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What is "Mythopoeic"

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  • d.bratman@xxxxx.xxx
    Life is a collaborative art. That s a good line - though it is possible to exaggerate, of course, as Wendell s closing joke shows. Tolkien wrote that the
    Message 1 of 5 , Aug 19, 1999
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      "Life is a collaborative art." That's a good line - though it is
      possible to exaggerate, of course, as Wendell's closing joke shows.

      Tolkien wrote that the debt (interesting how economic metaphors are
      usually used in discussing influence) that he owed to Lewis was not
      influence in the normal sense, but sheer encouragement. Indeed, it's
      quite possible that Tolkien would have completed neither _The Hobbit_
      nor _The Lord of the Rings_ without Lewis's encouragement; and since he
      never published any other fiction longer than _Farmer Giles of Ham_, we
      can see how much _we_ owe to Lewis in this matter.

      Critics writing of "influence" usually mean "[perceived] similarity".
      It is often not realized that there can be similarity without influence.
      And there can also be influence without similarity. Possibly the only
      textual change in LOTR attributed in the drafts to the advice of a
      specific person was the result of a comment from Williams, who read the
      ms. with care - but that hardly makes it more like a Williams novel than
      it would otherwise have been. (See _Treason of Isengard_, p. 419)

      This point - that influence is more than similarity - is Diana Glyer's
      thesis. She's expounded on it in several Mythcon papers, including one
      on Tolkien that was published in the TCC, and one on Joy Davidman given
      at the '97 Mythcon that may well be sitting in the Mythlore backlog.

      It was also the subject of her Ph.D. dissertation, which she is currently
      engaged on translating into English from dissertationese. I've got a
      copy of the current draft sitting right here ...

      David Bratman
      - not responsible for the following advertisement -
    • Matthew Winslow
      ... Would that be Joy Davidman Lewis: Author, Editor and Collaborator published in the most recent (if I may use the term recent ) issue of Mythlore? (Ted!
      Message 2 of 5 , Aug 19, 1999
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        David Bratman [d.bratman@...] wrote:
        > This point - that influence is more than similarity - is Diana Glyer's
        > thesis. She's expounded on it in several Mythcon papers, including one
        > on Tolkien that was published in the TCC, and one on Joy Davidman given
        > at the '97 Mythcon that may well be sitting in the Mythlore backlog.

        Would that be 'Joy Davidman Lewis: Author, Editor and Collaborator' published
        in the most recent (if I may use the term 'recent') issue of Mythlore?

        (Ted! You can't take the reigns too soon!)

        --
        Matthew Winslow mwinslow@... http://x-real.firinn.org/
        "Be careful. You know what he's like after a few novels."
        --M. Python
        Currently reading: Heir of Sea and Fire by Patricia McKillip
      • Staci Dumoski
        While I find this discussion of the Inklings interesting, it really is getting away from my original question? How do we define mythopoeic , and can we say
        Message 3 of 5 , Aug 19, 1999
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          While I find this discussion of the Inklings interesting, it really is
          getting away from my original question?

          How do we define "mythopoeic", and can we say that there are people
          writing mythopoeic fiction today?

          Staci Ann Dumoski Phantastes
          Editor and Publisher "The Fantasy Writer's Guide"
          editor@... http://www.phantastes.com
        • Steve Schaper
          ... My two cents is that a mythopoeic work would have to involve the meaning-elements that compose mythology. To deal with them in some way. Babylon 5 is
          Message 4 of 5 , Aug 19, 1999
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            At 9:11 AM -0700 8/19/99, Staci Dumoski wrote:
            >
            >How do we define "mythopoeic", and can we say that there are people
            >writing mythopoeic fiction today?

            My two cents is that a mythopoeic work would have to involve the
            meaning-elements that compose mythology. To deal with them in some
            way. Babylon 5 is mythopoeic, Star Trek is not. The Silmarillion is
            mythopoeic, The Hobbit is not.

            --Steve
            ======================================
            It's 1999, where's Moonbase Alpha?
            ======================================
          • d.bratman@xxxxx.xxx
            Steve Schaper: Could you please elaborate on how you feel that _The Hobbit_ is not mythopoeic and does not deal with mythological elements in some way? David
            Message 5 of 5 , Aug 22, 1999
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              Steve Schaper:

              Could you please elaborate on how you feel that _The Hobbit_ is not
              mythopoeic and does not deal with mythological elements in some way?

              David Bratman
              - not responsible for the following advertisement -
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