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Re: [mythsoc] Article that mentions Tolkien

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  • John D Rateliff
    Thanks for the link, Wendell. I found the article itself appalling, but fascinating as an exercise in applicability . And I would have missed it altogether if
    Message 1 of 12 , Dec 5, 2007
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      Thanks for the link, Wendell. I found the article itself appalling,
      but fascinating as an exercise in 'applicability'. And I would have
      missed it altogether if not for your posting.
      --JDR

      On Dec 4, 2007, at 11:31 AM, WendellWag@... wrote:

      > There's an article in the Readings section of _Harper's_ this month
      > that
      > mentions Tolkien in an interesting way. The Readings section
      > reprints writings
      > (or selections from writings) that the editors find important in
      > some way,
      > sometimes because they think it expresses a good idea, sometimes
      > because they
      > find the viewpoint horrifying. They make no comment themselves on
      > what they
      > think of it. Neither will I. It's "The Once & Future
      > Christendom" by James
      > P. Pinkerton from the September 10th issue of _The American
      > Conservative_. My
      > apologies if someone has already given a link to this.
      >
      > _http://www.amconmag.com/2007/2007_09_10/cover.html_
      > (http://www.amconmag.com/2007/2007_09_10/cover.html)
      >
      > Wendell Wagner
    • Lynn Maudlin
      Assuredly JRRT was ecologically minded but I don t know that that equals Green Party voter (which, my impression from *this* side of the pond, is fairly
      Message 2 of 12 , Dec 5, 2007
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        Assuredly JRRT was ecologically minded but I don't know that that
        equals "Green Party voter" (which, my impression from *this* side of
        the pond, is fairly left-leaning in nearly all regards, yes?). But I
        could have used the example of the folks who thought that pipeweed was
        marijuana... (like Peter Jackson, perhaps?!!).

        All due respect to Tom Shippey, but I suspect Priscilla Tolkien and
        Christopher Tolkien would be better at surmising how JRRT would vote
        in today's elections.

        -- Lynn --


        --- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, "Merlin DeTardo" <emptyD@...> wrote:
        >
        > >--- "Lynn Maudlin" <lynnmaudlin@> wrote:
        >
        > << One might read Pinkerton's article and feel he misuses JRRT but I
        > don't think he's any further off than the folks who saw Tolkien
        > as "green"... >>
        >
        >
        > Here's one such: Tom Shippey, in his article, "Literature, Twentieth
        > Century, Influence of Tolkien", in _J.R.R. Tolkien Encyclopedia_ (2006):
        >
        > "If he were voting today, Tolkien would certainly vote for the Green
        > Party..."
        >
        > -Merlin DeTardo
        >
      • David Bratman
        I very much doubt that Tolkien would vote for the Green Party, but he was very far from being a stereotypical Tory. That his ecological views were, through a
        Message 3 of 12 , Dec 5, 2007
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          I very much doubt that Tolkien would vote for the Green Party, but he was very far from being a stereotypical Tory. That his ecological views were, through a Christian viewpoint, very green with a small "g" is, I think, adequately proven by Dickerson and Evans's "Ents, Elves, and Eriador," and also supported by Curry's "Defending Middle-earth." Using "seeing Tolkien as 'green'" as any kind of measure of "offness" in Tolkien studies is, I think, unfair and mistaken. Tolkien was entirely comparatible with being "green", as long as you do not confuse that with either of 1) voting for the Green Party; 2) adopting the lifestyle of stereotypically "green" people.

          -----Original Message-----
          >From: Lynn Maudlin <lynnmaudlin@...>
          >Sent: Dec 5, 2007 9:12 PM
          >To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
          >Subject: [mythsoc] Re: Article that mentions Tolkien
          >
          >Assuredly JRRT was ecologically minded but I don't know that that
          >equals "Green Party voter" (which, my impression from *this* side of
          >the pond, is fairly left-leaning in nearly all regards, yes?). But I
          >could have used the example of the folks who thought that pipeweed was
          >marijuana... (like Peter Jackson, perhaps?!!).
          >
          >All due respect to Tom Shippey, but I suspect Priscilla Tolkien and
          >Christopher Tolkien would be better at surmising how JRRT would vote
          >in today's elections.
          >
          > -- Lynn --
          >
          >
          >--- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, "Merlin DeTardo" <emptyD@...> wrote:
          >>
          >> >--- "Lynn Maudlin" <lynnmaudlin@> wrote:
          >>
          >> << One might read Pinkerton's article and feel he misuses JRRT but I
          >> don't think he's any further off than the folks who saw Tolkien
          >> as "green"... >>
          >>
          >>
          >> Here's one such: Tom Shippey, in his article, "Literature, Twentieth
          >> Century, Influence of Tolkien", in _J.R.R. Tolkien Encyclopedia_ (2006):
          >>
          >> "If he were voting today, Tolkien would certainly vote for the Green
          >> Party..."
          >>
          >> -Merlin DeTardo
          >>
          >
          >
        • Lynn Maudlin
          Thank you for stating it so much better than I, David. I am also a little g green so I knew what I meant, however I mangled the sense! (currently throttling
          Message 4 of 12 , Dec 10, 2007
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            Thank you for stating it so much better than I, David. I am also a
            "little g green" so I knew what I meant, however I mangled the sense!
            (currently throttling words).

            -- Lynn --

            --- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, David Bratman <dbratman@...> wrote:
            >
            > I very much doubt that Tolkien would vote for the Green Party, but
            he was very far from being a stereotypical Tory. That his ecological
            views were, through a Christian viewpoint, very green with a small "g"
            is, I think, adequately proven by Dickerson and Evans's "Ents, Elves,
            and Eriador," and also supported by Curry's "Defending Middle-earth."
            Using "seeing Tolkien as 'green'" as any kind of measure of "offness"
            in Tolkien studies is, I think, unfair and mistaken. Tolkien was
            entirely comparatible with being "green", as long as you do not
            confuse that with either of 1) voting for the Green Party; 2) adopting
            the lifestyle of stereotypically "green" people.
            >
            > -----Original Message-----
            > >From: Lynn Maudlin <lynnmaudlin@...>
            > >Sent: Dec 5, 2007 9:12 PM
            > >To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
            > >Subject: [mythsoc] Re: Article that mentions Tolkien
            > >
            > >Assuredly JRRT was ecologically minded but I don't know that that
            > >equals "Green Party voter" (which, my impression from *this* side of
            > >the pond, is fairly left-leaning in nearly all regards, yes?). But I
            > >could have used the example of the folks who thought that pipeweed was
            > >marijuana... (like Peter Jackson, perhaps?!!).
            > >
            > >All due respect to Tom Shippey, but I suspect Priscilla Tolkien and
            > >Christopher Tolkien would be better at surmising how JRRT would vote
            > >in today's elections.
            > >
            > > -- Lynn --
            > >
            > >
            > >--- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, "Merlin DeTardo" <emptyD@> wrote:
            > >>
            > >> >--- "Lynn Maudlin" <lynnmaudlin@> wrote:
            > >>
            > >> << One might read Pinkerton's article and feel he misuses JRRT
            but I
            > >> don't think he's any further off than the folks who saw Tolkien
            > >> as "green"... >>
            > >>
            > >>
            > >> Here's one such: Tom Shippey, in his article, "Literature, Twentieth
            > >> Century, Influence of Tolkien", in _J.R.R. Tolkien Encyclopedia_
            (2006):
            > >>
            > >> "If he were voting today, Tolkien would certainly vote for the Green
            > >> Party..."
            > >>
            > >> -Merlin DeTardo
            > >>
            > >
            > >
            >
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