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Re: [Native Flute Woodworking] Re: Cutting Edge

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  • Anna Key
    Hi Art No problem you are not....Art I have to track down Art Peterson thats all. Regards Steve Art wrote: Hi Steve, Sorry, but no. Art
    Message 1 of 21 , Jun 1, 2007
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      Hi Art

      No problem you are not....Art

      I have to track down Art Peterson thats all.

      Regards

      Steve

      Art <lamedeer75@...> wrote:
      Hi Steve,

      Sorry, but no.

      Art

      --- In nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com, Anna Key
      <annakey18@...> wrote:
      >
      >
      > Hey There ....is that Art Peterson ?
      >
      > Steve
      >
      >
      >
      > --- Art <lamedeer75@...> wrote:
      >
      > >
      > > I use a cutting edge from paper thin to 1/32" thick.
      > >
      > > --- In nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com,
      > > "Terri Cerda"
      > > <tcerda@> wrote:
      > > >
      > > > Just wanted to sound off on something. I have
      > > read many posts about
      > > > the cutting edge of the TSH. Despite making this
      > > edge the thickness of
      > > > a credit card, my flutes have been a bit on the
      > > airy side, especially
      > > > in the lower register. I threw caution to the
      > > wind and now, after
      > > > stabbing my hand 1/2 inch deep with a needle file,
      > > found that if I make
      > > > the cutting edge PAPER THIN, I get an incredible,
      > > clear sound. This
      > > > recent flute has been wonderful. I feel like I
      > > got it finally, after
      > > > playing with many blanks and experimenting to see
      > > what works and does
      > > > not. But this paper thin cutting edge, seems to
      > > be the key to a
      > > > beautiful fundamental note.
      > > >
      > > > Terri
      > > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      >
      >
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    • Bob Grealish
      Hi Terri, That s the kind of discovery it s nice to hear about. I used to worry about a sharp edge causing overblow because the edge itself might vibrate at a
      Message 2 of 21 , Jun 1, 2007
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        Hi Terri,
        That's the kind of discovery it's nice to hear about. I used to worry
        about a sharp edge causing overblow because the edge itself might
        vibrate at a higher pitch, but that's just conjecture. Edward Kort
        also said he makes his edges on the sharper side, and his flutes have
        an excellent clear sound. I have been making my edges half the flue
        thickness, or about 1/64", but I will be trying them thinner on the
        next round of voicing. I think it's even more important to get the
        edge straight and even all the way across if it's thin, and it sounds
        like you got it just right.

        Sorry to hear you stabbed yourself. Take a look at
        www.widgetsupply.com for diamond files (with flat ends.) My favorites
        are item# BCT21, a set of 6 files, 3/8" wide in 3 grits, and item#
        BCY44, 10 smaller files in 3 grits.
        Cheers,
        Bob


        --- In nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com, "Terri Cerda"
        <tcerda@...> wrote:
        >
        > Just wanted to sound off on something. I have read many posts about
        > the cutting edge of the TSH. Despite making this edge the thickness
        of
        > a credit card, my flutes have been a bit on the airy side, especially
        > in the lower register. I threw caution to the wind and now, after
        > stabbing my hand 1/2 inch deep with a needle file, found that if I
        make
        > the cutting edge PAPER THIN, I get an incredible, clear sound. This
        > recent flute has been wonderful. I feel like I got it finally, after
        > playing with many blanks and experimenting to see what works and does
        > not. But this paper thin cutting edge, seems to be the key to a
        > beautiful fundamental note.
        >
        > Terri
        >
      • kent bush
        you can also just snap the sharp ends off with a pair of square nose pliers - started doing that after stabbing self several times in one day ... Bob Grealish
        Message 3 of 21 , Jun 1, 2007
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          you can also just snap the sharp ends off with a pair of square nose pliers - started doing that after stabbing self several times in one day ...

          Bob Grealish <shibuibob@...> wrote: Hi Terri,
          That's the kind of discovery it's nice to hear about. I used to worry
          about a sharp edge causing overblow because the edge itself might
          vibrate at a higher pitch, but that's just conjecture. Edward Kort
          also said he makes his edges on the sharper side, and his flutes have
          an excellent clear sound. I have been making my edges half the flue
          thickness, or about 1/64", but I will be trying them thinner on the
          next round of voicing. I think it's even more important to get the
          edge straight and even all the way across if it's thin, and it sounds
          like you got it just right.

          Sorry to hear you stabbed yourself. Take a look at
          www.widgetsupply.com for diamond files (with flat ends.) My favorites
          are item# BCT21, a set of 6 files, 3/8" wide in 3 grits, and item#
          BCY44, 10 smaller files in 3 grits.
          Cheers,
          Bob

          --- In nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com, "Terri Cerda"
          <tcerda@...> wrote:
          >
          > Just wanted to sound off on something. I have read many posts about
          > the cutting edge of the TSH. Despite making this edge the thickness
          of
          > a credit card, my flutes have been a bit on the airy side, especially
          > in the lower register. I threw caution to the wind and now, after
          > stabbing my hand 1/2 inch deep with a needle file, found that if I
          make
          > the cutting edge PAPER THIN, I get an incredible, clear sound. This
          > recent flute has been wonderful. I feel like I got it finally, after
          > playing with many blanks and experimenting to see what works and does
          > not. But this paper thin cutting edge, seems to be the key to a
          > beautiful fundamental note.
          >
          > Terri
          >






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          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • jkulias
          Hello Bob, Terri and Everyone, I don t post to the site very often but this thread hits home for me. I too have been experimenting with the thickness (or lack
          Message 4 of 21 , Jun 3, 2007
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            Hello Bob, Terri and Everyone,
            I don't post to the site very often but this thread hits home for me.

            I too have been experimenting with the thickness (or lack there of)
            on the cutting edge and its location. I am finding that the location
            of the cutting edge in the airstream seems to be more important than
            the actual thickness of the edge. I have flutes with a clear voice
            and a blunt cutting edge and flutes with a clear voice with a sharp
            edge. The common between these flutes was that the cutting edge was
            in the same position in the airstream. Just my opinion.

            For those attending Zion, please come by my booth and introduce
            yourself so I can put a face to the many people I have come to know
            on this site!

            John Kulias
            www.meadowlarkflutes.com

            --- In nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Grealish"
            <shibuibob@...> wrote:
            >
            > Hi Terri,
            > That's the kind of discovery it's nice to hear about. I used to
            worry
            > about a sharp edge causing overblow because the edge itself might
            > vibrate at a higher pitch, but that's just conjecture. Edward Kort
            > also said he makes his edges on the sharper side, and his flutes
            have
            > an excellent clear sound. I have been making my edges half the
            flue
            > thickness, or about 1/64", but I will be trying them thinner on the
            > next round of voicing. I think it's even more important to get the
            > edge straight and even all the way across if it's thin, and it
            sounds
            > like you got it just right.
            >
            > Sorry to hear you stabbed yourself. Take a look at
            > www.widgetsupply.com for diamond files (with flat ends.) My
            favorites
            > are item# BCT21, a set of 6 files, 3/8" wide in 3 grits, and item#
            > BCY44, 10 smaller files in 3 grits.
            > Cheers,
            > Bob
            >
            >
            > --- In nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com, "Terri Cerda"
            > <tcerda@> wrote:
            > >
            > > Just wanted to sound off on something. I have read many posts
            about
            > > the cutting edge of the TSH. Despite making this edge the
            thickness
            > of
            > > a credit card, my flutes have been a bit on the airy side,
            especially
            > > in the lower register. I threw caution to the wind and now,
            after
            > > stabbing my hand 1/2 inch deep with a needle file, found that if
            I
            > make
            > > the cutting edge PAPER THIN, I get an incredible, clear sound.
            This
            > > recent flute has been wonderful. I feel like I got it finally,
            after
            > > playing with many blanks and experimenting to see what works and
            does
            > > not. But this paper thin cutting edge, seems to be the key to a
            > > beautiful fundamental note.
            > >
            > > Terri
            > >
            >
          • Bob Grealish
            Hi John, Where do you place the cutting edge in the airstream now? What disadvantages did you find with other placements? Do you do the same with wood and
            Message 5 of 21 , Jun 3, 2007
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              Hi John,
              Where do you place the cutting edge in the airstream now? What
              disadvantages did you find with other placements? Do you do the same
              with wood and with clay flutes? Just curious,
              Bob

              --- In nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com, "jkulias" <jkulias@...>
              wrote:
              >
              > Hello Bob, Terri and Everyone,
              > I don't post to the site very often but this thread hits home for me.
              >
              > I too have been experimenting with the thickness (or lack there of)
              > on the cutting edge and its location. I am finding that the location
              > of the cutting edge in the airstream seems to be more important than
              > the actual thickness of the edge.
            • jkulias
              Hi Bob, I usually place the cutting edge a hair lower than the center of the air stream. This seems to let my flutes take a bit more air pressure and cleans up
              Message 6 of 21 , Jun 3, 2007
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                Hi Bob,
                I usually place the cutting edge a hair lower than the center of the
                air stream. This seems to let my flutes take a bit more air pressure
                and cleans up the tone. I am placing the flue in the body of the
                flute most of the time now. The flue in the flute body makes target
                practice with the air stream and the cutting edge a little easier for
                me.

                Although on the flutes that I place the flue in the bird I have found
                that angling the flue down slightly towards the cutting edge gives a
                cleaner tone and also more volume. I like a flute with volume! Not
                like a trumpet but one with the desire to take the accents of a good
                amount of pressure. Ok, well...I guess I like one like a trumpet
                sometimes too!

                I also am starting to find that moving the cutting edge up and down
                in the air stream affects the tuning of the fundamental note. Most of
                the flutes I am currently making are ceramic and they pose some
                different issues when tuning. I don't have some of the same
                flexibility as with my wood flutes. I use the cutting edge position
                to help bring the fundamental in tune. If cutting edge is low in the
                air stream the fundamental will go a bit flat and visa versa. I have
                to do quite a few things to the TSH, ramp and flue to help change the
                fundamental on the ceramic flutes so I can find the best voice for
                each flute.
                The last resort for me is to get out the dremel tile bit and shorten
                the end but I do that when I can't find a happy medium with the other
                variables.

                If I raise the air stream up, the cutting edge wants to be blunter.
                Gotta watch the size of the TSH at this point though! I have made
                some flutes with a very sharp cutting edge and the air stream seems
                to have a very precise place it wants to be positioned. Sometimes its
                very hard to find!

                Do some of these findings match what you have been coming up with?

                I look forward to seeing you and everyone else in Zion! By the way,
                I am bringing some ceramic birds for you to give a whirl. They work
                like a sponge! I will be interested to see how you like the way they
                work in preventing watering out. That's one big benefit to the
                ceramic flutes.

                Be Spirited,
                John Kulias

                www.meadowlarkflutes.com/






                --- In nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Grealish"
                <shibuibob@...> wrote:
                >
                > Hi John,
                > Where do you place the cutting edge in the airstream now? What
                > disadvantages did you find with other placements? Do you do the
                same
                > with wood and with clay flutes? Just curious,
                > Bob
                >
                > --- In nativeflutewoodworking@yahoogroups.com, "jkulias" <jkulias@>
                > wrote:
                > >
                > > Hello Bob, Terri and Everyone,
                > > I don't post to the site very often but this thread hits home for
                me.
                > >
                > > I too have been experimenting with the thickness (or lack there
                of)
                > > on the cutting edge and its location. I am finding that the
                location
                > > of the cutting edge in the airstream seems to be more important
                than
                > > the actual thickness of the edge.
                >
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