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Re: [mythsoc] Re: New LotR-based movie: The Hunt for Gollum

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  • David Bratman
    ... Yes, they do, don t they? It s one of the many harms of the Jackson films: film colonization. Have you noticed how nearly all fan-art depictions of LOTR
    Message 1 of 19 , Sep 23 9:27 AM
      Jason Fisher <visualweasel@...> wrote:

      >Actually, the visuals in the trailer are quite impressive. As is the music,
      >which the site says was composed by the director and project creator, Chris
      >Bouchard. Though I will say the clips from the soundtrack sound *strikingly*
      >like Howard Shore!

      Yes, they do, don't they? It's one of the many harms of the Jackson films: film colonization. Have you noticed how nearly all fan-art depictions of LOTR characters now look like Jackson's actors, whether the artist meant to depict them or not? Their imaginations have been colonized.

      Similarly, I guess Tolkien film music has to sound like Howard Shore. (Imagine it sounding like John Williams instead - that would be _wrong_, somehow - and you can see how deeply the presupposition has embedded itself.)

      Howard Shore on a cheap synthesizer, yet. Even worse.

      The visuals are beautiful, yes, but that's the landscape's fault. I'm sure I've seen that mountain lake before in half a dozen other movies. Judging from the brief glimpses of acting we get, this film will consist of two hours of Aragorn wandering tediously through the woods, looking as if he's about to say, "Be vewy quiet! I'm hunting wabbits!"

      I hope it's better than that, though the misspelling of "Eregion" on the map at the beginning of the second trailer does not raise hopes. At least they spelled "Tolkien" correctly.
    • Doug Kane
      ... Thanks for the chuckle, David. That was classic. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      Message 2 of 19 , Sep 23 9:57 AM
        David Bratman wrote:

        > Judging from the brief glimpses of acting we get, this film will consist of two hours of Aragorn wandering tediously through the
        > woods, looking as if he's about to say, "Be vewy quiet! I'm hunting wabbits!"

        Thanks for the chuckle, David. That was classic.

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Jason Fisher
        ... Yes, I noticed that too. It fairly jumped off the map at me.
        Message 3 of 19 , Sep 23 10:06 AM
          David Bratman <dbratman@...> wrote:

          > I hope it's better than that, though the misspelling of
          > "Eregion" on the map at the beginning of the second trailer
          > does not raise hopes. At least they spelled "Tolkien" correctly.

          Yes, I noticed that too. It fairly jumped off the map at me.
        • "Beregond, Anders Stenström"
          ... And south of Eregion, Tharbad has apparently been converted from a place to a region. Chivalrously, Beregond
          Message 4 of 19 , Sep 23 12:22 PM
            Jason Fisher wrote:
            >
            >
            > David Bratman <dbratman@...
            > <mailto:dbratman%40earthlink.net>> wrote:
            >
            > > I hope it's better than that, though the misspelling of
            > > "Eregion" on the map at the beginning of the second trailer
            > > does not raise hopes. At least they spelled "Tolkien" correctly.
            >
            > Yes, I noticed that too. It fairly jumped off the map at me.

            And south of Eregion, Tharbad has apparently been converted
            from a place to a region.

            Chivalrously,

            Beregond
          • ccampboyle
            (de-lurking) If you check their website more carefully, you ll see this is not feature-length; it s a 30 minute short. Cathy Boyle ... Judging from the brief
            Message 5 of 19 , Sep 24 9:19 AM
              (de-lurking)

              If you check their website more carefully, you'll see this is not
              feature-length; it's a 30 minute short.

              Cathy Boyle

              --- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, David Bratman <dbratman@...> wrote:
              Judging from the brief glimpses of acting we get, this film will
              consist of two hours of Aragorn wandering tediously through the woods,
              looking as if he's about to say, "Be vewy quiet! I'm hunting wabbits!"
              >
            • David Bratman
              I m sorry; my eyes glazed over from the clips. Concern for continued personal health caused me to stop there.
              Message 6 of 19 , Sep 24 9:33 AM
                I'm sorry; my eyes glazed over from the clips. Concern for continued personal health caused me to stop there.

                -----Original Message-----
                >From: ccampboyle <ccampboyle@...>
                >Sent: Sep 24, 2008 12:19 PM
                >To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                >Subject: [mythsoc] Re: New LotR-based movie: The Hunt for Gollum
                >
                >(de-lurking)
                >
                >If you check their website more carefully, you'll see this is not
                >feature-length; it's a 30 minute short.
                >
                >Cathy Boyle
                >
                >--- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, David Bratman <dbratman@...> wrote:
                > Judging from the brief glimpses of acting we get, this film will
                >consist of two hours of Aragorn wandering tediously through the woods,
                >looking as if he's about to say, "Be vewy quiet! I'm hunting wabbits!"
              • Michael Cunningham
                I have been in touch with the two main producers of this project, primarily as a fan and because this independent has been receiving some very positive
                Message 7 of 19 , Sep 24 10:19 AM
                  I have been in touch with the two main producers of this project, primarily
                  as a fan and because this independent has been receiving some very positive
                  coverage in several genre-related magazines. Naively or otherwise I thought
                  this to be a number of Tolkien aficionados with a cinematic and stage
                  background (and therefore some knowledge of copyright issues) expressing
                  their appreciation for the professor's works and, to a degree, Jackson's
                  cinematic interpretation of such. The producers are aware of these concerns
                  re copyright but raised the issue of the 'fan film' which may inhabit its
                  own genre and as such not fall under the legal remit of a large scale,
                  widely distributed, money making enterprise.

                  It's certainly not going to win any Oscars (or praise, it seems) but in
                  conversation with those involved the over-riding factor is that they are
                  purely fans and the feature is a labour of love and affection for a masterly
                  work that fires a creative spark in many of the folk who explore the world
                  between its pages.

                  I've pasted the response from the producers who sought to address the
                  copyright issue.

                  Michael

                  -----
                  I appreciate your editor's concern and he might be right. We haven't heard
                  anything from The Tolkien Estate but I can't see that we pose them any
                  serious threat. Hopefully we're helping to keep Tolkien's work alive. Anyway
                  this is question we get asked a lot and it's very important to make clear
                  that we feel there isn't a serious issue here. Let me explain why. The film
                  is non-profit and we're just a bunch of Tolkien fans making this in our
                  spare time as a labour of love. Here is an FAQ that explains more. It's also
                  worth noting that since many Star Wars "fan films" have been made and widely
                  publicised, the fan film has become recognised internationally as a genre in
                  itself.

                  How are you managing to make this with characters created by Tolkien when
                  the intellectual property rights are held elsewhere?
                  A very fair point. The answer is that we are a non-commercial film club and
                  the project is entirely non-profit. We certainly do not intend to breach
                  legal copyright and if we were to sell the finished film or anything related
                  to it then this would indeed be illegal. However this project is non-profit
                  and any videos and media generated will always be available freely and
                  openly over the internet. Nobody is or ever will be profiting financially
                  from this project. No products are being made or sold. The project is funded
                  by the fans who are taking part in it, a group of individuals collaborating
                  for fun. We're working on this project based on Lord of the Rings because we
                  love the material and as a way to showcase our technical film making skills.
                  If the copyright owners are concerned, then legally speaking we plead that
                  we are only a bunch of Tolkien fans practicing our film-making skills and
                  documenting the results online.

                  ------------
                • Croft, Janet B.
                  Being a non-profit doesn’t automatically give you free reign to do as you please with other folks’ copyrighted material, which is how they appear to be
                  Message 8 of 19 , Sep 24 10:36 AM
                    Being a non-profit doesn’t automatically give you free reign to do as you please with other folks’ copyrighted material, which is how they appear to be approaching this project. However, it can have weight in a Four Factors of Fair Use analysis, which is what they should sit down and do before the Estate or Saul Zantz or New Line takes notice of them. They should at least become more familiar with the vocabulary of fair use, and not rely solely on being non-profit to protect themselves.

                    Janet Brennan Croft

                    From: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com [mailto:mythsoc@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Cunningham
                    Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2008 12:19 PM
                    To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Re: New LotR-based movie: The Hunt for Gollum


                    I have been in touch with the two main producers of this project, primarily
                    as a fan and because this independent has been receiving some very positive
                    coverage in several genre-related magazines. Naively or otherwise I thought
                    this to be a number of Tolkien aficionados with a cinematic and stage
                    background (and therefore some knowledge of copyright issues) expressing
                    their appreciation for the professor's works and, to a degree, Jackson's
                    cinematic interpretation of such. The producers are aware of these concerns
                    re copyright but raised the issue of the 'fan film' which may inhabit its
                    own genre and as such not fall under the legal remit of a large scale,
                    widely distributed, money making enterprise.

                    It's certainly not going to win any Oscars (or praise, it seems) but in
                    conversation with those involved the over-riding factor is that they are
                    purely fans and the feature is a labour of love and affection for a masterly
                    work that fires a creative spark in many of the folk who explore the world
                    between its pages.

                    I've pasted the response from the producers who sought to address the
                    copyright issue.

                    Michael

                    -----
                    I appreciate your editor's concern and he might be right. We haven't heard
                    anything from The Tolkien Estate but I can't see that we pose them any
                    serious threat. Hopefully we're helping to keep Tolkien's work alive. Anyway
                    this is question we get asked a lot and it's very important to make clear
                    that we feel there isn't a serious issue here. Let me explain why. The film
                    is non-profit and we're just a bunch of Tolkien fans making this in our
                    spare time as a labour of love. Here is an FAQ that explains more. It's also
                    worth noting that since many Star Wars "fan films" have been made and widely
                    publicised, the fan film has become recognised internationally as a genre in
                    itself.

                    How are you managing to make this with characters created by Tolkien when
                    the intellectual property rights are held elsewhere?
                    A very fair point. The answer is that we are a non-commercial film club and
                    the project is entirely non-profit. We certainly do not intend to breach
                    legal copyright and if we were to sell the finished film or anything related
                    to it then this would indeed be illegal. However this project is non-profit
                    and any videos and media generated will always be available freely and
                    openly over the internet. Nobody is or ever will be profiting financially
                    from this project. No products are being made or sold. The project is funded
                    by the fans who are taking part in it, a group of individuals collaborating
                    for fun. We're working on this project based on Lord of the Rings because we
                    love the material and as a way to showcase our technical film making skills.
                    If the copyright owners are concerned, then legally speaking we plead that
                    we are only a bunch of Tolkien fans practicing our film-making skills and
                    documenting the results online.

                    ------------



                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Steven Sams
                    Where would the bridge film material come from again? What stories? Thanks, Steven [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    Message 9 of 19 , Sep 24 11:20 AM
                      Where would the bridge film material come from again? What stories?



                      Thanks,



                      Steven









                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Michael Cunningham
                      Possibly they should have been mindful of the Damnatus outcome. Intellectual property issues are rarely black and white and may see this project slip into the
                      Message 10 of 19 , Sep 24 11:25 AM
                        Possibly they should have been mindful of the Damnatus outcome. Intellectual property issues are rarely black and white and may see this project slip into the Dead Marshes.

                        Michael


                        ----- Original Message -----
                        From: Croft, Janet B.
                        To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2008 6:36 PM
                        Subject: RE: [mythsoc] Re: New LotR-based movie: The Hunt for Gollum


                        Being a non-profit doesn’t automatically give you free reign to do as you please with other folks’ copyrighted material, which is how they appear to be approaching this project. However, it can have weight in a Four Factors of Fair Use analysis, which is what they should sit down and do before the Estate or Saul Zantz or New Line takes notice of them. They should at least become more familiar with the vocabulary of fair use, and not rely solely on being non-profit to protect themselves.

                        Janet Brennan Croft

                        From: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com [mailto:mythsoc@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Cunningham
                        Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2008 12:19 PM
                        To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Re: New LotR-based movie: The Hunt for Gollum


                        I have been in touch with the two main producers of this project, primarily
                        as a fan and because this independent has been receiving some very positive
                        coverage in several genre-related magazines. Naively or otherwise I thought
                        this to be a number of Tolkien aficionados with a cinematic and stage
                        background (and therefore some knowledge of copyright issues) expressing
                        their appreciation for the professor's works and, to a degree, Jackson's
                        cinematic interpretation of such. The producers are aware of these concerns
                        re copyright but raised the issue of the 'fan film' which may inhabit its
                        own genre and as such not fall under the legal remit of a large scale,
                        widely distributed, money making enterprise.

                        It's certainly not going to win any Oscars (or praise, it seems) but in
                        conversation with those involved the over-riding factor is that they are
                        purely fans and the feature is a labour of love and affection for a masterly
                        work that fires a creative spark in many of the folk who explore the world
                        between its pages.

                        I've pasted the response from the producers who sought to address the
                        copyright issue.

                        Michael

                        -----
                        I appreciate your editor's concern and he might be right. We haven't heard
                        anything from The Tolkien Estate but I can't see that we pose them any
                        serious threat. Hopefully we're helping to keep Tolkien's work alive. Anyway
                        this is question we get asked a lot and it's very important to make clear
                        that we feel there isn't a serious issue here. Let me explain why. The film
                        is non-profit and we're just a bunch of Tolkien fans making this in our
                        spare time as a labour of love. Here is an FAQ that explains more. It's also
                        worth noting that since many Star Wars "fan films" have been made and widely
                        publicised, the fan film has become recognised internationally as a genre in
                        itself.

                        How are you managing to make this with characters created by Tolkien when
                        the intellectual property rights are held elsewhere?
                        A very fair point. The answer is that we are a non-commercial film club and
                        the project is entirely non-profit. We certainly do not intend to breach
                        legal copyright and if we were to sell the finished film or anything related
                        to it then this would indeed be illegal. However this project is non-profit
                        and any videos and media generated will always be available freely and
                        openly over the internet. Nobody is or ever will be profiting financially
                        from this project. No products are being made or sold. The project is funded
                        by the fans who are taking part in it, a group of individuals collaborating
                        for fun. We're working on this project based on Lord of the Rings because we
                        love the material and as a way to showcase our technical film making skills.
                        If the copyright owners are concerned, then legally speaking we plead that
                        we are only a bunch of Tolkien fans practicing our film-making skills and
                        documenting the results online.

                        ------------


                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






                        No virus found in this incoming message.
                        Checked by AVG.
                        Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.7.1/1688 - Release Date: 24/09/2008 06:29

                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Sarah Beach
                        The problem with the filmmakers citing the STAR WARS fanfilms as precedent is that Lucasfilm actually ALLOWS them to be made. Heck, Lucasfilm even sponsors a
                        Message 11 of 19 , Sep 24 2:09 PM
                          The problem with the filmmakers citing the STAR WARS fanfilms as
                          precedent is that Lucasfilm actually ALLOWS them to be made. Heck,
                          Lucasfilm even sponsors a Star Wars fanfic film (short) award at the
                          San Diego ComicCon each year. So it is NOT a good example of "Well,
                          if they can do it, so can we in this other property's playground."

                          Alas, I think the filmmakers, though they may be "pure-hearted", are
                          a bit naive about the possible ramifications.

                          I do hope that if something does get stirred up about it all, they
                          come through unscathed.

                          --- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Cunningham" <vargeisa@...>
                          wrote:
                          >
                          > I have been in touch with the two main producers of this project,
                          primarily
                          > as a fan and because this independent has been receiving some very
                          positive
                          > coverage in several genre-related magazines. Naively or otherwise I
                          thought
                          > this to be a number of Tolkien aficionados with a cinematic and
                          stage
                          > background (and therefore some knowledge of copyright issues)
                          expressing
                          > their appreciation for the professor's works and, to a degree,
                          Jackson's
                          > cinematic interpretation of such. The producers are aware of these
                          concerns
                          > re copyright but raised the issue of the 'fan film' which may
                          inhabit its
                          > own genre and as such not fall under the legal remit of a large
                          scale,
                          > widely distributed, money making enterprise.
                          >
                          > It's certainly not going to win any Oscars (or praise, it seems)
                          but in
                          > conversation with those involved the over-riding factor is that
                          they are
                          > purely fans and the feature is a labour of love and affection for a
                          masterly
                          > work that fires a creative spark in many of the folk who explore
                          the world
                          > between its pages.
                          >
                          > I've pasted the response from the producers who sought to address
                          the
                          > copyright issue.
                          >
                          > Michael
                          >
                          > -----
                          > I appreciate your editor's concern and he might be right. We
                          haven't heard
                          > anything from The Tolkien Estate but I can't see that we pose them
                          any
                          > serious threat. Hopefully we're helping to keep Tolkien's work
                          alive. Anyway
                          > this is question we get asked a lot and it's very important to make
                          clear
                          > that we feel there isn't a serious issue here. Let me explain why.
                          The film
                          > is non-profit and we're just a bunch of Tolkien fans making this in
                          our
                          > spare time as a labour of love. Here is an FAQ that explains more.
                          It's also
                          > worth noting that since many Star Wars "fan films" have been made
                          and widely
                          > publicised, the fan film has become recognised internationally as a
                          genre in
                          > itself.
                          >
                          > How are you managing to make this with characters created by
                          Tolkien when
                          > the intellectual property rights are held elsewhere?
                          > A very fair point. The answer is that we are a non-commercial film
                          club and
                          > the project is entirely non-profit. We certainly do not intend to
                          breach
                          > legal copyright and if we were to sell the finished film or
                          anything related
                          > to it then this would indeed be illegal. However this project is
                          non-profit
                          > and any videos and media generated will always be available freely
                          and
                          > openly over the internet. Nobody is or ever will be profiting
                          financially
                          > from this project. No products are being made or sold. The project
                          is funded
                          > by the fans who are taking part in it, a group of individuals
                          collaborating
                          > for fun. We're working on this project based on Lord of the Rings
                          because we
                          > love the material and as a way to showcase our technical film
                          making skills.
                          > If the copyright owners are concerned, then legally speaking we
                          plead that
                          > we are only a bunch of Tolkien fans practicing our film-making
                          skills and
                          > documenting the results online.
                          >
                          > ------------
                          >
                        • David Bratman
                          ... If they think this, they have mistaken probably too small to be worth suing for legally immune from being sued. They are also fantastically kidding
                          Message 12 of 19 , Sep 24 4:15 PM
                            >From: Michael Cunningham <vargeisa@...> wrote:

                            >The producers are aware of these concerns
                            >re copyright but raised the issue of the 'fan film' which may inhabit its
                            >own genre and as such not fall under the legal remit of a large scale,
                            >widely distributed, money making enterprise.

                            If they think this, they have mistaken "probably too small to be worth suing" for "legally immune from being sued." They are also fantastically kidding themselves if they don't realize that posting something on the open Web is not a synonym for "wide distribution."

                            And you quote them:

                            >We haven't heard
                            >anything from The Tolkien Estate but I can't see that we pose them any
                            >serious threat. Hopefully we're helping to keep Tolkien's work alive.

                            This is amazingly arrogant. The Tolkien Estate and their legal licensees get to decide what's to be released to keep Tolkien's work alive. Fan film makers don't get to decide that.


                            >The answer is that we are a non-commercial film club and
                            >the project is entirely non-profit. We certainly do not intend to breach
                            >legal copyright and if we were to sell the finished film or anything related
                            >to it then this would indeed be illegal. However this project is non-profit
                            >and any videos and media generated will always be available freely and
                            >openly over the internet.

                            This is so inaccurate it's not even funny. Disavowing any intention of making a profit is not a "break copyright free" card.

                            >If the copyright owners are concerned, then legally speaking we plead that
                            >we are only a bunch of Tolkien fans practicing our film-making skills and
                            >documenting the results online.

                            Doing whatever you like with Tolkien's characters privately, for your own amusement, is one thing. Documenting it online is quite another. If that's really their intent, they should make up their own Tolkienesque story and film that. If they didn't do that because nobody would watch it, that only proves how much they're piggybacking on Tolkien's fame. It might seen, or even be, silly to worry that this little film could harm Tolkien's reputation and future earnings, but again: they don't get to decide that.
                          • John D Rateliff
                            ... Thanks for posting the link, Ellen. News to me that any such project was in the works, much less that it was nearing completion. As for whether they can
                            Message 13 of 19 , Sep 24 7:14 PM
                              On Sep 23, 2008, at 4:58 AM, Ellen wrote:
                              > My question is this: can the filmmakers get away with blatantly
                              > using Tolkien's world and characters in a movie?

                              Thanks for posting the link, Ellen. News to me that any such project
                              was in the works, much less that it was nearing completion.
                              As for whether they can get away with this, I wdn't bet on it.
                              It's one thing to post a piece of fan fiction; the Estate might be
                              willing to let that pass. But a film is something else, and Tolkien
                              Enterprises is famous for bringing the hammer down on anything that
                              poaches on their turf. Nor are major studios like New Line inclined
                              to turn a blind eye to competition in any shape or form. I think
                              they've probably taken the Lovecraft independent film phenomenon as a
                              model, not taking into account that Lovecraft's work is out of
                              copyright. Then too, the $30 donation in return for a cd somewhat
                              undercuts the 'not-for-profit' claim.
                              And wasn't there someone else a while back working on a
                              Tolkienesque film?

                              Jason Fisher <visualweasel@...> wrote:
                              > Actually, the visuals in the trailer are quite impressive. As is
                              > the music . . . Though I will say the clips from the soundtrack
                              > sound *strikingly* like Howard Shore!

                              It was pretty clear that their goal was to make their piece seem as
                              much like Jackson as possible, right down to the sweep across snow-
                              covered mountains. Hence, the Shore-like music (which I thought they
                              did a better job on with the first clip than the second). I was
                              impressed by how beautiful the natural settings were; someone in the
                              project has a good eye for cinematography.


                              David Bratman wrote:
                              > Have you noticed how nearly all fan-art depictions of LOTR
                              > characters now look like Jackson's actors, whether the artist meant
                              > to depict them or not?

                              No, I hadn't, but that very issue (film-inspired art) is being
                              debated in the latest AMON HEN (#213).


                              On Sep 24, 2008, at 11:20 AM, Steven Sams wrote:
                              > Where would the bridge film material come from again? What stories?


                              Presumably from the Appendices. I'm sure they'd love to use material
                              from UNFINISHED TALES, but they'd have to negotiate a separate
                              license from the Estate to do that (unlikely, I shd think).

                              On Sep 24, 2008, at 11:25 AM, Michael Cunningham wrote:
                              > Possibly they should have been mindful of the Damnatus outcome.

                              Ouch!. I'd forgotten that one. Good example.

                              On Sep 24, 2008, at 9:19 AM, ccampboyle wrote:
                              > If you check their website more carefully, you'll see this is not
                              > feature-length; it's a 30 minute short.


                              I'd missed the detail of thirty minutes, but they do refer to it
                              several times as a short, so it's definitely not a full-length movie.


                              On Sep 24, 2008, at 9:33 AM, David Bratman wrote:
                              > I'm sorry; my eyes glazed over from the clips. Concern for
                              > continued personal health caused me to stop there.


                              Sorry to hear it; get well soon.

                              --John R.
                            • WendellWag@aol.com
                              There s really no point in us discussing this. They re violating copyright law, but it s not our job to enforce the law. Somebody here notify the Tolkien
                              Message 14 of 19 , Sep 24 8:08 PM
                                There's really no point in us discussing this. They're violating copyright
                                law, but it's not our job to enforce the law. Somebody here notify the
                                Tolkien estate about this website. The estate will decide how to proceed against
                                these people. Our discussing this accomplishes nothing.

                                Wendell Wagner



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                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              • aveeris523@aol.com
                                If by the bridge film you mean the connection between The Hobbit and LOTR , the essay The Quest of Erebor in Unfinished Tales might be a good start. Steve
                                Message 15 of 19 , Sep 24 10:16 PM
                                  If by the "bridge film" you mean the connection between The Hobbit and LOTR ,
                                  the essay "The Quest of Erebor" in Unfinished Tales might be a good start.
                                  Steve Gaddis


                                  **************
                                  Looking for simple solutions to your real-life
                                  financial challenges? Check out WalletPop for the latest news and information,
                                  tips and calculators.
                                  (http://www.walletpop.com/?NCID=emlcntuswall00000001)


                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                • Michael Cunningham
                                  Not my intention to linger on this but...another fan film in production was highlighted to me: http://www.bornofhope.com/index.html They have a disclaimer, but
                                  Message 16 of 19 , Sep 25 7:08 AM
                                    Not my intention to linger on this but...another fan film in production was highlighted to me: http://www.bornofhope.com/index.html

                                    They have a disclaimer, but that may be all it is. I suppose one may be looking towards a stated case being published if any legal action is taken to prevent future enterprises. As for me I think I'll just stick to music!

                                    Michael


                                    ----- Original Message -----
                                    From: WendellWag@...
                                    To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                                    Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 4:08 AM
                                    Subject: Re: [mythsoc] New LotR-based movie: The Hunt for Gollum


                                    There's really no point in us discussing this. They're violating copyright
                                    law, but it's not our job to enforce the law. Somebody here notify the
                                    Tolkien estate about this website. The estate will decide how to proceed against
                                    these people. Our discussing this accomplishes nothing.

                                    Wendell Wagner

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                                  • William Cloud Hicklin
                                    ... The Hobbit and LOTR , ... be a good start. ... Except, Steve, New Line/Time Warner/Zaentz have *no* rights to Unfinished Tales, nor to any other Tolkien
                                    Message 17 of 19 , Sep 25 9:10 AM
                                      --- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, aveeris523@... wrote:
                                      >
                                      > If by the "bridge film" you mean the connection between
                                      The Hobbit and LOTR ,
                                      > the essay "The Quest of Erebor" in Unfinished Tales might
                                      be a good start.
                                      > Steve Gaddis
                                      >
                                      >

                                      Except, Steve, New Line/Time Warner/Zaentz have *no* rights
                                      to Unfinished Tales, nor to any other Tolkien writings
                                      outside the covers of The Lord of the Rings and The Hobbit.
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