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RE: [new_distillers] Polishing spirit

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  • Lebbo
    Lukas, Alot of people will swear by just having the spirit sit in the bottle and maybe give it a shake a cupla times a day on the way past but having to filter
    Message 1 of 30 , Aug 8, 2004
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      Lukas,

      Alot of people will swear by just having the spirit sit in the bottle
      and maybe give it a shake a cupla times a day on the way past but having
      to filter it all again would give me the poops a bit so I use a
      z-filter. The sit and shake method would take much longer too I would
      suggest, maybe a week or so? Someone else will be able to answer that.

      I remember that question but haven't got a clue sorry... Maybe just use
      your usual disinfectant that you'd normally use? Got me knackered....

      Lebbs


      -----Original Message-----
      From: Lukas Paige [mailto:lukas@...]
      Sent: Monday, 9 August 2004 10:53 AM
      To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [new_distillers] Polishing spirit


      Hi,

      Is it better to agitate spirit when polishing with activated carbon?
      I'm doing a small test on some 40% and am wondering if it's doing its
      job sitting still in the bottom of the bottle. Any tips and tricks or
      advice would be much appreciated.

      On another note, I posted a question about cleaning a hot water
      system a while ago that no one answered... is it that no one knows
      how, or was everyone away on holiday or something. :-P

      Thanks in advance,

      LP.


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    • Lukas Paige
      Lebbs, Yeah this stuff has already been polished with the Z filter, but still gave me a headache after 5-6 standard drinks. I ll be testing the sit and shake
      Message 2 of 30 , Aug 8, 2004
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        Lebbs,

        Yeah this stuff has already been polished with the Z filter, but
        still gave me a headache after 5-6 standard drinks. I'll be testing
        the sit and shake method out tonight... :-!

        LP.


        >Lukas,
        >
        >Alot of people will swear by just having the spirit sit in the bottle
        >and maybe give it a shake a cupla times a day on the way past but having
        >to filter it all again would give me the poops a bit so I use a
        >z-filter. The sit and shake method would take much longer too I would
        >suggest, maybe a week or so? Someone else will be able to answer that.
        >
        >I remember that question but haven't got a clue sorry... Maybe just use
        >your usual disinfectant that you'd normally use? Got me knackered....
        >
        >Lebbs
        >
        >
        >-----Original Message-----
        >From: Lukas Paige [mailto:lukas@...]
        >Sent: Monday, 9 August 2004 10:53 AM
        >To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
        >Subject: [new_distillers] Polishing spirit
        >
        >
        >Hi,
        >
        >Is it better to agitate spirit when polishing with activated carbon?
        >I'm doing a small test on some 40% and am wondering if it's doing its
        >job sitting still in the bottom of the bottle. Any tips and tricks or
        >advice would be much appreciated.
        >
        >On another note, I posted a question about cleaning a hot water
        >system a while ago that no one answered... is it that no one knows
        >how, or was everyone away on holiday or something. :-P
        >
        >Thanks in advance,
        >
        >LP.
        >
        >
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      • Lebbo
        Lukas, Not real experience just yet but having said that I have never had any issues with my product, have only ever done 3 runs and all have worked
        Message 3 of 30 , Aug 8, 2004
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          Lukas,

          Not real experience just yet but having said that I have never had any
          issues with my product, have only ever done 3 runs and all have worked
          identically and the resulting spirit is a treat. Was the carbon old?
          And I assume you separated the methanol from the start of the still run?
          Like I said earlier, someone more experienced might have some better
          ideas.....

          Lebbo


          -----Original Message-----
          From: Lukas Paige [mailto:lukas@...]
          Sent: Monday, 9 August 2004 11:25 AM
          To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: RE: [new_distillers] Polishing spirit


          Lebbs,

          Yeah this stuff has already been polished with the Z filter, but
          still gave me a headache after 5-6 standard drinks. I'll be testing
          the sit and shake method out tonight... :-!

          LP.


          >Lukas,
          >
          >Alot of people will swear by just having the spirit sit in the bottle
          >and maybe give it a shake a cupla times a day on the way past but
          having
          >to filter it all again would give me the poops a bit so I use a
          >z-filter. The sit and shake method would take much longer too I would
          >suggest, maybe a week or so? Someone else will be able to answer that.
          >
          >I remember that question but haven't got a clue sorry... Maybe just
          use
          >your usual disinfectant that you'd normally use? Got me knackered....
          >
          >Lebbs
          >
          >
          >-----Original Message-----
          >From: Lukas Paige [mailto:lukas@...]
          >Sent: Monday, 9 August 2004 10:53 AM
          >To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
          >Subject: [new_distillers] Polishing spirit
          >
          >
          >Hi,
          >
          >Is it better to agitate spirit when polishing with activated carbon?
          >I'm doing a small test on some 40% and am wondering if it's doing its
          >job sitting still in the bottom of the bottle. Any tips and tricks or
          >advice would be much appreciated.
          >
          >On another note, I posted a question about cleaning a hot water
          >system a while ago that no one answered... is it that no one knows
          >how, or was everyone away on holiday or something. :-P
          >
          >Thanks in advance,
          >
          >LP.
          >
          >
          >New Distillers group archives are at
          ><http://archive.nnytech.net/>http://archive.nnytech.net/
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        • Levi Langershank
          I carbon treat in 6 gallon carboys...usually about 4-5 gal in each one...I shake them every 2-3 days for the first couple of weeks...after that I just leave
          Message 4 of 30 , Aug 8, 2004
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            I carbon treat in 6 gallon carboys...usually about 4-5 gal in each one...I
            shake them every 2-3 days for the first couple of weeks...after that I just
            leave them until I get around to straining the carbon out..works for
            me....:>)


            >From: Lukas Paige <lukas@...>
            >Reply-To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
            >To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
            >Subject: [new_distillers] Polishing spirit
            >Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 10:52:52 +1000
            >
            >Hi,
            >
            >Is it better to agitate spirit when polishing with activated carbon?
            >I'm doing a small test on some 40% and am wondering if it's doing its
            >job sitting still in the bottom of the bottle. Any tips and tricks or
            >advice would be much appreciated.
            >
            >On another note, I posted a question about cleaning a hot water
            >system a while ago that no one answered... is it that no one knows
            >how, or was everyone away on holiday or something. :-P
            >
            >Thanks in advance,
            >
            >LP.

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          • grayson_stewart66
            The carbon vendor s we deal with at work claim the surface area of a small amount of activated carbon (simply dried carbon like coconut shell) is the same area
            Message 5 of 30 , Aug 8, 2004
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              The carbon vendor's we deal with at work claim the surface area of a
              small amount of activated carbon (simply dried carbon like coconut
              shell) is the same area as a football field. Since the product you
              are trying to filter with carbon is essentially a homogeneous
              product the law of Brownian (sp?) motion would require that you
              agitate the material being filtered to "speed up" the process ie.
              get everything in contact with the carbon faster.

              If I was filtering I would try a few quick passes through a filter
              of carbon or give it a few quick shakes several times a day if you
              are using an amount of carbon in a container.

              As for the question of cleaning a hot water system I'm not sure what
              you want to clean from the system. you might want to try looking at
              this link
              http://www.hotwater.com/PDFManuals/WhyWhenHow4800Rev9.pdf . If you
              simply want to remove flux from soldering or contaminants you can
              use vinegar on copper or a strong citric acid.
            • Lukas Paige
              So what would be the minimum time to leave spirit on carbon? I ve read/heard that in some small commercial distilleries they do one run to get 92% ABV, then
              Message 6 of 30 , Aug 8, 2004
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                So what would be the minimum time to leave spirit on carbon?

                I've read/heard that in some small commercial
                distilleries they do one run to get 92% ABV, then
                put 40-50 litres on carbon for 24 hours only to
                get pure, headache free gear! And they only use
                4-5 tablespoons of carbon!

                What's the general consensus out there?

                For the spirit I'm currently treating I made up a
                sugar wash that was around 18-20% ABV, then
                stripped to 90% ABV, then did a slow run to get
                94% ABV. I collected all feints on both runs (and
                a lot of them) and made sure to get a good mid
                cut (swapping collection vessels often). This I
                then treated with a Z-Filter - got 15 x 750ml
                bottles out of it, but still got a f#$%ing
                headache afterwards.

                What am I doing wrong?

                LP.

                >I carbon treat in 6 gallon carboys...usually about 4-5 gal in each one...I
                >shake them every 2-3 days for the first couple of weeks...after that I just
                >leave them until I get around to straining the carbon out..works for
                >me....:>)
                >
                >
                >>From: Lukas Paige <lukas@...>
                >>Reply-To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                >>To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                >>Subject: [new_distillers] Polishing spirit
                >>Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 10:52:52 +1000
                >>
                >>Hi,
                >>
                >>Is it better to agitate spirit when polishing with activated carbon?
                >>I'm doing a small test on some 40% and am wondering if it's doing its
                >>job sitting still in the bottom of the bottle. Any tips and tricks or
                >>advice would be much appreciated.
                >>
                >>On another note, I posted a question about cleaning a hot water
                >>system a while ago that no one answered... is it that no one knows
                >>how, or was everyone away on holiday or something. :-P
                >>
                >>Thanks in advance,
                >>
                >>LP.
                >
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              • grayson_stewart66
                This I ... Sometimes it s difficult to clearly state something on these newsgroups without re-reading a post several times....so I need to ask a few questions
                Message 7 of 30 , Aug 8, 2004
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                  This I
                  > then treated with a Z-Filter - got 15 x 750ml
                  > bottles out of it, but still got a f#$%ing
                  > headache afterwards.

                  Sometimes it's difficult to clearly state something on these
                  newsgroups without re-reading a post several times....so I need to
                  ask a few questions to make sure I'm clear on your problem. You say
                  you collected the feints, took segmented collections in the middle,
                  then later you say "This I treated with a Z-filter". I'm going to
                  make the assumption you kept the feints seperate and treated only
                  the middle cut with the Z-filter.

                  If this is true then I ask the following: Has the carbon been
                  recharged by boiling the carbon, rinsing away impurities, then
                  drying? Is the still itself clean from impurities? And finally, not
                  to sound condscending, do you take in plenty of water after
                  consuming this alcohol. Even the purest product will cause a
                  dehydration headache in the morning if twice the volume of water
                  isn't consumed along with, or shortly thereafter, the alcohol. The
                  body really sucks up water while trying to break down the complex
                  chains in alcohol.

                  With this said, the only time I've had a headache in the morning in
                  the last 8 months was the one time I was pretty confident there was
                  a heavy dose of tails in a batch.
                • Lukas Paige
                  Your assumption is correct. Middle cut only treated though the Z-Filter. New Z-Filter, new carbon, instructions followed to the letter. Tails are not present
                  Message 8 of 30 , Aug 8, 2004
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                    Your assumption is correct. Middle cut only treated though the
                    Z-Filter. New Z-Filter, new carbon, instructions followed to the
                    letter. Tails are not present as I take the cut before the tails
                    start to appear. Even if I did get a slight amount of tails in there,
                    wouldn't it be detectable, and wouldn't it get filtered out with the
                    Z-Filter?

                    Where in the still could I be getting impurities from? I used a new
                    hot water system, new copper tubing, lead free solder, new scourers
                    (tested to be stainless). The still has been run about 10 times now
                    (5 batches, strip and final each) and is flushed with lots of water
                    after every batch. It was also run with water first to get rid of any
                    solder.

                    The product made looks great, smells great and tastes great. Very
                    very, VERY close to commercial grade vodka. Water is definitely
                    consumed with a session. But the headache feeling is definitely NOT a
                    normal hangover one. It's only slight, but it's piercing and in
                    behind the eyes. At first I thought it was the sugar wash, but after
                    lots of reading I think it's something else...

                    Any advice is welcome. Thanks in advance.

                    LP.



                    >This I
                    >> then treated with a Z-Filter - got 15 x 750ml
                    >> bottles out of it, but still got a f#$%ing
                    >> headache afterwards.
                    >
                    >Sometimes it's difficult to clearly state something on these
                    >newsgroups without re-reading a post several times....so I need to
                    >ask a few questions to make sure I'm clear on your problem. You say
                    >you collected the feints, took segmented collections in the middle,
                    >then later you say "This I treated with a Z-filter". I'm going to
                    >make the assumption you kept the feints seperate and treated only
                    >the middle cut with the Z-filter.
                    >
                    >If this is true then I ask the following: Has the carbon been
                    >recharged by boiling the carbon, rinsing away impurities, then
                    >drying? Is the still itself clean from impurities? And finally, not
                    >to sound condscending, do you take in plenty of water after
                    >consuming this alcohol. Even the purest product will cause a
                    >dehydration headache in the morning if twice the volume of water
                    >isn't consumed along with, or shortly thereafter, the alcohol. The
                    >body really sucks up water while trying to break down the complex
                    >chains in alcohol.
                    >
                    >With this said, the only time I've had a headache in the morning in
                    >the last 8 months was the one time I was pretty confident there was
                    >a heavy dose of tails in a batch.
                    >
                    >
                    >
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                  • BOKAKOB
                    Very often head aches are associated with dehydration, not with fusel oils. I glass or two of juice next morning could help. Whatever I wrote above is my
                    Message 9 of 30 , Aug 9, 2004
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                      Very often head aches are associated with dehydration, not with fusel oils. I glass or two of juice next morning could help.


                      Whatever I wrote above is my subjective opinion
                      There are no warranties of any kind
                      Act on your own risk and finally...
                      I can be wrong I must say
                      Cheers, Alex...






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                    • s r
                      the only , and best way to filter the stuff . takes 2.5 kg carbon to fill the pipe but its worth every bit , YUM YUM ... Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 50x more
                      Message 10 of 30 , Aug 9, 2004
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                        the only , and best way to filter the stuff .
                        takes 2.5 kg carbon to fill the pipe but its worth every bit , YUM YUM




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                      • barjarg2003
                        Guys, Guys, Guys, Polishing or filtering through carbon is best done at a rate of about 1/2 litre per hour (or less!!!) I can drink a full bottle in a sitting,
                        Message 11 of 30 , Aug 9, 2004
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                          Guys, Guys, Guys, Polishing or filtering through carbon is best done
                          at a rate of about 1/2 litre per hour (or less!!!) I can drink a full
                          bottle in a sitting, and still go to work in the morning with a
                          reasonably clear head - best result was 3/4 of a bottle (at 40%) in
                          one sitting and blew only 0.03% on the Police breathalyser 6 hrs
                          later - are some of you trying to get 10 or more litres of neutral
                          spirit thru your carbon overnight ?

                          Set up 2 or more filtering units, Slow the collection rate, NO MORE
                          HEADACHES - Unless you are collecting spirit at below 78 or above 89
                          deg C, in wich case you may be collecting nasty stuff
                          (my observations only - works for me.)

                          Distill in Peace

                          Craig
                          >
                          PS - Boil the crap out of your used carbon, dry in a medium oven,
                          cool down and re-use (cheap eh!)
                          >
                          >
                          >
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                        • Scott Petrinec
                          If the headache is behind the eyes...that is the first sign of methanol poisoning. BE SURE TO REMOVE ALL METHANOL. Lukas Paige
                          Message 12 of 30 , Aug 9, 2004
                          • 0 Attachment
                            If the headache is behind the eyes...that is the first sign of methanol poisoning. BE SURE TO REMOVE ALL METHANOL.

                            Lukas Paige <lukas@...> wrote:Your assumption is correct. Middle cut only treated though the
                            Z-Filter. New Z-Filter, new carbon, instructions followed to the
                            letter. Tails are not present as I take the cut before the tails
                            start to appear. Even if I did get a slight amount of tails in there,
                            wouldn't it be detectable, and wouldn't it get filtered out with the
                            Z-Filter?

                            Where in the still could I be getting impurities from? I used a new
                            hot water system, new copper tubing, lead free solder, new scourers
                            (tested to be stainless). The still has been run about 10 times now
                            (5 batches, strip and final each) and is flushed with lots of water
                            after every batch. It was also run with water first to get rid of any
                            solder.

                            The product made looks great, smells great and tastes great. Very
                            very, VERY close to commercial grade vodka. Water is definitely
                            consumed with a session. But the headache feeling is definitely NOT a
                            normal hangover one. It's only slight, but it's piercing and in
                            behind the eyes. At first I thought it was the sugar wash, but after
                            lots of reading I think it's something else...

                            Any advice is welcome. Thanks in advance.

                            LP.



                            >This I
                            >> then treated with a Z-Filter - got 15 x 750ml
                            >> bottles out of it, but still got a f#$%ing
                            >> headache afterwards.
                            >
                            >Sometimes it's difficult to clearly state something on these
                            >newsgroups without re-reading a post several times....so I need to
                            >ask a few questions to make sure I'm clear on your problem. You say
                            >you collected the feints, took segmented collections in the middle,
                            >then later you say "This I treated with a Z-filter". I'm going to
                            >make the assumption you kept the feints seperate and treated only
                            >the middle cut with the Z-filter.
                            >
                            >If this is true then I ask the following: Has the carbon been
                            >recharged by boiling the carbon, rinsing away impurities, then
                            >drying? Is the still itself clean from impurities? And finally, not
                            >to sound condscending, do you take in plenty of water after
                            >consuming this alcohol. Even the purest product will cause a
                            >dehydration headache in the morning if twice the volume of water
                            >isn't consumed along with, or shortly thereafter, the alcohol. The
                            >body really sucks up water while trying to break down the complex
                            >chains in alcohol.
                            >
                            >With this said, the only time I've had a headache in the morning in
                            >the last 8 months was the one time I was pretty confident there was
                            >a heavy dose of tails in a batch.
                            >
                            >
                            >
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                          • grayson_stewart66
                            ... methanol poisoning. BE SURE TO REMOVE ALL METHANOL. I wouldn t suspect methanol to be a problem as he is referencing a sugar wash.
                            Message 13 of 30 , Aug 9, 2004
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                              > If the headache is behind the eyes...that is the first sign of
                              methanol poisoning. BE SURE TO REMOVE ALL METHANOL.


                              I wouldn't suspect methanol to be a problem as he is referencing a
                              sugar wash.
                            • Scott Petrinec
                              yeah,yeah...I have heard this nonsense before, and for my own piece of mind, I took some vodka (that I made from a sugar wash) to a chemist frien...and it DID
                              Message 14 of 30 , Aug 9, 2004
                              • 0 Attachment
                                yeah,yeah...I have heard this nonsense before, and for my own piece of mind, I took some vodka (that I made from a sugar wash) to a chemist frien...and it DID contain methanol.
                                Sugar wash or not...it is still good practice to discard at least the first 100ml per 20liter batch.

                                grayson_stewart66 <grayson_stewart66@...> wrote:

                                > If the headache is behind the eyes...that is the first sign of
                                methanol poisoning. BE SURE TO REMOVE ALL METHANOL.


                                I wouldn't suspect methanol to be a problem as he is referencing a
                                sugar wash.



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                              • Lebbo
                                Fellow distillers, IMHO, it seems to me like I am really lucky and there are alot of people out there dealing with plenty of issues just to produce a good
                                Message 15 of 30 , Aug 9, 2004
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  Fellow distillers,

                                  IMHO, it seems to me like I am really lucky and there are alot of people
                                  out there dealing with plenty of issues just to produce a good quality
                                  neutral spirit. I dunno, maybe my spirit isn't as good as I think it is
                                  but then I have never had a headache from alcohol in my life. I am sure
                                  though that if I wasn't doing the right thing throughout the whole
                                  production process that me and my friends that have tried my gear would
                                  have found out well before this point.

                                  I end up with about 8 litres of spirit @ 50% to filter through my zed,
                                  then water the result down to 40% making it to about 10 litres. I don't
                                  recycle my carbon, simply passing the purchase of further carbon as a
                                  cost of production. Maybe one day I will but I just don't like the idea
                                  of boiling off bad guys into the air of my rented unit. 8-) It takes me
                                  about an hour or so to filter that 8 litres.

                                  I have a mate that regularly knocks back a bottle of Bundy Rum in a
                                  sitting and swears that a bottle of my imitation had greater effects, I
                                  simply put that down to a better quality spirit than that you get off
                                  the shelf, no (sorry little) impurities and no additives/preservatives
                                  etc.

                                  There have been heaps of posts that I have read since being here a few
                                  months ago that have confused and perplexed me, mainly because they are
                                  not in Australia, and have simply just thought that it's easier to go
                                  ahead with what I am doing considering my success.

                                  Using my reflux still, it takes me about a full day to collect a little
                                  over 4 litres of ethanol @ 93%, using a digitial thermometer and keeping
                                  the temps mostly between 79.5 and 80.3 degrees, I would rather be under
                                  than over. My latest little toy is a webcam that can monitor the
                                  digital readout so I can just sit inside and not worry about doing laps
                                  in and out of the back door to check the temp/progress every 15 minutes
                                  or so. I just alt+tab, have a squiz and then get on with things. 8-)

                                  I in no way profess to be an expert, in fact quite the opposite esp
                                  after only 3 runs. I am a beginner willing to answer any questions I
                                  can and give any advice which may be asked of me. I can only tell
                                  someone what I know and insist I know little.

                                  It has been very enjoyable reading about the experiences of everyone who
                                  contributes and I hope that I can help people out as much as those who
                                  have gone out of their way to do the same. Email me direct if you like
                                  and uhmmmm......... bottoms up!

                                  Lebbo

                                  -----Original Message-----
                                  From: barjarg2003 [mailto:barjargchilli@...]
                                  Sent: Monday, 9 August 2004 10:55 PM
                                  To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                                  Subject: [new_distillers] Re: Polishing spirit


                                  Guys, Guys, Guys, Polishing or filtering through carbon is best done
                                  at a rate of about 1/2 litre per hour (or less!!!) I can drink a full
                                  bottle in a sitting, and still go to work in the morning with a
                                  reasonably clear head - best result was 3/4 of a bottle (at 40%) in
                                  one sitting and blew only 0.03% on the Police breathalyser 6 hrs
                                  later - are some of you trying to get 10 or more litres of neutral
                                  spirit thru your carbon overnight ?

                                  Set up 2 or more filtering units, Slow the collection rate, NO MORE
                                  HEADACHES - Unless you are collecting spirit at below 78 or above 89
                                  deg C, in wich case you may be collecting nasty stuff
                                  (my observations only - works for me.)

                                  Distill in Peace

                                  Craig
                                  >
                                  PS - Boil the crap out of your used carbon, dry in a medium oven,
                                  cool down and re-use (cheap eh!)
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
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                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                • Austin Smith
                                  Message 16 of 30 , Aug 9, 2004
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                  • Rana Pipiens
                                    I guess that I ll finally ask; what is a z filter and where could they be purchased in the US? I ve seen the ones sold by Brewhaus,U.S.A. Is that the same
                                    Message 17 of 30 , Aug 9, 2004
                                    • 0 Attachment
                                      I guess that I'll finally ask; what is a z filter and where could they be purchased in the US? I've seen the ones sold by Brewhaus,U.S.A. Is that the same thing? Rana



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                                    • Levi Langershank
                                      ...maybe you are just headache prone ....I m not trying to be sarcastic here...my method of fermenting and distilling is very similar to yours......I use
                                      Message 18 of 30 , Aug 9, 2004
                                      • 0 Attachment
                                        ...maybe you are just 'headache prone'....I'm not trying to be sarcastic
                                        here...my method of fermenting and distilling is very similar to
                                        yours......I use Prestige yeast,sugar and spring water....strip quickly to
                                        appx 60-70%ABV....I then do a very slow (48-72 hours to collect 2 gal@ 96%)
                                        run,tossing everything until the bad smell goes away and the temp
                                        stabelizes (for days:>) at the entrance to the condenser....as soon as the
                                        temp rises 1 degC,I shut the operation down and toss the rest.....I then
                                        dilute with spring water to appx 40% and add 1 cup premium quality carbon
                                        per 5 gallon...agitate every 2-3 days for appx 2 weeks and strain off when I
                                        get around to it....I have consumed up to a full quart of this over a 3-4
                                        hour period and never had a headache or nausea....I have,however,still been
                                        about half 'lit' the next morning..:>)..I routinely consume a pint in the
                                        evening with absolutely no effect in the morning,after 6-7 hours
                                        sleep....back when I drank 'commercial' alcoholic products a morning
                                        headache wasnt un-common.....I havnt bought any commercial spirit of any
                                        kind in >10 years now...also,I NEVER add any 'foreshots' (aka ant killer)
                                        back to future runs and I dont collect tails...all goes down the
                                        drain...good luck...:>)


                                        >From: Lukas Paige <lukas@...>
                                        >Reply-To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                                        >To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                                        >Subject: RE: [new_distillers] Polishing spirit
                                        >Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 13:08:20 +1000
                                        >
                                        >So what would be the minimum time to leave spirit on carbon?
                                        >
                                        >I've read/heard that in some small commercial
                                        >distilleries they do one run to get 92% ABV, then
                                        >put 40-50 litres on carbon for 24 hours only to
                                        >get pure, headache free gear! And they only use
                                        >4-5 tablespoons of carbon!
                                        >
                                        >What's the general consensus out there?
                                        >
                                        >For the spirit I'm currently treating I made up a
                                        >sugar wash that was around 18-20% ABV, then
                                        >stripped to 90% ABV, then did a slow run to get
                                        >94% ABV. I collected all feints on both runs (and
                                        >a lot of them) and made sure to get a good mid
                                        >cut (swapping collection vessels often). This I
                                        >then treated with a Z-Filter - got 15 x 750ml
                                        >bottles out of it, but still got a f#$%ing
                                        >headache afterwards.
                                        >
                                        >What am I doing wrong?
                                        >
                                        >LP.
                                        >
                                        > >I carbon treat in 6 gallon carboys...usually about 4-5 gal in each
                                        >one...I
                                        > >shake them every 2-3 days for the first couple of weeks...after that I
                                        >just
                                        > >leave them until I get around to straining the carbon out..works for
                                        > >me....:>)
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >>From: Lukas Paige <lukas@...>
                                        > >>Reply-To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                                        > >>To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                                        > >>Subject: [new_distillers] Polishing spirit
                                        > >>Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 10:52:52 +1000
                                        > >>
                                        > >>Hi,
                                        > >>
                                        > >>Is it better to agitate spirit when polishing with activated carbon?
                                        > >>I'm doing a small test on some 40% and am wondering if it's doing its
                                        > >>job sitting still in the bottom of the bottle. Any tips and tricks or
                                        > >>advice would be much appreciated.
                                        > >>
                                        > >>On another note, I posted a question about cleaning a hot water
                                        > >>system a while ago that no one answered... is it that no one knows
                                        > >>how, or was everyone away on holiday or something. :-P
                                        > >>
                                        > >>Thanks in advance,
                                        > >>
                                        > >>LP.
                                        > >
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                                        > > New Distillers group archives are at http://archive.nnytech.net/
                                        > > FAQ and other information available at http://homedistiller.org
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >Yahoo! Groups Links
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        >

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                                      • Levi Langershank
                                        ...: )...I used to agree...it just didnt make sense to just dump carbon into a carboy of spirit and get good results...I got very good results with my
                                        Message 19 of 30 , Aug 9, 2004
                                        • 0 Attachment
                                          ...:>)...I used to agree...it just didnt make sense to just dump carbon into
                                          a carboy of spirit and get good results...I got very good results with my
                                          home-made filter...now I get great results by dumping a cup of carbon into
                                          the carboy...and its a lot less work,in my opinion of corse.....the
                                          key,IMHO,is to use a quality carbon to start with....but as long as it
                                          works,go for it!!!....:>)


                                          >From: s r <ismeok2002@...>
                                          >Reply-To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                                          >To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                                          >Subject: Re: [new_distillers] Polishing spirit
                                          >Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 05:06:17 -0700 (PDT)
                                          >
                                          >the only , and best way to filter the stuff .
                                          >takes 2.5 kg carbon to fill the pipe but its worth every bit , YUM YUM

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                                        • Levi Langershank
                                          ABOVE 89?????...I never collect above 80 these days....the few times I did,the volume wasnt worth the effort(maybe 250ml between 80 and water) and was nasty to
                                          Message 20 of 30 , Aug 9, 2004
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            ABOVE 89?????...I never collect above 80 these days....the few times I
                                            did,the volume wasnt worth the effort(maybe 250ml between 80 and water) and
                                            was nasty to boot...:>)....on my final-run-still,when the temp gets to appx
                                            80,there isnt sufficient heat to drive it much higher anyways,usually the
                                            temp falls back a bit...if I turn the heat up,it increases rapidly,telling
                                            me the ethanol is gone and thats all I wanted to collect...:>)


                                            >From: "barjarg2003" <barjargchilli@...>

                                            >
                                            - Unless you are collecting spirit at below 78 or above 89
                                            >deg C, in wich case you may be collecting nasty stuff
                                            >(my observations only - works for me.)
                                            >
                                            >Distill in Peace
                                            >
                                            >Craig
                                            >

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                                          • Levi Langershank
                                            This is true...I started the hobby years before the internet was around...I knew and still know a few moonshiners and none of them agree on very
                                            Message 21 of 30 , Aug 9, 2004
                                            • 0 Attachment
                                              This is true...I started the 'hobby' years before the internet was
                                              around...I knew and still know a few 'moonshiners' and none of them agree on
                                              very much,except that "I" am the expert here...:>)...the best you can do is
                                              obtain a basic knowledge of the 'hobby' and figure out(thru trial-and-error)
                                              what works best for you...a little common sense goes a long way here...you
                                              can use complex formulas to determine the ABV etc but that changes little in
                                              the end...experimentation will prove many ,self-proclaimed
                                              experts,wrong...it will also prove many are correct...its your task to sort
                                              thru all the 'evidence' and return a verdict....:>)...good luck...


                                              >From: "Lebbo" <bundy_rum98@...>
                                              >Fellow distillers,
                                              >
                                              >IMHO..............I in no way profess to be an expert, in fact quite the
                                              >opposite esp
                                              >after only 3 runs. I am a beginner willing to answer any questions I
                                              >can and give any advice which may be asked of me. I can only tell
                                              >someone what I know and insist I know little.
                                              >
                                              >It has been very enjoyable reading about the experiences of everyone who
                                              >contributes and I hope that I can help people out as much as those who
                                              >have gone out of their way to do the same. Email me direct if you like
                                              >and uhmmmm......... bottoms up!
                                              >
                                              >Lebbo

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                                            • Harry
                                              ... methanol poisoning. BE SURE TO REMOVE ALL METHANOL. Remove all methanol is sound advice. However I doubt that methanol is the problem here. I d be
                                              Message 22 of 30 , Aug 9, 2004
                                              • 0 Attachment
                                                --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, Scott Petrinec
                                                <crazycro2@y...> wrote:
                                                > If the headache is behind the eyes...that is the first sign of
                                                methanol poisoning. BE SURE TO REMOVE ALL METHANOL.



                                                "Remove all methanol" is sound advice. However I doubt that
                                                methanol is the problem here. I'd be looking at other things
                                                like 'nasties' produced by stressed yeast working under less-than-
                                                ideal conditions, like too little nutrient, poor temperature
                                                control, O.G too high, any one of a dozen things that affect the by-
                                                products that yeasts make. Some of these do carry over.

                                                The amount of methanol produced by pure sugar fermentations is
                                                negligable. All grain fermentations produce a heck of a lot more,
                                                and in fact methanol is present in even the very best commercial
                                                Scotch Malts, ranging from 38 to 140 ppm (parts per million).
                                                Moonshine tested at the same time on the same gas chromatograph
                                                showed methanol at 41 ppm.
                                                (Source:
                                                http://www.dcs.ed.ac.uk/home/jhb/whisky/gleanings/analysis.htm )

                                                The amount of methanol needed in your system to produce signs of
                                                poisoning is very high (15 - 30 ml of 40% solution).

                                                Speaking of 'signs of poisoning',...
                                                (source: http://www.homestead.com/emguidemaps/files/methanol.html )

                                                - many of the early symptoms of methanol poisoning are non-specific
                                                eg. headache, dizziness, malaise, generalized weakness, altered
                                                sensorium, acute mania, and paresthesias.

                                                - the most characteristic symptoms that are very suggestive of
                                                methanol toxicity are the visual symptoms - blurred vision,
                                                decreased vision, snowfield blindness - described as "seeing a
                                                snowstorm" or "stepping into a snowfield", visual scintillations,
                                                photophobia, constricted vision or visual field defects, total
                                                blindness.


                                                HTH
                                                Slainte!
                                                regards Harry
                                              • Harry
                                                ... they be purchased in the US? I ve seen the ones sold by Brewhaus,U.S.A. Is that the same thing? Rana Download this file for a good description...
                                                Message 23 of 30 , Aug 9, 2004
                                                • 0 Attachment
                                                  --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, Rana Pipiens <ranawater@y...>
                                                  wrote:
                                                  > I guess that I'll finally ask; what is a z filter and where could
                                                  they be purchased in the US? I've seen the ones sold by
                                                  Brewhaus,U.S.A. Is that the same thing? Rana



                                                  Download this file for a good description...
                                                  http://www.stillspirits.com/webfiles/StillSpirits/files/5_litre_Pot_S
                                                  till_&_z_filter.pdf

                                                  Same link in TinyURL...

                                                  http://tinyurl.com/7y3xt


                                                  Slainte!
                                                  regards Harry
                                                • Harry
                                                  ... times I ... water) and ... gets to appx ... anyways,usually the ... rapidly,telling ... They sound like pot still working temps to me. Not everyone uses
                                                  Message 24 of 30 , Aug 9, 2004
                                                  • 0 Attachment
                                                    --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Levi Langershank"
                                                    <unit_77@h...> wrote:
                                                    > ABOVE 89?????...I never collect above 80 these days....the few
                                                    times I
                                                    > did,the volume wasnt worth the effort(maybe 250ml between 80 and
                                                    water) and
                                                    > was nasty to boot...:>)....on my final-run-still,when the temp
                                                    gets to appx
                                                    > 80,there isnt sufficient heat to drive it much higher
                                                    anyways,usually the
                                                    > temp falls back a bit...if I turn the heat up,it increases
                                                    rapidly,telling
                                                    > me the ethanol is gone and thats all I wanted to collect...:>)



                                                    They sound like 'pot still' working temps to me. Not everyone uses
                                                    reflux. ;-)


                                                    Slainte!
                                                    regards Harry
                                                  • Levi Langershank
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                                                    Message 25 of 30 , Aug 9, 2004
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                                                      ...true...thanks for the 'heads-up'...:>)


                                                      >
                                                      >They sound like 'pot still' working temps to me. Not everyone uses
                                                      >reflux. ;-)
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                      >Slainte!
                                                      >regards Harry
                                                      >

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                                                    • Rana Pipiens
                                                      Thanks alot Harry. Does anyone have experience with both the Z Filter and the Gert Strand setup? Any reccomendations on either? R Harry
                                                      Message 26 of 30 , Aug 10, 2004
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                                                        Thanks alot Harry. Does anyone have experience with both the Z Filter and the Gert Strand setup? Any reccomendations on either? R

                                                        Harry <gnikomson2000@...> wrote:--- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, Rana Pipiens <ranawater@y...>
                                                        wrote:
                                                        > I guess that I'll finally ask; what is a z filter and where could
                                                        they be purchased in the US? I've seen the ones sold by
                                                        Brewhaus,U.S.A. Is that the same thing? Rana



                                                        Download this file for a good description...
                                                        http://www.stillspirits.com/webfiles/StillSpirits/files/5_litre_Pot_S
                                                        till_&_z_filter.pdf

                                                        Same link in TinyURL...

                                                        http://tinyurl.com/7y3xt


                                                        Slainte!
                                                        regards Harry



                                                        New Distillers group archives are at http://archive.nnytech.net/
                                                        FAQ and other information available at http://homedistiller.org




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                                                      • GWN
                                                        Ouch!! ... uses
                                                        Message 27 of 30 , Aug 10, 2004
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                                                          Ouch!!

                                                          :)

                                                          --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "Levi Langershank"
                                                          <unit_77@h...> wrote:
                                                          > ...true...thanks for the 'heads-up'...:>)
                                                          >
                                                          >
                                                          > >
                                                          > >They sound like 'pot still' working temps to me. Not everyone
                                                          uses
                                                          > >reflux. ;-)
                                                          > >
                                                          > >
                                                          > >Slainte!
                                                          > >regards Harry
                                                          > >
                                                          >
                                                          > _________________________________________________________________
                                                          > FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar – get it now!
                                                          > http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/
                                                        • Levi Langershank
                                                          ... _________________________________________________________________ Don’t just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search!
                                                          Message 28 of 30 , Aug 10, 2004
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                                                            ...something bite your butt???....:>)


                                                            >From: "GWN" <GrtWhiteNorth56@...>
                                                            >Reply-To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                                                            >To: new_distillers@yahoogroups.com
                                                            >Subject: [new_distillers] Re: Polishing spirit
                                                            >Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 00:03:16 -0000
                                                            >
                                                            >
                                                            >Ouch!!
                                                            >
                                                            >:)
                                                            >

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                                                          • David
                                                            Thanks for that info, Harry, You just answered some of my questions,,,Dave
                                                            Message 29 of 30 , Aug 11, 2004
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                                                              Thanks for that info, Harry, You just answered some of my questions,,,Dave






                                                              At 09:17 PM 8/9/04 -0000, you wrote:
                                                              >--- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, Scott Petrinec
                                                              ><crazycro2@y...> wrote:
                                                              >> If the headache is behind the eyes...that is the first sign of
                                                              >methanol poisoning. BE SURE TO REMOVE ALL METHANOL.
                                                              >
                                                              >
                                                              >
                                                              >"Remove all methanol" is sound advice. However I doubt that
                                                              >methanol is the problem here. I'd be looking at other things
                                                              >like 'nasties' produced by stressed yeast working under less-than-
                                                              >ideal conditions, like too little nutrient, poor temperature
                                                              >control, O.G too high, any one of a dozen things that affect the by-
                                                              >products that yeasts make. Some of these do carry over.
                                                              >
                                                              >The amount of methanol produced by pure sugar fermentations is
                                                              >negligable. All grain fermentations produce a heck of a lot more,
                                                              >and in fact methanol is present in even the very best commercial
                                                              >Scotch Malts, ranging from 38 to 140 ppm (parts per million).
                                                              >Moonshine tested at the same time on the same gas chromatograph
                                                              >showed methanol at 41 ppm.
                                                              >(Source:
                                                              >http://www.dcs.ed.ac.uk/home/jhb/whisky/gleanings/analysis.htm )
                                                              >
                                                              >The amount of methanol needed in your system to produce signs of
                                                              >poisoning is very high (15 - 30 ml of 40% solution).
                                                              >
                                                              >Speaking of 'signs of poisoning',...
                                                              >(source: http://www.homestead.com/emguidemaps/files/methanol.html )
                                                              >
                                                              >- many of the early symptoms of methanol poisoning are non-specific
                                                              >eg. headache, dizziness, malaise, generalized weakness, altered
                                                              >sensorium, acute mania, and paresthesias.
                                                              >
                                                              >- the most characteristic symptoms that are very suggestive of
                                                              >methanol toxicity are the visual symptoms - blurred vision,
                                                              >decreased vision, snowfield blindness - described as "seeing a
                                                              >snowstorm" or "stepping into a snowfield", visual scintillations,
                                                              >photophobia, constricted vision or visual field defects, total
                                                              >blindness.
                                                              >
                                                              >
                                                              >HTH
                                                              >Slainte!
                                                              >regards Harry
                                                              >
                                                              >
                                                              >
                                                              >
                                                              > New Distillers group archives are at http://archive.nnytech.net/
                                                              > FAQ and other information available at http://homedistiller.org
                                                              >
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                                                              >Yahoo! Groups Links
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