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A fan considers the issues ..

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  • John Rateliff
    Thanks for the link, Joseph. Only had time to skim it so far, but interesting piece. My own position is simpler: CT has the right to make the call over what
    Message 2 of 6 , Jan 7, 2013
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      Thanks for the link, Joseph. Only had time to skim it so far, but interesting piece. My own position is simpler: CT has the right to make the call over what does and doesn't get published and over what does and doesn't get filmed beyond LotR and H, the rights to which were sold before his time by JRRT himself. I'm willing to trust his judgment. 
         More to the point, I've been mulling over possible SILMARILLION films recently and come to the conclusion that the stories in the first age aren't likely to lend themselves to filming the way LotR and H have. Too compressed, too rarified, too gloomy. I'd much rather see an animated version of FARMER GILES or film shorts of LBN or SWM than an epic-length TURIN.
         --John R.





    • Tony Zbaraschuk
      ... I think you could probably do Beren or Turin as single films in themselves, though I don t know if the tragedy of Turin could be done well on film. Tony Z
      Message 3 of 6 , Jan 7, 2013
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        On Mon, Jan 07, 2013 at 11:40:28AM -0800, John Rateliff wrote:
        > Thanks for the link, Joseph. Only had time to skim it so far, but interesting piece. My own position is simpler: CT has the right to make the call over what does and doesn't get published and over what does and doesn't get filmed beyond LotR and H, the rights to which were sold before his time by JRRT himself. I'm willing to trust his judgment.
        > More to the point, I've been mulling over possible SILMARILLION films recently and come to the conclusion that the stories in the first age aren't likely to lend themselves to filming the way LotR and H have. Too compressed, too rarified, too gloomy. I'd much rather see an animated version of FARMER GILES or film shorts of LBN or SWM than an epic-length TURIN.

        I think you could probably do Beren or Turin as single films in themselves,
        though I don't know if the tragedy of Turin could be done well on film.


        Tony Z

        --
        A picture is worth a thousand words.
        A map is worth a thousand pictures.
      • Mike Foster
        Worth reading, this article asserts the sovereign virtues of the books. There’s no way of knowing how many new readers will come to THE HOBBIT for the first
        Message 4 of 6 , Jan 7, 2013
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          Worth reading, this article asserts the sovereign virtues of the books.  There’s no way of knowing how many new readers will come to THE HOBBIT for the first time or how many will go back for a re-reading, as Far Westfarthing smial did, because of the Jackson films. 
           
          A Pixar film of GILES might be entertaining but it seems unlikely that such will ever be made.
           
          The tales in SILMARILLION are too dark, doom-laden, and depressing. 
           
          Mike
           
           
           
          Sent: Monday, January 07, 2013 1:40 PM
          Subject: Re: [mythsoc] A fan considers the issues ..
           
           

          Thanks for the link, Joseph. Only had time to skim it so far, but interesting piece. My own position is simpler: CT has the right to make the call over what does and doesn't get published and over what does and doesn't get filmed beyond LotR and H, the rights to which were sold before his time by JRRT himself. I'm willing to trust his judgment.
             More to the point, I've been mulling over possible SILMARILLION films recently and come to the conclusion that the stories in the first age aren't likely to lend themselves to filming the way LotR and H have. Too compressed, too rarified, too gloomy. I'd much rather see an animated version of FARMER GILES or film shorts of LBN or SWM than an epic-length TURIN.
             --John R.
           
           
           
           

        • scribbler@scribblerworks.us
          ... I ve thought about it from time to time and of the stories in the SILMARILLION, definitely the tale of Luthien and Beren and the quest for the Silmaril
          Message 5 of 6 , Jan 7, 2013
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            > More to the point, I've been mulling over possible SILMARILLION films
            > recently and come to the conclusion that the stories in the first age
            > aren't likely to lend themselves to filming the way LotR and H have.
            > Too compressed, too rarified, too gloomy. I'd much rather see an
            > animated version of FARMER GILES or film shorts of LBN or SWM than an
            > epic-length TURIN.
            > --John R.

            I've thought about it from time to time and of the stories in the
            SILMARILLION, definitely the tale of Luthien and Beren and the quest for
            the Silmaril would be a wonderful film: romance! action! adventure! strong
            heroine!

            After that: the Fall of Gondolin; the Quest of Elwing and Earendil
            (although shaping that story would be a challenge). Turin would make a
            fascinating, though tragic, mini-series. Feanor would make an interesting
            dramatic subject, but again, probably more mini-series than single film.

            But... that's mostly pipe-dreaming.
          • Westermeyer GS11 Paul W
            ... I love the photo of JRRT and CRRT that comes with the article. I often identify with Tolkien, as a fellow academic and an intellectual, raised Catholic,
            Message 6 of 6 , Jan 8, 2013
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              > Posted by: "John Rateliff" sacnoth@... sacnoth32
              > Date: Mon Jan 7, 2013 11:40 am ((PST))
              >
              > Thanks for the link, Joseph. Only had time to skim it so far, but interesting piece. My own position is simpler: CT has the right to make
              > the call over what does and doesn't get published and over what does and doesn't get filmed beyond LotR and H, the rights to which
              > were sold before his time by JRRT himself. I'm willing to trust his judgment.

              I love the photo of JRRT and CRRT that comes with the article. I often identify with Tolkien, as a fellow academic and an intellectual, raised Catholic, who struggles to provide for his family while also trying to write. And his relationship with his children, especially CRRT, as it comes through in his letters and in the Father Christmas letters, reminds me of mine with my own son (more and more, actually, as this year he has started joining me at the local game store for Friday night Flames of War games).

              Of course, I'm not a genius, so we aren't twins. ;) And my passion is history, not language. But I do identify with him. Heck, I suspect many gamemasters in general do, reading about his process while trying to write, edit, and organize has often reminded me of a gamemaster's struggle.

              I agree with the basic conclusion of the article, that CRRT is the right guy to decide and we have to trust his decision. I think we tend to see a blockbuster film as the 'climax' of a great tale's life, and so JRRT's work feels incomplete without a great film version. I think that is flawed thinking.

              And I could never thank Peter Jackson. I just can't thank the man when he gets so much about the work so fundamentally wrong. I feel rather that he should publish a long apology to CRRT, begging forgiveness for Faramir, shattering Gandalf's staff, the plot wrenches of Two Towers, the stone giants with dwarf fleas... the Goblin Town scene... Aragorn's 'journey' and so much more.

              > More to the point, I've been mulling over possible SILMARILLION films recently and come to the conclusion that the stories in the
              > first age aren't likely to lend themselves to filming the way LotR and H have. Too compressed, too rarified, too gloomy. I'd much rather
              > see an animated version of FARMER GILES or film shorts of LBN or SWM than an epic-length TURIN.

              I think, as others have mentioned that portions of the Silmarillion could be done as a film and have great power. Even better, would be an HBO-style miniseries. I think the Hobbit and LOTR themselves would have been better served by something along those lines, and with far greater literal adherence to the source then Jackson provided.

              If I'm still alive (doubtful) when the works enter the public domain, I hope that then are done in that sort of miniseries format.


              Paul Westermeyer
              paul.westermeyer@...

              “All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us.”
              J. R. R. Tolkien, _The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring_
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