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amp for flute music

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  • Wayne Greenway
    Greetings all! I was at a Pow Wow in Prescott AZ last weekend and saw some beautiful ceremonial dances done by tribes from all across the country. While there
    Message 1 of 25 , Oct 4, 2012
      Greetings all!

      I was at a Pow Wow in Prescott AZ last weekend and saw some beautiful ceremonial dances done by tribes from all across the country.
      While there I also visited many of the artists that had their creations on display for sale.
      Among them was a local flute maker.
      He had a small amp that he said was the best for flute playing.
      It's the first I've seen and heard. It was a Vortex Sounds unit and was pretty nice but a little pricy at ~ $300

      This week I found another unit called a Roland Cube being sold by an on-line flute maker.

      Anyone care to give some feedback on the various amps out there that work well with a flute and are portable?

      Thanks in advance
      Wayne
    • Bob Blair
      You sometimes get what you pay for, Vortex is one of those things. Vortex rules, I love mine... From: Wayne Greenway Sent: Thursday, October 04, 2012 7:07 PM
      Message 2 of 25 , Oct 4, 2012
        You sometimes get what you pay for, Vortex is one of those things.

        Vortex rules, I love mine...


        From: Wayne Greenway
        Sent: Thursday, October 04, 2012 7:07 PM
        To: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [Native Flute Woodworking] amp for flute music


        Greetings all!

        I was at a Pow Wow in Prescott AZ last weekend and saw some beautiful ceremonial dances done by tribes from all across the country.
        While there I also visited many of the artists that had their creations on display for sale.
        Among them was a local flute maker.
        He had a small amp that he said was the best for flute playing.
        It's the first I've seen and heard. It was a Vortex Sounds unit and was pretty nice but a little pricy at ~ $300

        This week I found another unit called a Roland Cube being sold by an on-line flute maker.

        Anyone care to give some feedback on the various amps out there that work well with a flute and are portable?

        Thanks in advance
        Wayne





        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Brent Adams
        I have a Roland Street Cube. It s a little larger, but can still be used with 6 AA batteries for outdoor use away from a power source. It costs as much as the
        Message 3 of 25 , Oct 4, 2012
          I have a Roland Street Cube. It's a little larger, but can still be used
          with 6 AA batteries for outdoor use away from a power source. It costs as
          much as the Vortex, I believe. It isn't designed to be used while moving
          around hanging on you, but to sit in one place. I have been very happy with
          this choice for my needs, because I also play guitars (both acoustic &
          overdriven electrics) through it and it works for ALL of my needs. I don't
          think that the Vortex would make me very happy if I wanted to plug my
          electric guitar in through it and play an overdriven lead style. The small
          Roland Cube has most of the features that the Street Cube has, with the
          Street being a little louder for larger areas. I think that any of these can
          also be run through a larger PA system if need be to play on a stage in
          front of a huge audience if needed.



          I love my Roland! ..but these are two very different types of amplifiers.





          Brent







          _____

          From: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
          [mailto:nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Greenway
          Sent: Thursday, October 04, 2012 7:08 PM
          To: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [Native Flute Woodworking] amp for flute music





          Greetings all!

          I was at a Pow Wow in Prescott AZ last weekend and saw some beautiful
          ceremonial dances done by tribes from all across the country.
          While there I also visited many of the artists that had their creations on
          display for sale.
          Among them was a local flute maker.
          He had a small amp that he said was the best for flute playing.
          It's the first I've seen and heard. It was a Vortex Sounds unit and was
          pretty nice but a little pricy at ~ $300

          This week I found another unit called a Roland Cube being sold by an on-line
          flute maker.

          Anyone care to give some feedback on the various amps out there that work
          well with a flute and are portable?

          Thanks in advance
          Wayne



          _____

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          Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
          Version: 2013.0.2677 / Virus Database: 2591/5809 - Release Date: 10/04/12



          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • John Pink
          I also picked up a roland cube last month. I got it at a local shop for a $100. It is my first experience with an amp. I really like it. I especially enjoy
          Message 4 of 25 , Oct 5, 2012
            I also picked up a roland cube last month. I got it at a local shop for a $100. It is my first experience with an amp. I really like it. I especially enjoy plugging my phone into it and playing along with my music collection.

            "To thine own self be true"
            John L. Pink


            On Oct 4, 2012, at 11:54 PM, "Brent Adams" <adams1485@...> wrote:

            > I have a Roland Street Cube. It's a little larger, but can still be used
            > with 6 AA batteries for outdoor use away from a power source. It costs as
            > much as the Vortex, I believe. It isn't designed to be used while moving
            > around hanging on you, but to sit in one place. I have been very happy with
            > this choice for my needs, because I also play guitars (both acoustic &
            > overdriven electrics) through it and it works for ALL of my needs. I don't
            > think that the Vortex would make me very happy if I wanted to plug my
            > electric guitar in through it and play an overdriven lead style. The small
            > Roland Cube has most of the features that the Street Cube has, with the
            > Street being a little louder for larger areas. I think that any of these can
            > also be run through a larger PA system if need be to play on a stage in
            > front of a huge audience if needed.
            >
            > I love my Roland! ..but these are two very different types of amplifiers.
            >
            > Brent
            >
            > _____
            >
            > From: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
            > [mailto:nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wayne Greenway
            > Sent: Thursday, October 04, 2012 7:08 PM
            > To: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
            > Subject: [Native Flute Woodworking] amp for flute music
            >
            > Greetings all!
            >
            > I was at a Pow Wow in Prescott AZ last weekend and saw some beautiful
            > ceremonial dances done by tribes from all across the country.
            > While there I also visited many of the artists that had their creations on
            > display for sale.
            > Among them was a local flute maker.
            > He had a small amp that he said was the best for flute playing.
            > It's the first I've seen and heard. It was a Vortex Sounds unit and was
            > pretty nice but a little pricy at ~ $300
            >
            > This week I found another unit called a Roland Cube being sold by an on-line
            > flute maker.
            >
            > Anyone care to give some feedback on the various amps out there that work
            > well with a flute and are portable?
            >
            > Thanks in advance
            > Wayne
            >
            > _____
            >
            > size=1 width="100%" noshade color="#aca899" align=center>
            >
            > No virus found in this message.
            > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
            > Version: 2013.0.2677 / Virus Database: 2591/5809 - Release Date: 10/04/12
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • JIM MOREHOUSE
            I have the VOX DA5 I like it. Up to 5 hrs of battery life. only thig is do not leave the batteries in it. I take out 1 from each bank when not using them . If
            Message 5 of 25 , Oct 5, 2012
              I have the VOX DA5 I like it. Up to 5 hrs of battery life. only thig is do not leave the batteries in it. I take out 1 from each bank when not using them . If left in I found the they start to leak.  Has any one had this happen on the Roland?



              ________________________________
              From: Bob Blair <rangermon@...>
              To: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Thursday, October 4, 2012 10:38 PM
              Subject: Re: [Native Flute Woodworking] amp for flute music


               
              You sometimes get what you pay for, Vortex is one of those things.

              Vortex rules, I love mine...

              From: Wayne Greenway
              Sent: Thursday, October 04, 2012 7:07 PM
              To: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [Native Flute Woodworking] amp for flute music

              Greetings all!

              I was at a Pow Wow in Prescott AZ last weekend and saw some beautiful ceremonial dances done by tribes from all across the country.
              While there I also visited many of the artists that had their creations on display for sale.
              Among them was a local flute maker.
              He had a small amp that he said was the best for flute playing.
              It's the first I've seen and heard. It was a Vortex Sounds unit and was pretty nice but a little pricy at ~ $300

              This week I found another unit called a Roland Cube being sold by an on-line flute maker.

              Anyone care to give some feedback on the various amps out there that work well with a flute and are portable?

              Thanks in advance
              Wayne

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Brent Adams
              I always remove all of the batteries from things like this when they are not in use...now. I had a nine volt battery leak in an acoustic/electric guitar. It
              Message 6 of 25 , Oct 5, 2012
                I always remove all of the batteries from things like this when they are not
                in use...now.



                I had a nine volt battery leak in an acoustic/electric guitar. It was not
                much fun getting that mess cleaned out and I've learned my lesson.



                I agree with you. The Vox is a very nice unit also. If I would have not
                wanted to go with the larger & louder Roland Street Cube, I was leaning
                toward the Vox over the Roland Cube. The price and (I thought) the delay was
                nicer on the Vox for my tastes. I have not had the pleasure of trying out
                the Vortex, but I don't believe it has a guitar "channel", which is helpful
                for my needs.





                Brent



                _____

                From: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
                [mailto:nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of JIM MOREHOUSE
                Sent: Friday, October 05, 2012 5:57 AM
                To: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: Re: [Native Flute Woodworking] amp for flute music





                I have the VOX DA5 I like it. Up to 5 hrs of battery life. only thig is do
                not leave the batteries in it. I take out 1 from each bank when not using
                them . If left in I found the they start to leak. Has any one had this
                happen on the Roland?

                ________________________________
                From: Bob Blair <rangermon@... <mailto:rangermon%40gmail.com> >
                To: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
                <mailto:nativeflutewoodworking%40yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Thursday, October 4, 2012 10:38 PM
                Subject: Re: [Native Flute Woodworking] amp for flute music



                You sometimes get what you pay for, Vortex is one of those things.

                Vortex rules, I love mine...

                From: Wayne Greenway
                Sent: Thursday, October 04, 2012 7:07 PM
                To: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
                <mailto:nativeflutewoodworking%40yahoogroups.com>
                Subject: [Native Flute Woodworking] amp for flute music

                Greetings all!

                I was at a Pow Wow in Prescott AZ last weekend and saw some beautiful
                ceremonial dances done by tribes from all across the country.
                While there I also visited many of the artists that had their creations on
                display for sale.
                Among them was a local flute maker.
                He had a small amp that he said was the best for flute playing.
                It's the first I've seen and heard. It was a Vortex Sounds unit and was
                pretty nice but a little pricy at ~ $300

                This week I found another unit called a Roland Cube being sold by an on-line
                flute maker.

                Anyone care to give some feedback on the various amps out there that work
                well with a flute and are portable?

                Thanks in advance
                Wayne

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                _____

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                No virus found in this message.
                Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
                Version: 2013.0.2677 / Virus Database: 2591/5810 - Release Date: 10/04/12



                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Donn Shands
                Jim I used an old trick that helps on the batteries. When I know that I will use the Roland unit off and on during a short period of time, when I am packing
                Message 7 of 25 , Oct 5, 2012
                  Jim

                  I used an old trick that helps on the batteries.

                  When I know that I will use the Roland unit off and on during a short period of time, when I am packing up, I will slip a piece of cut credit card between two of the batteries. Not sure about your unit, but the Roland can have the power switch bumped to the on position and it will just drain down the batteries in storage. This way, should the switch get bumped, the batteries will not drain.

                  If you are going to store over a month…it is always best to take the batteries out of the unit…or for that matter any unit that uses batteries.

                  I found that a nice size Rubber Maid tote box is just right to carry the unit in… and it leaves room for cables, connectors, and mic. . And….a tupperware type container for extra batteries. Haven’t found just the right size container yet to include the knock downed boom mic stands as yet…but was able to carry them in sling bags.



                  Donn



                  From: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com [mailto:nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of JIM MOREHOUSE
                  Sent: Friday, October 05, 2012 7:57 AM
                  To: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: Re: [Native Flute Woodworking] amp for flute music





                  I have the VOX DA5 I like it. Up to 5 hrs of battery life. only thing is do not leave the batteries in it. I take out 1 from each bank when not using them . If left in I found the they start to leak. Has any one had this happen on the Roland?

                  ________________________________







                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • wro713
                  Its a lot of fun having a amp. when i play my flutes i use my amp 90% of the time.If you have flutes that don,t play very loud , just play into your
                  Message 8 of 25 , Oct 5, 2012
                    Its a lot of fun having a amp. when i play my flutes i use my amp 90% of the time.If you have flutes that don,t play very loud , just play into your mic and amp and you will have all the loudness you want.I have a roland cube 30x plug into the wall model.A while back well known musician friend of mine suggested i put a BOSS DD-3 Digital Delay Pedal between the mic and the amp.Wow talk about echo and other things. it really enhances your music.I just up graded and got the DD7 it even does more. The Boss can be operated on batteries our off a plug into the wall power supply.Go to You-tube to see how Boss works and sounds and also to see the many different power amps that are out there. The mike i use is A Shure SM 57 not the sm 58 that one is more for talking into or singing The sm 57 is more for instruments.
                  • Bryan Towers
                    I have had the vortex walkabout for 3 weeks now {its cool} it stands by itself as a amp made specifically for the NAF you will love the different settings it
                    Message 9 of 25 , Oct 5, 2012
                      I have had the vortex walkabout for 3 weeks now {its cool} it stands by
                      itself as a amp made specifically for the NAF you will love the different
                      settings it has built into it .



                      I do plan on getting the more affordable Roland micro cube later for my
                      flutes and for a 3 string cigar box guitar I plan on getting soon .



                      "B"



                      bnativeflutes.com



                      From: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
                      [mailto:nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of wro713
                      Sent: Friday, October 05, 2012 7:11 PM
                      To: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: [Native Flute Woodworking] amp for flute music





                      Its a lot of fun having a amp. when i play my flutes i use my amp 90% of the
                      time.If you have flutes that don,t play very loud , just play into your mic
                      and amp and you will have all the loudness you want.I have a roland cube 30x
                      plug into the wall model.A while back well known musician friend of mine
                      suggested i put a BOSS DD-3 Digital Delay Pedal between the mic and the
                      amp.Wow talk about echo and other things. it really enhances your music.I
                      just up graded and got the DD7 it even does more. The Boss can be operated
                      on batteries our off a plug into the wall power supply.Go to You-tube to see
                      how Boss works and sounds and also to see the many different power amps that
                      are out there. The mike i use is A Shure SM 57 not the sm 58 that one is
                      more for talking into or singing The sm 57 is more for instruments.





                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • tezza30
                      Hi I have both the Vortex Sounds and the Roland Micro Cube, and I prefer the Vortex if you are attaching the mic to the flute, as the Micro Cube picks up the
                      Message 10 of 25 , Oct 5, 2012
                        Hi
                        I have both the Vortex Sounds and the Roland Micro Cube, and I prefer the Vortex if you are attaching the mic to the flute, as the Micro Cube picks up the tap of the fingers, but the Vortex does not (even with same Mic) The Vortex has way more effects than the Cube, I sometimes run the Vortex through the Cube but you need a Studio Mic to do this and not the clip on Mic that comes with the Vortex as again it will pick up finger noise.
                        So out of the 2 I would go for the Vortex, its a lot of fun and more effects that the Cube, plus when you get a larger speaker/amp you can connect the vortex to it so you can still use the effects form the vortex. The guts of the Vortex is a custom made Zoom G1 effects unit.

                        Terry
                        Australia

                        --- In nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com, Wayne Greenway <GosHawk508@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Greetings all!
                        >
                        > I was at a Pow Wow in Prescott AZ last weekend and saw some beautiful ceremonial dances done by tribes from all across the country.
                        > While there I also visited many of the artists that had their creations on display for sale.
                        > Among them was a local flute maker.
                        > He had a small amp that he said was the best for flute playing.
                        > It's the first I've seen and heard. It was a Vortex Sounds unit and was pretty nice but a little pricy at ~ $300
                        >
                        > This week I found another unit called a Roland Cube being sold by an on-line flute maker.
                        >
                        > Anyone care to give some feedback on the various amps out there that work well with a flute and are portable?
                        >
                        > Thanks in advance
                        > Wayne
                        >
                      • co.d_texasranger
                        Hi all I bought the Vortex Walkabout and had it shipped to the UK, from USA. When I had a proper look at it, I found out that it was made by a company called
                        Message 11 of 25 , Oct 6, 2012
                          Hi all

                          I bought the Vortex Walkabout and had it shipped to the UK, from USA. When I had a proper look at it, I found out that it was made by a company called Zoom and that it was infact a guitar effect pedal, with some of the buttons removed. It would of only cost £40 GBP if I had known and could have bought it over here at a shop down the road. Maybe look around decent music shops where you live, as Zoom is a worldwide company and are not happy about their products being sold under someone elses name.

                          This is the link to what the Vortex walkabout actually is when you remove the front label off it.

                          http://www.zoom.co.jp/products/g1n

                          Apart from the fact that I found this out too late it is still a great piece of kit for flutes and Harmonicas.

                          Hope this helps, as I am not trying to cause trouble, just explaining that you can by it cheaper than when it is sold as a Vortex.

                          Take care and best wishes.
                          Sky_u_Sdi
                        • Bryan Towers
                          I had a look inside my vortex walkabout it states made by Zoom for Vortex . So the question now is are the settings the same as a Zoom G1 made for a guitar or
                          Message 12 of 25 , Oct 6, 2012
                            I had a look inside my vortex walkabout it states made by Zoom for Vortex .
                            So the question now is are the settings the same as a Zoom G1 made for a
                            guitar or are they customized by zoom for vortex for the NAF.



                            Who’s going to buy a Zoom G1 to test this out .



                            “B”



                            From: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
                            [mailto:nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                            co.d_texasranger
                            Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2012 6:56 AM
                            To: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
                            Subject: [Native Flute Woodworking] Re: amp for flute music







                            Hi all

                            I bought the Vortex Walkabout and had it shipped to the UK, from USA. When I
                            had a proper look at it, I found out that it was made by a company called
                            Zoom and that it was infact a guitar effect pedal, with some of the buttons
                            removed. It would of only cost £40 GBP if I had known and could have bought
                            it over here at a shop down the road. Maybe look around decent music shops
                            where you live, as Zoom is a worldwide company and are not happy about their
                            products being sold under someone elses name.

                            This is the link to what the Vortex walkabout actually is when you remove
                            the front label off it.

                            http://www.zoom.co.jp/products/g1n

                            Apart from the fact that I found this out too late it is still a great piece
                            of kit for flutes and Harmonicas.

                            Hope this helps, as I am not trying to cause trouble, just explaining that
                            you can by it cheaper than when it is sold as a Vortex.

                            Take care and best wishes.
                            Sky_u_Sdi





                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Brent Adams
                            Looking at the pictures…..if you only bought the Zoom G1, you wouldn’t get the speakers, the belt clips, connectors, microphone, the case that holds
                            Message 13 of 25 , Oct 6, 2012
                              Looking at the pictures…..if you only bought the Zoom G1, you wouldn’t get
                              the speakers, the belt clips, connectors, microphone, the case that holds
                              everything……and probably something else I’m not thinking of at this moment.
                              If you like to cobble things together you should probably get the Zoom. If
                              you like a simple plug and play set up to enhance your flute while playing
                              for yourself and others…..get the Vortex! It seems to come with everything
                              that you would need, except for the batteries. If you buy from them they
                              provide options for the batteries too.



                              I still prefer the abilities that are provided with the Roland Cube Street
                              model. I can plug in an acoustic or electric guitar ( with separate
                              effects), a microphone (this can be for your flute, vocals or ?....but only
                              one unless you get a mixer as well) with echo or reverb effects, and an mp3
                              player. Someone mention “finger slap noise” coming through with a Cube. That
                              would depend on how you mike it. I don’t get any unwanted noises using a
                              simple inexpensive lapel mic clipped to me as if I was going to use it for a
                              speaking engagement and it sounds amazing. If you are outdoors, there could
                              always be issues with noise from the wind or anything else in you playing
                              environment. These will always need to be dealt with when encountered
                              regardless of the system you try to use.



                              If you are thinking about a system to amplify and enhance your flute, I
                              think either one will make you happy. You can visit a music store with a
                              couple of flutes and see what they have to offer. With the Vortex, you would
                              probably need to find someone that owns it and would let you try it out.
                              High Spirits carries them, but you would probably have to pay shipping if
                              they agreed to having it returned after a trial period (CHECK FIRST!). The
                              Vortex site doesn’t say anything about returns…..only warranties.



                              …….Have FUN & enjoy the music……



                              Brent







                              _____

                              From: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
                              [mailto:nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Bryan Towers
                              Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2012 6:41 AM
                              To: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
                              Subject: RE: [Native Flute Woodworking] Re: amp for flute music





                              I had a look inside my vortex walkabout it states made by Zoom for Vortex .
                              So the question now is are the settings the same as a Zoom G1 made for a
                              guitar or are they customized by zoom for vortex for the NAF.

                              Who’s going to buy a Zoom G1 to test this out .

                              “B”

                              From: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
                              <mailto:nativeflutewoodworking%40yahoogroups.com>
                              [mailto:nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
                              <mailto:nativeflutewoodworking%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of
                              co.d_texasranger
                              Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2012 6:56 AM
                              To: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
                              <mailto:nativeflutewoodworking%40yahoogroups.com>
                              Subject: [Native Flute Woodworking] Re: amp for flute music

                              Hi all

                              I bought the Vortex Walkabout and had it shipped to the UK, from USA. When I
                              had a proper look at it, I found out that it was made by a company called
                              Zoom and that it was infact a guitar effect pedal, with some of the buttons
                              removed. It would of only cost £40 GBP if I had known and could have bought
                              it over here at a shop down the road. Maybe look around decent music shops
                              where you live, as Zoom is a worldwide company and are not happy about their
                              products being sold under someone elses name.

                              This is the link to what the Vortex walkabout actually is when you remove
                              the front label off it.

                              http://www.zoom.co.jp/products/g1n

                              Apart from the fact that I found this out too late it is still a great piece
                              of kit for flutes and Harmonicas.

                              Hope this helps, as I am not trying to cause trouble, just explaining that
                              you can by it cheaper than when it is sold as a Vortex.

                              Take care and best wishes.
                              Sky_u_Sdi

                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                              _____

                              size=1 width="100%" noshade color="#aca899" align=center>

                              No virus found in this message.
                              Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
                              Version: 2013.0.2677 / Virus Database: 2591/5812 - Release Date: 10/05/12



                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            • Dave Wilson
                              There is a further option (probably many!) I have a Roland Mobile Cube on battery/mains that is smaller than the Street Cube. It weighs 3kg (6 1/2 lbs) and is
                              Message 14 of 25 , Oct 6, 2012
                                There is a further option (probably many!) I have a Roland Mobile Cube on battery/mains that is smaller than the Street Cube. It weighs 3kg (6 1/2 lbs) and is 7”x11”x4” It can be carried on a shoulder strap, or just placed on the floor when you play. I use mine with a Vox goose neck mike made for wind instruments, hook and loop strap so you can place it near tsh or middle space etc. The Vox has it’s own mini 9v battery that is housed in the junction box on a belt clip,(smaller than a pack of cards. Everything in a flat zip wallet the size of a cd case)
                                Plug in your backing track from mp3 player/lap top/note book,. It has cut out vocals, add reverb......
                                Acoustic/Electric Guitar/Keyboard/Voice or flute, it can do the job. Auxiliary input with centre channel cut out option(kareoke). Delay/reverb +tone control. Like ‘mighty mouse’ on steroids! I played at a local open air Fair a month ago after the band stand guys had stood down and disconnected their amps. They were impressed, and friends out on the grounds said it carried well and sounded good.
                                Roland website has a good demo if you want to check it out.
                                Dave W

                                From: Brent Adams
                                Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2012 5:06 PM
                                To: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: RE: [Native Flute Woodworking] Re: amp for flute music


                                Looking at the pictures…..if you only bought the Zoom G1, you wouldn’t get
                                the speakers, the belt clips, connectors, microphone, the case that holds
                                everything……and probably something else I’m not thinking of at this moment.
                                If you like to cobble things together you should probably get the Zoom. If
                                you like a simple plug and play set up to enhance your flute while playing
                                for yourself and others…..get the Vortex! It seems to come with everything
                                that you would need, except for the batteries. If you buy from them they
                                provide options for the batteries too.

                                I still prefer the abilities that are provided with the Roland Cube Street
                                model. I can plug in an acoustic or electric guitar ( with separate
                                effects), a microphone (this can be for your flute, vocals or ?....but only
                                one unless you get a mixer as well) with echo or reverb effects, and an mp3
                                player. Someone mention “finger slap noise” coming through with a Cube. That
                                would depend on how you mike it. I don’t get any unwanted noises using a
                                simple inexpensive lapel mic clipped to me as if I was going to use it for a
                                speaking engagement and it sounds amazing. If you are outdoors, there could
                                always be issues with noise from the wind or anything else in you playing
                                environment. These will always need to be dealt with when encountered
                                regardless of the system you try to use.

                                If you are thinking about a system to amplify and enhance your flute, I
                                think either one will make you happy. You can visit a music store with a
                                couple of flutes and see what they have to offer. With the Vortex, you would
                                probably need to find someone that owns it and would let you try it out.
                                High Spirits carries them, but you would probably have to pay shipping if
                                they agreed to having it returned after a trial period (CHECK FIRST!). The
                                Vortex site doesn’t say anything about returns…..only warranties.

                                …….Have FUN & enjoy the music……

                                Brent

                                _____

                                From: mailto:nativeflutewoodworking%40yahoogroups.com
                                [mailto:mailto:nativeflutewoodworking%40yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Bryan Towers
                                Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2012 6:41 AM
                                To: mailto:nativeflutewoodworking%40yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: RE: [Native Flute Woodworking] Re: amp for flute music

                                I had a look inside my vortex walkabout it states made by Zoom for Vortex .
                                So the question now is are the settings the same as a Zoom G1 made for a
                                guitar or are they customized by zoom for vortex for the NAF.

                                Who’s going to buy a Zoom G1 to test this out .

                                “B”

                                From: mailto:nativeflutewoodworking%40yahoogroups.com
                                <mailto:nativeflutewoodworking%40yahoogroups.com>
                                [mailto:mailto:nativeflutewoodworking%40yahoogroups.com
                                <mailto:nativeflutewoodworking%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of
                                co.d_texasranger
                                Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2012 6:56 AM
                                To: mailto:nativeflutewoodworking%40yahoogroups.com
                                <mailto:nativeflutewoodworking%40yahoogroups.com>
                                Subject: [Native Flute Woodworking] Re: amp for flute music

                                Hi all

                                I bought the Vortex Walkabout and had it shipped to the UK, from USA. When I
                                had a proper look at it, I found out that it was made by a company called
                                Zoom and that it was infact a guitar effect pedal, with some of the buttons
                                removed. It would of only cost £40 GBP if I had known and could have bought
                                it over here at a shop down the road. Maybe look around decent music shops
                                where you live, as Zoom is a worldwide company and are not happy about their
                                products being sold under someone elses name.

                                This is the link to what the Vortex walkabout actually is when you remove
                                the front label off it.

                                http://www.zoom.co.jp/products/g1n

                                Apart from the fact that I found this out too late it is still a great piece
                                of kit for flutes and Harmonicas.

                                Hope this helps, as I am not trying to cause trouble, just explaining that
                                you can by it cheaper than when it is sold as a Vortex.

                                Take care and best wishes.
                                Sky_u_Sdi

                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                                _____

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                                No virus found in this message.
                                Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
                                Version: 2013.0.2677 / Virus Database: 2591/5812 - Release Date: 10/05/12

                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              • Barry Higgins
                                I have stayed out of this conversation for a while to allow it to percolate. I have been performing much longer than I have been making flutes and both a long
                                Message 15 of 25 , Oct 6, 2012
                                  I have stayed out of this conversation for a while to allow it to
                                  percolate. I have been performing much longer than I have been making
                                  flutes and both a long time. I also provide live sound engineering
                                  services for concerts and own a small recording studio. So my comments
                                  have some technical experience. The key element in choosing ANY sound
                                  system is the audience (which could be just you). The purpose of sound
                                  reinforcement is to amplify the ambient qualities of the sound per the
                                  needs of the environment/physical space and distance from the source.
                                  The sound can also be or required to be processed to either enhance/
                                  distort to address problem frequencies or used creatively. The
                                  ultimate goal is to bring the sound the audience. Many musicians
                                  confuse who the music is for when performing allowing ego to get in
                                  the way. If you play music for ego, such as laud or looking/sounding
                                  cool you are doing it for the wrong reasons. Being in the sound
                                  business I have multiple modular systems for sound reinforcement that
                                  allow me to be specific to the needs of the performance/space.
                                  Understandably not everyone does it as a business nor have the
                                  financial resources to have it all. I added pieces along the way
                                  building my flexibility. I would recommend that people make a check
                                  list needs and weight them by priority of requirement verses nice to
                                  have. Sound system design should also consider the elements and needs
                                  in the audio chain (from source to speaker) these include microphone,
                                  cable, preamps/amps, and signal processors, speakers. Although I put
                                  signal processors last they can be introduced into the audio chain at
                                  different points depending on how you want them mixed into the sound
                                  (color all sound or blend into the sound). Each piece should be
                                  tailored to the recreation of the true sound and the audience
                                  listening needs. Along the way budget and convenience may create
                                  compromise points for you. I have listed a best to worst from the true
                                  sound reproduction perspective and added a few Pros/Cons. These are
                                  generalized statements and there are exceptions but there is not
                                  enough space to cover the details here.

                                  Microphones
                                  1. Condenser Microphone - more often referred to as recording
                                  microphones but performance models exist as well.
                                  Pros - increased sensitivity for a "truer sound", many designs that
                                  allow greater matching to the source reproduction
                                  Cons - often larger, expense, more -> very fragile, may not work well
                                  in all spaces (feedback problems), fixed positioning

                                  2. Dynamic Microphone - generally described as performance
                                  Pros - within reasonable budget reach, road worthy, broad range of
                                  source uses
                                  Cons - limited recording use, fixed positioning (mic stand reguired)

                                  * comment about sm57 verses sm58 for the "NAF" there is little
                                  perceptive difference between the two until you get to sub-bass
                                  instruments. This is due to the cut-off frequency of the mic. In the
                                  case of these flutes the sm58 would be a better choice. as it cuts off
                                  at 100 Hz, verses the sm57 with a cut-off of 200 Hz.

                                  3. Lavaliere Microphone
                                  Pros - small size visually and transport, can be clipped on no stand
                                  required, easier to use when used in non-fixed playing positions.
                                  Cons - favors high frequencies at cost to lower frequencies, enhances
                                  artifact sound hole noise and finger taps.

                                  Cables
                                  Very simple get the best you can get - signal loss is related to
                                  capacitance and resistance. For most flute folks they will come up
                                  against harsh signal loss due to cable issues except in the case of
                                  mis-matched impedance on adapters. The biggest thing that will get you
                                  in trouble is using a system that requires adapting XLR (found on mic
                                  cables) and 1/4" (found on instruments). To go from 1/4" to XLR use a
                                  DI box or mixer, to go from XRL to 1/4" ALWAYS use an impedance
                                  transformer between them. DO NOT use a cable that has 1/4" on one end
                                  and XRL on the other the impedance mis-match will steal away 605 of
                                  the sound. If that is your current configuration you will be amazed at
                                  what you get back by using the correct devices. All said use as few
                                  step down adapters as possible (each add grater risk of artifact) and
                                  buy the best cables you can afford. You pay for better/more wire,
                                  quality/strength of the external coating and connectors.

                                  Amp and Speakers
                                  Speakers and Amps are specifically designed by application and space.
                                  This means they are tailored to the source type it is designed to
                                  reproduce and how far the sound is required to travel the effects of
                                  drop off and reflection/absorption. An amp designed for guitars will
                                  NOT best represent the reproduction of other instruments or voice due
                                  to the frequency ranges they enhance. Amps created for keyboards
                                  however have a flatter response over a wider range of frequencies. A
                                  PA system is more like keyboard amp designed to reproduce a flatter
                                  response but more often, unless include the use of sub woofers or 15"
                                  speakers, do not do as well for bass frequencies such as kick drum or
                                  bass guitar or low end of keyboards. As a very general rule the larger
                                  the space the more watts output you will need and more or larger
                                  speakers you will need to get the sound to the back of the room in one
                                  piece. A general rule of sound engineering is that you control the
                                  levels for the "sweet spot" in the audience and understand it will be
                                  a little hot in the front row and a little weak in the nose bleed
                                  section. But most important in evaluating the sound is to ALWAYS judge
                                  it from the audience position that is why you will see most live sound
                                  engineers positioned out front in the "sweet spot" in bigger concerts.
                                  So again design your system for the average room you will generally
                                  play in. If you do hospice work my recommendation is to use no sound
                                  reinforcement in a small room with 6 people the low watt small speaker
                                  "cube" like technology, medium size room the 30-50 watt system with a
                                  6-10 speaker or mix of tweeter and driver/bass, and larger room go
                                  with a PA system with 12-15" speakers (min 10") and enough watts to
                                  drive then 250 watts+.

                                  In following is my personal, but informed, opinion only so take it for
                                  what it is worth. I can not think of any reason I would ever purchase
                                  a Vortex like system except if I had to perform a mobile "troubadour"
                                  like gig (which I would not take anyway) in which case there are few
                                  choices. The best attribute of it is that it is "cool". If you can not
                                  find a technical reference for the system that should be your first
                                  indicator you should look twice. Wearing the system on your person an
                                  judging the sound is not a good reference for its effectiveness. I
                                  watched the sales video on youtube which has a few questionable flaws.
                                  When the player is playing the flute without the system you hear
                                  ambient environmental sounds mixed with the flute sound, when he plays
                                  through the system the ambient sounds disappear which most likely
                                  means he is playing direct out of the unit into a recording device.
                                  Half the time he makes mistakes of reaching for controls on his side
                                  and half the time down on what must be a second unit on a table in
                                  front of him. This is an unrealistic video to chose a system by. The
                                  unit is only 5 1/2" wide so the speak has to be quite small I am sure
                                  if you judge the sound wearing it or transferring it to a tethered
                                  recording device or PA is it fine but how far does it stay "quality"
                                  and audience usable. Think is terms of ipod ear buds they work as
                                  intended in your ear but even held an inch from your ear they loss
                                  signal and frequency response. The effects are cool but quite over
                                  stated and unrealistic in sound even for a canyon. Not being able to
                                  review technical specs is it impossible to determine whether you can
                                  control the mix of dry signal to wet signal other than the strength of
                                  the effect itself to make it more realistic. The system and marketing
                                  is designed for sales to non-musicians (don't be fooled by promotional
                                  videos of pro players doing endorsements for free units.) Look instead
                                  at the number of pros that actually use them in everyday use.
                                  Technically and musically it is a very narrow use product especially
                                  since that can buy you much more in a modular system. Bigger in cool
                                  factor than well thought application for listeners. You have to be the
                                  judge for yourself but be informed and choose wisely by becoming the
                                  audience when you evaluate systems.

                                  Barry WC

                                  More on my website about some specifics regarding live performance
                                  setups if interested here is a direct link to the specific page: http://www.whitecrowflutes.com/micprimer.htm
                                • John Pink
                                  Thanks for sharing your knowledge and experience Barry. A lot of good information. Since I only bought my little micro cube for personal enjoyment (with
                                  Message 16 of 25 , Oct 6, 2012
                                    Thanks for sharing your knowledge and experience Barry. A lot of good information.

                                    Since I only bought my little micro cube for personal enjoyment (with disposable income) and to make a little "noise" in the back yard, I don't feel the disappointment I would have had I bought a larger system and misapplied it.

                                    "To thine own self be true"
                                    John L. Pink


                                    On Oct 6, 2012, at 2:48 PM, Barry Higgins <barry@...> wrote:

                                    > I have stayed out of this conversation for a while to allow it to
                                    > percolate. I have been performing much longer than I have been making
                                    > flutes and both a long time. I also provide live sound engineering
                                    > services for concerts and own a small recording studio. So my comments
                                    > have some technical experience. The key element in choosing ANY sound
                                    > system is the audience (which could be just you). The purpose of sound
                                    > reinforcement is to amplify the ambient qualities of the sound per the
                                    > needs of the environment/physical space and distance from the source.
                                    > The sound can also be or required to be processed to either enhance/
                                    > distort to address problem frequencies or used creatively. The
                                    > ultimate goal is to bring the sound the audience. Many musicians
                                    > confuse who the music is for when performing allowing ego to get in
                                    > the way. If you play music for ego, such as laud or looking/sounding
                                    > cool you are doing it for the wrong reasons. Being in the sound
                                    > business I have multiple modular systems for sound reinforcement that
                                    > allow me to be specific to the needs of the performance/space.
                                    > Understandably not everyone does it as a business nor have the
                                    > financial resources to have it all. I added pieces along the way
                                    > building my flexibility. I would recommend that people make a check
                                    > list needs and weight them by priority of requirement verses nice to
                                    > have. Sound system design should also consider the elements and needs
                                    > in the audio chain (from source to speaker) these include microphone,
                                    > cable, preamps/amps, and signal processors, speakers. Although I put
                                    > signal processors last they can be introduced into the audio chain at
                                    > different points depending on how you want them mixed into the sound
                                    > (color all sound or blend into the sound). Each piece should be
                                    > tailored to the recreation of the true sound and the audience
                                    > listening needs. Along the way budget and convenience may create
                                    > compromise points for you. I have listed a best to worst from the true
                                    > sound reproduction perspective and added a few Pros/Cons. These are
                                    > generalized statements and there are exceptions but there is not
                                    > enough space to cover the details here.
                                    >
                                    > Microphones
                                    > 1. Condenser Microphone - more often referred to as recording
                                    > microphones but performance models exist as well.
                                    > Pros - increased sensitivity for a "truer sound", many designs that
                                    > allow greater matching to the source reproduction
                                    > Cons - often larger, expense, more -> very fragile, may not work well
                                    > in all spaces (feedback problems), fixed positioning
                                    >
                                    > 2. Dynamic Microphone - generally described as performance
                                    > Pros - within reasonable budget reach, road worthy, broad range of
                                    > source uses
                                    > Cons - limited recording use, fixed positioning (mic stand reguired)
                                    >
                                    > * comment about sm57 verses sm58 for the "NAF" there is little
                                    > perceptive difference between the two until you get to sub-bass
                                    > instruments. This is due to the cut-off frequency of the mic. In the
                                    > case of these flutes the sm58 would be a better choice. as it cuts off
                                    > at 100 Hz, verses the sm57 with a cut-off of 200 Hz.
                                    >
                                    > 3. Lavaliere Microphone
                                    > Pros - small size visually and transport, can be clipped on no stand
                                    > required, easier to use when used in non-fixed playing positions.
                                    > Cons - favors high frequencies at cost to lower frequencies, enhances
                                    > artifact sound hole noise and finger taps.
                                    >
                                    > Cables
                                    > Very simple get the best you can get - signal loss is related to
                                    > capacitance and resistance. For most flute folks they will come up
                                    > against harsh signal loss due to cable issues except in the case of
                                    > mis-matched impedance on adapters. The biggest thing that will get you
                                    > in trouble is using a system that requires adapting XLR (found on mic
                                    > cables) and 1/4" (found on instruments). To go from 1/4" to XLR use a
                                    > DI box or mixer, to go from XRL to 1/4" ALWAYS use an impedance
                                    > transformer between them. DO NOT use a cable that has 1/4" on one end
                                    > and XRL on the other the impedance mis-match will steal away 605 of
                                    > the sound. If that is your current configuration you will be amazed at
                                    > what you get back by using the correct devices. All said use as few
                                    > step down adapters as possible (each add grater risk of artifact) and
                                    > buy the best cables you can afford. You pay for better/more wire,
                                    > quality/strength of the external coating and connectors.
                                    >
                                    > Amp and Speakers
                                    > Speakers and Amps are specifically designed by application and space.
                                    > This means they are tailored to the source type it is designed to
                                    > reproduce and how far the sound is required to travel the effects of
                                    > drop off and reflection/absorption. An amp designed for guitars will
                                    > NOT best represent the reproduction of other instruments or voice due
                                    > to the frequency ranges they enhance. Amps created for keyboards
                                    > however have a flatter response over a wider range of frequencies. A
                                    > PA system is more like keyboard amp designed to reproduce a flatter
                                    > response but more often, unless include the use of sub woofers or 15"
                                    > speakers, do not do as well for bass frequencies such as kick drum or
                                    > bass guitar or low end of keyboards. As a very general rule the larger
                                    > the space the more watts output you will need and more or larger
                                    > speakers you will need to get the sound to the back of the room in one
                                    > piece. A general rule of sound engineering is that you control the
                                    > levels for the "sweet spot" in the audience and understand it will be
                                    > a little hot in the front row and a little weak in the nose bleed
                                    > section. But most important in evaluating the sound is to ALWAYS judge
                                    > it from the audience position that is why you will see most live sound
                                    > engineers positioned out front in the "sweet spot" in bigger concerts.
                                    > So again design your system for the average room you will generally
                                    > play in. If you do hospice work my recommendation is to use no sound
                                    > reinforcement in a small room with 6 people the low watt small speaker
                                    > "cube" like technology, medium size room the 30-50 watt system with a
                                    > 6-10 speaker or mix of tweeter and driver/bass, and larger room go
                                    > with a PA system with 12-15" speakers (min 10") and enough watts to
                                    > drive then 250 watts+.
                                    >
                                    > In following is my personal, but informed, opinion only so take it for
                                    > what it is worth. I can not think of any reason I would ever purchase
                                    > a Vortex like system except if I had to perform a mobile "troubadour"
                                    > like gig (which I would not take anyway) in which case there are few
                                    > choices. The best attribute of it is that it is "cool". If you can not
                                    > find a technical reference for the system that should be your first
                                    > indicator you should look twice. Wearing the system on your person an
                                    > judging the sound is not a good reference for its effectiveness. I
                                    > watched the sales video on youtube which has a few questionable flaws.
                                    > When the player is playing the flute without the system you hear
                                    > ambient environmental sounds mixed with the flute sound, when he plays
                                    > through the system the ambient sounds disappear which most likely
                                    > means he is playing direct out of the unit into a recording device.
                                    > Half the time he makes mistakes of reaching for controls on his side
                                    > and half the time down on what must be a second unit on a table in
                                    > front of him. This is an unrealistic video to chose a system by. The
                                    > unit is only 5 1/2" wide so the speak has to be quite small I am sure
                                    > if you judge the sound wearing it or transferring it to a tethered
                                    > recording device or PA is it fine but how far does it stay "quality"
                                    > and audience usable. Think is terms of ipod ear buds they work as
                                    > intended in your ear but even held an inch from your ear they loss
                                    > signal and frequency response. The effects are cool but quite over
                                    > stated and unrealistic in sound even for a canyon. Not being able to
                                    > review technical specs is it impossible to determine whether you can
                                    > control the mix of dry signal to wet signal other than the strength of
                                    > the effect itself to make it more realistic. The system and marketing
                                    > is designed for sales to non-musicians (don't be fooled by promotional
                                    > videos of pro players doing endorsements for free units.) Look instead
                                    > at the number of pros that actually use them in everyday use.
                                    > Technically and musically it is a very narrow use product especially
                                    > since that can buy you much more in a modular system. Bigger in cool
                                    > factor than well thought application for listeners. You have to be the
                                    > judge for yourself but be informed and choose wisely by becoming the
                                    > audience when you evaluate systems.
                                    >
                                    > Barry WC
                                    >
                                    > More on my website about some specifics regarding live performance
                                    > setups if interested here is a direct link to the specific page: http://www.whitecrowflutes.com/micprimer.htm
                                    >
                                    >


                                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  • Donn Shands
                                    Thanks Barry… Very thorough response on the sound systems. Personally, I have been dead set against the Vortex from the first. Great if you just want to
                                    Message 17 of 25 , Oct 6, 2012
                                      Thanks Barry…



                                      Very thorough response on the sound systems.



                                      Personally, I have been dead set against the Vortex from the first. Great
                                      if you just want to plug your earphones in and practice on your own. But
                                      not so great for stage performance.



                                      Appreciated the fill in the blanks for a lot of us on specific uses of sound
                                      systems for specific rooms and area.



                                      Also, I had heard of losses from XLR to ¼ before…but had not really
                                      noticed that much difference. Will pay a bit closer attention.

                                      I do remember the days when hooking up VCR and TV leads that every time
                                      you came to one of those splitters you lost a whole lot of signal… same
                                      concept.



                                      Not mentioned was that several of us use our sound cards or usb external
                                      sound cards on our computers to play on the BlogTV or on Pal Talk.

                                      The use of certain mics as you suggested will have a great deal of
                                      difference in the captured sound and what is heard over the blogs.



                                      Some of the amps have taps to allow out put to other line in devices.
                                      Takes a bit of research to know how to do properly, but worth learning.

                                      I use a Diamond External sound usb card… But I use a small Nady MM14FX pre
                                      amp before it. The mic is a standard dynamic stage mic on a boom. I
                                      researched and made a better shock mount for it.

                                      This works for me for blog.

                                      On stage, I still use the Street Cube and sometimes add the Nady before the
                                      input. The FX sounds a bit better.

                                      Something that needs to be stressed to new players. FX can be overworked.
                                      One particular effect can be boring real quick in a short time.



                                      I have researched the finger tap problem a long time…no real solutions right
                                      now.

                                      I did find and interesting concept of finding a thin flex rod …in fact one
                                      that was used for those USB computer lights.. By cutting off the ends…and
                                      mounting one end into a wood block and insulating it with felt and foam,
                                      Then running the wire and mic to the distal end… just taping the wire on for
                                      test. It did isolate the tapping sound some what.

                                      The block is held to the flute with Velcro strap and the flex rod is
                                      arched down the side of the flute and up and over and sits several inches
                                      above and South of the TSH. That way it is out of the wind path of the
                                      K2.



                                      Not a positive fix as yet…but a start. I have some ideas of the actual mic
                                      suspension to give further isolation.



                                      What mic? Well I was using the little lavalier mic from the cheap
                                      wireless set ups. Believe it or not…they actually work. Range? audio and
                                      distance….small room…ok… worth the test.



                                      But, if not isolated enough…you do get the finger taps.



                                      I have experimented with the fuzzy mic covers and they work…but they will
                                      not work to just make a small one for the little mics. Something about the
                                      physics makes the requirement of a larger surface and longer pile of fur to
                                      make it work. Have had very successful trials lately with two known
                                      musicians using them in windy conditions.

                                      Kuz’s flute wings for TSH are a must. but one size does not fit all.
                                      You still have to stand to block the wind.

                                      Funny comment from one musician… “I still had to do the Wind Dance.” the
                                      winds were shifting constantly between the buildings and the canyon walls
                                      with both musicians. The sound tech was impressed with the lack of wind
                                      rustle on the stage mics.



                                      Sad…but they just will not work on the little flute mics. And will not
                                      work on the Vortex

                                      Please….people…understand that the foam covers only get 1% of the
                                      wind…..they are actually there to prevent voice pop when talking or singing.
                                      and maybe to be a little more sanitary ….some people have disposable covers
                                      for the singalong mics.



                                      I am sure you will correct and add to some of this and look forward to more
                                      comments Barry.



                                      Regards,



                                      Donn



                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    • Brent Adams
                                      Hey Barry, Thanks for your expertise! How very true! Everyone needs to make a check list as to what they really need the system for. I did this (mentally.not
                                      Message 18 of 25 , Oct 6, 2012
                                        Hey Barry,

                                        Thanks for your expertise!



                                        How very true! Everyone needs to make a check list as to what they really
                                        need the system for.



                                        I did this (mentally.not on paper, as my needs were simple) before I started
                                        checking out some possible options to meet my modest needs. If I was truly a
                                        "Performer" my needs would have been more demanding, and I already had some
                                        of that type of gear for a larger "performance".



                                        Thanks for sharing your expertise. I appreciated going through your post. It
                                        is very helpful!

                                        Brent



                                        _____

                                        From: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
                                        [mailto:nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Barry Higgins
                                        Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2012 11:49 AM
                                        To: nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com
                                        Subject: RE: [Native Flute Woodworking] amp for flute music





                                        I have stayed out of this conversation for a while to allow it to
                                        percolate. I have been performing much longer than I have been making
                                        flutes and both a long time. I also provide live sound engineering
                                        services for concerts and own a small recording studio. So my comments
                                        have some technical experience. The key element in choosing ANY sound
                                        system is the audience (which could be just you). The purpose of sound
                                        reinforcement is to amplify the ambient qualities of the sound per the
                                        needs of the environment/physical space and distance from the source.
                                        The sound can also be or required to be processed to either enhance/
                                        distort to address problem frequencies or used creatively. The
                                        ultimate goal is to bring the sound the audience. Many musicians
                                        confuse who the music is for when performing allowing ego to get in
                                        the way. If you play music for ego, such as laud or looking/sounding
                                        cool you are doing it for the wrong reasons. Being in the sound
                                        business I have multiple modular systems for sound reinforcement that
                                        allow me to be specific to the needs of the performance/space.
                                        Understandably not everyone does it as a business nor have the
                                        financial resources to have it all. I added pieces along the way
                                        building my flexibility. I would recommend that people make a check
                                        list needs and weight them by priority of requirement verses nice to
                                        have. Sound system design should also consider the elements and needs
                                        in the audio chain (from source to speaker) these include microphone,
                                        cable, preamps/amps, and signal processors, speakers. Although I put
                                        signal processors last they can be introduced into the audio chain at
                                        different points depending on how you want them mixed into the sound
                                        (color all sound or blend into the sound). Each piece should be
                                        tailored to the recreation of the true sound and the audience
                                        listening needs. Along the way budget and convenience may create
                                        compromise points for you. I have listed a best to worst from the true
                                        sound reproduction perspective and added a few Pros/Cons. These are
                                        generalized statements and there are exceptions but there is not
                                        enough space to cover the details here.

                                        Microphones
                                        1. Condenser Microphone - more often referred to as recording
                                        microphones but performance models exist as well.
                                        Pros - increased sensitivity for a "truer sound", many designs that
                                        allow greater matching to the source reproduction
                                        Cons - often larger, expense, more -> very fragile, may not work well
                                        in all spaces (feedback problems), fixed positioning

                                        2. Dynamic Microphone - generally described as performance
                                        Pros - within reasonable budget reach, road worthy, broad range of
                                        source uses
                                        Cons - limited recording use, fixed positioning (mic stand reguired)

                                        * comment about sm57 verses sm58 for the "NAF" there is little
                                        perceptive difference between the two until you get to sub-bass
                                        instruments. This is due to the cut-off frequency of the mic. In the
                                        case of these flutes the sm58 would be a better choice. as it cuts off
                                        at 100 Hz, verses the sm57 with a cut-off of 200 Hz.

                                        3. Lavaliere Microphone
                                        Pros - small size visually and transport, can be clipped on no stand
                                        required, easier to use when used in non-fixed playing positions.
                                        Cons - favors high frequencies at cost to lower frequencies, enhances
                                        artifact sound hole noise and finger taps.

                                        Cables
                                        Very simple get the best you can get - signal loss is related to
                                        capacitance and resistance. For most flute folks they will come up
                                        against harsh signal loss due to cable issues except in the case of
                                        mis-matched impedance on adapters. The biggest thing that will get you
                                        in trouble is using a system that requires adapting XLR (found on mic
                                        cables) and 1/4" (found on instruments). To go from 1/4" to XLR use a
                                        DI box or mixer, to go from XRL to 1/4" ALWAYS use an impedance
                                        transformer between them. DO NOT use a cable that has 1/4" on one end
                                        and XRL on the other the impedance mis-match will steal away 605 of
                                        the sound. If that is your current configuration you will be amazed at
                                        what you get back by using the correct devices. All said use as few
                                        step down adapters as possible (each add grater risk of artifact) and
                                        buy the best cables you can afford. You pay for better/more wire,
                                        quality/strength of the external coating and connectors.

                                        Amp and Speakers
                                        Speakers and Amps are specifically designed by application and space.
                                        This means they are tailored to the source type it is designed to
                                        reproduce and how far the sound is required to travel the effects of
                                        drop off and reflection/absorption. An amp designed for guitars will
                                        NOT best represent the reproduction of other instruments or voice due
                                        to the frequency ranges they enhance. Amps created for keyboards
                                        however have a flatter response over a wider range of frequencies. A
                                        PA system is more like keyboard amp designed to reproduce a flatter
                                        response but more often, unless include the use of sub woofers or 15"
                                        speakers, do not do as well for bass frequencies such as kick drum or
                                        bass guitar or low end of keyboards. As a very general rule the larger
                                        the space the more watts output you will need and more or larger
                                        speakers you will need to get the sound to the back of the room in one
                                        piece. A general rule of sound engineering is that you control the
                                        levels for the "sweet spot" in the audience and understand it will be
                                        a little hot in the front row and a little weak in the nose bleed
                                        section. But most important in evaluating the sound is to ALWAYS judge
                                        it from the audience position that is why you will see most live sound
                                        engineers positioned out front in the "sweet spot" in bigger concerts.
                                        So again design your system for the average room you will generally
                                        play in. If you do hospice work my recommendation is to use no sound
                                        reinforcement in a small room with 6 people the low watt small speaker
                                        "cube" like technology, medium size room the 30-50 watt system with a
                                        6-10 speaker or mix of tweeter and driver/bass, and larger room go
                                        with a PA system with 12-15" speakers (min 10") and enough watts to
                                        drive then 250 watts+.

                                        In following is my personal, but informed, opinion only so take it for
                                        what it is worth. I can not think of any reason I would ever purchase
                                        a Vortex like system except if I had to perform a mobile "troubadour"
                                        like gig (which I would not take anyway) in which case there are few
                                        choices. The best attribute of it is that it is "cool". If you can not
                                        find a technical reference for the system that should be your first
                                        indicator you should look twice. Wearing the system on your person an
                                        judging the sound is not a good reference for its effectiveness. I
                                        watched the sales video on youtube which has a few questionable flaws.
                                        When the player is playing the flute without the system you hear
                                        ambient environmental sounds mixed with the flute sound, when he plays
                                        through the system the ambient sounds disappear which most likely
                                        means he is playing direct out of the unit into a recording device.
                                        Half the time he makes mistakes of reaching for controls on his side
                                        and half the time down on what must be a second unit on a table in
                                        front of him. This is an unrealistic video to chose a system by. The
                                        unit is only 5 1/2" wide so the speak has to be quite small I am sure
                                        if you judge the sound wearing it or transferring it to a tethered
                                        recording device or PA is it fine but how far does it stay "quality"
                                        and audience usable. Think is terms of ipod ear buds they work as
                                        intended in your ear but even held an inch from your ear they loss
                                        signal and frequency response. The effects are cool but quite over
                                        stated and unrealistic in sound even for a canyon. Not being able to
                                        review technical specs is it impossible to determine whether you can
                                        control the mix of dry signal to wet signal other than the strength of
                                        the effect itself to make it more realistic. The system and marketing
                                        is designed for sales to non-musicians (don't be fooled by promotional
                                        videos of pro players doing endorsements for free units.) Look instead
                                        at the number of pros that actually use them in everyday use.
                                        Technically and musically it is a very narrow use product especially
                                        since that can buy you much more in a modular system. Bigger in cool
                                        factor than well thought application for listeners. You have to be the
                                        judge for yourself but be informed and choose wisely by becoming the
                                        audience when you evaluate systems.

                                        Barry WC

                                        More on my website about some specifics regarding live performance
                                        setups if interested here is a direct link to the specific page:
                                        http://www.whitecrowflutes.com/micprimer.htm



                                        _____

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                                        No virus found in this message.
                                        Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
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                                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                      • Barry Higgins
                                        Don t have to many remarks to Donn s post other than I feel that I personally lav mics are not good for any flute except when you have to be moving about and
                                        Message 19 of 25 , Oct 6, 2012
                                          Don't have to many remarks to Donn's post other than I feel that I
                                          personally lav mics are not good for any flute except when you have to
                                          be moving about and then it is a necessary evil. The reason for that
                                          is simple... where does the majority of the sound come out of a flute
                                          verses being generated - answer at the foot and finger holes. So why
                                          mic the sound hole??

                                          Fixing finger tap, especially in a recording is done by positioning
                                          the mic further away and using more gain if necessary. It also helps
                                          in calming down a flutes upper harmonics because high frequency sound
                                          does not travel as far as low frequency sound so positioning source to
                                          mic further away you will tame the shrill nature of a flute. This is
                                          also the reason not to use a lav mic unless really necessary. It
                                          places it too close to the artifact producing elements of the flute
                                          mainly the splitting edge, add finger taps and muted lows. At about
                                          one minute of the attached youtube link you will see R.Carlos Nakai
                                          recording at Canyon records notice the distance to mic is about three
                                          away with the mic face parallel to the sound source majority, being
                                          the middle of the flute over the finger holes. Joe FireCrow showed me
                                          a vid of his being recorded at Makoche and they were at about five
                                          feet and added a second mic for room ambience to be mixed in. Of
                                          course they are using $3000 microphones.
                                          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Rn73zcNn5o

                                          Audio interfaces and recording chains are a whole other topic but
                                          there you get what you pay for. For Skype/PalTalk like interface
                                          noting fancy is really needed because from an audio perspective the
                                          internet technology is not that great to begin with from a quality
                                          standpoint. If you are really serious about getting a quality
                                          recordings (not home grown sound) figure about $500.00 per channel for
                                          convertors/preamp as a starting point for quality equipment otherwise
                                          you will be chasing a NAMMY sounding ghost. You can get into home
                                          recording for a reasonable price you just have to manage your
                                          expectations on quality of playing to quality of sound. I have seen
                                          great players sound like sh#* by using sh#*y equipment and lousy
                                          players that sound worse on great equipment (because it is more
                                          truthful to the source sound). Be objective about your talent and keep
                                          you investments in equipment in line with it.

                                          Barry WC
                                        • Wayne Greenway
                                          Thank you everyone for your responses to my post. Watching the Youtube video was very inspiring. R.C. Nakai was my original NAF inspiration about ten years
                                          Message 20 of 25 , Oct 6, 2012
                                            Thank you everyone for your responses to my post.

                                            Watching the Youtube video was very inspiring.
                                            R.C. Nakai was my original NAF inspiration about ten years ago.

                                            Cheers,
                                            Wayne


                                            On Oct 6, 2012, at 2:26 PM, Barry Higgins wrote:

                                            > Don't have to many remarks to Donn's post other than I feel that I
                                            > personally lav mics are not good for any flute except when you have to
                                            > be moving about and then it is a necessary evil. The reason for that
                                            > is simple... where does the majority of the sound come out of a flute
                                            > verses being generated - answer at the foot and finger holes. So why
                                            > mic the sound hole??
                                            >
                                            > Fixing finger tap, especially in a recording is done by positioning
                                            > the mic further away and using more gain if necessary. It also helps
                                            > in calming down a flutes upper harmonics because high frequency sound
                                            > does not travel as far as low frequency sound so positioning source to
                                            > mic further away you will tame the shrill nature of a flute. This is
                                            > also the reason not to use a lav mic unless really necessary. It
                                            > places it too close to the artifact producing elements of the flute
                                            > mainly the splitting edge, add finger taps and muted lows. At about
                                            > one minute of the attached youtube link you will see R.Carlos Nakai
                                            > recording at Canyon records notice the distance to mic is about three
                                            > away with the mic face parallel to the sound source majority, being
                                            > the middle of the flute over the finger holes. Joe FireCrow showed me
                                            > a vid of his being recorded at Makoche and they were at about five
                                            > feet and added a second mic for room ambience to be mixed in. Of
                                            > course they are using $3000 microphones.
                                            > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Rn73zcNn5o
                                            >
                                            > Audio interfaces and recording chains are a whole other topic but
                                            > there you get what you pay for. For Skype/PalTalk like interface
                                            > noting fancy is really needed because from an audio perspective the
                                            > internet technology is not that great to begin with from a quality
                                            > standpoint. If you are really serious about getting a quality
                                            > recordings (not home grown sound) figure about $500.00 per channel for
                                            > convertors/preamp as a starting point for quality equipment otherwise
                                            > you will be chasing a NAMMY sounding ghost. You can get into home
                                            > recording for a reasonable price you just have to manage your
                                            > expectations on quality of playing to quality of sound. I have seen
                                            > great players sound like sh#* by using sh#*y equipment and lousy
                                            > players that sound worse on great equipment (because it is more
                                            > truthful to the source sound). Be objective about your talent and keep
                                            > you investments in equipment in line with it.
                                            >
                                            > Barry WC
                                            >
                                            >



                                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                          • tezza30
                                            Hi The Vortex G1 is specially made by Zoom, or at least specially modified for Vortex. If you use the standard G1 it does not have the same sounds as the G1
                                            Message 21 of 25 , Oct 6, 2012
                                              Hi
                                              The Vortex G1 is specially made by Zoom, or at least specially modified for Vortex. If you use the standard G1 it does not have the same sounds as the G1 used by Vortex, so Vortex must get it made for them by Zoom. I took it to a Music store where I know one of the owners and he compared it against the G1, totally different, its the first 10 (A0 to A9) that are modified for the flute, when you try the flute with the B channel it sounds awful as they are for the guitar not flute. So don't get a G1 it,s not the same.

                                              Terry


                                              --- In nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com, "co.d_texasranger" <skyusdi@...> wrote:
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              > Hi all
                                              >
                                              > I bought the Vortex Walkabout and had it shipped to the UK, from USA. When I had a proper look at it, I found out that it was made by a company called Zoom and that it was infact a guitar effect pedal, with some of the buttons removed. It would of only cost £40 GBP if I had known and could have bought it over here at a shop down the road. Maybe look around decent music shops where you live, as Zoom is a worldwide company and are not happy about their products being sold under someone elses name.
                                              >
                                              > This is the link to what the Vortex walkabout actually is when you remove the front label off it.
                                              >
                                              > http://www.zoom.co.jp/products/g1n
                                              >
                                              > Apart from the fact that I found this out too late it is still a great piece of kit for flutes and Harmonicas.
                                              >
                                              > Hope this helps, as I am not trying to cause trouble, just explaining that you can by it cheaper than when it is sold as a Vortex.
                                              >
                                              > Take care and best wishes.
                                              > Sky_u_Sdi
                                              >
                                            • Barry Higgins
                                              BTW - if you have to have it and want want to build your own over the shoulder portable system here is a list of components... Olympus lav mic 29.99 1/8
                                              Message 22 of 25 , Oct 6, 2012
                                                BTW - if you have to have it and want want to build your own over the
                                                shoulder portable system here is a list of components...

                                                Olympus lav mic 29.99 1/8" plug
                                                1/8" to 1/4" adapter 2.99 to connect to G1
                                                Zoom G1 effects box 9.99 effect box
                                                Pedal Box cable 12" 4.99 to connect EFX to Amp
                                                Pignose Amp 74.95 classic small practice amp battery/AC, 5" speaker
                                                Velcro 2" X 4" Strips 4.29 Industrial strength 2 pak to attach
                                                effects to top of amp from True Value Hardware
                                                Ernie Ball Generic Strap 7.59 attach to amp to carry Amp has strap
                                                posts already built in
                                                =========
                                                Total Build your own $174.79 You Save $124.21 and have a better
                                                components and full access to functions
                                                batteries not included

                                                Barry WC

                                                On Oct 6, 2012, at 9:56 PM, Wayne Greenway wrote:

                                                > Thank you everyone for your responses to my post.
                                                >
                                                > Watching the Youtube video was very inspiring.
                                                > R.C. Nakai was my original NAF inspiration about ten years ago.
                                                >
                                                > Cheers,
                                                > Wayne
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > On Oct 6, 2012, at 2:26 PM, Barry Higgins wrote:
                                                >
                                                >> Don't have to many remarks to Donn's post other than I feel that I
                                                >> personally lav mics are not good for any flute except when you have
                                                >> to
                                                >> be moving about and then it is a necessary evil. The reason for that
                                                >> is simple... where does the majority of the sound come out of a flute
                                                >> verses being generated - answer at the foot and finger holes. So why
                                                >> mic the sound hole??
                                                >>
                                                >> Fixing finger tap, especially in a recording is done by positioning
                                                >> the mic further away and using more gain if necessary. It also helps
                                                >> in calming down a flutes upper harmonics because high frequency sound
                                                >> does not travel as far as low frequency sound so positioning source
                                                >> to
                                                >> mic further away you will tame the shrill nature of a flute. This is
                                                >> also the reason not to use a lav mic unless really necessary. It
                                                >> places it too close to the artifact producing elements of the flute
                                                >> mainly the splitting edge, add finger taps and muted lows. At about
                                                >> one minute of the attached youtube link you will see R.Carlos Nakai
                                                >> recording at Canyon records notice the distance to mic is about three
                                                >> away with the mic face parallel to the sound source majority, being
                                                >> the middle of the flute over the finger holes. Joe FireCrow showed me
                                                >> a vid of his being recorded at Makoche and they were at about five
                                                >> feet and added a second mic for room ambience to be mixed in. Of
                                                >> course they are using $3000 microphones.
                                                >> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Rn73zcNn5o
                                                >>
                                                >> Audio interfaces and recording chains are a whole other topic but
                                                >> there you get what you pay for. For Skype/PalTalk like interface
                                                >> noting fancy is really needed because from an audio perspective the
                                                >> internet technology is not that great to begin with from a quality
                                                >> standpoint. If you are really serious about getting a quality
                                                >> recordings (not home grown sound) figure about $500.00 per channel
                                                >> for
                                                >> convertors/preamp as a starting point for quality equipment otherwise
                                                >> you will be chasing a NAMMY sounding ghost. You can get into home
                                                >> recording for a reasonable price you just have to manage your
                                                >> expectations on quality of playing to quality of sound. I have seen
                                                >> great players sound like sh#* by using sh#*y equipment and lousy
                                                >> players that sound worse on great equipment (because it is more
                                                >> truthful to the source sound). Be objective about your talent and
                                                >> keep
                                                >> you investments in equipment in line with it.
                                                >>
                                                >> Barry WC
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > ------------------------------------
                                                >
                                                > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >



                                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                              • Barry Higgins
                                                something got lost in the worksheet to email like formatting - ish and the Zoom G1 should have said 49.99 but the total and saving was correct. sorry about
                                                Message 23 of 25 , Oct 6, 2012
                                                  something got lost in the worksheet to email like formatting - ish and
                                                  the
                                                  Zoom G1 should have said 49.99 but the total and saving was correct.

                                                  sorry about that - Barry WC

                                                  On Oct 7, 2012, at 2:07 AM, Barry Higgins wrote:

                                                  > BTW - if you have to have it and want want to build your own over the
                                                  > shoulder portable system here is a list of components...
                                                  >
                                                  > Olympus lav mic 29.99 1/8" plug
                                                  > 1/8" to 1/4" adapter 2.99 to connect to G1
                                                  > Zoom G1 effects box 9.99 effect box
                                                  > Pedal Box cable 12" 4.99 to connect EFX to Amp
                                                  > Pignose Amp 74.95 classic small practice amp battery/AC, 5" speaker
                                                  > Velcro 2" X 4" Strips 4.29 Industrial strength 2 pak to attach
                                                  > effects to top of amp from True Value Hardware
                                                  > Ernie Ball Generic Strap 7.59 attach to amp to carry Amp has strap
                                                  > posts already built in
                                                  > =========
                                                  > Total Build your own $174.79 You Save $124.21 and have a better
                                                  > components and full access to functions
                                                  > batteries not included
                                                  >
                                                  > Barry WC
                                                  >
                                                  > On Oct 6, 2012, at 9:56 PM, Wayne Greenway wrote:
                                                  >
                                                  > > Thank you everyone for your responses to my post.
                                                  > >
                                                  > > Watching the Youtube video was very inspiring.
                                                  > > R.C. Nakai was my original NAF inspiration about ten years ago.
                                                  > >
                                                  > > Cheers,
                                                  > > Wayne
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > > On Oct 6, 2012, at 2:26 PM, Barry Higgins wrote:
                                                  > >
                                                  > >> Don't have to many remarks to Donn's post other than I feel that I
                                                  > >> personally lav mics are not good for any flute except when you have
                                                  > >> to
                                                  > >> be moving about and then it is a necessary evil. The reason for
                                                  > that
                                                  > >> is simple... where does the majority of the sound come out of a
                                                  > flute
                                                  > >> verses being generated - answer at the foot and finger holes. So
                                                  > why
                                                  > >> mic the sound hole??
                                                  > >>
                                                  > >> Fixing finger tap, especially in a recording is done by positioning
                                                  > >> the mic further away and using more gain if necessary. It also
                                                  > helps
                                                  > >> in calming down a flutes upper harmonics because high frequency
                                                  > sound
                                                  > >> does not travel as far as low frequency sound so positioning source
                                                  > >> to
                                                  > >> mic further away you will tame the shrill nature of a flute. This
                                                  > is
                                                  > >> also the reason not to use a lav mic unless really necessary. It
                                                  > >> places it too close to the artifact producing elements of the flute
                                                  > >> mainly the splitting edge, add finger taps and muted lows. At about
                                                  > >> one minute of the attached youtube link you will see R.Carlos Nakai
                                                  > >> recording at Canyon records notice the distance to mic is about
                                                  > three
                                                  > >> away with the mic face parallel to the sound source majority, being
                                                  > >> the middle of the flute over the finger holes. Joe FireCrow
                                                  > showed me
                                                  > >> a vid of his being recorded at Makoche and they were at about five
                                                  > >> feet and added a second mic for room ambience to be mixed in. Of
                                                  > >> course they are using $3000 microphones.
                                                  > >> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Rn73zcNn5o
                                                  > >>
                                                  > >> Audio interfaces and recording chains are a whole other topic but
                                                  > >> there you get what you pay for. For Skype/PalTalk like interface
                                                  > >> noting fancy is really needed because from an audio perspective the
                                                  > >> internet technology is not that great to begin with from a quality
                                                  > >> standpoint. If you are really serious about getting a quality
                                                  > >> recordings (not home grown sound) figure about $500.00 per channel
                                                  > >> for
                                                  > >> convertors/preamp as a starting point for quality equipment
                                                  > otherwise
                                                  > >> you will be chasing a NAMMY sounding ghost. You can get into home
                                                  > >> recording for a reasonable price you just have to manage your
                                                  > >> expectations on quality of playing to quality of sound. I have seen
                                                  > >> great players sound like sh#* by using sh#*y equipment and lousy
                                                  > >> players that sound worse on great equipment (because it is more
                                                  > >> truthful to the source sound). Be objective about your talent and
                                                  > >> keep
                                                  > >> you investments in equipment in line with it.
                                                  > >>
                                                  > >> Barry WC
                                                  > >>
                                                  > >>
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > > ------------------------------------
                                                  > >
                                                  > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  >
                                                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                  >
                                                  >



                                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                • Gene
                                                  I have had a Vortex for well over a year and bought the Dingo to add a bit more volume that I felt I wanted. Vortex is located about an hour and a half from me
                                                  Message 24 of 25 , Oct 9, 2012
                                                    I have had a Vortex for well over a year and bought the Dingo to add a bit more volume that I felt I wanted. Vortex is located about an hour and a half from me and I have talked to Dwayne several time. Including at last years Flute Quest in Seattle. The Vortex works well for a small group in quiet surroundings. And the echo and reverb sound really nice. It is very portable and you can play and move freely around outside with it. With all that, I wanted to pump out more volume, and just completed my quest for something bigger. I like to play in the Eastern Oregon desert rim rock country, on ocean beaches, and mountain lakes. I bought the Carvin S400d battery powered PA system with one speaker and special effects. The first use it got was this September at a high mountain lake, early in the morning, while we were on a wild huckleberry picking expedition. I played out over the water and the mountains across the lake sent the flutes voice back to me. Incredible, I was one happy soul! I have just started adding a drum track with my playing, and am having a lot of fun with that. The Carvin is BIG and heavy but if I felt the need I could get it packed (Well padded) on my quad for a remote concert.
                                                    By the way, this is a Flute Building Group right? …LOL

                                                    Gene
                                                    P.S. I can't say Thanks enough to everyone for all the guidance this group has given me in building flutes.
                                                  • Charles
                                                    Hi, I thought I would mention that Oregon Flute Store has announced a new wearable sound effects unit (made in Oregon). It is on their front page, at
                                                    Message 25 of 25 , Oct 18, 2012
                                                      Hi,
                                                      I thought I would mention that Oregon Flute Store has announced a new wearable sound effects unit (made in Oregon). It is on their front page, at http://oregonflutestore.com
                                                      Charles


                                                      --- In nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com, "tezza30" <dragonflyflutes@...> wrote:
                                                      >
                                                      > Hi
                                                      > The Vortex G1 is specially made by Zoom, or at least specially modified for Vortex. If you use the standard G1 it does not have the same sounds as the G1 used by Vortex, so Vortex must get it made for them by Zoom. I took it to a Music store where I know one of the owners and he compared it against the G1, totally different, its the first 10 (A0 to A9) that are modified for the flute, when you try the flute with the B channel it sounds awful as they are for the guitar not flute. So don't get a G1 it,s not the same.
                                                      >
                                                      > Terry
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                      > --- In nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com, "co.d_texasranger" <skyusdi@> wrote:
                                                      > >
                                                      > >
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                                                      > > Hi all
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                                                      > > I bought the Vortex Walkabout and had it shipped to the UK, from USA. When I had a proper look at it, I found out that it was made by a company called Zoom and that it was infact a guitar effect pedal, with some of the buttons removed. It would of only cost £40 GBP if I had known and could have bought it over here at a shop down the road. Maybe look around decent music shops where you live, as Zoom is a worldwide company and are not happy about their products being sold under someone elses name.
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                                                      > > This is the link to what the Vortex walkabout actually is when you remove the front label off it.
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                                                      > > http://www.zoom.co.jp/products/g1n
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                                                      > > Apart from the fact that I found this out too late it is still a great piece of kit for flutes and Harmonicas.
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                                                      > > Hope this helps, as I am not trying to cause trouble, just explaining that you can by it cheaper than when it is sold as a Vortex.
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                                                      > > Take care and best wishes.
                                                      > > Sky_u_Sdi
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