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Re: LOTR, a whine for Matt

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  • WendellWag@xxx.xxx
    In a message dated 7/26/99 6:04:36 PM Eastern Daylight Time, ... Actually, it makes sense to film in New Zealand. I remember back in the mid- 70 s, before the
    Message 1 of 12 , Jul 26, 1999
      In a message dated 7/26/99 6:04:36 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
      sschaper@... writes:

      > New Zealand? It has to be filmed in England! At least until they reach
      > Rivendell!

      Actually, it makes sense to film in New Zealand. I remember back in the
      mid-'70's, before the Bakshi film of _The Lord of the Rings_ came out,
      discussions among Tolkien fans where it was proposed that a live film should
      be filmed in New Zealand. If it were to be filmed in Europe or North
      America, nearly any place that it could be filmed would be familiar territory
      to many people. As they watched the film, they would be thinking, "That's
      not Middle Earth. That's where I went on vacation last year." That sort of
      thing would be much less common if the film were to be shot in New Zealand.

      Furthermore, England is especially bad. Remember, England is crowded. While
      you can still film a Western in the U.S. because there are still enough
      remote places that can pass as nineteenth century locations, you can't make a
      movie supposedly set in medieval England if you film it in England (unless
      you're confined to small sets). Did you see the film _Dragonheart_ a couple
      of years ago? (A bad movie overall, but nice settings.) It did look like
      medieval England, but only because it was filmed in Slovakia.

      Wendell Wagner
    • WendellWag@xxx.xxx
      In a message dated 7/26/99 6:04:36 PM Eastern Daylight Time, ... No, nor anyone from the (British) Tolkien Society, which would be an even more obvious choice.
      Message 2 of 12 , Jul 26, 1999
        In a message dated 7/26/99 6:04:36 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
        sschaper@... writes:

        > I don't suppose anyone from Mythsoc is advising on this project?

        No, nor anyone from the (British) Tolkien Society, which would be an even
        more obvious choice. Apparently Peter Jackson has talked with Christopher
        Tolkien.

        Wendell Wagner
      • Steve Schaper
        ... I was just thinking about how many areas were roughly modeled on areas on England, esp., if I remember correctly, the West Midlands. There are certain
        Message 3 of 12 , Jul 26, 1999
          At 8:43 PM -0400 7/26/99, WendellWag@... wrote:
          >
          >
          >Actually, it makes sense to film in New Zealand. I remember back in the
          >mid-'70's,


          I was just thinking about how many areas were roughly modeled on
          areas on England, esp., if I remember correctly, the West Midlands.
          There are certain types of hills or 'down's that they have in
          England. I'm not sure they have them anywhere else.

          -Steve
          ======================================
          It's 1999, where's Moonbase Alpha?
          ======================================
        • Berni Phillips
          I realize Joan already gave him the practical answer, but I just couldn t resist this. After all, I am the Bratwife. ... Of course it ought not to be! But
          Message 4 of 12 , Jul 26, 1999
            I realize Joan already gave him the practical answer, but I just
            couldn't resist this. After all, I am the Bratwife.

            > From: Steve Schaper <sschaper@...>

            > BTW, I have only received one copy of Mythlore since re-upping last
            > fall. Ought that to be?

            Of course it ought not to be! But that's the way it's been under Glen.

            Looking forward to a new editor,
            Berni
            -- I didn't ask for an ad after my name. --
          • David Lenander
            Responding to the message of ... [. . . .] ... Well, I wouldn t have put it quite the way that Berni did, and I will
            Message 5 of 12 , Jul 26, 1999
              Responding to the message of <v04210103b3c28ba7aeb4@[24.2.204.60]>
              from mythsoc@onelist.com:
              >
              > From: Steve Schaper <sschaper@...>
              [. . . .]
              > BTW, I have only received one copy of Mythlore since re-upping last
              > fall. Ought that to be?
              >
              > --Steve

              Well, I wouldn't have put it quite the way that Berni did, and I will observe
              that Glen managed 4 issues per year for some years, however, the next issue has
              been "95%-complete" since last November. I don't think we're going to see it at
              Mythcon. The Council is expected to proceed with an issue maybe this fall,
              under the new editor, Ted Sherman. IF he is elected in the fall election, we
              expect to see a return to regular Mythlores within a year or so. I would guess
              that we'll see at least a couple of issues next year, and possibly as many as
              4--unless it remains a tri-quarterly, in which case, 3 would be the maximum.
              Unless Glen's final issue comes out somewhere during that year....

              In the meantime, please note that Mythprint comes out every month, usually in
              advance of the cover month, like clockwork, ever since Ellie Farrell took
              over--hm, was it 3 years ago, now?

              David Lenander
              293 Selby Ave. work: (612)626-3375
              St. Paul, MN 55102-1811 home: (651)292-8887
              fax: (612)626-2454
              e-mail: d-lena@...

              Bree Moot 4/Mythcon XXX web-page:
              http://www.tc.umn.edu/nlhome/m391/d-lena/BreeMoot.html
            • WendellWag@xxx.xxx
              In a message dated 7/26/99 8:53:34 PM Eastern Daylight Time, ... O.K., there s several problems here. West Midlands is a county in England, and it consists
              Message 6 of 12 , Jul 26, 1999
                In a message dated 7/26/99 8:53:34 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
                sschaper@... writes:

                > I was just thinking about how many areas were roughly modeled on
                > areas on England, esp., if I remember correctly, the West Midlands.
                > There are certain types of hills or 'down's that they have in England.
                > I'm not sure they have them anywhere else.

                O.K., there's several problems here. "West Midlands" is a county in England,
                and it consists of Birmingham and its suburbs. There's nothing wrong with
                Birmingham (after all, it's where Tolkien lived from age 4 to age 18), but
                there's little there that looks like Middle Earth. The term "downs" is
                usually applied not so much to the Midlands as to Southeast England. It
                means treeless, undulating chalk uplands of the sort used for pasture. I
                don't know if there is anything comparable to it in New Zealand. Is anyone
                here an expert on New Zealand geography?

                There's some very pretty patchwork-quilt sorts of landscape (like some of
                Tolkien's own illustrations of his books) in the Midlands of England. You'd
                have to point your camera carefully to avoid any signs of modernity, but in a
                sense it looks like Middle Earth, I guess.

                Wendell Wagner
              • THEODORE SHERMAN
                ... West Midlands is also a dialect area of Middle English--one of JRRT s many areas of expertise--that is comprised of the western half of the Midlands
                Message 7 of 12 , Jul 27, 1999
                  WendellWag@... wrote:
                  >
                  > From: WendellWag@...
                  >
                  >
                  > O.K., there's several problems here. "West Midlands" is a county in England,
                  > and it consists of Birmingham and its suburbs. There's nothing wrong with
                  > Birmingham (after all, it's where Tolkien lived from age 4 to age 18), but
                  > there's little there that looks like Middle Earth. The term "downs" is
                  > usually applied not so much to the Midlands as to Southeast England.


                  West Midlands is also a dialect area of Middle English--one of JRRT's
                  many areas of expertise--that is comprised of the western half of the
                  Midlands (middle) area of England. I can be more precise if you like. I
                  think the previous writer, to whom Wendell was responding, was using
                  West Midlands more of as a geographical area rather than a specific
                  county.

                  Yours,

                  Ted Sherman
                • Wayne G. Hammond
                  ... I ve heard of various fans offering their services to the project, but I don t know of any who have been hired for it. As for Christopher, as far as I ve
                  Message 8 of 12 , Jul 27, 1999
                    At 08:52 PM 7/26/99 -0400, WendellWag@... wrote:

                    >> I don't suppose anyone from Mythsoc is advising on this project?
                    >
                    >No, nor anyone from the (British) Tolkien Society, which would be an even
                    >more obvious choice. Apparently Peter Jackson has talked with Christopher
                    >Tolkien.

                    I've heard of various fans offering their services to the project, but I
                    don't know of any who have been hired for it. As for Christopher, as far as
                    I've heard, he has not talked with the producers and is staying as far from
                    the production as he possibly can.

                    Wayne Hammond
                  • WendellWag@aol.com
                    ... It would seem that if one were to make a movie about place X, the obvious place to film it is in X. But that s not always the case. For instance, if one
                    Message 9 of 12 , Jul 29, 1999
                      I just wanted to further defend my saying:

                      > Actually, it makes sense to film in New Zealand.

                      It would seem that if one were to make a movie about place X, the obvious
                      place to film it is in X. But that's not always the case. For instance, if
                      one wants to make a film about turn-of-the-century New York, with streets
                      crowded with immigrants and pushcarts, the best place to film it is not New
                      York, but (I'm told) Montreal, which has some streets that look like
                      turn-of-the-century New York.

                      If it's true that Tolkien based some scenes from _The Lord of the Rings_ on
                      places near where he grew up in Birmingham, it's also true that there's no
                      longer anything there that looks Middle-Earthish to my eyes. Birmingham
                      looks to me very much like a modern city. If I were to compare it to any
                      American city, it would be Baltimore. It's not that there's any particular
                      building or anything in the skyline of the two cities that looks particularly
                      alike, but they are of approximately the same size and both grew up in the
                      nineteenth century and were greatly built upon in the twentieth century.
                      They both seem to me to be generic bland big cities.

                      If we are to look further at the counties that constitute the western half of
                      the Midlands area, there are little pieces that would be acceptable terrain
                      for the Shire, assuming you do a little pruning of modern signs and such. I
                      think, though, that you would have a lot of trouble finding enough open space
                      even for scenes in the Shire.

                      On the other hand, I've been told that there are many different types of
                      scenery in New Zealand, and most of it hasn't been turned into a cliche by
                      overfilming (the way, say, that Monument Valley has been turned into a cliche
                      by Westerns). Peter Jackson has to film almost 9 hours of film set in a
                      large variety of kinds of scenery. Perhaps he has decided that wandering
                      around the world finding precisely the correct look for each scene would be
                      too expensive. Perhaps he is correct in thinking that he can find the
                      correct look just in New Zealand.

                      Wendell Wagner
                    • WendellWag@xxx.xxx
                      In reply to my writing ... don t ... Oops, I guess I shouldn t have believed the gossip I read about the making of the film. Wendell Wagner
                      Message 10 of 12 , Jul 29, 1999
                        In reply to my writing

                        > Apparently Peter Jackson has talked with Christopher Tolkien.

                        Wayne Hammond wrote:

                        > I've heard of various fans offering their services to the project, but I
                        don't
                        > know of any who have been hired for it. As for Christopher, as far as I've
                        > heard, he has not talked with the producers and is staying as far from
                        > the production as he possibly can.

                        Oops, I guess I shouldn't have believed the gossip I read about the making of
                        the film.

                        Wendell Wagner
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