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RE: [mythsoc] Digest Number 563

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  • David S. Bratman
    ... At least one of his books has been translated into Spanish, but I don t think it s one of these. English (to date), nothing. David Bratman
    Message 1 of 18 , Apr 17, 2001
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      At 02:10 PM 4/17/2001 , Julia Palffy wrote:

      >I'm delurking, because this message reminded me : a couple of years ago, I
      >discovered the books of a German author called Ralf Isau. He has written a
      >trilogy that has many similarities with Lewis's Narnia books, but his story
      >is based on a Jewish tradition/perspective, rather than a Christian one. I
      >don't know if these books have been translated into English

      At least one of his books has been translated into Spanish, but I don't
      think it's one of these. English (to date), nothing.

      David Bratman
    • Steve Dufour
      I think lots of people would be very excited if these books were translated to English. Steve Dufour ... one of these.
      Message 2 of 18 , Apr 17, 2001
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        I think lots of people would be very excited if these
        books were translated to English. Steve Dufour ---
        "David S. Bratman" <dbratman@...> wrote: > At
        02:10 PM 4/17/2001 , Julia Palffy wrote: > > >I'm
        delurking, because this message reminded me : a >
        couple of years ago, I > >discovered the books of a
        German author called Ralf > Isau. He has written a >
        >trilogy that has many similarities with Lewis's >
        Narnia books, but his story > >is based on a Jewish
        tradition/perspective, rather > than a Christian one.
        I > >don't know if these books have been translated
        into > English > > At least one of his books has been
        translated into > Spanish, but I don't > think it's
        one of these.

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      • Lisa Deutsch Harrigan
        Hey, this sounds like a job of one of our German speaking linguists. If the books are decent, could they be printed by the Mythopoeic Press? Or if they are
        Message 3 of 18 , Apr 17, 2001
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          Hey, this sounds like a job of one of our German speaking
          linguists. If the books are decent, could they be printed by the
          Mythopoeic Press? Or if they are current, may be Isau is looking
          for a larger publisher?

          Inquiring Jews want to know.

          Mythically yours

          Lisa

          "David S. Bratman" wrote:

          > At 02:10 PM 4/17/2001 , Julia Palffy wrote:
          >
          > >I'm delurking, because this message reminded me : a couple of
          > years ago, I
          > >discovered the books of a German author called Ralf Isau. He
          > has written a
          > >trilogy that has many similarities with Lewis's Narnia books,
          > but his story
          > >is based on a Jewish tradition/perspective, rather than a
          > Christian one. I
          > >don't know if these books have been translated into English
          >
          > At least one of his books has been translated into Spanish, but
          > I don't
          > think it's one of these. English (to date), nothing.
          >
          > David Bratman
          >
        • alexeik@aol.com
          In a message dated 4/17/1 9:18:12 PM, Julia Palffy wrote:
          Message 4 of 18 , Apr 20, 2001
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            In a message dated 4/17/1 9:18:12 PM, Julia Palffy wrote:

            <<Since then I have wondered whether
            there are any other fantasy novels based on a religious conception of the
            world, taking place in an imaginary world, and related to other world
            religions than Christianity. >>

            Well, one of my favourite writers is Makhali-Phal, a Cambodian writer who
            wrote in French (primarily during the '40's), fantasies from a religious
            Buddhist point of view. Her main works in this vein are the novel _Narayana
            ou celui qui se meut sur les eaux_ and the story collection _Le Festin des
            vautours_. She has a very idiosyncratic style in French, extremely lush and
            full of sensuous imagery, and a very numinous, mythopoeic impact. At least
            this is how she affected me when I first read her in my teens -- around the
            same time I was discovering the Inklings, and she felt very much like the
            same kind of author to me.
            Alexei
          • Bill
            Hmm..jumps out of the lurker shadows for a sec.. The issue of Publisher s Weekly that arrived in my store this week had an article on SF, Fantasy , and
            Message 5 of 18 , Apr 21, 2001
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              Hmm..jumps out of the lurker shadows for a sec..
              The issue of Publisher's Weekly that arrived in my store this week had an article
              on SF, Fantasy , and Religion, which is online if you are curious at

              http://www.publishersweekly.com/index_articles/20010416_95214.asp

              Jumps back into the lurk mode...<g>
            • ted sherman
              Thanks, Bill, for the link--very informative. Ted Dr. Theodore J. Sherman, Editor Mythlore: A Journal of J. R. R. Tolkien, C. S. Lewis, Charles Williams, and
              Message 6 of 18 , Apr 21, 2001
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                Thanks, Bill, for the link--very informative.

                Ted

                Dr. Theodore J. Sherman, Editor
                Mythlore: A Journal of J. R. R. Tolkien, C. S. Lewis, Charles Williams, and
                Mythopoeic Literature
                Associate Professor of English
                Box X041, Middle Tennessee State University
                Murfreesboro, TN 37132
                615 898-5836 Office
                615 898-5098 FAX
                tsherman@... Office
                tedsherman@... Home

                ----- Original Message -----
                From: Bill <lunacy@...>
                To: <mythsoc@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2001 2:32 AM
                Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Digest Number 563


                > Hmm..jumps out of the lurker shadows for a sec..
                > The issue of Publisher's Weekly that arrived in my store this week had an
                article
                > on SF, Fantasy , and Religion, which is online if you are curious at
                >
                > http://www.publishersweekly.com/index_articles/20010416_95214.asp
                >
                > Jumps back into the lurk mode...<g>
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > The Mythopoeic Society website http://www.mythsoc.org
                >
                > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                >
                >
                >
              • Stolzi@aol.com
                In a message dated 4/17/01 4:18:24 PM Central Daylight Time, ... While there s not exactly an imaginary world involved, (there is a strange Island, however)
                Message 7 of 18 , Apr 21, 2001
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                  In a message dated 4/17/01 4:18:24 PM Central Daylight Time,
                  jupalffy@... writes:

                  > Since then I have wondered whether
                  > there are any other fantasy novels based on a religious conception of the
                  > world, taking place in an imaginary world, and related to other world
                  > religions than Christianity.

                  While there's not exactly an "imaginary world" involved, (there is a strange
                  Island, however) the novel MISTRESS OF SPICES by Chitra Banerjee Divakaruni
                  builds heavily on Hinduism.

                  Mary S
                • Margaret Dean
                  ... CREATURES OF LIGHT AND DARKNESS. --Margaret Dean
                  Message 8 of 18 , Apr 21, 2001
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                    Bill wrote:
                    >
                    > I can't recall if anyone has mentioned Zelazny as yet. LORD OF
                    > LIGHT comes to mind immediately. ISLE OF THE DEAD as well, and
                    > I can't recall the title of a third that makes use of the Egyptian
                    > mythos.

                    CREATURES OF LIGHT AND DARKNESS.


                    --Margaret Dean
                    <margdean@...>
                  • Bill
                    I can t recall if anyone has mentioned Zelazny as yet. LORD OF LIGHT comes to mind immediately. ISLE OF THE DEAD as well, and I can t recall the title of a
                    Message 9 of 18 , Apr 21, 2001
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                      I can't recall if anyone has mentioned Zelazny as yet. LORD OF LIGHT comes to mind
                      immediately. ISLE OF THE DEAD as well, and I can't recall the title of a third that
                      makes use of the Egyptian mythos.
                      By coincidence, I just finished a re-read of GOD STALK
                      by Hodgell, which concerns no rl religions but whose heroine
                      is involved with several confrontations in a city with a thousand
                      or so gods. (just ordered her third book, so I went back to
                      read the first two again).

                      Stolzi@... wrote:

                      > In a message dated 4/17/01 4:18:24 PM Central Daylight Time,
                      > jupalffy@... writes:
                      >
                      > > Since then I have wondered whether
                      > > there are any other fantasy novels based on a religious conception of the
                      > > world, taking place in an imaginary world, and related to other world
                      > > religions than Christianity.
                    • alexeik@aol.com
                      In a message dated 4/21/1 2:45:27 PM, Mary wrote:
                      Message 10 of 18 , Apr 21, 2001
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                        In a message dated 4/21/1 2:45:27 PM, Mary wrote:

                        <<While there's not exactly an "imaginary world" involved, (there is a
                        strange
                        Island, however) the novel MISTRESS OF SPICES by Chitra Banerjee Divakaruni
                        builds heavily on Hinduism.
                        >>

                        Perhaps I don't remember it that well, but there didn't seem to be all that
                        much Hinduism in it, as opposed to Indian culture _per se_ (which, of course,
                        is going to be Hindu-flavoured to some extent). There were a lot of Muslim
                        and Sikh characters in it as well, so it seemed to me that the Hindu element
                        was deliberately played down in favour of the ambient folk culture
                        (represented by the spices and their magical properties) which all the
                        religious groups of India can identify with.
                        Alexei
                      • Bill
                        Yessssss! Thanks!
                        Message 11 of 18 , Apr 21, 2001
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                          Yessssss! Thanks!
                          <grin>
                          Margaret Dean wrote:

                          > Bill wrote:
                          > >
                          > > I can't recall if anyone has mentioned Zelazny as yet. LORD OF
                          > > LIGHT comes to mind immediately. ISLE OF THE DEAD as well, and
                          > > I can't recall the title of a third that makes use of the Egyptian
                          > > mythos.
                          >
                          > CREATURES OF LIGHT AND DARKNESS.
                          >
                          > --Margaret Dean
                          > <margdean@...>
                          >
                          >
                          > The Mythopoeic Society website http://www.mythsoc.org
                          >
                          > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                        • alexeik@aol.com
                          In a message dated 4/21/1 4:16:03 PM, you wrote:
                          Message 12 of 18 , Apr 21, 2001
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                            In a message dated 4/21/1 4:16:03 PM, you wrote:

                            <<I can't recall if anyone has mentioned Zelazny as yet. LORD OF LIGHT comes
                            to mind
                            immediately. ISLE OF THE DEAD as well, and I can't recall the title of a
                            third that
                            makes use of the Egyptian mythos.
                            By coincidence, I just finished a re-read of GOD STALK
                            by Hodgell, which concerns no rl religions but whose heroine
                            is involved with several confrontations in a city with a thousand
                            or so gods. (just ordered her third book, so I went back to
                            read the first two again).
                            >>

                            In Zelazny's case, though, the author isn't writing from a religious point of
                            view, simply using a historical religion as a fantasy prop. The characters in
                            _Lord of Light_ play the roles of Hindu gods (and the Buddha), but there's
                            nothing about the story that's expressive of a Hindu or Buddhist sensibility.
                            And, of course, fantasy writers frequently invent religions for their fantasy
                            worlds -- which doesn't mean that they have faith in those religions in the
                            primary world. I think the original query referred to writers who were
                            applying their own faith-experience (in a religion other than Christianity)
                            in a literary fantasy context.
                            Alexei
                          • Stolzi@aol.com
                            In a message dated 4/21/01 12:23:53 PM Central Daylight Time, alexeik@aol.com ... element ... I stand corrected - Alexei is right! Mary S
                            Message 13 of 18 , Apr 21, 2001
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                              In a message dated 4/21/01 12:23:53 PM Central Daylight Time, alexeik@...
                              writes:

                              > There were a lot of Muslim
                              > and Sikh characters in it as well, so it seemed to me that the Hindu
                              element
                              >
                              > was deliberately played down in favour of the ambient folk culture
                              > (represented by the spices and their magical properties) which all the
                              > religious groups of India can identify with.

                              I stand corrected - Alexei is right!

                              Mary S
                            • Steve Dufour
                              I don t have a copy of The Worm Oruborus and I can t find it in any of our local libraries. (I also might not be spelling Oruborus right.) But there are
                              Message 14 of 18 , Apr 23, 2001
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                                I don't have a copy of "The Worm Oruborus" and I can't
                                find it in any of our local libraries. (I also might
                                not be spelling "Oruborus" right.) But there are two
                                poems in it, one starts "You curious chanters of the
                                woods" the other "Not he who can love only the fair."
                                If someone could post the text of these and also the
                                original authors I would be grateful. Thanks. Steve
                                Dufour


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                              • Trudy Shaw
                                I have this book in paperback somewhere in my apartment. People who ve asked to borrow things from me know this is akin to saying, There s a piece of lint
                                Message 15 of 18 , Apr 23, 2001
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                                  I have this book in paperback somewhere in my apartment. People who've asked to borrow things from me know this is akin to saying, "There's a piece of lint somewhere in this ragbag." I've just taken a quick look in the most likely places and haven't found it yet.

                                  But--I'll keep your message in my inbox, and will keep looking. I have a meeting coming up this weekend for which I've got lots of preparation to do. If no one posts the poems by the time that meeting's over I'll do an all-out search. It'll give me a good incentive to actually try to get my books organized.

                                  If anyone else has the poems, though, _by all means_ pass them on--the fact that I'm going to look is no guarantee I'll find the book (and certainly no guarantee that I'll find it _soon_).

                                  -- Trudy Shaw

                                  ----- Original Message -----
                                  From: Steve Dufour
                                  To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                                  Sent: Monday, April 23, 2001 2:13 PM
                                  Subject: [mythsoc] poems from "The Worm Oruborus"


                                  I don't have a copy of "The Worm Oruborus" and I can't
                                  find it in any of our local libraries. (I also might
                                  not be spelling "Oruborus" right.) But there are two
                                  poems in it, one starts "You curious chanters of the
                                  woods" the other "Not he who can love only the fair."
                                  If someone could post the text of these and also the
                                  original authors I would be grateful. Thanks. Steve
                                  Dufour


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                                • Bill
                                  Hmm..don t have my copy handy and at 3am I don t think my neighbors would appreciate a typical rendering of my search every nook and cranny of the place
                                  Message 16 of 18 , Apr 24, 2001
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                                    Hmm..don't have my copy handy and at 3am I don't think my
                                    neighbors would appreciate a typical rendering of my search
                                    every nook and cranny of the place routine...but...,
                                    this may one of the two you are looking for...
                                    (Gawd I love Google)

                                    Sir Henry Wotton

                                    21. On his Mistris, the Queen of Bohemia


                                    YOU meaner Beauties of the Night,

                                    That poorly satisfie our Eies

                                    More by your number, then your light,

                                    You Common-people of the Skies;

                                    What are you when the Sun shall rise?


                                    You Curious Chanters of the Wood,

                                    That warble forth Dame Natures layes,

                                    Thinking your Voyces understood

                                    By your weake accents; what's your praise

                                    When Philomell her voyce shal raise?


                                    You Violets, that first apeare,

                                    By your pure purpel mantels knowne,

                                    Like the proud Virgins of the yeare,

                                    As if the Spring were all your own;

                                    What are you when the Rose is blowne?


                                    So, when my Mistris shal be seene

                                    In Form and Beauty of her mind,

                                    By Vertue first, then Choyce a Queen,

                                    Tell me, if she were not design'd

                                    Th' Eclypse and Glory of her kind?





                                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  • Steve Dufour
                                    Thank you so much, Bill. That s great. Steve ... __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at
                                    Message 17 of 18 , Apr 24, 2001
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                                      Thank you so much, Bill. That's great. Steve ---
                                      Bill <lunacy@...> wrote: > Hmm..don't have my
                                      copy handy and at 3am I > don't think my >
                                      neighbors would appreciate a typical rendering > of my
                                      search > every nook and cranny of the place >
                                      routine...but..., > this may one of the two you
                                      are looking for... > (Gawd I love Google) > >
                                      Sir > Henry
                                      Wotton > > 21. On his Mistris,
                                      the Queen > of Bohemia > > >
                                      YOU meaner Beauties of > the Night, > >
                                      That poorly satisfie our > Eies > >
                                      More by your number, then >
                                      your light, > > You
                                      Common-people of the > Skies; > >
                                      What are you when the > Sun shall rise? > >
                                      > You Curious Chanters
                                      of > the Wood, > > That
                                      warble forth Dame > Natures layes, > >
                                      Thinking your Voyces > understood > >
                                      By your weake accents; > what's
                                      your praise > > When
                                      Philomell her > voyce shal raise? > > >
                                      You Violets, that first > apeare, > >
                                      By your pure purpel > mantels
                                      knowne, > > Like the proud
                                      Virgins of > the yeare, > >
                                      As if the Spring were all > your own; > >
                                      What are you when the > Rose is
                                      blowne? > > > So, when my
                                      Mistris shal > be seene > >
                                      In Form and Beauty of her > mind, > >
                                      By Vertue first, then > Choyce a Queen, >
                                      > Tell me, if she were
                                      not > design'd > > Th'
                                      Eclypse and Glory > of her kind? > > > > > >
                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been >
                                      removed] > >

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