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Lewis name origin question

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  • Oberhelman, D
    Greetings, I m asking this on behalf of a friend who is an avid Lewis reader. She is wondering if anyone might know the origin of the name Oyarsa from Out of
    Message 1 of 11 , Feb 5, 2007
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      Greetings,

      I'm asking this on behalf of a friend who is an avid Lewis reader.

      She is wondering if anyone might know the origin of the name "Oyarsa" from Out of the Silent Planet. She has heard of the term "Orisa" or "Orisha"--a spirit in the Yoruba religion of Africa and the New World/Brazil--and wondered if Lewis might have adapted that word when he coined the name for his eldil.

      Thank you for any light you can shed on the name.



      **************************************
      David D. Oberhelman
      Associate Professor
      Humanities-Social Sciences Division
      Oklahoma State University Library
      Stillwater, OK 74078
      Phone: (405) 744-9773 Fax: (405) 744-7579
      Email: d.oberhelman@...




      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • lakowskir
      Try looking at the entry for Oyarsa in Wikipedia, which suggests that it is derived via Bernard Silvestris s Cosmographia ultimately from the Greek
      Message 2 of 11 , Feb 5, 2007
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        Try looking at the entry for "Oyarsa" in Wikipedia,
        which suggests that it is derived via Bernard
        Silvestris's Cosmographia ultimately from the
        Greek "ousiarches" or "lords of being."
        Lewis if I remember rightly refers to Silvestris
        somewhere in the Space Trilogy but I can't
        remember where.

        Ronnie Lakowski
        --- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, "Oberhelman, D" <d.oberhelman@...>
        wrote:
        >
        > Greetings,
        >
        > I'm asking this on behalf of a friend who is an avid Lewis reader.
        >
        > She is wondering if anyone might know the origin of the
        name "Oyarsa" from Out of the Silent Planet. She has heard of the
        term "Orisa" or "Orisha"--a spirit in the Yoruba religion of Africa
        and the New World/Brazil--and wondered if Lewis might have adapted
        that word when he coined the name for his eldil.
        >
        > Thank you for any light you can shed on the name.
        >
        >
        >
        > **************************************
        > David D. Oberhelman
        > Associate Professor
        > Humanities-Social Sciences Division
        > Oklahoma State University Library
        > Stillwater, OK 74078
        > Phone: (405) 744-9773 Fax: (405) 744-7579
        > Email: d.oberhelman@...
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
      • Oberhelman, D
        Thanks, I didn t have a chance to Wiki it before referring it to the list! A Greek origin would make more sense for Lewis.
        Message 3 of 11 , Feb 5, 2007
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          Thanks, I didn't have a chance to Wiki it before referring it to the list! A Greek origin would make more sense for Lewis.


          **************************************
          David D. Oberhelman
          Associate Professor
          Humanities-Social Sciences Division
          Oklahoma State University Library
          Stillwater, OK 74078
          Phone: (405) 744-9773 Fax: (405) 744-7579
          Email: d.oberhelman@...



          -----Original Message-----
          From: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com on behalf of lakowskir
          Sent: Mon 2/5/2007 4:01 PM
          To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [mythsoc] Re: Lewis name origin question

          Try looking at the entry for "Oyarsa" in Wikipedia,
          which suggests that it is derived via Bernard
          Silvestris's Cosmographia ultimately from the
          Greek "ousiarches" or "lords of being."
          Lewis if I remember rightly refers to Silvestris
          somewhere in the Space Trilogy but I can't
          remember where.

          Ronnie Lakowski
          --- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, "Oberhelman, D" <d.oberhelman@...>
          wrote:
          >
          > Greetings,
          >
          > I'm asking this on behalf of a friend who is an avid Lewis reader.
          >
          > She is wondering if anyone might know the origin of the
          name "Oyarsa" from Out of the Silent Planet. She has heard of the
          term "Orisa" or "Orisha"--a spirit in the Yoruba religion of Africa
          and the New World/Brazil--and wondered if Lewis might have adapted
          that word when he coined the name for his eldil.
          >
          > Thank you for any light you can shed on the name.
          >
          >
          >
          > **************************************
          > David D. Oberhelman
          > Associate Professor
          > Humanities-Social Sciences Division
          > Oklahoma State University Library
          > Stillwater, OK 74078
          > Phone: (405) 744-9773 Fax: (405) 744-7579
          > Email: d.oberhelman@...
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >





          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Merlin DeTardo
          How funny: having this friend in common with David, I checked wikipedia last week about the origin of Oyarsa , and found nothing; the source of name section
          Message 4 of 11 , Feb 5, 2007
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            How funny: having this friend in common with David, I checked
            wikipedia last week about the origin of "Oyarsa", and found nothing;
            the "source of name" section seems to have been added to
            wikipedia's "Oyarsa" entry only yesterday.

            -Merlin DeTardo


            >---"Oberhelman, D" <d.oberhelman@...> wrote:
            > Thanks, I didn't have a chance to Wiki it before referring it to
            the list! A Greek origin would make more sense for Lewis.


            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: lakowskir
            > Sent: Mon 2/5/2007 4:01 PM
            > Subject: Re: Lewis name origin question
            > Try looking at the entry for "Oyarsa" in Wikipedia, which suggests
            that it is derived via Bernard Silvestris's Cosmographia ultimately
            from the Greek "ousiarches" or "lords of being." Lewis if I remember
            rightly refers to Silvestris somewhere in the Space Trilogy but I
            can't remember where.
          • Oberhelman, D
            Ah, interesting that the entry was apparently altered within a day or two. One of the advantages of Wikis is that they can updated quickly. Yet there are
            Message 5 of 11 , Feb 5, 2007
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              Ah, interesting that the entry was apparently altered within a day or two. One of the advantages of Wikis is that they can updated quickly. Yet there are still many dangers in relying upon "community policing" to ensure quality and accuracy. I will have to use this as an example in the discussion topic I am giving the undergraduates in my online Library Science research skills course (they are looking at how Wiki sites differ from traditional, peer-reviewed information sources with known authors).

              I have looked at the Tolkien Wiki (http://www.thetolkienwiki.org) a few times, and it has some decent material, but the entries are very inconsistent in quality and detail.



              **************************************
              David D. Oberhelman
              Associate Professor
              Humanities-Social Sciences Division
              Oklahoma State University Library
              Stillwater, OK 74078
              Phone: (405) 744-9773 Fax: (405) 744-7579
              Email: d.oberhelman@...



              -----Original Message-----
              From: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com on behalf of Merlin DeTardo
              Sent: Mon 2/5/2007 4:28 PM
              To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [mythsoc] Re: Lewis name origin question

              How funny: having this friend in common with David, I checked
              wikipedia last week about the origin of "Oyarsa", and found nothing;
              the "source of name" section seems to have been added to
              wikipedia's "Oyarsa" entry only yesterday.

              -Merlin DeTardo




              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • John D Rateliff
              Check the last chapter of OUT OF THE SILENT PLANET, where Ransom writes to CSL himself for more information about Bernardus Silvestris use of the word
              Message 6 of 11 , Feb 5, 2007
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                Check the last chapter of OUT OF THE SILENT PLANET, where 'Ransom'
                writes to CSL himself for more information about Bernardus
                Silvestris' use of the word OYARSES.

                --JDR


                On Feb 5, 2007, at 2:01 PM, lakowskir wrote:

                > Try looking at the entry for "Oyarsa" in Wikipedia,
                > which suggests that it is derived via Bernard
                > Silvestris's Cosmographia ultimately from the
                > Greek "ousiarches" or "lords of being."
                > Lewis if I remember rightly refers to Silvestris
                > somewhere in the Space Trilogy but I can't
                > remember where.
              • Jeremy Edmonds
                The Tolkien Wiki you mention was last updated in May of 2006, and doesn t seem all that active. You might also try http://www.tolkiengateway.net - it was
                Message 7 of 11 , Feb 5, 2007
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                  The Tolkien Wiki you mention was last updated in May of 2006, and doesn't seem
                  all that active. You might also try http://www.tolkiengateway.net - it was
                  started two years ago, but is quite active. I have no formed opinion on the
                  quality and detail of all the articles, there are more than 5000 now and I have
                  read only a handful.

                  Another example of how Wiki sites differ from other information sources. Two
                  years from now, Tolkien Gateway could well be stale and some other site have
                  taken up the mantle.

                  Jeremy

                  --- "Oberhelman, D" <d.oberhelman@...> wrote:

                  >
                  > Ah, interesting that the entry was apparently altered within a day or two.
                  > One of the advantages of Wikis is that they can updated quickly. Yet there
                  > are still many dangers in relying upon "community policing" to ensure quality
                  > and accuracy. I will have to use this as an example in the discussion topic
                  > I am giving the undergraduates in my online Library Science research skills
                  > course (they are looking at how Wiki sites differ from traditional,
                  > peer-reviewed information sources with known authors).
                  >
                  > I have looked at the Tolkien Wiki (http://www.thetolkienwiki.org) a few
                  > times, and it has some decent material, but the entries are very inconsistent
                  > in quality and detail.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > **************************************
                  > David D. Oberhelman
                  > Associate Professor
                  > Humanities-Social Sciences Division
                  > Oklahoma State University Library
                  > Stillwater, OK 74078
                  > Phone: (405) 744-9773 Fax: (405) 744-7579
                  > Email: d.oberhelman@...
                • lakowskir
                  I found the source for the Wikipedia entry. Walter Hooper in C.S. Lewis Companion and Guide (207-08) quotes the relevant passage from Bernardus Silvestris in
                  Message 8 of 11 , Feb 5, 2007
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                    I found the "source" for the Wikipedia entry. Walter Hooper in C.S. Lewis
                    Companion and Guide (207-08) quotes the relevant passage from Bernardus
                    Silvestris in Latin with an English translation. He also adds that one
                    of Lewis's colleagues at Madgalen had suggested to him that "Oyarses"
                    was a corruption of "Ousiarches" from Pseudo-Apuleius. Besides, the
                    reference noted by John Rateliff to Ch.22 of Out of the Silent Planet,
                    Lewis seems to be also translating from him at the end of the Postscript.

                    Lewis refers to Silvestris in a number of his academic works (see Bernardus
                    Silvestris in the Indices), including Studies in Medieval and Renaissance
                    Literature, The Discarded Image, Studies in Words, A Preface to Paradise
                    Lost, and The Allegory of Love, in which he devotes several pages (90-98
                    in my edition) to Bernardus. He also includes a quote from him at the
                    beginning of Book 10 of A Pilgrim's Regress.

                    There is a convenient translation of the Cosmographia in the Columbia
                    Records of Civilization series (1973) and an edition of the Latin text
                    by Peter Dronke (1978).

                    Romuald (Ronnie) I. Lakowski


                    --- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, John D Rateliff <sacnoth@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Check the last chapter of OUT OF THE SILENT PLANET, where 'Ransom'
                    > writes to CSL himself for more information about Bernardus
                    > Silvestris' use of the word OYARSES.
                    >
                    > --JDR
                    >
                    >
                    > On Feb 5, 2007, at 2:01 PM, lakowskir wrote:
                    >
                    > > Try looking at the entry for "Oyarsa" in Wikipedia,
                    > > which suggests that it is derived via Bernard
                    > > Silvestris's Cosmographia ultimately from the
                    > > Greek "ousiarches" or "lords of being."
                    > > Lewis if I remember rightly refers to Silvestris
                    > > somewhere in the Space Trilogy but I can't
                    > > remember where.
                    >
                  • John D Rateliff
                    Happened to catch a snippet of the House debate on the non-binding resolution today, and tickled to see that one Rep. Mike Pence (Republican of Indiana) quoted
                    Message 9 of 11 , Feb 16, 2007
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                      Happened to catch a snippet of the House debate on the non-binding
                      resolution today, and tickled to see that one Rep. Mike Pence
                      (Republican of Indiana) quoted from C. S. Lewis in his speech
                      opposing the measure (I didn't recognize the quote; something about
                      courage). Does this mean he's becoming ubiquitous?
                      --JDR
                    • WendellWag@aol.com
                      I just did a Google on Mike Pence, C. S. Lewis, and resolution, and I found the following news story:
                      Message 10 of 11 , Feb 17, 2007
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                        I just did a Google on "Mike Pence," "C. S. Lewis," and "resolution," and I
                        found the following news story:


                        _http://mikepence.house.gov/News/DocumentSingle.aspx?DocumentID=58224_
                        (http://mikepence.house.gov/News/DocumentSingle.aspx?DocumentID=58224)
                        The quotation from Lewis is the following:
                        C. S. Lewis said "courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of
                        every virtue at the testing point."
                        Further Googling tells me that it's in _The Screwtape Letters_. The one
                        place where a webpage mentions where it's at in that book says that it's in the
                        28th letter. Flipping through my copy of the book though, I find it in the
                        29th letter. Does the numbering of the letters differ in difference editions?
                        Wendell Wagner


                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • kim4fsu
                        ... and resolution, and I ... DocumentID=58224_ ... DocumentID=58224) ... the form of ... The one ... that it s in the ... it in the ... difference editions?
                        Message 11 of 11 , Feb 17, 2007
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                          --- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, WendellWag@... wrote:
                          >
                          > I just did a Google on "Mike Pence," "C. S. Lewis,"
                          and "resolution," and I
                          > found the following news story:
                          >
                          >
                          > _http://mikepence.house.gov/News/DocumentSingle.aspx?
                          DocumentID=58224_
                          > (http://mikepence.house.gov/News/DocumentSingle.aspx?
                          DocumentID=58224)
                          > The quotation from Lewis is the following:
                          > C. S. Lewis said "courage is not simply one of the virtues, but
                          the form of
                          > every virtue at the testing point."
                          > Further Googling tells me that it's in _The Screwtape Letters_.
                          The one
                          > place where a webpage mentions where it's at in that book says
                          that it's in the
                          > 28th letter. Flipping through my copy of the book though, I find
                          it in the
                          > 29th letter. Does the numbering of the letters differ in
                          difference editions?
                          > Wendell Wagner
                          >
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                          Kim here - and this is my first post to this group after lurking a
                          while, so, please bear with me!

                          I have an old, ratty paperback version of Screwtape - which was the
                          first of CS Lewis's works I read as a child after finishing Narnia -
                          and the quote is in the 29th letter. I checked my new version of his
                          signature classices, and it's in the 29th letter there, as well. I
                          can't imagine any version changing the numbering.

                          And, no matter which side you're on in the war debate - isn't this a
                          great quote to use? It's always encouraging to me when
                          contemporaries seek wisdom from great thinkers and writers.

                          Kim Jaudon
                          >
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