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Re: [nde] Assisted Suicide and nde....

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  • Noni
    I do believe that some things have been arranged before birth. But I also have good reason s to believe that because of a premature death some souls will have
    Message 1 of 16 , Mar 1, 2013
      I do believe that some things have been arranged before birth. But I also have good reason's to believe that because of a premature death some souls will have to return to complete their purpose for being here. From the NDEs I have read, premature death is a real possibility.

      Some NDErs reported that while trying to commit suicide they spoke to 'someone' on the other side. They were given a choice to return or stay. They were told that if they 'stayed' they would have to reincarnate and endure the same challenges later. There was another NDEr (on the Bio Channel program Beyond and Back) who said she met her grandmother (who she never met because she committed suicide before she was born) was told that because of her suicide she will need to reincarnate. She stayed with her granddaughter while she had her life review.

      I know that depression (especially from a prolonged illness) is not an easy thing to deal with.

      But I have seen the 'ripples' of what a premature death does to friends and family.

      As far as assisted suicide, to me, it is a matter of 'who' will do the assisting? There is a danger here. People are always making judgments and they tend to believe what ever judgments they are making. We may believe that someone will not get better, they are in too much pain, it is too much of a financial hardship, they are too much of a burden, etc.. Who has the right to play God and assist in a death when human beings are often wrong in their thinking?

      Hospice is in the business of assisting at the 'time of dying'. Once someone has been diagnosed with 6 months to live, they qualify for assistance in dealing with pain and discomfort. Family and close friends gather as the time nears. This is part of the normal process.. It is believed that hospice has no problem giving extreme doses of pain relief medications. (Sometimes, even to the point of what may be considered lethal doses.) You may be correct in that many people will not die unless they are ready. Hospice workers are trained to ask questions to see if there are family or friends that they 'need' to see before passing on. There have also been some people who 'left' hospice care because they got better.

      Bruce believes that 'everything' is predestined. Since that is his belief, he has to add this belief to every one of his posts.. (few exceptions) As you can see, what we believe is reflected by how we live..
      Love, Noni


      On 2/28/2013 7:56 PM, Alya Solet wrote:
       
      I have read many times, too, that if they succeed it was time to die,
      if they dont, it was not meant to be,
      they only get hurt and life becomes harder to manage.
       
      If suicide was as easy at it looks no one would be alive and suffering.
      many people who suffer are not afraid to die, but they have to wait
      or bigger troubles will come around. 
       
       
       
      love, Alya



    • Alya Solet
      I would be afraid to have to do this life all over again, if that is the truth. I want to finish this cycle and be done with. Truly want to get out of this
      Message 2 of 16 , Mar 2, 2013
        I would be afraid to have to do this life all over again, if that is the truth.
        I want to finish this cycle and be done with. Truly want to get out of this
        planet, this human flesh prison, move on. I know my
        spiritual home is waiting, the light
        is waiting, another dimension less dense than this is out there,
         but I could not
        access it right now, my diamond/soul is not sharp and sparkling enough
        to be part of that.
         
         
          
         
         
         
        love, Alya

        From: Noni <kiwanis@...>
        To: nde@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Friday, March 1, 2013 8:26 AM
        Subject: Re: [nde] Assisted Suicide and nde....
         
        I do believe that some things have been arranged before birth. But I also have good reason's to believe that because of a premature death some souls will have to return to complete their purpose for being here. From the NDEs I have read, premature death is a real possibility.

        Some NDErs reported that while trying to commit suicide they spoke to 'someone' on the other side. They were given a choice to return or stay. They were told that if they 'stayed' they would have to reincarnate and endure the same challenges later. There was another NDEr (on the Bio Channel program Beyond and Back) who said she met her grandmother (who she never met because she committed suicide before she was born) was told that because of her suicide she will need to reincarnate. She stayed with her granddaughter while she had her life review.

        I know that depression (especially from a prolonged illness) is not an easy thing to deal with.

        But I have seen the 'ripples' of what a premature death does to friends and family.

        As far as assisted suicide, to me, it is a matter of 'who' will do the assisting? There is a danger here. People are always making judgments and they tend to believe what ever judgments they are making. We may believe that someone will not get better, they are in too much pain, it is too much of a financial hardship, they are too much of a burden, etc.. Who has the right to play God and assist in a death when human beings are often wrong in their thinking?

        Hospice is in the business of assisting at the 'time of dying'. Once someone has been diagnosed with 6 months to live, they qualify for assistance in dealing with pain and discomfort. Family and close friends gather as the time nears. This is part of the normal process.. It is believed that hospice has no problem giving extreme doses of pain relief medications. (Sometimes, even to the point of what may be considered lethal doses.) You may be correct in that many people will not die unless they are ready. Hospice workers are trained to ask questions to see if there are family or friends that they 'need' to see before passing on. There have also been some people who 'left' hospice care because they got better.

        Bruce believes that 'everything' is predestined. Since that is his belief, he has to add this belief to every one of his posts.. (few exceptions) As you can see, what we believe is reflected by how we live..
        Love, Noni


        On 2/28/2013 7:56 PM, Alya Solet wrote:
         
        I have read many times, too, that if they succeed it was time to die,
        if they dont, it was not meant to be,
        they only get hurt and life becomes harder to manage.
         
        If suicide was as easy at it looks no one would be alive and suffering.
        many people who suffer are not afraid to die, but they have to wait
        or bigger troubles will come around. 
         
         
         
        love, Alya

      • Venugopal AK
        Rest assured and take comfort in the fact that every thing is pre-destined. Every thing is God s will. Man proposes, God disposes !! Regards vg ... From: Alya
        Message 3 of 16 , Mar 2, 2013
          Rest assured and take comfort in the fact that every thing is pre-destined. Every thing is God's will. Man proposes, God disposes !!
          Regards
          vg

          --- On Sat, 2/3/13, Alya Solet <alyasolet@...> wrote:

          From: Alya Solet <alyasolet@...>
          Subject: Re: [nde] Assisted Suicide and nde....
          To: "nde@yahoogroups.com" <nde@yahoogroups.com>
          Date: Saturday, 2 March, 2013, 10:30 PM

           

          I would be afraid to have to do this life all over again, if that is the truth.
          I want to finish this cycle and be done with. Truly want to get out of this
          planet, this human flesh prison, move on. I know my
          spiritual home is waiting, the light
          is waiting, another dimension less dense than this is out there,
           but I could not
          access it right now, my diamond/soul is not sharp and sparkling enough
          to be part of that.
           
           
            
           
           
           
          love, Alya

          From: Noni <kiwanis@...>
          To: nde@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Friday, March 1, 2013 8:26 AM
          Subject: Re: [nde] Assisted Suicide and nde....
           
          I do believe that some things have been arranged before birth. But I also have good reason's to believe that because of a premature death some souls will have to return to complete their purpose for being here. From the NDEs I have read, premature death is a real possibility.

          Some NDErs reported that while trying to commit suicide they spoke to 'someone' on the other side. They were given a choice to return or stay. They were told that if they 'stayed' they would have to reincarnate and endure the same challenges later. There was another NDEr (on the Bio Channel program Beyond and Back) who said she met her grandmother (who she never met because she committed suicide before she was born) was told that because of her suicide she will need to reincarnate. She stayed with her granddaughter while she had her life review.

          I know that depression (especially from a prolonged illness) is not an easy thing to deal with.

          But I have seen the 'ripples' of what a premature death does to friends and family.

          As far as assisted suicide, to me, it is a matter of 'who' will do the assisting? There is a danger here. People are always making judgments and they tend to believe what ever judgments they are making. We may believe that someone will not get better, they are in too much pain, it is too much of a financial hardship, they are too much of a burden, etc.. Who has the right to play God and assist in a death when human beings are often wrong in their thinking?

          Hospice is in the business of assisting at the 'time of dying'. Once someone has been diagnosed with 6 months to live, they qualify for assistance in dealing with pain and discomfort. Family and close friends gather as the time nears. This is part of the normal process.. It is believed that hospice has no problem giving extreme doses of pain relief medications. (Sometimes, even to the point of what may be considered lethal doses.) You may be correct in that many people will not die unless they are ready. Hospice workers are trained to ask questions to see if there are family or friends that they 'need' to see before passing on. There have also been some people who 'left' hospice care because they got better.

          Bruce believes that 'everything' is predestined. Since that is his belief, he has to add this belief to every one of his posts.. (few exceptions) As you can see, what we believe is reflected by how we live..
          Love, Noni


          On 2/28/2013 7:56 PM, Alya Solet wrote:
           
          I have read many times, too, that if they succeed it was time to die,
          if they dont, it was not meant to be,
          they only get hurt and life becomes harder to manage.
           
          If suicide was as easy at it looks no one would be alive and suffering.
          many people who suffer are not afraid to die, but they have to wait
          or bigger troubles will come around. 
           
           
           
          love, Alya

        • Noni
          As human beings with illness or handicaps we may see the human flesh as a prison. But it is not true, unless we resist what life is.. I can t say that I am in
          Message 4 of 16 , Mar 2, 2013
            As human beings with illness or handicaps we may see the human flesh as a prison. But it is not true, unless we resist what life is.. I can't say that I am in total acceptance of who and where I am. I can say that when I really look at my unhappiness it is caused by my own resistance to 'my life circumstances.'  Fear is a 'form' of resistance.

            Please think about what Rick said in his post. It is a good step in a direction that will improve the 'life' that you still have.. We are not alone and help is being offered as best that it can be done by a message board..

            I know that as human beings we must speak of things as a person, place or thing. But 'God/What Is' is none of those 'things'. We are living a life of 'form' but our spirit is 'formless'.. To rediscover our spirit we must not 'think' of it as a 'thing'. I did like how Rick suggested to just 'feel peace' for as long as you can..
            Love, Noni

            On 3/2/2013 12:00 PM, Alya Solet wrote:
             
            I would be afraid to have to do this life all over again, if that is the truth.
            I want to finish this cycle and be done with. Truly want to get out of this
            planet, this human flesh prison, move on. I know my
            spiritual home is waiting, the light
            is waiting, another dimension less dense than this is out there,
             but I could not
            access it right now, my diamond/soul is not sharp and sparkling enough
            to be part of that.
             
             
              
             
             
             
            love, Alya

            From: Noni <kiwanis@...>
            To: nde@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Friday, March 1, 2013 8:26 AM
            Subject: Re: [nde] Assisted Suicide and nde....
             
            I do believe that some things have been arranged before birth. But I also have good reason's to believe that because of a premature death some souls will have to return to complete their purpose for being here. From the NDEs I have read, premature death is a real possibility.

            Some NDErs reported that while trying to commit suicide they spoke to 'someone' on the other side. They were given a choice to return or stay. They were told that if they 'stayed' they would have to reincarnate and endure the same challenges later. There was another NDEr (on the Bio Channel program Beyond and Back) who said she met her grandmother (who she never met because she committed suicide before she was born) was told that because of her suicide she will need to reincarnate. She stayed with her granddaughter while she had her life review.

            I know that depression (especially from a prolonged illness) is not an easy thing to deal with.

            But I have seen the 'ripples' of what a premature death does to friends and family.

            As far as assisted suicide, to me, it is a matter of 'who' will do the assisting? There is a danger here. People are always making judgments and they tend to believe what ever judgments they are making. We may believe that someone will not get better, they are in too much pain, it is too much of a financial hardship, they are too much of a burden, etc.. Who has the right to play God and assist in a death when human beings are often wrong in their thinking?

            Hospice is in the business of assisting at the 'time of dying'. Once someone has been diagnosed with 6 months to live, they qualify for assistance in dealing with pain and discomfort. Family and close friends gather as the time nears. This is part of the normal process.. It is believed that hospice has no problem giving extreme doses of pain relief medications. (Sometimes, even to the point of what may be considered lethal doses.) You may be correct in that many people will not die unless they are ready. Hospice workers are trained to ask questions to see if there are family or friends that they 'need' to see before passing on. There have also been some people who 'left' hospice care because they got better.

            Bruce believes that 'everything' is predestined. Since that is his belief, he has to add this belief to every one of his posts.. (few exceptions) As you can see, what we believe is reflected by how we live..
            Love, Noni


            On 2/28/2013 7:56 PM, Alya Solet wrote:
             
            I have read many times, too, that if they succeed it was time to die,
            if they dont, it was not meant to be,
            they only get hurt and life becomes harder to manage.
             
            If suicide was as easy at it looks no one would be alive and suffering.
            many people who suffer are not afraid to die, but they have to wait
            or bigger troubles will come around. 
             
             
             
            love, Alya


          • bruce budden
                          Hey Noni....       As far as assisted suicide, to me, it is a matter of who will do the assisting? There is a danger here.
            Message 5 of 16 , Mar 2, 2013
               

               
               
                      Hey Noni....

                   
              As far as assisted suicide, to me, it is a matter of 'who' will do the assisting? There is a danger here. People are always making judgements and they tend to believe what ever judgements they are making. We may believe that someone will not get better, they are in too much pain, it is too much of a financial hardship, they are too much of a burden, etc.. Who has the right to play God and assist in a death when human beings are often wrong in their thinking?
                 
                 I would say that it is only a doctor who should assist but that goes against their creeds, but whatever someone believes a good reason, a doctor should have a final say...
                 Humans seem to have the right to play God, except when it comes to other humans. Humans kill, slaughter every type of animal daily and most humans couldn't care a less. We slaughter cows, pigs, chickens, baby chicks for their wings, fish etc... we take our beloved pets to the vets and have them put down when they become too much a burden and there's no problem with that, so why is it that humans are sooo special?
                It all has to do with our egos. We weep for our pets when we lose them, but then turn around and go out and get another one so we don't have to go through any hurt and pain... We emotionally attach ourselves as an extension of ourselves, an identity to our pets, family, friends. When we lose our pets we go through the same emotional process as the loss of a family member, friend, so maybe we should just go out and get another father or mother when they pass and we won't have to grieve so much? imho, the worst mistake to do for the kids is to go out and get another pet . We should allow our kids to go through the grieving process. Allow them to fill in the emotional hole with emotional strenght that was once was filled with their identity. When we go out and get another pet without  experiencing the greiving process, all it leaves is a emotional hole that grows with more insecurity.
                  May I ask, What is a premature death mean to you? Are humans the only creature in this realm that have a premature death?
                  imho, "death" to any creature only comes at the right time and the right place. Every living creature only has a destined life path "time" in this realm. Nothing ever leaves too soon nor too late.
               
              Bruce believes that 'everything' is predestined. Since that is his belief, he has to add this belief to every one of his posts.. (few exceptions) As you can see, what we believe is reflected by how we live..
               
                   <smile> Yes, because it is relevant......
               
                                      ;o) Bruce.

               
               
              Love, Noni



               
              On 2/28/2013 7:56 PM, Alya Solet wrote:
               
              I have read many times, too, that if they succeed it was time to die,
              if they dont, it was not meant to be,
              they only get hurt and life becomes harder to manage.
               
              If suicide was as easy at it looks no one would be alive and suffering.
              many people who suffer are not afraid to die, but they have to wait
              or bigger troubles will come around. 
               
               
               
              love, Alya



            • Noni
              Dear Bruce, when I say premature death, I am saying that *I believe* that not everything is predestined -which I know you don t believe. What do you think
              Message 6 of 16 , Mar 2, 2013
                Dear Bruce, when I say premature death, I am saying that I believe that 'not everything is predestined' -which I know you don't believe.

                What do you think about the NDE reports written that talk about 'free will'? I know, they were meant to get that message. It is impossible to debate free will when someone's belief is so concrete. If this is all you ever wish to talk about then you really should invest your time finding a message board with people who think like you do..

                It doesn't matter if you 'believe in God or don't believe in God'.. It doesn't matter if you believe everything is predestined to happen and someone else doesn't.. Either way one believes.. It is still a belief..

                Each 'individual' human being has a belief system and I am no different.

                I 'believe' that some things in life are destined to happen.  I also 'believe' that some things happen that are the result of our free will actions/choices. The result of those choices is also a part of our experience.. It doesn't matter who is right. But it does matter if we tell others that deciding to attempt suicide is just another preplanned action. It appears from several NDE reports that we will see the ripples we created in our life review.. And feel the results of all who were effected. The bottom line is- we should 'try to do acts that are beneficial.'

                IMO, humans are not the only creatures that can have premature death. Everything in this physical world dies. Yes, that is part of our destiny. As human beings we have challenges that require making decisions that other creatures may not have to make. Many of our decisions are done in 'auto mode'. But I feel I can say with certainty that we will have to make decisions, in this life, that can not be done in auto mode. (deciding to get a family pet is a good example) I have been talking to my sister for a few days now about a story she wants to put on facebook. I know it will be a mistake and she is questioning my reasons.. I know that if she puts the story in, it will not be taken well by certain family members.. I also feel that if she decides to go with the story, it will be from her own free will.. And she will have to deal with any pain that it may cause. (And I may have to deal with her pain of not freely letting her do what she wants to do.)

                I guess another question that comes to mind, -If you wish to believe that all this happens according to a great plan -that has been already written- how did this plan come into existence?
                Love, Noni




                On 3/2/2013 6:29 PM, bruce budden wrote:
                May I ask, What is a premature death mean to you? Are humans the only creature in this realm that have a premature death?    imho, "death" to any creature only comes at the right time and the right place. Every living creature only has a destined life path "time" in this realm. Nothing ever leaves too soon nor too late.

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