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Re: [mythsoc] Re: Fw: JRR Tolkien letters for sale

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  • Vincent Ferré
    that s a very clever comment, merlin :-) but there are still so many things to say about the published letters (the selection by carpenter & ch. tolkien) and
    Message 1 of 15 , Nov 22, 2007
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      that's a very clever comment, merlin :-)

      but there are still so many things to say about the published letters (the selection by carpenter & ch. tolkien) and about the most important ones among the letters that Wayne & Christina have traced, that I am still in doubt !

      very best wishes to all,
      vincent

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    • mwilt
      But setting aside the letters value as collectibles, what use might they have for researchers? It might be interesting to list the possibilities -- a holiday
      Message 2 of 15 , Nov 22, 2007
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        But setting
        aside the letters' value as collectibles, what use might they have
        for researchers? It might be interesting to list the possibilities --
        a holiday exercise here in the U.S.
        ***

        Far be it from me to participate in "holiday exercises" except the raising of turkey leg to mouth. :-) However:


        ***
        The latter article is called "From
        Middle-earth to the Silent Planet", according to Judith Johnson's
        bibiography, which also reveals that Lobdell wrote a different
        article titled "Words That Sound Like Castles" for _National Review_
        in 1967.
        ***

        It might be the same article? The magazine "Rally" is described as a "Triple A Farm Team for the National Review" in the obituary for Mr. Wheeler published in the National Review (see the Wheeler personal web site for the obituary here http://www.pbase.com/csw62/image/85861087). It might be the article was published in Rally in 1966 and picked up by NR in 1967?

        mary


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      • Merlin DeTardo
        Hassles, tassels, vassals... ... A friend of mine organizes a wallyball outing annually on the
        Message 3 of 15 , Nov 22, 2007
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          Hassles, tassels, vassals...

          >>--- "mwilt" <mary.wilt@...> wrote:

          << Far be it from me to participate in "holiday exercises" >>

          A friend of mine organizes a wallyball outing annually on the day
          after Thanksgiving; I guess I'm in the holiday exercise habit. Not
          that it shows. (Or rather, I have the appearance of someone who only
          exercises on the holidays.)

          << "Lobdell wrote a different article titled 'Words That Sound Like
          Castles' for _National Review_ in 1967."
          It might be the same article? The magazine "Rally" is described as
          a "Triple A Farm Team for the National Review" ... might be the
          article was published in Rally in 1966 and picked up by NR in 1967? >>

          Johnson describes the 1966 article this way:
          "Praises Tolkien's creation of languages and histories for his
          characters" (_J.R.R. Tolkien: Six Decades of Criticism_, 66).

          Her description of the 1968 article is:
          "Attacks Hodgart's criticism ... finds C.S. Lewis is the best Tolkien
          critic, and suggests Tolkien's appeal is to readers who identify with
          Tolkien's imaginative life, find echoes of their imaginations in
          their work" (77).

          Richard West's J.R.R. Tolkien: An Annotated Checklist_, Revised
          Edition, explicitly says the two are "not the same" (82).

          -Merlin DeTardo
        • mwilt
          You re right, of course (and you have access to better reference books, too!!) they are different. I found the National Review article, if you d care to see
          Message 4 of 15 , Nov 22, 2007
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            You're right, of course (and you have access to better reference books,
            too!!) they are different. I found the National Review article, if you'd
            care to see it. I don't know the rules for sending an entire article to the
            list and can't link to it.

            mary


            ----- Original Message -----
            From: Merlin DeTardo
            To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2007 11:58 AM
            Subject: [mythsoc] Re: "Words That Sound Like Castles"


            << "Lobdell wrote a different article titled 'Words That Sound Like
            Castles' for _National Review_ in 1967."
            It might be the same article? The magazine "Rally" is described as
            a "Triple A Farm Team for the National Review" ... might be the
            article was published in Rally in 1966 and picked up by NR in 1967? >>

            Johnson describes the 1966 article this way:
            "Praises Tolkien's creation of languages and histories for his
            characters" (_J.R.R. Tolkien: Six Decades of Criticism_, 66).

            Her description of the 1968 article is:
            "Attacks Hodgart's criticism ... finds C.S. Lewis is the best Tolkien
            critic, and suggests Tolkien's appeal is to readers who identify with
            Tolkien's imaginative life, find echoes of their imaginations in
            their work" (77).

            Richard West's J.R.R. Tolkien: An Annotated Checklist_, Revised
            Edition, explicitly says the two are "not the same" (82).
          • Andrew Higgins
              Hello all.  I am currently on holiday in Portugal and I happened to come > across a rather interesting book in a local shop - its called O >
            Message 5 of 15 , Jun 7, 2008
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              Hello all.  I am currently on holiday in Portugal and I happened to come
              > across a rather interesting book in a local shop - its called O
              > Ultima Anel (The Final Ring) by a Russian Author called Kyril
              > Yeskov.  I am in the process of studying Portuguese so my
              > understanding of it is rather limited - but from what I can make out -
              >  this is a Portuguese translation of a Russian book that tells the
              > tale of the War of the Ring and aftermath from the Orcs point of
              > view.  Orc culture is portrayed quite differntly from the information
              > we receive through Elvish, Men and Hobbit sources and it certainly
              > drives home the point that the victors write the histories.
              >
              > Be interested in knowing if anyone has read this book in any
              > language - is it avaialble in English?  And how did the author work
              > with the Tolkien Estate on it (or did he?).  The cover of the
              > Portuguese edition has an illustration from Alan Lee and I have found
              > some mention of it online - but it does not look like its been
              > translated into English.
              >
              > More to come when I retrun to blighty!
              >
              > Thanks, Andy

               
               
               















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            • WendellWag@aol.com
              It s completely unauthorized and certain to never be translated and published in English. The only surprising thing is that it was translated and published
              Message 6 of 15 , Jun 7, 2008
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                It's completely unauthorized and certain to never be translated and
                published in English. The only surprising thing is that it was translated and
                published in Portuguese. Copyright laws are rather loosely enforced in Russia.
                There have been many unauthorized sequels and such to Tolkien published there.
                (Tolkien has been quite popular in Russia since at least the early 1990's.
                Much authorized and unauthorized Tolkien material has appeared since then.)
                There are also sequels to other popular authors. The Tolkien estate can
                prevent violation of copyright laws in much of the world, but it's harder work in
                certain places like Russia. Someone here might want to notify the Tolkien
                estate about the Portuguese edition.

                Wendell Wagner



                **************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with
                Tyler Florence" on AOL Food.
                (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4?&NCID=aolfod00030000000002)


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • WendellWag@aol.com
                The author s name is more commonly transliterated as Kirill Eskov and the book s title is commonly given in English as The Last Ringbearer. There s a
                Message 7 of 15 , Jun 7, 2008
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                  The author's name is more commonly transliterated as Kirill Eskov and the
                  book's title is commonly given in English as The Last Ringbearer. There's a
                  Wikipedia entry for the author. Here's an article in English about this book
                  and other Russian reactions to Tolkien:

                  _http://media.www.thespartandaily.com/media/storage/paper852/news/2004/11/10/O
                  pinioncolumnists/lord-Of.The.Rings.Spoofs.Find.A.Russian.Following-1499947.sht
                  ml_
                  (http://media.www.thespartandaily.com/media/storage/paper852/news/2004/11/10/Opinioncolumnists/lord-Of.The.Rings.Spoofs.Find.A.Russian.Following-1499947
                  .shtml)

                  Wendell Wagner



                  **************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with
                  Tyler Florence" on AOL Food.
                  (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4?&NCID=aolfod00030000000002)


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • WendellWag@aol.com
                  That URL I mentioned in the last post might not come across for many of you. Try Googling for Kirill Eskov . The webpage that I m referring to is at the
                  Message 8 of 15 , Jun 7, 2008
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                    That URL I mentioned in the last post might not come across for many of you.
                    Try Googling for "Kirill Eskov". The webpage that I'm referring to is at
                    the bottom of the first page for that Google search.

                    Wendell Wagner



                    **************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with
                    Tyler Florence" on AOL Food.
                    (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4?&NCID=aolfod00030000000002)


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Grace Donaldson
                    ... and the ... Ringbearer. There s a ... about this book ... _http://media.www.thespartandaily.com/media/storage/paper852/news/200 4/11/10/O ... 1499947.sht
                    Message 9 of 15 , Jun 11, 2008
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                      --- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, WendellWag@... wrote:
                      >
                      > The author's name is more commonly transliterated as Kirill Eskov
                      and the
                      > book's title is commonly given in English as The Last
                      Ringbearer. There's a
                      > Wikipedia entry for the author. Here's an article in English
                      about this book
                      > and other Russian reactions to Tolkien:
                      >
                      >
                      _http://media.www.thespartandaily.com/media/storage/paper852/news/200
                      4/11/10/O
                      > pinioncolumnists/lord-Of.The.Rings.Spoofs.Find.A.Russian.Following-
                      1499947.sht
                      > ml_
                      >
                      (http://media.www.thespartandaily.com/media/storage/paper852/news/200
                      4/11/10/Opinioncolumnists/lord-
                      Of.The.Rings.Spoofs.Find.A.Russian.Following-1499947
                      > .shtml)

                      Ah, yes, the Goblin translations (mrntioned in one of the
                      articles)...there's something about a pickle that became a running
                      joke in my class when I was teaching LOTR in Kyrgyzstan. I tried
                      watching part of one of them, but have to confess my Russian wasn't
                      up to it; I missed most of the jokes. But my understanding was that
                      they were a kind of Russian "Weird Al" of films.

                      I have an authorized Russian translation of LOTR, but was appalled
                      to discover that a common (unauthorized) cheap paperback translation
                      chopped off the chapters in which Frodo and Sam encounter Boromir --
                      so my students who read that version weren't the least appalled by
                      the slaughtering of Boromir's character that Jackson did in the film.

                      I wasn't aware of Eskov's work; I'd be interested in struggling
                      through it in the original; maybe if I get a copy and can make it to
                      another Mythcon, I can provide unauthorized (and no doubt very poor)
                      translations of it to any who want to hear.

                      Grace
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