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Re: [neoplatonism] help with possible reference to Phaedrus in Plotinus 5.8.4

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  • Michael Wakoff
    Hi Tim, Thanks, I see what you mean. The Hackforth translation doesn t convey the sense that this knowledge is not of one thing in another, although it is
    Message 1 of 34 , May 28 7:03 AM
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      Hi Tim,

      Thanks, I see what you mean. The Hackforth translation doesn't convey
      the sense that this knowledge is not of one thing in another, although
      it is found in the translation that Mike Chase just kindly provided or
      in the Thomas Taylor translation.

      Best,

      Michael

      Best,

      Michael

      Tim Addey wrote:
      >
      >
      > Michael
      >
      > You may be interested in the translations of Thomas Taylor of these two
      > passages, where there is very close agreement between Plato and
      > Plotinus' Plato:
      >
      > Phaedrus 247d: But in this circuit it beholds justice herself, it
      > beholds temperance, and science herself: not that with which generation
      > is present, nor in which one thing has a particular local residence in
      > another, and to which we give the appellation of beings; but that which
      > is science in true being.
      >
      > Plotinus, V, viii, 4: But if anyone doubts concerning our sciences, we
      > must neglect the discussion for the present, at the same time assuming
      > an occasion from hence, let us dispute concerning that science, which
      > Plato beholding in the intelligible world says, that science there is
      > not one thing in another.
      >
      > Tim Addey
      >
      > Michael Wakoff wrote:
      > > Dear all,
      > >
      > > I am trying to identify the passage in Plato that Plotinus refers to in
      > > 5.8.4.53-55. In the source of quotations in the back of the 1969
      > > MacKenna, it says it is Phaedrus 247d. However, when I read Phaedrus
      > > 247d, I don't see where it says anything like what Plotinus quotes
      > Plato
      > > as saying. I am at a disadvantage since I'm Greekless, so I can compare
      > > only the English translation of Plotinus with the English
      > translation of
      > > Plato.
      > >
      > > 5.8.4.53-55 in Armstrong's translation reads:
      > >
      > > but about the knowledge there--which Plato observed and said "that
      > which
      > > is not a knowledge different from that in which it is"
      > >
      > > I have the Hackforth translation of Phaedrus in the Bollingen Collected
      > > Works. Is it perhaps this line:
      > >
      > > "not that knowledge that is neighbor to becoming and varies with the
      > > various objects..." (Phd 247d-e)
      > >
      > > Perhaps a different translation of either the Plotinus or the Plato
      > > passage will reveal how they agree or perhaps the source is listed
      > > incorrectly. If anyone is able to identify the passage in Plato, I'd
      > > appreciate it if you would supply enough of the English translation
      > so I
      > > can identify the passage in my translation of the dialogues.
      > >
      > > Best,
      > >
      > > Michael Wakoff
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > (I'll cite the passage in English since I'm Greekless.)
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >>
      > >>
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > ------------------------------------
      > >
      > > Yahoo! Groups Links
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      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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    • John Uebersax
      Excellent paper, Mike.  Thanks for posting it.  It addresses the question I asked splendily. All the best, John Uebersax [Non-text portions of this message
      Message 34 of 34 , Jun 17, 2010
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        Excellent paper, Mike.  Thanks for posting it.  It addresses the question I asked splendily.

        All the best,

        John Uebersax


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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