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Re: [new_distillers] weird happenings with mash

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  • Roderick Holmes
    I have the same thing happen some times. Few things could affect this: -The temperature of the sugar solution when you pitched the yeast. If you pitch it when
    Message 1 of 16 , Jul 1 8:48 AM
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      I have the same thing happen some times. Few things could affect this:

      -The temperature of the sugar solution when you pitched the yeast. If you pitch it when the wash is still warm, it seems to take off much faster and ferment quicker vs. if you pitch into a cold wash. I found this out because one batch I aerated overnight, the other I pitched warm right away without aeration. The initial colony gets a big boost if pitched into a warm wash.

      -The ambient termperature of where you have the fermentation vats. Are they in the same room together?

      -Sugar concentration. Did you take a specific gravity reading of both washes to confirm the sugar level is the same. The one with more sugar will take more time. Can't tell you how many times I lost count of how many scoops of sugar I put in and guessed.

      -yeast: did you dissolve the yeast in water first or pitch it dry? If you dissolved the yeast in too warm water, in one batch, it could have cut the viable yeast down in one batch.

      This is all I can think of off the top of my head.

      Warm regards on ice,
      Roderick

      jmsmckenna@... wrote:
      i made two sugar mashes on the same day,25 litre batches,they were made
      using exactly the same usin same yeast,after slightly more than two weeks one of
      them was ready an had stopped bubblin but the other one is still bubblin away
      merrily after another week an looks like it could be another week,wots
      happenin


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    • jmsmckenna@aol.com
      both washes were made at same time using 8 one kilo bags of sugar then left overnite to cool downthey were then topped up with water to the requires level just
      Message 2 of 16 , Jul 1 9:36 AM
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        both washes were made at same time using 8 one kilo bags of sugar then left
        overnite to cool downthey were then topped up with water to the requires level
        just to aid the cooling process coz we are havin a sorta heatwave at minthen
        there was one packet of yeast added to each,dry an aerated ,thats all i
        know,when the last one was distilled i got 5 1/2 litres of 93% an it was damned
        good stuff,i know this one will be ok when its done but i was just wonderin
        bout the time discrepancy


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      • pguy40
        ... Harry, I just made an all grain wheat mash (mashed last night pitched yeast this AM) and upon adding yeast was disappointed in the lack of activity. My
        Message 3 of 16 , Jul 1 1:52 PM
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          > More viable yeast cells per litre of mash in one than in the other.
          > Common problem with pre-packaged turbos.

          Harry,

          I just made an all grain wheat mash (mashed last night pitched yeast
          this AM) and upon adding yeast was disappointed in the lack of
          activity. My sugar washes always bubbled vigorously, I can barely
          detect any bubbling at all in this. I do think it's fermenting because
          about half the grain has now risen to the surface and the room smells
          like I'm baking bread.

          Could my packet of turbo be bad? Should I add another packet? Maybe
          this minimal activity is normal?

          TIA
          Peter
        • go_stiller
          Hi Rob The best way I found was to add 16 kg sugar to large container and top to 50-litre mark with hot water and mix well. When cool separate 25 litres to
          Message 4 of 16 , Jul 1 2:56 PM
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            Hi Rob
            The best way I found was to add 16 kg sugar to large container and top
            to 50-litre mark with hot water and mix well. When cool separate 25
            litres to second container and test SG should be 1.130. In original
            stir very well to aerate and add 48 turbo pack, after 2 days when
            bubbling well, do next part. In other 25 litres add 1 desert spoon
            vegemite & 1 cup molasses mixing very well. I add this through the day
            about 2 litres at a time back to first container, takes about 16 days
            at 22C degrees and the end SG is 990.


            JW




            --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, Robert Thomas
            <whosbrewing@y...> wrote:
            > Is there a best way of pitching turbo mix into 2
            > fermenters? Currently I guess. How about
            > mixing/disolving in a volume of water and adding that
            > between them? Or would thew high nutrient conc.
            > kill/stun the yeast?
            > Rob.
          • Harry
            ... other. ... yeast ... because ... smells ... Maybe ... Could be many things. Did you use sprouted wheat?, or barley? Wheat sometimes gives poor conversion.
            Message 5 of 16 , Jul 1 3:50 PM
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              --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "pguy40" <pguy40@y...> wrote:
              > > More viable yeast cells per litre of mash in one than in the
              other.
              > > Common problem with pre-packaged turbos.
              >
              > Harry,
              >
              > I just made an all grain wheat mash (mashed last night pitched
              yeast
              > this AM) and upon adding yeast was disappointed in the lack of
              > activity. My sugar washes always bubbled vigorously, I can barely
              > detect any bubbling at all in this. I do think it's fermenting
              because
              > about half the grain has now risen to the surface and the room
              smells
              > like I'm baking bread.
              >
              > Could my packet of turbo be bad? Should I add another packet?
              Maybe
              > this minimal activity is normal?
              >
              > TIA
              > Peter


              Could be many things. Did you use sprouted wheat?, or barley?
              Wheat sometimes gives poor conversion.
              I assume you had everything else right such as...
              Iodine test for conversion.
              OSG recorded.
              pH between 4 and 5.
              Pitching temp ~25°C.

              If all that was right, then give it up to 24hrs. If the activity
              doesn't improve, repitch with fresh yeast. That's about all I can
              offer. Sven is the man to talk to on all-grain mashes. He may know
              some other angles.


              Slainte!
              regards Harry
            • Mark
              ... barely ... know ... I ve had a couple of wheat mashes stick on me when I deviate from standard beer making procedures. For me, safest way is to use at
              Message 6 of 16 , Jul 1 9:02 PM
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                --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Harry" <gnikomson2000@y...>
                wrote:
                > --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "pguy40" <pguy40@y...>
                wrote:
                > > > More viable yeast cells per litre of mash in one than in the
                > other.
                > > > Common problem with pre-packaged turbos.
                > >
                > > Harry,
                > >
                > > I just made an all grain wheat mash (mashed last night pitched
                > yeast
                > > this AM) and upon adding yeast was disappointed in the lack of
                > > activity. My sugar washes always bubbled vigorously, I can
                barely
                > > detect any bubbling at all in this. I do think it's fermenting
                > because
                > > about half the grain has now risen to the surface and the room
                > smells
                > > like I'm baking bread.
                > >
                > > Could my packet of turbo be bad? Should I add another packet?
                > Maybe
                > > this minimal activity is normal?
                > >
                > > TIA
                > > Peter
                >
                >
                > Could be many things. Did you use sprouted wheat?, or barley?
                > Wheat sometimes gives poor conversion.
                > I assume you had everything else right such as...
                > Iodine test for conversion.
                > OSG recorded.
                > pH between 4 and 5.
                > Pitching temp ~25°C.
                >
                > If all that was right, then give it up to 24hrs. If the activity
                > doesn't improve, repitch with fresh yeast. That's about all I can
                > offer. Sven is the man to talk to on all-grain mashes. He may
                know
                > some other angles.
                >
                >
                > Slainte!
                > regards Harry

                I've had a couple of wheat mashes stick on me when I deviate
                from "standard" beer making procedures. For me, safest way is to
                use at least 35% 6 row high enzyme barley, and hold conversion
                temperature for 3 hours with a mash out. I make a yeast starter, and
                aquarium pump in air for 12 hours minimum. I batch sparge, if that
                matters.

                Wheat sure makes a good whiskey, though. It's worth the hassle.

                Mark
              • pguy40
                ... and ... I used malted wheat, it seems to be working fine now, it just took a while for those yeasties to become aroused :-) Everything went real well, had
                Message 7 of 16 , Jul 2 7:23 AM
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                  --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Mark" <highabv@y...> wrote:
                  > --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Harry" <gnikomson2000@y...>
                  > wrote:
                  > > --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "pguy40" <pguy40@y...>
                  > wrote:
                  >>
                  > I've had a couple of wheat mashes stick on me when I deviate
                  > from "standard" beer making procedures. For me, safest way is to
                  > use at least 35% 6 row high enzyme barley, and hold conversion
                  > temperature for 3 hours with a mash out. I make a yeast starter,
                  and
                  > aquarium pump in air for 12 hours minimum. I batch sparge, if that
                  > matters.
                  >
                  > Wheat sure makes a good whiskey, though. It's worth the hassle.
                  >
                  > Mark

                  I used malted wheat, it seems to be working fine now, it just took a
                  while for those yeasties to become aroused :-)

                  Everything went real well, had a good conversion, pumped air for 30
                  minutes before pitching yeast. First 6 hours showed little activity.
                  Now 24 hours later it's bubbling fairly aggressively.

                  Thanks all,
                  peter
                • Mark
                  ... Did you happen to measure the initial/original specific gravity? And if you can, I d like to know what the final / terminal specific gravity is. Oh, and
                  Message 8 of 16 , Jul 5 2:01 PM
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                    > I used malted wheat, it seems to be working fine now, it just took a
                    > while for those yeasties to become aroused :-)
                    >
                    > Everything went real well, had a good conversion, pumped air for 30
                    > minutes before pitching yeast. First 6 hours showed little activity.
                    > Now 24 hours later it's bubbling fairly aggressively.
                    >
                    > Thanks all,
                    > peter

                    Did you happen to measure the initial/original specific gravity? And
                    if you can, I'd like to know what the final / terminal specific
                    gravity is. Oh, and how many pounds/kg's of wheat did you use?

                    Mark
                  • pguy40
                    ... OG 1.048 FG 1.016 It may not have been done fermenting, I ended up with about 5% alc out of the wash (72 hours after pitching yeast). I used about 9 lbs of
                    Message 9 of 16 , Jul 7 3:48 PM
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                      > Did you happen to measure the initial/original specific gravity? And
                      > if you can, I'd like to know what the final / terminal specific
                      > gravity is. Oh, and how many pounds/kg's of wheat did you use?
                      >
                      > Mark

                      OG 1.048 FG 1.016 It may not have been done fermenting, I ended up with
                      about 5% alc out of the wash (72 hours after pitching yeast). I used
                      about 9 lbs of wheat and 1.5 lbs of wheat malt.

                      Peter
                    • Mark
                      ... And ... with ... Comparing it to a conventional wheat home brew beer: For a 5 GAL BATCH : 2.5LB lager malt 5 LB wheat malt you should get an original
                      Message 10 of 16 , Jul 7 8:06 PM
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                        --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "pguy40" <pguy40@y...> wrote:
                        > > Did you happen to measure the initial/original specific gravity?
                        And
                        > > if you can, I'd like to know what the final / terminal specific
                        > > gravity is. Oh, and how many pounds/kg's of wheat did you use?
                        > >
                        > > Mark
                        >
                        > OG 1.048 FG 1.016 It may not have been done fermenting, I ended up
                        with
                        > about 5% alc out of the wash (72 hours after pitching yeast). I used
                        > about 9 lbs of wheat and 1.5 lbs of wheat malt.
                        >
                        > Peter

                        Comparing it to a conventional wheat home brew beer:
                        For a "5 GAL BATCH":
                        2.5LB lager malt
                        5 LB wheat malt
                        you should get an original gravity of around 1.048, and after
                        fermentation a final gravity of around 1.013.

                        The lager malt in the above recipe is necessary to provide conversion
                        enzymes. I don't understand how 9 lb wheat and 1.5 lbs of wheat malt
                        converted to fermentable sugars.

                        Malted wheat is something like 38 points/pound/gal assuming good
                        decent mash & sparging techniques. 1 pound of malted wheat should
                        provide a gravity of 1.038 in a 1 gal batch. But wheat malt won't
                        convert itself (starch to sugar).
                      • pguy40
                        ... Not sure how it works myself, but I did it based on an Ian Smiley recipe for an all wheat vodka. I think you can find it somewhere on brewhaus.com Peter
                        Message 11 of 16 , Jul 8 7:02 AM
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                          --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Mark" <highabv@y...> wrote:
                          > Comparing it to a conventional wheat home brew beer:
                          > For a "5 GAL BATCH":
                          > 2.5LB lager malt
                          > 5 LB wheat malt
                          > you should get an original gravity of around 1.048, and after
                          > fermentation a final gravity of around 1.013.
                          >
                          > The lager malt in the above recipe is necessary to provide conversion
                          > enzymes. I don't understand how 9 lb wheat and 1.5 lbs of wheat malt
                          > converted to fermentable sugars.
                          >
                          > Malted wheat is something like 38 points/pound/gal assuming good
                          > decent mash & sparging techniques. 1 pound of malted wheat should
                          > provide a gravity of 1.038 in a 1 gal batch. But wheat malt won't
                          > convert itself (starch to sugar).

                          Not sure how it works myself, but I did it based on an Ian Smiley
                          recipe for an all wheat vodka. I think you can find it somewhere on
                          brewhaus.com

                          Peter
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