowcase
              > and
              > > > poured the mixture in but the liquid would not pass through
              it.
              > > > Deciding that the silk pillowcase must have been too fine I
              used
              > a
              > > > cotton one. Same problem, no liquid would pass through it even
              > > after
              > > > suspending it. The bag was suspended over a container and out
              of
              > > the
              > > > 15L batch maybe one litre was in the bowl. Squeezing didnt
              work.
              > > >
              > > > So I decided to try to distill with the solids still in the
              mix.
              > > The
              > > > solids just burnt on the bottom of the still and sent a burnt
              > > taste
              > > > through the heads. I abandened the attempt after collecting
              > 100mls.
              > > >
              > > > Any thoughts on where I went wrong.



              Ok, first of all the author of that pdf is a very reputable person
              in distilling circles, one Ian Smiley. After reading the pdf I
              couldn't see anything wrong with it (didn't expect to).

              I do note however that your mash has deviated considerably from the
              stated recipe. Let's look at a few things.

              You're using substitute wheat sources. That's fine except for one
              very important fact. You now have NO ENZYMES!! When Ian Smiley
              says crushed wheat malt, he means wheat that has been sprouted to
              generate enzyme activity. This is necessary to convert the other
              starches. Malt extract, wheat or otherwise, has NO ENZYME
              ACTIVITY. That's why it smells off. It's full of bacteria eating
              up big on the unconverted starch.


              You say that the first time you used the wrong yeast, then the
              second time you used the recipe's recommended yeast with AG. The AG
              is AmyloGlucosidase, which converts the residual starches and some
              unfermentable sugars, AFTER the bulk of the starch has been
              converted by the crushed wheat malt. If you were getting good
              primary conversion, (which you're not, no enzymes) almost any yeast
              would work, AG or not.

              What you're getting is a tiny bit of conversion through the AG and
              that's all. So the obvious thing to do for starters is to use
              SPROUTED WHEAT MALT, not liquid malt extract.

              The next thing to look at is the amount of starches/sugars in your
              altered recipe. 1.8 kg of flake and 1 kg of LME is only equal to
              about 2.5 kg potential sugar, IF it's fully converted. That's a bit
              low for 15 litres of water, and at best will only produce ~2 litres
              of 43% finished drinking spirit.

              If you're going to go to all this trouble for a couple of bottles,
              then is it worth it? I realise you're probably trying to prove to
              yourself that it's feasible, but really, do a full mash BY THE
              RECIPE. Then you'll have some sort of a result and it will give you
              the courage to continue. Most newcomers to grain distilling make
              this mistake and that's why many never go any further.

              Resolve the enzyme issue first, then worry about the separating with
              pillowcases after you have something to work with.

              Hope this points you in the right direction.


              Slainte!
              regards Harry
              Moderator
            • hypodyne
              ... the ... AG ... yeast ... That was the only malt I could find locally, will look for some crushed wheat malt. ... bit ... litres ... Yes I want to see if
              Message 6 of 20 , Nov 8, 2005
                > Ok, first of all the author of that pdf is a very reputable person
                > in distilling circles, one Ian Smiley. After reading the pdf I
                > couldn't see anything wrong with it (didn't expect to).
                >
                > I do note however that your mash has deviated considerably from
                the
                > stated recipe. Let's look at a few things.
                >
                > You're using substitute wheat sources. That's fine except for one
                > very important fact. You now have NO ENZYMES!! When Ian Smiley
                > says crushed wheat malt, he means wheat that has been sprouted to
                > generate enzyme activity. This is necessary to convert the other
                > starches. Malt extract, wheat or otherwise, has NO ENZYME
                > ACTIVITY. That's why it smells off. It's full of bacteria eating
                > up big on the unconverted starch.
                >
                >
                > You say that the first time you used the wrong yeast, then the
                > second time you used the recipe's recommended yeast with AG. The
                AG
                > is AmyloGlucosidase, which converts the residual starches and some
                > unfermentable sugars, AFTER the bulk of the starch has been
                > converted by the crushed wheat malt. If you were getting good
                > primary conversion, (which you're not, no enzymes) almost any
                yeast
                > would work, AG or not.
                >
                > What you're getting is a tiny bit of conversion through the AG and
                > that's all. So the obvious thing to do for starters is to use
                > SPROUTED WHEAT MALT, not liquid malt extract.

                That was the only malt I could find locally, will look for some
                crushed wheat malt.

                > The next thing to look at is the amount of starches/sugars in your
                > altered recipe. 1.8 kg of flake and 1 kg of LME is only equal to
                > about 2.5 kg potential sugar, IF it's fully converted. That's a
                bit
                > low for 15 litres of water, and at best will only produce ~2
                litres
                > of 43% finished drinking spirit.
                >
                > If you're going to go to all this trouble for a couple of bottles,
                > then is it worth it? I realise you're probably trying to prove to
                > yourself that it's feasible, but really, do a full mash BY THE
                > RECIPE.

                Yes I want to see if the extra trouble to wheat vodka is worth all
                the trouble.

                FULL MIX
                23L Water
                4K flaked wheat
                3/4K finely crushed wheat malt

                HALF MIX
                11.5L Water
                2K flaked wheat
                3/8K finely crushed wheat malt

                Well the pdf does state that it scales well and the mix is 1/2 the
                original quantities. The reason I have done this is because my
                fermenter (Stainless Steel Stock Pot) is only 18liters. If I had
                done a full mash quantities I would have had the same quantities
                just in seperate stock pots.

                > Then you'll have some sort of a result and it will give you
                > the courage to continue. Most newcomers to grain distilling make
                > this mistake and that's why many never go any further.
                >
                > Resolve the enzyme issue first, then worry about the separating
                with
                > pillowcases after you have something to work with.

                Well if I make a successful mash and still cannot seperate it I get
                the same result as an unsuccessful mash, it all goes to the compost.

                > Hope this points you in the right direction.
                >
                >
                > Slainte!
                > regards Harry
                > Moderator
                >
              • Harry
                ... ...........I doubt very much if you will find wheat malt commercially. Everybody uses 6-row barley malt, available at good homebrew outlets. This will do
                Message 7 of 20 , Nov 8, 2005
                  --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "hypodyne" <hypodyne@y...>
                  wrote:
                  > So the obvious thing to do for starters is to use
                  > > SPROUTED WHEAT MALT, not liquid malt extract.
                  >
                  > That was the only malt I could find locally, will look for some
                  > crushed wheat malt.



                  ...........I doubt very much if you will find wheat malt
                  commercially. Everybody uses 6-row barley malt, available at good
                  homebrew outlets. This will do the job and much better than wheat
                  malt. Remember you have to crush the malt yourself with a coffee
                  grinder or pastry roller or similar. Otherwise the enzymes aren't
                  exposed to the mash and again you get little to no conversion.

                  You can always malt your own wheat, but it's a PITA, and requires
                  good seed wheat (not cheap) and some expertise.

                  For a test batch, get the barley, or just use enzyme powder.





                  >
                  >
                  > Yes I want to see if the extra trouble to wheat vodka is worth all
                  > the trouble.

                  >
                  > Well if I make a successful mash and still cannot seperate it I
                  get
                  > the same result as an unsuccessful mash, it all goes to the
                  compost.


                  ..................If you make a successful mash, it will have thin
                  watery sweet liquid, the wort, which will be much easier to
                  separate. There's a huge difference between a converted mash and
                  one that's basically still all starch (flour & water glue ring any
                  bells?).

                  Mashing all grain beers is a skill, just like any other. The wort
                  we make as distillers is identical in every respect to beer except
                  for the hops. Distillers beer has no hops (too bitter when
                  distilled).

                  There are many excellent tutorials on the web for making all grain
                  beer. May I suggest John Palmer's excellent paper... "A "Cooler"
                  Way to Ease into All-Grain Brewing". Link here...
                  http://tinyurl.com/aobp3

                  John also has a full book "How to Brew", readable online here...
                  http://www.howtobrew.com/intro.html


                  Bottom line is, all grain brewing for distilling purposes produces
                  some remarkable whiskies, and to a lesser extent vodkas. However
                  there's a lot of work involved and it doesn't produce lots of
                  alcohol like you can with sugar worts. That's why I suggested you
                  cut corners with powdered enzymes and make a full batch to make it
                  worthwhile.



                  Slainte!
                  regards Harry
                  Moderator
                • hypodyne
                  ... Could not find enzyme powder. Found malted grain (photo under the hypodyne directory) which I think is barley and bought a coffee grinder. So I have to
                  Message 8 of 20 , Nov 12, 2005
                    --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Harry" <gnikomson2000@y...>
                    wrote:
                    >
                    > --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "hypodyne" <hypodyne@y...>
                    > wrote:
                    > > So the obvious thing to do for starters is to use
                    > > > SPROUTED WHEAT MALT, not liquid malt extract.
                    > >
                    > > That was the only malt I could find locally, will look for some
                    > > crushed wheat malt.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > ...........I doubt very much if you will find wheat malt
                    > commercially. Everybody uses 6-row barley malt, available at good
                    > homebrew outlets. This will do the job and much better than wheat
                    > malt. Remember you have to crush the malt yourself with a coffee
                    > grinder or pastry roller or similar. Otherwise the enzymes aren't
                    > exposed to the mash and again you get little to no conversion.
                    >
                    > You can always malt your own wheat, but it's a PITA, and requires
                    > good seed wheat (not cheap) and some expertise.
                    >
                    > For a test batch, get the barley, or just use enzyme powder.

                    Could not find enzyme powder. Found malted grain (photo under the
                    hypodyne directory) which I think is barley and bought a coffee
                    grinder.

                    So I have to germinate the barley and then crush it. I am guessing
                    that the results are going to be a paste instead of a dry powder.

                    Any information on malting around? Suppose I should google it.

                    > > Yes I want to see if the extra trouble to wheat vodka is worth
                    all
                    > > the trouble.
                    >
                    > >
                    > > Well if I make a successful mash and still cannot seperate it I
                    > get
                    > > the same result as an unsuccessful mash, it all goes to the
                    > compost.
                    >
                    >
                    > ..................If you make a successful mash, it will have thin
                    > watery sweet liquid, the wort, which will be much easier to
                    > separate. There's a huge difference between a converted mash and
                    > one that's basically still all starch (flour & water glue ring any
                    > bells?).
                    >
                    > Mashing all grain beers is a skill, just like any other. The wort
                    > we make as distillers is identical in every respect to beer except
                    > for the hops. Distillers beer has no hops (too bitter when
                    > distilled).
                    >
                    > There are many excellent tutorials on the web for making all grain
                    > beer. May I suggest John Palmer's excellent paper... "A "Cooler"
                    > Way to Ease into All-Grain Brewing". Link here...
                    > http://tinyurl.com/aobp3
                    >
                    > John also has a full book "How to Brew", readable online here...
                    > http://www.howtobrew.com/intro.html
                    >
                    >
                    > Bottom line is, all grain brewing for distilling purposes produces
                    > some remarkable whiskies, and to a lesser extent vodkas. However
                    > there's a lot of work involved and it doesn't produce lots of
                    > alcohol like you can with sugar worts. That's why I suggested you
                    > cut corners with powdered enzymes and make a full batch to make it
                    > worthwhile.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Slainte!
                    > regards Harry
                    > Moderator
                    >
                  • Harry
                    ... Aw c mon. Quit yankin my chain! You don t REALLY mean to tell us you bought MALTED grain, export pils from West Brew in WA, and didn t ask em how to
                    Message 9 of 20 , Nov 13, 2005
                      --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "hypodyne" <hypodyne@y...>
                      wrote:
                      >
                      > Could not find enzyme powder. Found malted grain (photo under the
                      > hypodyne directory) which I think is barley and bought a coffee
                      > grinder.
                      >
                      > So I have to germinate the barley and then crush it. I am guessing
                      > that the results are going to be a paste instead of a dry powder.
                      >
                      > Any information on malting around? Suppose I should google it.



                      Aw c'mon. Quit yankin' my chain! You don't REALLY mean to tell us
                      you bought MALTED grain, export pils from West Brew in WA, and
                      didn't ask 'em how to use it? (see you got the pic from their
                      website).
                      http://www.westbrew.com.au/index.html keyword search malt

                      The word MALTED means it's already been germinated, dried etc. and
                      ready to go to work!



                      Slainte!
                      regards Harry
                      Moderator
                    • hypodyne
                      ... the ... guessing ... powder. ... us ... I did ask and the guy that sold it to me but he did not know. I thought that may have been the case, I asked online
                      Message 10 of 20 , Nov 13, 2005
                        --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Harry" <gnikomson2000@y...>
                        wrote:
                        >
                        > --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "hypodyne" <hypodyne@y...>
                        > wrote:
                        > >
                        > > Could not find enzyme powder. Found malted grain (photo under
                        the
                        > > hypodyne directory) which I think is barley and bought a coffee
                        > > grinder.
                        > >
                        > > So I have to germinate the barley and then crush it. I am
                        guessing
                        > > that the results are going to be a paste instead of a dry
                        powder.
                        > >
                        > > Any information on malting around? Suppose I should google it.
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > Aw c'mon. Quit yankin' my chain! You don't REALLY mean to tell
                        us
                        > you bought MALTED grain, export pils from West Brew in WA, and
                        > didn't ask 'em how to use it? (see you got the pic from their
                        > website).
                        > http://www.westbrew.com.au/index.html keyword search malt
                        >
                        > The word MALTED means it's already been germinated, dried etc. and
                        > ready to go to work!
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > Slainte!
                        > regards Harry
                        > Moderator
                        >

                        I did ask and the guy that sold it to me but he did not know. I
                        thought that may have been the case, I asked online and they will
                        get back to me.(wont be holding my breath) So I tried some crushed
                        it up and added it to the mix and nothing at all happened.

                        From reading an article that I have to germinate the seed, then
                        crush it.

                        Thats pretty much what I thought Malted means but I take it in this
                        case it means Grain that can be malted.
                      • Robert Thomas
                        No, no, no. Malted grain is malted grain, nothing else. If nothing happenned when you crushed it and added it, then your technique is wrong. Check for correct
                        Message 11 of 20 , Nov 13, 2005
                          No, no, no. Malted grain is malted grain, nothing else. If nothing happenned when you crushed it and added it, then your technique is wrong. Check for correct temperature, complete mixing, enough malted barley, enough time, correct pH.

                          The final, though unlikely reason (being as the bag looked hermetically sealed) is that the grain has gone slack (ie absorbed moisture and "gone off") The grain should be firm and quite hard to crush. When crushed it should produce powder/lumps, not playdo/dough type stuff.

                          Cheers,
                          Rob.


                          hypodyne <hypodyne@...> wrote: --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Harry" <gnikomson2000@y...>
                          wrote:
                          >
                          > --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "hypodyne" <hypodyne@y...>
                          > wrote:
                          > >
                          > > Could not find enzyme powder. Found malted grain (photo under
                          the
                          > > hypodyne directory) which I think is barley and bought a coffee
                          > > grinder.
                          > >
                          > > So I have to germinate the barley and then crush it. I am
                          guessing
                          > > that the results are going to be a paste instead of a dry
                          powder.
                          > >
                          > > Any information on malting around? Suppose I should google it.
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > Aw c'mon. Quit yankin' my chain! You don't REALLY mean to tell
                          us
                          > you bought MALTED grain, export pils from West Brew in WA, and
                          > didn't ask 'em how to use it? (see you got the pic from their
                          > website).
                          > http://www.westbrew.com.au/index.html keyword search malt
                          >
                          > The word MALTED means it's already been germinated, dried etc. and
                          > ready to go to work!
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > Slainte!
                          > regards Harry
                          > Moderator
                          >

                          I did ask and the guy that sold it to me but he did not know. I
                          thought that may have been the case, I asked online and they will
                          get back to me.(wont be holding my breath) So I tried some crushed
                          it up and added it to the mix and nothing at all happened.

                          From reading an article that I have to germinate the seed, then
                          crush it.

                          Thats pretty much what I thought Malted means but I take it in this
                          case it means Grain that can be malted.






                          New Distillers group archives are at http://archive.nnytech.net/
                          FAQ and other information available at http://homedistiller.org





                          ---------------------------------
                          YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS


                          Visit your group "new_distillers" on the web.

                          To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                          new_distillers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


                          ---------------------------------






                          Cheers,
                          Rob.

                          ---------------------------------
                          Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click.

                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • hypodyne
                          Okay here are the instructions that I follow to make a test batch. Test batch is just a scaled down version (1/10th) to prevent wasting ingrediants until I get
                          Message 12 of 20 , Nov 14, 2005
                            Okay here are the instructions that I follow to make a test batch.
                            Test batch is just a scaled down version (1/10th) to prevent wasting
                            ingrediants until I get the recipe correct.

                            3rd Attempt recipe.

                            2.3L water
                            0.4 kg of flaked wheat
                            0.075 kg of finely crushed Malted Grain Export PILS
                            1/10th Prestige WD Active Dried Yeast with Amyloglucosidase (which
                            is suitable for 25L, 10 times current recipe)

                            Stainless Steel pot.
                            Meat thermometer
                            Electric coffee grinder

                            Grind the grain ready for use. It crushed up well into a powder
                            using the electric coffee grinder. No moisture.
                            Add water to pot.
                            Check the waters PH. Around 5.8 already.
                            Heat the water until it gets to 74 degrees C then turn off the heat.
                            Add the Whole Wheat biscuits. (97% wheat, sugar, salt, barley malt
                            extract, vitamins( niacin, thiamin, riboflavin)).
                            Stir for 5 mins.
                            Let it cool till it reaches 66 degrees C then add the crushed malted
                            barley and stir in.
                            Leave until it reaches under 38 degrees C (overnight which brings it
                            to room tempreture Between 15 and 25 degrees C (night/day)) .
                            Add the yeast at 20 degrees C in the morning and after it has
                            hydrated stir it in and put the lid back on.

                            Nothing happened in the fermentation (it just sat there).

                            Guessing it is something to do with the Malted grain as even the
                            (2nd attempt) malt extract gave some activity for the first couple
                            of days.
                          • Harry
                            ... wasting ... heat. ... malted ... it ... Why do you insist on using whole wheat biscuits? Any baker or housewife who cooks (any left out there?) will tell
                            Message 13 of 20 , Nov 14, 2005
                              --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "hypodyne" <hypodyne@y...>
                              wrote:
                              >
                              > Okay here are the instructions that I follow to make a test batch.
                              > Test batch is just a scaled down version (1/10th) to prevent
                              wasting
                              > ingrediants until I get the recipe correct.
                              >
                              > 3rd Attempt recipe.
                              >
                              > 2.3L water
                              > 0.4 kg of flaked wheat
                              > 0.075 kg of finely crushed Malted Grain Export PILS
                              > 1/10th Prestige WD Active Dried Yeast with Amyloglucosidase (which
                              > is suitable for 25L, 10 times current recipe)
                              >
                              > Stainless Steel pot.
                              > Meat thermometer
                              > Electric coffee grinder
                              >
                              > Grind the grain ready for use. It crushed up well into a powder
                              > using the electric coffee grinder. No moisture.
                              > Add water to pot.
                              > Check the waters PH. Around 5.8 already.
                              > Heat the water until it gets to 74 degrees C then turn off the
                              heat.
                              > Add the Whole Wheat biscuits. (97% wheat, sugar, salt, barley malt
                              > extract, vitamins( niacin, thiamin, riboflavin)).
                              > Stir for 5 mins.
                              > Let it cool till it reaches 66 degrees C then add the crushed
                              malted
                              > barley and stir in.
                              > Leave until it reaches under 38 degrees C (overnight which brings
                              it
                              > to room tempreture Between 15 and 25 degrees C (night/day)) .
                              > Add the yeast at 20 degrees C in the morning and after it has
                              > hydrated stir it in and put the lid back on.
                              >
                              > Nothing happened in the fermentation (it just sat there).
                              >
                              > Guessing it is something to do with the Malted grain as even the
                              > (2nd attempt) malt extract gave some activity for the first couple
                              > of days.
                              >



                              Why do you insist on using whole wheat biscuits? Any baker or
                              housewife who cooks (any left out there?) will tell you, SALT
                              RETARDS YEAST.

                              You can't use ALL the water in one go. You will make the mash too
                              thin and the enzymes won't get contact with the starches to convert
                              them. The mash should be thick to start with, then when the
                              conversion reaction is finished, the rest of the water is added.

                              Splitting yeast packs is not a good idea. The ingredients are often
                              not well mixed, therefore you have no way of knowing if your 1/10th
                              is yeast, emzymes, buffer, nutrients, or (ideally) a combination of
                              all.

                              You state that "Test batch is just a scaled down version (1/10th) to
                              prevent wasting ingrediants until I get the recipe correct." Well
                              this is the 3rd attempt and still no result. I can't see that as
                              preventing wasting ingredients.

                              Also the size of the test batch won't produce much alcohol even if
                              all conditions are right, certainly not enough to prove the concept.

                              You're making things more & more difficult for yourself and just
                              confusing the issue. Make a full batch, with wheat or flaked wheat
                              BY THE PDF RECIPE. If it doesn't work, contact Gert Strand (yeast)
                              or Ian Smilie (recipe).


                              Slainte!
                              regards Harry
                              Moderator
                            • hypodyne
                              ... batch. ... (which ... malt ... brings ... couple ... Insist, who said I insist on them. I dont care what I use as long as it works and is resonable priced.
                              Message 14 of 20 , Nov 15, 2005
                                --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Harry" <gnikomson2000@y...>
                                wrote:
                                >
                                > --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "hypodyne" <hypodyne@y...>
                                > wrote:
                                > >
                                > > Okay here are the instructions that I follow to make a test
                                batch.
                                > > Test batch is just a scaled down version (1/10th) to prevent
                                > wasting
                                > > ingrediants until I get the recipe correct.
                                > >
                                > > 3rd Attempt recipe.
                                > >
                                > > 2.3L water
                                > > 0.4 kg of flaked wheat
                                > > 0.075 kg of finely crushed Malted Grain Export PILS
                                > > 1/10th Prestige WD Active Dried Yeast with Amyloglucosidase
                                (which
                                > > is suitable for 25L, 10 times current recipe)
                                > >
                                > > Stainless Steel pot.
                                > > Meat thermometer
                                > > Electric coffee grinder
                                > >
                                > > Grind the grain ready for use. It crushed up well into a powder
                                > > using the electric coffee grinder. No moisture.
                                > > Add water to pot.
                                > > Check the waters PH. Around 5.8 already.
                                > > Heat the water until it gets to 74 degrees C then turn off the
                                > heat.
                                > > Add the Whole Wheat biscuits. (97% wheat, sugar, salt, barley
                                malt
                                > > extract, vitamins( niacin, thiamin, riboflavin)).
                                > > Stir for 5 mins.
                                > > Let it cool till it reaches 66 degrees C then add the crushed
                                > malted
                                > > barley and stir in.
                                > > Leave until it reaches under 38 degrees C (overnight which
                                brings
                                > it
                                > > to room tempreture Between 15 and 25 degrees C (night/day)) .
                                > > Add the yeast at 20 degrees C in the morning and after it has
                                > > hydrated stir it in and put the lid back on.
                                > >
                                > > Nothing happened in the fermentation (it just sat there).
                                > >
                                > > Guessing it is something to do with the Malted grain as even the
                                > > (2nd attempt) malt extract gave some activity for the first
                                couple
                                > > of days.
                                > >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > Why do you insist on using whole wheat biscuits? Any baker or
                                > housewife who cooks (any left out there?) will tell you, SALT
                                > RETARDS YEAST.

                                Insist, who said I insist on them. I dont care what I use as long as
                                it works and is resonable priced. Biscuits are cheaper than the
                                loose wheat flakes.

                                I am neither a baker or a housewife and its the first time I have
                                heard that salt retards yeast. Since I used the same brand of wheat
                                biscuits and the yeast worked on the first attempt, I doubt the
                                trace amounts of salt are the problem.

                                But the question is why are you yelling? It's like your emotionally
                                attached to the yeast or something. If your going to get that upset
                                maybe you should just ignore my posts.

                                > You can't use ALL the water in one go. You will make the mash too
                                > thin and the enzymes won't get contact with the starches to
                                convert
                                > them. The mash should be thick to start with, then when the
                                > conversion reaction is finished, the rest of the water is added.

                                I have the other problem. It's too thick, maybe there is something
                                in the biscuits that glues them together, such as corn flour. When I
                                did the first large batch the last of the biscuits would not hydrate.

                                > Splitting yeast packs is not a good idea. The ingredients are
                                often
                                > not well mixed, therefore you have no way of knowing if your
                                1/10th
                                > is yeast, emzymes, buffer, nutrients, or (ideally) a combination
                                of
                                > all.
                                >
                                > You state that "Test batch is just a scaled down version (1/10th)
                                to
                                > prevent wasting ingrediants until I get the recipe correct." Well
                                > this is the 3rd attempt and still no result. I can't see that as
                                > preventing wasting ingredients.

                                Well the ingredients for a full test batch cost $20 au
                                So 3 x $20 = $60 The ingredients for a 1/10th batch cost $2 if I had
                                of used smaller batches from the start the cost would have been 3 x
                                $2 = $6.

                                All the batches failed because I don't know what I am doing. The
                                recipe says it scales well and have no reason to doubt it.

                                > Also the size of the test batch won't produce much alcohol even if
                                > all conditions are right, certainly not enough to prove the
                                concept.
                                > You're making things more & more difficult for yourself and just
                                > confusing the issue. Make a full batch, with wheat or flaked
                                wheat
                                > BY THE PDF RECIPE. If it doesn't work, contact Gert Strand
                                (yeast)
                                > or Ian Smilie (recipe).

                                I dont care about the alcohol yet, I am interested in getting the
                                first stage right, with a smaller size I can afford to ditch it. The
                                exact ingrediants for the recipe are not advailable here and its the
                                only recipe I have found for wheat vodka. Although a recipe from
                                wheat grain to vodka would be ideal. So I doing trial and error to
                                see what works.

                                The last yeast worked, so I have no reason to suspect the yeast. I
                                have no reason to think there is anything wrong with the recipe
                                either.

                                Have you actually ever made wheat vodka?


                                > Slainte!
                                > regards Harry
                                > Moderator
                                >
                              • Robert Thomas
                                hypodyne wrote: --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, Harry ... ... convert ... I have the other
                                Message 15 of 20 , Nov 15, 2005
                                  hypodyne <hypodyne@...> wrote: --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Harry" <gnikomson2000@y...>
                                  wrote:
                                  >
                                  > --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "hypodyne" <hypodyne@y...>
                                  <snip>

                                  > You can't use ALL the water in one go. You will make the mash too
                                  > thin and the enzymes won't get contact with the starches to
                                  convert
                                  > them. The mash should be thick to start with, then when the
                                  > conversion reaction is finished, the rest of the water is added.

                                  I have the other problem. It's too thick, maybe there is something
                                  in the biscuits that glues them together, such as corn flour. When I
                                  did the first large batch the last of the biscuits would not hydrate.

                                  Harry's right, you do need to start thick. It really doesn't matter how hot the water is to hydrate the biscuits (providing you don't burn them)
                                  The stickiness is due to a combination of starch and glutens. The malt will convert the starch to soluble sugars.


                                  > Splitting yeast packs is not a good idea. The ingredients are
                                  often
                                  > not well mixed, therefore you have no way of knowing if your
                                  1/10th
                                  > is yeast, emzymes, buffer, nutrients, or (ideally) a combination
                                  of
                                  > all.
                                  >
                                  > You state that "Test batch is just a scaled down version (1/10th)
                                  to
                                  > prevent wasting ingrediants until I get the recipe correct." Well
                                  > this is the 3rd attempt and still no result. I can't see that as
                                  > preventing wasting ingredients.

                                  Well the ingredients for a full test batch cost $20 au
                                  So 3 x $20 = $60 The ingredients for a 1/10th batch cost $2 if I had
                                  of used smaller batches from the start the cost would have been 3 x
                                  $2 = $6.

                                  All the batches failed because I don't know what I am doing. The
                                  recipe says it scales well and have no reason to doubt it.

                                  Splitting the yeast is a problem, particularly if using only 1/10th of a pack.
                                  Why not use bakers yeast (atleast in the tests, although it will work on the full batch - it just won't ferment > 12ish% or less than ca 1015).


                                  <snip>

                                  My other worry is the weighing out of 75g of malt. What volume is this? A handful? less? It may not be mixed in homogeneously.

                                  And on such a small mash, how long is it at 66degC? You'll be losing heat very quickly I guess. If you put the whole lot in a plastic pop bottle and sink this in a big bucket of water at 66, you maintain temp for longer.

                                  To gain confidence (and prove to yourself - and Harry) that the wheat biscuits work, take 50:50 biscuits and malt. The thick gloop should thin out as the starch conversion progresses. It should start as a thick porridge and finish as a barley soup (sweet).
                                  Cheers,
                                  Rob.




                                  New Distillers group archives are at http://archive.nnytech.net/
                                  FAQ and other information available at http://homedistiller.org





                                  SPONSORED LINKS
                                  Corporate culture Distillers Business culture of china Organizational culture Culture change Cell culture

                                  ---------------------------------
                                  YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS


                                  Visit your group "new_distillers" on the web.

                                  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                                  new_distillers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                                  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


                                  ---------------------------------






                                  Cheers,
                                  Rob.

                                  ---------------------------------
                                  Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click.

                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                • Brendan Keith
                                  ... Then use sugar. You obviously do care, since you keep choosing something sounds to you like it should work, but you keep making poor choices. You re
                                  Message 16 of 20 , Nov 15, 2005
                                    >
                                    > Insist, who said I insist on them. I dont care what I use as long as
                                    > it works and is resonable priced. Biscuits are cheaper than the
                                    > loose wheat flakes.

                                    Then use sugar. You obviously do care, since you keep choosing something
                                    sounds to you like it should work, but you keep making poor choices.
                                    You're basing your choices on a few cents difference between a box of
                                    biscuits vs a box of cereal?
                                    If you want to be authentic, be authentic.

                                    >
                                    > I am neither a baker or a housewife and its the first time I have
                                    > heard that salt retards yeast. Since I used the same brand of wheat
                                    > biscuits and the yeast worked on the first attempt, I doubt the
                                    > trace amounts of salt are the problem.

                                    A very tiny bit of research would have told you that. It wouldn't be
                                    a bad idea to investigate all of the ingredients that you are dumping
                                    in, if you don't know what their consequences will be.

                                    >
                                    > But the question is why are you yelling? It's like your emotionally
                                    > attached to the yeast or something. If your going to get that upset
                                    > maybe you should just ignore my posts.

                                    It's hard to ignore because you keep making such huge blunders that
                                    could easily be avoided.

                                    >
                                    > Well the ingredients for a full test batch cost $20 au
                                    > So 3 x $20 = $60 The ingredients for a 1/10th batch cost $2 if I had
                                    > of used smaller batches from the start the cost would have been 3 x
                                    > $2 = $6.
                                    >
                                    > All the batches failed because I don't know what I am doing.

                                    BINGO! The heart of the matter.
                                    At least once or twice a week, newcomers are advised to read
                                    http://homedistiller.org front to back. Have you?

                                    > The recipe says it scales well and have no reason to doubt it.

                                    Scaling usually means "up", not down to a fraction.

                                    > I dont care about the alcohol yet, I am interested in getting the
                                    > first stage right, with a smaller size I can afford to ditch it. The
                                    > exact ingrediants for the recipe are not advailable here and its the
                                    > only recipe I have found for wheat vodka. Although a recipe from
                                    > wheat grain to vodka would be ideal. So I doing trial and error to
                                    > see what works.

                                    You seem to throwing a bunch of things in a bucket and hoping
                                    vodka will pour out. There are a lot of steps in between that you
                                    can observe and test for. If you don't understand what is going on,
                                    you might get a valid result by pure chance 1 in 20 times.

                                    >
                                    > Have you actually ever made wheat vodka?

                                    I'll bet Harry has made more things than you can dream up.

                                    Also, there's reasons why fine vodkas and such are hard to make, it takes
                                    good equipment, good ingredients and good technique.

                                    --
                                    Brendan Keith
                                    bkeith@...
                                  • sonum norbu
                                    Well said!!! ... From: Brendan Keith To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [new_distillers] Re: Wheat vodka disaster Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2005
                                    Message 17 of 20 , Nov 15, 2005
                                      Well said!!!

                                      ----- Original Message -----
                                      From: "Brendan Keith"
                                      To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                                      Subject: RE: [new_distillers] Re: Wheat vodka disaster
                                      Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2005 14:26:06 -0500

                                      >
                                      > Insist, who said I insist on them. I dont care what I use as long as
                                      > it works and is resonable priced. Biscuits are cheaper than the
                                      > loose wheat flakes.

                                      Then use sugar. You obviously do care, since you keep choosing something
                                      sounds to you like it should work, but you keep making poor choices.
                                      You're basing your choices on a few cents difference between a box of
                                      biscuits vs a box of cereal?
                                      If you want to be authentic, be authentic.

                                      >
                                      > I am neither a baker or a housewife and its the first time I have
                                      > heard that salt retards yeast. Since I used the same brand of wheat
                                      > biscuits and the yeast worked on the first attempt, I doubt the
                                      > trace amounts of salt are the problem.

                                      A very tiny bit of research would have told you that. It wouldn't be
                                      a bad idea to investigate all of the ingredients that you are dumping
                                      in, if you don't know what their consequences will be.

                                      >
                                      > But the question is why are you yelling? It's like your emotionally
                                      > attached to the yeast or something. If your going to get that upset
                                      > maybe you should just ignore my posts.

                                      It's hard to ignore because you keep making such huge blunders that
                                      could easily be avoided.

                                      >
                                      > Well the ingredients for a full test batch cost $20 au
                                      > So 3 x $20 = $60 The ingredients for a 1/10th batch cost $2 if I had
                                      > of used smaller batches from the start the cost would have been 3 x
                                      > $2 = $6.
                                      >
                                      > All the batches failed because I don't know what I am doing.

                                      BINGO! The heart of the matter.
                                      At least once or twice a week, newcomers are advised to read
                                      http://homedistiller.org front to back. Have you?

                                      > The recipe says it scales well and have no reason to doubt it.

                                      Scaling usually means "up", not down to a fraction.

                                      > I dont care about the alcohol yet, I am interested in getting the
                                      > first stage right, with a smaller size I can afford to ditch it. The
                                      > exact ingrediants for the recipe are not advailable here and its the
                                      > only recipe I have found for wheat vodka. Although a recipe from
                                      > wheat grain to vodka would be ideal. So I doing trial and error to
                                      > see what works.

                                      You seem to throwing a bunch of things in a bucket and hoping
                                      vodka will pour out. There are a lot of steps in between that you
                                      can observe and test for. If you don't understand what is going on,
                                      you might get a valid result by pure chance 1 in 20 times.

                                      >
                                      > Have you actually ever made wheat vodka?

                                      I'll bet Harry has made more things than you can dream up.

                                      Also, there's reasons why fine vodkas and such are hard to make, it takes
                                      good equipment, good ingredients and good technique.

                                      --
                                      Brendan Keith
                                      bkeith@...




                                      New Distillers group archives are at http://archive.nnytech.net/
                                      FAQ and other information available at http://homedistiller.org




                                      ------------------------------------------------------------------------

                                      YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS

                                      * Visit your group "new_distillers" on the web.

                                      * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                                      new_distillers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                                      * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


                                      ------------------------------------------------------------------------



                                      "Most of the troubles of the world are caused by human beings". (Shakyamuni Buddha)

                                      SOARING, SAILING AND SKYDIVING web page
                                      http://www.angelfire.com/fl2/cloudbase/
                                      IRC server tessnet.cx

                                      --
                                      _______________________________________________
                                      Surf the Web in a faster, safer and easier way:
                                      Download Opera 8 at http://www.opera.com

                                      Powered by Outblaze


                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    • Roderick Holmes
                                      Jeez guys, I make killer vodka from sugar and turbo yeasts. Age on oak and then charcoal filter. It has got to be cheaper than biscuits! I get 50 lbs of sugar
                                      Message 18 of 20 , Nov 15, 2005
                                        Jeez guys,

                                        I make killer vodka from sugar and turbo yeasts. Age on oak and then charcoal filter. It has got to be cheaper than biscuits!

                                        I get 50 lbs of sugar for $15 US. Turbo yeast for $4. Ends up costing me about $1 for a liter of vodka.

                                        Someday I hope to try grains but am still mastering sugar and mollasses based worts.

                                        Oh, PS. I am a baker as a hobby and salt is death to yeast if you use too much. Same reason why you gargle with it when you have a sore throat, it kills a lot of bacteria.

                                        Roderick

                                        sonum norbu <blanik@...> wrote:
                                        Well said!!!

                                        ----- Original Message -----
                                        From: "Brendan Keith"
                                        To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                                        Subject: RE: [new_distillers] Re: Wheat vodka disaster
                                        Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2005 14:26:06 -0500

                                        >
                                        > Insist, who said I insist on them. I dont care what I use as long as
                                        > it works and is resonable priced. Biscuits are cheaper than the
                                        > loose wheat flakes.

                                        Then use sugar. You obviously do care, since you keep choosing something
                                        sounds to you like it should work, but you keep making poor choices.
                                        You're basing your choices on a few cents difference between a box of
                                        biscuits vs a box of cereal?
                                        If you want to be authentic, be authentic.

                                        >
                                        > I am neither a baker or a housewife and its the first time I have
                                        > heard that salt retards yeast. Since I used the same brand of wheat
                                        > biscuits and the yeast worked on the first attempt, I doubt the
                                        > trace amounts of salt are the problem.

                                        A very tiny bit of research would have told you that. It wouldn't be
                                        a bad idea to investigate all of the ingredients that you are dumping
                                        in, if you don't know what their consequences will be.

                                        >
                                        > But the question is why are you yelling? It's like your emotionally
                                        > attached to the yeast or something. If your going to get that upset
                                        > maybe you should just ignore my posts.

                                        It's hard to ignore because you keep making such huge blunders that
                                        could easily be avoided.

                                        >
                                        > Well the ingredients for a full test batch cost $20 au
                                        > So 3 x $20 = $60 The ingredients for a 1/10th batch cost $2 if I had
                                        > of used smaller batches from the start the cost would have been 3 x
                                        > $2 = $6.
                                        >
                                        > All the batches failed because I don't know what I am doing.

                                        BINGO! The heart of the matter.
                                        At least once or twice a week, newcomers are advised to read
                                        http://homedistiller.org front to back. Have you?

                                        > The recipe says it scales well and have no reason to doubt it.

                                        Scaling usually means "up", not down to a fraction.

                                        > I dont care about the alcohol yet, I am interested in getting the
                                        > first stage right, with a smaller size I can afford to ditch it. The
                                        > exact ingrediants for the recipe are not advailable here and its the
                                        > only recipe I have found for wheat vodka. Although a recipe from
                                        > wheat grain to vodka would be ideal. So I doing trial and error to
                                        > see what works.

                                        You seem to throwing a bunch of things in a bucket and hoping
                                        vodka will pour out. There are a lot of steps in between that you
                                        can observe and test for. If you don't understand what is going on,
                                        you might get a valid result by pure chance 1 in 20 times.

                                        >
                                        > Have you actually ever made wheat vodka?

                                        I'll bet Harry has made more things than you can dream up.

                                        Also, there's reasons why fine vodkas and such are hard to make, it takes
                                        good equipment, good ingredients and good technique.

                                        --
                                        Brendan Keith
                                        bkeith@...




                                        New Distillers group archives are at http://archive.nnytech.net/
                                        FAQ and other information available at http://homedistiller.org




                                        ------------------------------------------------------------------------

                                        YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS

                                        * Visit your group "new_distillers" on the web.

                                        * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                                        new_distillers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                                        * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


                                        ------------------------------------------------------------------------



                                        "Most of the troubles of the world are caused by human beings". (Shakyamuni Buddha)

                                        SOARING, SAILING AND SKYDIVING web page
                                        http://www.angelfire.com/fl2/cloudbase/
                                        IRC server tessnet.cx

                                        --
                                        _______________________________________________
                                        Surf the Web in a faster, safer and easier way:
                                        Download Opera 8 at http://www.opera.com

                                        Powered by Outblaze


                                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                                        New Distillers group archives are at http://archive.nnytech.net/
                                        FAQ and other information available at http://homedistiller.org





                                        SPONSORED LINKS
                                        Corporate culture Distillers Business culture of china Organizational culture Culture change Cell culture

                                        ---------------------------------
                                        YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS


                                        Visit your group "new_distillers" on the web.

                                        To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                                        new_distillers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                                        Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


                                        ---------------------------------






                                        ---------------------------------
                                        Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click.

                                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                      • sonum norbu
                                        Me Too. I lerv Activated carbon, it s great stuff. Thank you Harry for putting me onto using it. blanikdog ... From: Roderick Holmes To:
                                        Message 19 of 20 , Nov 15, 2005
                                          Me Too. I lerv Activated carbon, it's great stuff. Thank you Harry for
                                          putting me onto using it. blanikdog

                                          ----- Original Message -----
                                          From: "Roderick Holmes"
                                          To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                                          Subject: RE: [new_distillers] Re: Wheat vodka disaster
                                          Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2005 16:42:42 -0800 (PST)

                                          Jeez guys,

                                          I make killer vodka from sugar and turbo yeasts. Age on oak and then
                                          charcoal filter. It has got to be cheaper than biscuits!

                                          I get 50 lbs of sugar for $15 US. Turbo yeast for $4. Ends up costing me
                                          about $1 for a liter of vodka.

                                          Someday I hope to try grains but am still mastering sugar and mollasses
                                          based worts.

                                          Oh, PS. I am a baker as a hobby and salt is death to yeast if you use too
                                          much. Same reason why you gargle with it when you have a sore throat, it
                                          kills a lot of bacteria.

                                          Roderick

                                          sonum norbu <blanik@...> wrote:
                                          Well said!!!

                                          ----- Original Message -----
                                          From: "Brendan Keith"
                                          To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                                          Subject: RE: [new_distillers] Re: Wheat vodka disaster
                                          Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2005 14:26:06 -0500

                                          >
                                          > Insist, who said I insist on them. I dont care what I use as long as
                                          > it works and is resonable priced. Biscuits are cheaper than the
                                          > loose wheat flakes.

                                          Then use sugar. You obviously do care, since you keep choosing something
                                          sounds to you like it should work, but you keep making poor choices.
                                          You're basing your choices on a few cents difference between a box of
                                          biscuits vs a box of cereal?
                                          If you want to be authentic, be authentic.

                                          >
                                          > I am neither a baker or a housewife and its the first time I have
                                          > heard that salt retards yeast. Since I used the same brand of wheat
                                          > biscuits and the yeast worked on the first attempt, I doubt the
                                          > trace amounts of salt are the problem.

                                          A very tiny bit of research would have told you that. It wouldn't be
                                          a bad idea to investigate all of the ingredients that you are dumping
                                          in, if you don't know what their consequences will be.

                                          >
                                          > But the question is why are you yelling? It's like your emotionally
                                          > attached to the yeast or something. If your going to get that upset
                                          > maybe you should just ignore my posts.

                                          It's hard to ignore because you keep making such huge blunders that
                                          could easily be avoided.

                                          >
                                          > Well the ingredients for a full test batch cost $20 au
                                          > So 3 x $20 = $60 The ingredients for a 1/10th batch cost $2 if I had
                                          > of used smaller batches from the start the cost would have been 3 x
                                          > $2 = $6.
                                          >
                                          > All the batches failed because I don't know what I am doing.

                                          BINGO! The heart of the matter.
                                          At least once or twice a week, newcomers are advised to read
                                          http://homedistiller.org front to back. Have you?

                                          > The recipe says it scales well and have no reason to doubt it.

                                          Scaling usually means "up", not down to a fraction.

                                          > I dont care about the alcohol yet, I am interested in getting the
                                          > first stage right, with a smaller size I can afford to ditch it. The
                                          > exact ingrediants for the recipe are not advailable here and its the
                                          > only recipe I have found for wheat vodka. Although a recipe from
                                          > wheat grain to vodka would be ideal. So I doing trial and error to
                                          > see what works.

                                          You seem to throwing a bunch of things in a bucket and hoping
                                          vodka will pour out. There are a lot of steps in between that you
                                          can observe and test for. If you don't understand what is going on,
                                          you might get a valid result by pure chance 1 in 20 times.

                                          >
                                          > Have you actually ever made wheat vodka?

                                          I'll bet Harry has made more things than you can dream up.

                                          Also, there's reasons why fine vodkas and such are hard to make, it takes
                                          good equipment, good ingredients and good technique.

                                          --
                                          Brendan Keith
                                          bkeith@...




                                          New Distillers group archives are at http://archive.nnytech.net/
                                          FAQ and other information available at http://homedistiller.org




                                          ------------------------------------------------------------------------

                                          YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS

                                          * Visit your group "new_distillers" on the web.

                                          * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                                          new_distillers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                                          * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


                                          ------------------------------------------------------------------------



                                          "Most of the troubles of the world are caused by human beings".
                                          (Shakyamuni Buddha)

                                          SOARING, SAILING AND SKYDIVING web page
                                          http://www.angelfire.com/fl2/cloudbase/
                                          IRC server tessnet.cx

                                          --
                                          _______________________________________________
                                          Surf the Web in a faster, safer and easier way:
                                          Download Opera 8 at http://www.opera.com

                                          Powered by Outblaze


                                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                                          New Distillers group archives are at http://archive.nnytech.net/
                                          FAQ and other information available at http://homedistiller.org





                                          SPONSORED LINKS
                                          Corporate culture Distillers Business culture of china
                                          Organizational culture Culture change Cell culture

                                          ---------------------------------
                                          YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS


                                          Visit your group "new_distillers" on the web.

                                          To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                                          new_distillers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                                          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


                                          ---------------------------------






                                          ---------------------------------
                                          Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click.

                                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                                          New Distillers group archives are at http://archive.nnytech.net/
                                          FAQ and other information available at http://homedistiller.org




                                          ------------------------------------------------------------------------

                                          YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS

                                          * Visit your group "new_distillers" on the web.

                                          * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                                          new_distillers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                                          * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


                                          ------------------------------------------------------------------------



                                          "Most of the troubles of the world are caused by human beings". (Shakyamuni Buddha)

                                          SOARING, SAILING AND SKYDIVING web page
                                          http://www.angelfire.com/fl2/cloudbase/
                                          IRC server tessnet.cx

                                          --
                                          _______________________________________________
                                          Surf the Web in a faster, safer and easier way:
                                          Download Opera 8 at http://www.opera.com

                                          Powered by Outblaze


                                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                        • waljaco
                                          Harry recommends glucose as it is closer to grain mashes. 17g/l sucrose produces 1%abv 17.9g/l glucose produces 1%abv wal ... then charcoal filter. It has got
                                          Message 20 of 20 , Nov 16, 2005
                                            Harry recommends glucose as it is closer to grain mashes.

                                            17g/l sucrose produces 1%abv
                                            17.9g/l glucose produces 1%abv
                                            wal

                                            --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, Roderick Holmes
                                            <pure95percent@y...> wrote:
                                            >
                                            > Jeez guys,
                                            >
                                            > I make killer vodka from sugar and turbo yeasts. Age on oak and
                                            then charcoal filter. It has got to be cheaper than biscuits!
                                            >
                                            > I get 50 lbs of sugar for $15 US. Turbo yeast for $4. Ends up
                                            costing me about $1 for a liter of vodka.
                                            >
                                            > Someday I hope to try grains but am still mastering sugar and
                                            mollasses based worts.
                                            >
                                            > Oh, PS. I am a baker as a hobby and salt is death to yeast if you
                                            use too much. Same reason why you gargle with it when you have a sore
                                            throat, it kills a lot of bacteria.
                                            >
                                            > Roderick
                                            >
                                            > sonum norbu <blanik@o...> wrote:
                                            > Well said!!!
                                            >
                                            > ----- Original Message -----
                                            > From: "Brendan Keith"
                                            > To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                                            > Subject: RE: [new_distillers] Re: Wheat vodka disaster
                                            > Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2005 14:26:06 -0500
                                            >
                                            > >
                                            > > Insist, who said I insist on them. I dont care what I use as long as
                                            > > it works and is resonable priced. Biscuits are cheaper than the
                                            > > loose wheat flakes.
                                            >
                                            > Then use sugar. You obviously do care, since you keep choosing
                                            something
                                            > sounds to you like it should work, but you keep making poor choices.
                                            > You're basing your choices on a few cents difference between a box of
                                            > biscuits vs a box of cereal?
                                            > If you want to be authentic, be authentic.
                                            >
                                            > >
                                            > > I am neither a baker or a housewife and its the first time I have
                                            > > heard that salt retards yeast. Since I used the same brand of wheat
                                            > > biscuits and the yeast worked on the first attempt, I doubt the
                                            > > trace amounts of salt are the problem.
                                            >
                                            > A very tiny bit of research would have told you that. It wouldn't be
                                            > a bad idea to investigate all of the ingredients that you are dumping
                                            > in, if you don't know what their consequences will be.
                                            >
                                            > >
                                            > > But the question is why are you yelling? It's like your emotionally
                                            > > attached to the yeast or something. If your going to get that upset
                                            > > maybe you should just ignore my posts.
                                            >
                                            > It's hard to ignore because you keep making such huge blunders that
                                            > could easily be avoided.
                                            >
                                            > >
                                            > > Well the ingredients for a full test batch cost $20 au
                                            > > So 3 x $20 = $60 The ingredients for a 1/10th batch cost $2 if I had
                                            > > of used smaller batches from the start the cost would have been 3 x
                                            > > $2 = $6.
                                            > >
                                            > > All the batches failed because I don't know what I am doing.
                                            >
                                            > BINGO! The heart of the matter.
                                            > At least once or twice a week, newcomers are advised to read
                                            > http://homedistiller.org front to back. Have you?
                                            >
                                            > > The recipe says it scales well and have no reason to doubt it.
                                            >
                                            > Scaling usually means "up", not down to a fraction.
                                            >
                                            > > I dont care about the alcohol yet, I am interested in getting the
                                            > > first stage right, with a smaller size I can afford to ditch it. The
                                            > > exact ingrediants for the recipe are not advailable here and its the
                                            > > only recipe I have found for wheat vodka. Although a recipe from
                                            > > wheat grain to vodka would be ideal. So I doing trial and error to
                                            > > see what works.
                                            >
                                            > You seem to throwing a bunch of things in a bucket and hoping
                                            > vodka will pour out. There are a lot of steps in between that you
                                            > can observe and test for. If you don't understand what is going on,
                                            > you might get a valid result by pure chance 1 in 20 times.
                                            >
                                            > >
                                            > > Have you actually ever made wheat vodka?
                                            >
                                            > I'll bet Harry has made more things than you can dream up.
                                            >
                                            > Also, there's reasons why fine vodkas and such are hard to make, it
                                            takes
                                            > good equipment, good ingredients and good technique.
                                            >
                                            > --
                                            > Brendan Keith
                                            > bkeith@s...
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > New Distillers group archives are at http://archive.nnytech.net/
                                            > FAQ and other information available at http://homedistiller.org
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                            >
                                            > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
                                            >
                                            > * Visit your group "new_distillers" on the web.
                                            >
                                            > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                                            > new_distillers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                                            >
                                            > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
                                            Service.
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > "Most of the troubles of the world are caused by human beings".
                                            (Shakyamuni Buddha)
                                            >
                                            > SOARING, SAILING AND SKYDIVING web page
                                            > http://www.angelfire.com/fl2/cloudbase/
                                            > IRC server tessnet.cx
                                            >
                                            > --
                                            > _______________________________________________
                                            > Surf the Web in a faster, safer and easier way:
                                            > Download Opera 8 at http://www.opera.com
                                            >
                                            > Powered by Outblaze
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > New Distillers group archives are at http://archive.nnytech.net/
                                            > FAQ and other information available at http://homedistiller.org
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > SPONSORED LINKS
                                            > Corporate culture Distillers Business culture of china
                                            Organizational culture Culture change Cell culture
                                            >
                                            > ---------------------------------
                                            > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > Visit your group "new_distillers" on the web.
                                            >
                                            > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                                            > new_distillers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                                            >
                                            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
                                            Service.
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > ---------------------------------
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > ---------------------------------
                                            > Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click.
                                            >
                                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                            >
                                          Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.