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Re: [mythsoc] Source of Tolkien quote

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  • Margaret Dean
    ... It doesn t sound familiar to me in that form. What Tolkien says about the Balrog in his commentary on Zimmerman s film treatment is: The Balrog =never
    Message 1 of 5 , Apr 17 6:56 PM
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      Linda DeMars wrote:
      >
      > Help, please, all-knowing and learned list. I am writing an essay on
      > Forces of Good and Evil in Tolkien's writings and their possible
      > source (s) in mythology. Somewhere very recently I read a comment by
      > Tolkien himself about the Balrog and how he had never pictured it
      > (him) with horns and a tail. He may even have said, "He does not have
      > horns and a tail>" I thought it was in the Collected Letters and I
      > thought it was addressed to Zimmerman (?) who had plans at one time
      > to make a movie of LOTR trilogy. Naturally I cannot find the quote
      > now when I want to include it in my essay. Does this quote sound
      > familiar to anyone? Does anyone remember where it might be? I keep
      > going through the books I have looking and looking, and it's nowhere.

      It doesn't sound familiar to me in that form. What Tolkien says
      about the Balrog in his commentary on Zimmerman's film treatment
      is:

      "The Balrog =never speaks or makes any vocal sound= at all.
      Above all he =does not= laugh or sneer..... Z may think that he
      knows more about Balrogs than I do, but he cannot expect me to
      agree with him."

      At least, that's what's in the published version. For all I know
      the presumable omission indicated by the ellipses may have
      included comments about horns and a tail, but somehow I doubt
      it. And oh, that final, tart sentence is such vintage Tolkien,
      isn't it? :)


      --Margaret Dean
      <margdean@...>
    • Linda DeMars
      Thanks so much, Margaret for being so prompt. Yes, I have the quote you mentioned - and the quote I saw had its own tart flavor. Off topic, remember the
      Message 2 of 5 , Apr 17 7:46 PM
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        Thanks so much, Margaret for being so prompt. Yes, I have the quote
        you mentioned - and the quote I saw had its own tart flavor.

        Off topic, remember the several letters to the woman who had a farm
        where she raised fancy pure-bred cows and wanted to honor him by
        calling the farm Rivendell and the cows Arwen and Galadriel, I think
        the bull was to be Elrond or Celeborn.

        Linda




        On 117Sun AprAug 20072004, at 21:56, Margaret Dean wrote:

        > Linda DeMars wrote:
        > >
        > > Help, please, all-knowing and learned list. I am writing an essay on
        > > Forces of Good and Evil in Tolkien's writings and their possible
        > > source (s) in mythology. Somewhere very recently I read a comment by
        > > Tolkien himself about the Balrog and how he had never pictured it
        > > (him) with horns and a tail. He may even have said, "He does not
        > have
        > > horns and a tail>" I thought it was in the Collected Letters and I
        > > thought it was addressed to Zimmerman (?) who had plans at one time
        > > to make a movie of LOTR trilogy. Naturally I cannot find the quote
        > > now when I want to include it in my essay. Does this quote sound
        > > familiar to anyone? Does anyone remember where it might be? I keep
        > > going through the books I have looking and looking, and it's
        > nowhere.
        >
        > It doesn't sound familiar to me in that form. What Tolkien says
        > about the Balrog in his commentary on Zimmerman's film treatment
        > is:
        >
        > "The Balrog =never speaks or makes any vocal sound= at all.
        > Above all he =does not= laugh or sneer..... Z may think that he
        > knows more about Balrogs than I do, but he cannot expect me to
        > agree with him."
        >
        > At least, that's what's in the published version. For all I know
        > the presumable omission indicated by the ellipses may have
        > included comments about horns and a tail, but somehow I doubt
        > it. And oh, that final, tart sentence is such vintage Tolkien,
        > isn't it? :)
        >
        > --Margaret Dean
        > <margdean@...>
        >
        >



        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Margaret Dean
        ... Yes, and he responded with several more appropriate bull and cow names (revealing that the Quenya for bull was =mundo=). I remember that one. --Margaret
        Message 3 of 5 , Apr 18 5:08 AM
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          Linda DeMars wrote:
          >
          > Thanks so much, Margaret for being so prompt. Yes, I have the quote
          > you mentioned - and the quote I saw had its own tart flavor.
          >
          > Off topic, remember the several letters to the woman who had a farm
          > where she raised fancy pure-bred cows and wanted to honor him by
          > calling the farm Rivendell and the cows Arwen and Galadriel, I think
          > the bull was to be Elrond or Celeborn.

          Yes, and he responded with several more appropriate bull and cow
          names (revealing that the Quenya for "bull" was =mundo=). I
          remember that one.


          --Margaret Dean
          <margdean@...>
        • John D Rateliff
          I don t recognize that quote. It doesn t come from anything in LETTERS OF JRRT. And if Tolkien had made such a definitive statement on such a contentious point
          Message 4 of 5 , Apr 18 9:50 AM
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            I don't recognize that quote. It doesn't come from anything in
            LETTERS OF JRRT. And if Tolkien had made such a definitive statement
            on such a contentious point as the balrog's appearance in any
            published source, I suspect we'd all be v. familiar with it. So I'd
            treat the statement as suspicious unless you can confirm it.
            Sorry not to be helpful.
            --JDR


            On Apr 17, 2007, at 6:40 PM, Linda DeMars wrote:
            > Help, please, all-knowing and learned list. I am writing an essay on
            > Forces of Good and Evil in Tolkien's writings and their possible
            > source (s) in mythology. Somewhere very recently I read a comment by
            > Tolkien himself about the Balrog and how he had never pictured it
            > (him) with horns and a tail. He may even have said, "He does not have
            > horns and a tail>" I thought it was in the Collected Letters and I
            > thought it was addressed to Zimmerman (?) who had plans at one time
            > to make a movie of LOTR trilogy. Naturally I cannot find the quote
            > now when I want to include it in my essay. Does this quote sound
            > familiar to anyone? Does anyone remember where it might be? I keep
            > going through the books I have looking and looking, and it's nowhere.
            >
            > Hopefully,
            >
            > Linda C. DeMars
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