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Re: [mythsoc] Suggestions

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  • jamcconney@aol.com
    I think the book I d recommend is _The King Must Die_ by Mary Renault. It s a fast read and has enough adventure and sex to keep your 18 year olds
    Message 1 of 28 , Mar 23, 2003
      I think the book I'd recommend is _The King Must Die_ by Mary Renault. It's a
      fast read and has enough adventure and sex to keep your 18 year olds
      interested--at least I taught it to freshmen and found it worked quite well.
      It also gives you a chance to talk about myth and how it may have had its
      roots in reality, get in a little Greek history and maybe a bit of some of
      the classic dramas

      If you'd like a Wimsey book, my favorite would be _Gaudy Night_ which has an
      intersting pre-World War II background (made poignant because WE know what's
      coming), lots of literary references and a look at British academe. I had
      read it several times before I ran across a wonderful map of Oxford and had
      great fun finding Jowett Walk and the Balliol cricket ground right where they
      ought to be.

      One of my favorites as a fun book is _In Pursuit of the Green Lion_, by
      Judith Merkle Riley, a sequel that I think is better than its original.
      Medieval adventure with a touch of fantasy. _The Red Tent_ by Anita Diamant
      is a fascinating women's-eye view of the Book of Genesis, but I wouldn't
      recommend it unless you're teaching in a women's college--it might not have
      much appeal to male students.


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Lisa Padol
      Anyone on the Adult Committee need any of the books? As the person who nominated _The Fairy Feller s Master Stroke_, I m willing to loan out my copy as needed.
      Message 2 of 28 , Mar 24, 2003
        Anyone on the Adult Committee need any of the books? As the person who
        nominated _The Fairy Feller's Master Stroke_, I'm willing to loan out
        my copy as needed.

        Really liked the Chiang collection. I don't think the Goldstein will
        make my finalists list (though too early to say for sure), but it is a
        good read, and I see why it was nominated.

        -Lisa


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      • dianejoy@earthlink.net
        ... From: Lisa Padol lpadol@yahoo.com Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2003 18:49:33 -0800 (PST) To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com Subject: [mythsoc] This year s list
        Message 3 of 28 , Mar 25, 2003
          Original Message:
          -----------------
          From: Lisa Padol lpadol@...
          Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2003 18:49:33 -0800 (PST)
          To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [mythsoc] This year's list


          << Anyone on the Adult Committee need any of the books? As the person who
          nominated _The Fairy Feller's Master Stroke_, I'm willing to loan out
          my copy as needed. >>

          Might take that offer; I couldn't even find this title on Amazon.com.

          I have Robinson and Sherman / Kushner. I must say that I don't look
          forward to the Robinson. I *loved* NK Hoffman's (thanks to the library)
          and the other Hoffman was interesting, if a bit too philosophical, sticking
          to too many Freudian patterns for belief. NK Hoffman's book is one of my
          five, so far, and I could also see it on the YA list.

          << Really liked the Chiang collection. >>

          One of the good ones; reading the stories in a bunch, they seemed to have
          a certain sameness: scientist working on a particular problem, usually
          alone
          ---but Chiang's got interesting ideas, and writes well. Interesting that
          Chiange twits the Book of Job (which he riffed from) for being too
          *easy*---since Job got family and wealth back at the end (read this in his
          Afterword.


          << I don't think the Goldstein will make my finalists list (though too
          early to say for sure), but it is a good read, and I see why it was
          nominated. >>

          Haven't gotten to that one yet. Could be interesting; I saw another on
          golems, but hadn't had a chance to either read or nominate it. ---djb




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        • alexeik@aol.com
          In a message dated 3/25/3 3:48:15 AM, Lisa Padol wrote:
          Message 4 of 28 , Mar 25, 2003
            In a message dated 3/25/3 3:48:15 AM, Lisa Padol wrote:

            <<As the person who
            nominated _The Fairy Feller's Master Stroke_, I'm willing to loan out
            my copy as needed.>>

            I'd appreciate that loan eventually, as I haven't been able to find the book
            anywhere so far.
            Alexei
          • Lisa Padol
            Okay, I think it makes sense for me to loan Fairy Feller to Alexei first, as he s practically in my backyard, then have it get mailed from person to person as
            Message 5 of 28 , Mar 25, 2003
              Okay, I think it makes sense for me to loan Fairy Feller to Alexei
              first, as he's practically in my backyard, then have it get mailed from
              person to person as needed. It's a special edition thingy, which is why
              it's hard to track down. I managed to get the last softcover the dealer
              at Boskone had. Alexei, what's your schedule for the next week or so?
              Today (Tuesday, the 25th, at 5), I'll be in for at least another hour
              and a half if you're actually in the neighborhood. If this gets too
              tangled, I'll just mail it to you, and it can go the rounds from there.

              -Lisa


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            • alexeik@aol.com
              In a message dated 3/26/3 1:56:26 AM, Lisa Padol wrote:
              Message 6 of 28 , Mar 26, 2003
                In a message dated 3/26/3 1:56:26 AM, Lisa Padol wrote:

                <<I managed to get the last softcover the dealer
                at Boskone had. Alexei, what's your schedule for the next week or so?
                Today (Tuesday, the 25th, at 5), I'll be in for at least another hour
                and a half if you're actually in the neighborhood. >>

                Lisa, I'll be roughly in your part of Queens next Tuesday afternoon (April
                1st). E-mail me privately to make arrangements if the day suits you.
                Alexei
              • dianejoy@earthlink.net
                ... From: Lisa Padol lpadol@yahoo.com Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 14:05:24 -0800 (PST) To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [mythsoc] This year s list Okay, I
                Message 7 of 28 , Mar 26, 2003
                  Original Message:
                  -----------------
                  From: Lisa Padol lpadol@...
                  Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 14:05:24 -0800 (PST)
                  To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: RE: [mythsoc] This year's list


                  Okay, I think it makes sense for me to loan Fairy Feller to Alexei
                  first, as he's practically in my backyard, then have it get mailed from
                  person to person as needed. It's a special edition thingy, which is why
                  it's hard to track down. I managed to get the last softcover the dealer
                  at Boskone had. Alexei, what's your schedule for the next week or so?
                  Today (Tuesday, the 25th, at 5), I'll be in for at least another hour
                  and a half if you're actually in the neighborhood. If this gets too
                  tangled, I'll just mail it to you, and it can go the rounds from there.

                  -Lisa

                  Perfectly understandable. It's an unusual title; hope it's an unusually
                  good book. Maybe the MFA will help a bit, should it win. At least get in
                  a few libraries. Don't know how these things affect printings, or if MFA
                  helps a larger publisher to put it out again. I've seen (at least on a few
                  books) the appelation "Winner of the Mythopoeic Fantasy Award," so some
                  publishers do pay attention to the roar of the lion.! ---djb


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                • Paul F. Labaki
                  I found _The Fairy Feller s Master Stroke_ at PS Publishing LLP in Harrogate, England. Theirweb address is http://www.pspublishing.co.uk/cat/tffms.htm Find
                  Message 8 of 28 , Mar 26, 2003
                    I found _The Fairy Feller's Master Stroke_ at PS Publishing LLP in
                    Harrogate, England. Theirweb address is
                    http://www.pspublishing.co.uk/cat/tffms.htm Find it by running a search in
                    their catalog. Paperback is fourteen pounds if I remember correctly. I
                    ordered it the night of March 4 and it hasn't arrived. I live in Buffalo,
                    NY and if I may put in a plug for my local library, all the other books on
                    this year's list are available there.

                    Peace,
                    Paul Labaki

                    From: Lisa Padol <lpadol@...>
                    Reply-To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                    Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 14:05:24 -0800 (PST)
                    To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: RE: [mythsoc] This year's list


                    Okay, I think it makes sense for me to loan Fairy Feller to Alexei
                    first, as he's practically in my backyard, then have it get mailed from
                    person to person as needed. It's a special edition thingy, which is why
                    it's hard to track down. I managed to get the last softcover the dealer
                    at Boskone had. Alexei, what's your schedule for the next week or so?
                    Today (Tuesday, the 25th, at 5), I'll be in for at least another hour
                    and a half if you're actually in the neighborhood. If this gets too
                    tangled, I'll just mail it to you, and it can go the rounds from there.

                    -Lisa


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                  • Lisa Padol
                    ... So I made out like a bandit -- I think I got it for $15 USA. -Lisa __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum -
                    Message 9 of 28 , Mar 27, 2003
                      > their catalog. Paperback is fourteen pounds if I remember correctly.

                      So I made out like a bandit -- I think I got it for $15 USA.

                      -Lisa


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                    • Lisa Padol
                      I started The Mount. Not mythopoeic, IMO, and not something I am in the mood for, but well written, and I can see why people like it. That s a case where it s
                      Message 10 of 28 , Apr 21 6:07 AM
                        I started The Mount. Not mythopoeic, IMO, and not something I am in the
                        mood for, but well written, and I can see why people like it. That's a
                        case where it's just me.

                        I read Summer Country, and it annoys the heck out of me. I'm not quite
                        sure why. I took a break a while back and read The Tithe, which I did
                        like very much. I like a lot of De Lint, despite his flaws as an
                        author. I am not necessarily picky -- I very much liked the Fionavar
                        books, and I may be one of the few people here who enjoyed reading
                        Sword of Shannara. (I was in high school at the time, but I don't
                        consider that an excuse. I'd already read LotR several times.) So, I'm
                        not sure why Summer Country sticks in my craw, and I don't think it's
                        only my taste.

                        -Lisa


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                      • dianejoy@earthlink.net
                        ... From: Lisa Padol lpadol@yahoo.com Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 06:07:19 -0700 (PDT) To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [mythsoc] This year s list Lisa: I
                        Message 11 of 28 , Apr 21 7:34 AM
                          Original Message:
                          -----------------
                          From: Lisa Padol lpadol@...
                          Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 06:07:19 -0700 (PDT)
                          To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: Re: [mythsoc] This year's list

                          Lisa:

                          I started The Mount. Not mythopoeic, IMO, and not something I am in the
                          mood for, but well written, and I can see why people like it. That's a
                          case where it's just me.

                          Diane:

                          I also *liked* *The Mount* but you're right; not mythopoeic. Just because
                          something takes place on an alien world does not make it so.

                          I read Summer Country, and it annoys the heck out of me. I'm not quite
                          sure why. I took a break a while back and read The Tithe, which I did
                          like very much. I like a lot of De Lint, despite his flaws as an
                          author.

                          DeLint seems to strike the same themes over and over, at least for me. I
                          liked his crow girls, and especially when he gets out of Newford, he's
                          better. *Onion Girl* was good---partly because something bad actually
                          happened to Jilly, who's kind of an Artistic Paragon for all those in
                          Newford. Though for me, *Memory and Dream* is his best book.

                          There's a lot of good fantasy which did not make it to the list this year;
                          I could have nominated a number of them, but didn't see them before the
                          deadline. Now I'm seeing good stuff all over; isn't that always the way?

                          Lisa:

                          I am not necessarily picky -- I very much liked the Fionavar
                          books, and I may be one of the few people here who enjoyed reading
                          Sword of Shannara. (I was in high school at the time, but I don't
                          consider that an excuse. I'd already read LotR several times.) So, I'm
                          not sure why Summer Country sticks in my craw, and I don't think it's
                          only my taste.

                          Usually, when I can't quite identify why I don't like a book, it comes down
                          to a difference in writing style---use of language and word choices for
                          descriptions (overblown, or not enough?). Did you think the characters
                          were too easy / overdone? Too much cliched Celtic mythology? Did the
                          characters have too easy a time?

                          I rather liked the hunter character; very creepy, and Fionna was also
                          creepy in unexpected ways; villains were more interesting than the main
                          characters, but Hetley should have gone more into the difficulties of the
                          relationship between the two sisters, and played that out in the context of
                          the Summer Country; why Fionna didn't, I have no clue. But this *is* a
                          first novel, so I'll give him some slack. ---djb




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                        • Stolzi@aol.com
                          In a message dated 4/21/2003 8:14:01 AM Central Daylight Time, ... I didn t like the heavy layers of (sexually-tinged) torture in the middle part, which is
                          Message 12 of 28 , Apr 21 10:02 AM
                            In a message dated 4/21/2003 8:14:01 AM Central Daylight Time,
                            lpadol@... writes:


                            > I read Summer Country, and it annoys the heck out of me. I'm not quite
                            > sure why.

                            I didn't like the heavy layers of (sexually-tinged) torture in the middle
                            part, which is where I am. Nor do I think the book is "deep" enough to be
                            truly mythopoeic.

                            He's a competent writer, though, and had an interesting idea. We may hope
                            for more good stuff from him.

                            Diamond Proudbrook


                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Paul F. Labaki
                            I don t think it s just you, Lisa. This struck me similarly. About 80 pages in I started asking myself why I was reading this. I don t know if it might
                            Message 13 of 28 , Apr 21 4:44 PM
                              I don't think it's just you, Lisa. This struck me similarly. About 80
                              pages in I started asking myself why I was reading this. I don't know if it
                              might color opinions before reading, but with The Mount, I wanted a brief
                              paragraph from whomever nominated it giving some reason why. Would it be
                              reasonable to request this for next year's nominees, or at least to suggest
                              that a nominator might include such on a voluntary basis?

                              Peace,
                              Paul Labaki

                              From: Lisa Padol <lpadol@...>
                              Reply-To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                              Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 06:07:19 -0700 (PDT)
                              To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                              Subject: Re: [mythsoc] This year's list


                              I started The Mount. Not mythopoeic, IMO, and not something I am in the
                              mood for, but well written, and I can see why people like it. That's a
                              case where it's just me.








                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            • Matthew Winslow
                              ... I felt that the book seemed a bit too juvenile with its attitude toward sex. Maureen s problem is she was raped by her sister s boyfriend and carries
                              Message 14 of 28 , Apr 22 6:55 AM
                                dianejoy@... [dianejoy@...] wrote:
                                > I read Summer Country, and it annoys the heck out of me. I'm not quite
                                > sure why.

                                I felt that the book seemed a bit too juvenile with its attitude toward sex.
                                Maureen's problem is she was raped by her sister's boyfriend and carries
                                around all that baggage. What's the answer? Kill your current tormenter and
                                then force your current 'boyfriend' to have sex with you.

                                Not only that, but the whole economy of the Summer Country seems to be
                                centered around sex. Sort of like an adolescent's dream come true.

                                This one is definitely /not/ going on my short list.

                                > There's a lot of good fantasy which did not make it to the list this year;
                                > I could have nominated a number of them, but didn't see them before the
                                > deadline. Now I'm seeing good stuff all over; isn't that always the way?

                                Heh. Yes. The only hope is that these good books are in hardcover and you can
                                nominate them when they come out in trade or paperback. Of course, if they
                                never do....

                                --
                                Matthew Winslow mwinslow@... http://x-real.firinn.org/
                                "Some of us are beginning our lives, some are in the middle, and some are
                                at the end. (I have a proof of this statement, but it will not fit in the
                                margins.)"
                                --Steve Martin
                                Currently reading: The Worm Ouroboros by E.R. Eddison
                              • Lisa Padol
                                ... I didn t care for Onion Girl. Struck me as by the numbers about a character who d never been consistent enough for me to care what happened to her in this
                                Message 15 of 28 , Apr 22 2:30 PM
                                  > DeLint seems to strike the same themes over and over, at least for
                                  > me. I
                                  > liked his crow girls, and especially when he gets out of Newford,
                                  > he's
                                  > better. *Onion Girl* was good---partly because something bad actually
                                  > happened to Jilly, who's kind of an Artistic Paragon for all those in
                                  > Newford. Though for me, *Memory and Dream* is his best book.

                                  I didn't care for Onion Girl. Struck me as by the numbers about a
                                  character who'd never been consistent enough for me to care what
                                  happened to her in this book, and I did not like that Geordie had to be
                                  destined for her. I liked Memory and Dream, but, for some reason, the
                                  happy ending feels like a cheat. Now, I don't know why -- the rabbit de
                                  Lint pulls out of the hat with the other painter is set up quite nicely
                                  in advance, so by the numbers, he's not cheating. But the rhetoric of
                                  the story seemed to demand tragedy, and did not get it.

                                  I liked Trader, but was aware of a few flaws. I really liked Somewhere
                                  to be Flying.

                                  > There's a lot of good fantasy which did not make it to the list this
                                  > year;
                                  > I could have nominated a number of them, but didn't see them before
                                  > the
                                  > deadline. Now I'm seeing good stuff all over; isn't that always the
                                  > way?

                                  Yes -- it's why I tried to touch base with other folks and why I asked
                                  David Hartwell what was good. Alas, he found some stuff for me -after-
                                  deadline. Not sure if it's good stuff, as I've not read it,
                                  prioritizing what is actually on the list.

                                  > Usually, when I can't quite identify why I don't like a book, it
                                  > comes down
                                  > to a difference in writing style---use of language and word choices
                                  > for
                                  > descriptions (overblown, or not enough?). Did you think the
                                  > characters
                                  > were too easy / overdone? Too much cliched Celtic mythology? Did
                                  > the
                                  > characters have too easy a time?

                                  The language is likely a large part of it. Oh, there were a few
                                  glitches in Tithe -- Black's characters "smirk" too much. But I felt no
                                  desire to blip over passages, whereas in Summer Country, I felt no
                                  desire to actually do more than skim a bunch of passages.

                                  Not too easy per se -- too empty, too carbon copy.

                                  > I rather liked the hunter character; very creepy, and Fionna was
                                  > also
                                  > creepy in unexpected ways; villains were more interesting than the
                                  > main
                                  > characters,

                                  Mm, yes. Problem is, the alien creepiness is where it's -at-, what is
                                  interesting. What the author focused on was the sexual titilation. Now,
                                  I don't exactly object to that per se, but if you're telling a story,
                                  that can't be the whole point. Tithe certainly has it, but, while the
                                  teenagers think a lot about sex, and the faeries aren't celibate, there
                                  is more going on than someone working out a hideous childhood
                                  experience.

                                  Or maybe it's that what works for a bildungsroman is out of place in a
                                  novel supposedly about adults? I dunno -- but it's not the first time
                                  the Young Adult novel is more mature than the For Grownups novel.

                                  but Hetley should have gone more into the difficulties of
                                  > the
                                  > relationship between the two sisters, and played that out in the
                                  > context of
                                  > the Summer Country; why Fionna didn't, I have no clue. But this

                                  Mm, maybe so. Tithe works because it is grounded in something
                                  resembling the world we consider real. One of the more powerful parts
                                  of Summer Country is the confrontation between the two sisters, in the
                                  real world. Yah, sure, they've got swirly magic currents flowing
                                  between them, but that's irrelevant. It's the human tension that makes
                                  the scene interesting.

                                  -Lisa


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                                • Lisa Padol
                                  ... It isn t. The parts I find intriguing are the bits about odd takes on blending DNA and the genetic sciences with old powers. But that seems to be just an
                                  Message 16 of 28 , Apr 22 2:33 PM
                                    > > I read Summer Country, and it annoys the heck out of me. I'm not
                                    > quite
                                    > > sure why.
                                    >
                                    > I didn't like the heavy layers of (sexually-tinged) torture in the
                                    > middle
                                    > part, which is where I am. Nor do I think the book is "deep" enough
                                    > to be
                                    > truly mythopoeic.

                                    It isn't. The parts I find intriguing are the bits about odd takes on
                                    blending DNA and the genetic sciences with old powers. But that seems
                                    to be just an excuse for a so-so story.

                                    > He's a competent writer, though, and had an interesting idea. We may
                                    > hope
                                    > for more good stuff from him.

                                    Can't say I minded reading the book, but I am glad I took it out from
                                    the library rather than buying it. Tithe I expect to buy; the better
                                    adult titles (the Chiang, fr'ex) are already on my shelf.

                                    -Lisa


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                                  • Lisa Padol
                                    ... Mm, got mixed feelings about that. I ve wondered myself, but some books I ve nominated on an I m not sure -- let s see what the committee thinks basis.
                                    Message 17 of 28 , Apr 22 2:36 PM
                                      > pages in I started asking myself why I was reading this. I don't
                                      > know if it
                                      > might color opinions before reading, but with The Mount, I wanted a
                                      > brief
                                      > paragraph from whomever nominated it giving some reason why. Would
                                      > it be
                                      > reasonable to request this for next year's nominees, or at least to
                                      > suggest
                                      > that a nominator might include such on a voluntary basis?

                                      Mm, got mixed feelings about that. I've wondered myself, but some books
                                      I've nominated on an "I'm not sure -- let's see what the committee
                                      thinks" basis. Josh nominated one on the "let's not ignore genre
                                      fantasy" one year. I was convinced he was wrong to do this. Others were
                                      equally convinced he was right, and that it was a mythopoeic book. And
                                      I still don't think Djinn should have won for its year or even made the
                                      short list, so it isn't as if we have a hard consensus, or even a soft
                                      one.

                                      -Lisa

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                                    • Lisa Padol
                                      ... Well, number one certainly seemed to make sense. But I see what you mean. ... Economy? It had an economy? ... Or if they re British imports that will come
                                      Message 18 of 28 , Apr 22 2:38 PM
                                        > I felt that the book seemed a bit too juvenile with its attitude
                                        > toward sex.
                                        > Maureen's problem is she was raped by her sister's boyfriend and
                                        > carries
                                        > around all that baggage. What's the answer? Kill your current
                                        > tormenter and
                                        > then force your current 'boyfriend' to have sex with you.

                                        Well, number one certainly seemed to make sense. But I see what you
                                        mean.

                                        > Not only that, but the whole economy of the Summer Country seems to
                                        > be
                                        > centered around sex. Sort of like an adolescent's dream come true.

                                        Economy? It had an economy?
                                        > Heh. Yes. The only hope is that these good books are in hardcover and
                                        > you can
                                        > nominate them when they come out in trade or paperback. Of course, if
                                        > they
                                        > never do....

                                        Or if they're British imports that will come over in USAn editions in a
                                        year or two...

                                        So, which books?

                                        -Lisa


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                                      • dianejoy@earthlink.net
                                        I ll have to find *Tithe.* Is that also by Hetley, or by someone else (though I could look it up on Amazon.com)? I take it the title refers to the one out of
                                        Message 19 of 28 , Apr 23 8:34 AM
                                          I'll have to find *Tithe.* Is that also by Hetley, or by someone else
                                          (though I could look it up on Amazon.com)? I take it the title refers to
                                          the one out of ten marked for hell in the world of faerie (one could do a
                                          lot with that motif). ---djb

                                          Original Message:
                                          -----------------
                                          From: Lisa Padol lpadol@...
                                          Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 14:33:53 -0700 (PDT)
                                          To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, drcpunk@...
                                          Subject: Re: [mythsoc] This year's list


                                          > > I read Summer Country, and it annoys the heck out of me. I'm not
                                          > quite
                                          > > sure why.
                                          >
                                          > I didn't like the heavy layers of (sexually-tinged) torture in the
                                          > middle
                                          > part, which is where I am. Nor do I think the book is "deep" enough
                                          > to be
                                          > truly mythopoeic.

                                          It isn't. The parts I find intriguing are the bits about odd takes on
                                          blending DNA and the genetic sciences with old powers. But that seems
                                          to be just an excuse for a so-so story.

                                          > He's a competent writer, though, and had an interesting idea. We may
                                          > hope
                                          > for more good stuff from him.

                                          Can't say I minded reading the book, but I am glad I took it out from
                                          the library rather than buying it. Tithe I expect to buy; the better
                                          adult titles (the Chiang, fr'ex) are already on my shelf.

                                          -Lisa


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                                        • dianejoy@earthlink.net
                                          ... From: Lisa Padol lpadol@yahoo.com Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 14:36:19 -0700 (PDT) To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [mythsoc] This year s list ... Lisa
                                          Message 20 of 28 , Apr 23 8:48 AM
                                            Original Message:
                                            -----------------
                                            From: Lisa Padol lpadol@...
                                            Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 14:36:19 -0700 (PDT)
                                            To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                                            Subject: Re: [mythsoc] This year's list


                                            > pages in I started asking myself why I was reading this. I don't
                                            > know if it
                                            > might color opinions before reading, but with The Mount, I wanted a
                                            > brief
                                            > paragraph from whomever nominated it giving some reason why. Would
                                            > it be
                                            > reasonable to request this for next year's nominees, or at least to
                                            > suggest
                                            > that a nominator might include such on a voluntary basis?

                                            Lisa wrote:

                                            Mm, got mixed feelings about that. I've wondered myself, but some books
                                            I've nominated on an "I'm not sure -- let's see what the committee
                                            thinks" basis. Josh nominated one on the "let's not ignore genre
                                            fantasy" one year. I was convinced he was wrong to do this. Others were
                                            equally convinced he was right, and that it was a mythopoeic book. And
                                            I still don't think Djinn should have won for its year or even made the
                                            short list, so it isn't as if we have a hard consensus, or even a soft
                                            one.

                                            Diane:

                                            Most of the time, when I nominate a book, I get a gut feeling that it's
                                            Really Good. It's often hard to explain. By the time it comes 'round to
                                            nominating, I pretty much know what's good about it and can explain, but
                                            for others, that may not prove sufficient (or right). Writing a paragraph
                                            would require people to think about it, but I think most have done that in
                                            advance anyway; even those who say "Let's just see what happens" think
                                            their selection is worth notice. I'd hate to have a rationale "vetted"
                                            before the book can go in the hopper. I'm sure that's not Paul's
                                            intention, but it *could* turn that way. It could make nominating a longer
                                            and more dificult process. Let's keep things as they are. ---djb



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                                          • Joshua Kronengold
                                            ... Someone else. Holly Black, TITHE: A MODERN FAERIE TALE (Simon & Schuster hc, October 2002) There it is. ... It refers to the tradition of faerie
                                            Message 21 of 28 , Apr 23 9:04 AM
                                              dianejoy@... writes:
                                              >I'll have to find *Tithe.* Is that also by Hetley, or by someone
                                              >else

                                              Someone else.

                                              Holly Black, TITHE: A MODERN FAERIE TALE (Simon & Schuster hc, October 2002)

                                              There it is.

                                              >(though I could look it up on Amazon.com)? I take it the title refers to
                                              >the one out of ten marked for hell in the world of faerie (one could do a
                                              >lot with that motif). ---djb

                                              It refers to the tradition of "faerie sacrifice"; anything more would
                                              spoil the book a bit. :)


                                              --
                                              Joshua Kronengold (mneme@...) "I've been teaching |\ _,,,--,,_ ,)
                                              --^--him...to live, to breathe, to walk, to sample the /,`.-'`' -, ;-;;'
                                              /\\joy on each road, and the sorrow at each turning. |,4- ) )-,_ ) /\
                                              /-\\\I'm sorry if I kept him out too late"--Vlad Taltos '---''(_/--' (_/-'
                                            • Lisa Padol
                                              Currently, Josh, Alexei, and I have read my copy of _The Fairy Feller s Master Stroke and it is en route to Diane. Who needs it next? I don t mind if it
                                              Message 22 of 28 , Apr 29 5:28 AM
                                                Currently, Josh, Alexei, and I have read my copy of _The Fairy Feller's
                                                Master Stroke" and it is en route to Diane. Who needs it next? I don't
                                                mind if it doesn't win or make the short list, but that should be
                                                because people don't think it should, not because they haven't been
                                                able to get a copy.

                                                As we're getting down to voting time, what are the books that folks
                                                think are serious contenders?

                                                -Lisa


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                                              • Paul F. Labaki
                                                I would love to have a crack at it for a day or two. If possible, my mailing address is below. It appears I am not going to receive the copy I ordered before
                                                Message 23 of 28 , May 3, 2003
                                                  I would love to have a crack at it for a day or two. If possible, my
                                                  mailing address is below. It appears I am not going to receive the copy I
                                                  ordered before the deadline, (paypal goof) but should be able to get it for
                                                  circulation if it survives the cut to the short list.

                                                  I want to put in a good word for _The Fall of the Kings_. It seems to me
                                                  that this is the kind of work the Aslan was intended to honor and celebrate.
                                                  I don't mean to knock anyone else's efforts, but Kushner and Sherman are far
                                                  out in front of all the others in my opinion.

                                                  RE: Lisa's remarks about merit v. availability... I agree merit should rule
                                                  the day in evaluating the finished work, but availability means something
                                                  too. The work is of limited value (i.e., can it really be "best" in any
                                                  sense) if readers cannot access it. If I can't read it, it won't affect my
                                                  way of thinking or my life in any way, thus it might just as well not be.

                                                  Paul Labaki
                                                  91 Westland Parkway
                                                  Buffalo, NY 14225-3035
                                                  Thanks to all.

                                                  Peace,
                                                  Paul Labaki

                                                  From: Lisa Padol <lpadol@...>
                                                  Reply-To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                                                  Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 05:28:37 -0700 (PDT)
                                                  To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                                                  Subject: [mythsoc] Fairy Feller


                                                  Currently, Josh, Alexei, and I have read my copy of _The Fairy Feller's
                                                  Master Stroke" and it is en route to Diane. Who needs it next? I don't
                                                  mind if it doesn't win or make the short list, but that should be
                                                  because people don't think it should, not because they haven't been
                                                  able to get a copy.

                                                  As we're getting down to voting time, what are the books that folks
                                                  think are serious contenders?

                                                  -Lisa


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                                                • Stolzi@aol.com
                                                  Who is this fairy feller, anyway? Ducking and running, Diamond Proudbrook
                                                  Message 24 of 28 , May 3, 2003
                                                    Who is this fairy feller, anyway?

                                                    Ducking and running,


                                                    Diamond Proudbrook
                                                  • dianejoy@earthlink.net
                                                    Paul Labaki:
                                                    Message 25 of 28 , May 5, 2003
                                                      Paul Labaki:

                                                      << I want to put in a good word for _The Fall of the Kings_. It seems to me
                                                      that this is the kind of work the Aslan was intended to honor and celebrate.
                                                      I don't mean to knock anyone else's efforts, but Kushner and Sherman are far
                                                      out in front of all the others in my opinion. >>

                                                      I thought I'd be bright and start reading *Swordspoint* before I read *Fall
                                                      of the Kings.* (Now, I'm running out of time!) I liked *Swordspoint* so
                                                      much that I'm willing to put *Fall* on my list of five *sight unseen.*

                                                      << RE: Lisa's remarks about merit v. availability... I agree merit should
                                                      rule the day in evaluating the finished work, but availability means
                                                      something too. The work is of limited value (i.e., can it really be "best"
                                                      in any sense) if readers cannot access it. If I can't read it, it won't
                                                      affect my way of thinking or my life in any way, thus it might just as well
                                                      not be. >>

                                                      My feeling is that if a work is *that* good, it should be made widely
                                                      available---eventually. It always irks me when film critics nominate a
                                                      film for an Oscar that is available only in San Francisco or LA when the
                                                      Oscars come out. But it would also be a shame if something like *Fairy
                                                      Feller* doesn't get considered just because it's small press. There's no
                                                      way to solve that---except post the thing online, which would vastly cut
                                                      the author's income source. What to do? I've no clue! ---djb
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                                                    • WendellWag@aol.com
                                                      In a message dated 5/5/2003 10:42:33 AM Eastern Daylight Time, ... Trivial nitpick: I believe the rule for the Oscars is that the film must play one week at a
                                                      Message 26 of 28 , May 5, 2003
                                                        In a message dated 5/5/2003 10:42:33 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
                                                        dianejoy@... writes:


                                                        > always irks me when film critics nominate a
                                                        > film for an Oscar that is available only in San Francisco or LA when the
                                                        > Oscars come out.

                                                        Trivial nitpick: I believe the rule for the Oscars is that the film must play
                                                        one week at a movie theater in New York and one week at a movie theater in
                                                        Los Angeles during the year for which it's nominated in order to be
                                                        considered for an Oscar. Usually even in that minimal case that means that
                                                        it will be opening in Cincinnati in late January, well before the Oscar
                                                        ceremony in March. The only real problem is the foreign film category.
                                                        That's a problem even in big cities that have a couple of theaters that do
                                                        foreign films. By the time of the Oscars, it's hard to remember if the
                                                        nominated films played in one of those theaters for a week or not.

                                                        Wendell Wagner


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                                                      • dianejoy@earthlink.net
                                                        I sent Lisa s copy your way yesterday. Do let me know when you get it. Thanks. ---djb ... From: Paul F. Labaki sheik@buffnet.net Date: Tue, 06 May 2003
                                                        Message 27 of 28 , May 6, 2003
                                                          I sent Lisa's copy your way yesterday. Do let me know when you get it.
                                                          Thanks. ---djb

                                                          Original Message:
                                                          -----------------
                                                          From: Paul F. Labaki sheik@...
                                                          Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 20:33:04 -0400
                                                          To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                                                          Subject: [mythsoc] Fairy Feller


                                                          For those who are interested, _The Fairy Feller's Master Stroke_ is now
                                                          available through Amazon.uk . It wasn't in early March. Paperback is 8
                                                          pounds plus shipping. 4 - 6 weeks between ordering and shipping.

                                                          Peace,
                                                          Paul Labaki




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                                                        • Paul F. Labaki
                                                          I m sorry I haven t been able to get back to email before today, Diane. It arrived on Thursday, May 8. thank you very much. I hope I can send it out to
                                                          Message 28 of 28 , May 11, 2003
                                                            I'm sorry I haven't been able to get back to email before today, Diane. It
                                                            arrived on Thursday, May 8. thank you very much. I hope I can send it out
                                                            to someone else today.
                                                            Peace,
                                                            Paul Labaki

                                                            From: "dianejoy@..." <dianejoy@...>
                                                            Reply-To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                                                            Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 01:29:33 -0400
                                                            To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                                                            Subject: RE: [mythsoc] Fairy Feller


                                                            I sent Lisa's copy your way yesterday. Do let me know when you get it.
                                                            Thanks. ---djb

                                                            Original Message:
                                                            -----------------
                                                            From: Paul F. Labaki sheik@...
                                                            Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 20:33:04 -0400
                                                            To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                                                            Subject: [mythsoc] Fairy Feller


                                                            For those who are interested, _The Fairy Feller's Master Stroke_ is now
                                                            available through Amazon.uk . It wasn't in early March. Paperback is 8
                                                            pounds plus shipping. 4 - 6 weeks between ordering and shipping.

                                                            Peace,
                                                            Paul Labaki




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