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RE: [mythsoc] count the errors

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  • Jay Hershberger
    Thanks, John. I look forward to reading them all. Cheers, Jay Hershberger Moorhead, MN ... From: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com [mailto:mythsoc@yahoogroups.com] On
    Message 1 of 18 , Nov 7, 2005
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      Thanks, John. I look forward to reading them all.

      Cheers,

      Jay Hershberger
      Moorhead, MN

      -----Original Message-----
      From: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com [mailto:mythsoc@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
      Of John D Rateliff
      Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 12:46 PM
      To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com; mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: RE: [mythsoc] count the errors

      Actually, of the three main biographies on CSL, I'd recommend starting
      with the Green & Hooper. That's the authorized biography, and it does
      the best job of discussing the main outlines of his life, works, and
      career. Although now more than thirty years old, it's still not been
      superceded as a whole. Then if you'd like to read more I'd read the
      Sayer next, since it's a warm portrait by a friend, as much memoir as
      biography; it'll convey why Lewis's friends thought so highly of him.
      Its main shortcoming is that it's too uncritical of its subject, which
      isn't that much of a flaw in a biography. Then I'd read the Wilson,
      who's deliberately iconoclastic and wants to establish that, all in all,
      CSL while talents was also a rather strange man.
      Or, if you want a shorter take on things, Carpenter's THE INKLINGS is
      as much a biography of CSL as the group.
      Enjoy!
      --JDR

      P.S.: "Never wrote another word" is White's garbled version of a comment
      by Carpenter that, after his mauling by Anscombe, CSL stopped writing
      straightforward apologetics for many years and, when he resumed, his
      religious books were much more personal in tone (e.g., MIRACLES, THE
      PROBLEM OF PAIN, MERE XIANITY vs. REFLECTIONS ON THE PSALMS and LETTERS
      TO MALCOLM: CHIEFLY ON PRAYER).


      -----Original Message-----
      From: Jay Hershberger <hershjay@...>
      Sent: Nov 7, 2005 10:27 AM
      To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: RE: [mythsoc] count the errors

      Thanks for the information, David. And to all who responded. I think I
      will start with Sayer's book on Lewis.

      Cheers,

      Jay Hershberger
      Moorhead, MN



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    • David Bratman
      ... I d start with Sayer for exactly the same reason. G&H is a valuable source, but much too dry for casual reading. Also, G&H was recently massively
      Message 2 of 18 , Nov 7, 2005
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        At 10:46 AM 11/7/2005 -0800, John D. Rateliff wrote:
        >Actually, of the three main biographies on CSL, I'd recommend starting with
        >the Green & Hooper. That's the authorized biography, and it does the best
        >job of discussing the main outlines of his life, works, and career. Although
        >now more than thirty years old, it's still not been superceded as a whole.
        >Then if you'd like to read more I'd read the Sayer next, since it's a warm
        >portrait by a friend, as much memoir as biography; it'll convey why Lewis's
        >friends thought so highly of him.

        I'd start with Sayer for exactly the same reason. G&H is a valuable
        source, but much too dry for casual reading. Also, G&H was recently
        massively rewritten and extended by H, and I haven't studied all the
        changes; nor are all editions that say "revised" actually the rewritten
        edition.

        >P.S.: "Never wrote another word" is White's garbled version of a comment by
        >Carpenter that, after his mauling by Anscombe, CSL stopped writing
        >straightforward apologetics for many years and, when he resumed, his
        >religious books were much more personal in tone (e.g., MIRACLES, THE PROBLEM
        >OF PAIN, MERE XIANITY vs. REFLECTIONS ON THE PSALMS and LETTERS TO MALCOLM:
        >CHIEFLY ON PRAYER).

        Thank you; that clarifies the point better than I did.

        David Bratman
      • Mike Foster
        I agree with David. Who better to tell the story of Lewis life than one who was taught then mentored and then befriended by him? Begin with Sayer. Mike ...
        Message 3 of 18 , Nov 7, 2005
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          I agree with David. Who better to tell the story of Lewis' life than
          one who was taught then mentored and then befriended by him? Begin with
          Sayer.

          Mike

          David Bratman wrote:

          >At 10:46 AM 11/7/2005 -0800, John D. Rateliff wrote:
          >
          >
          >>Actually, of the three main biographies on CSL, I'd recommend starting with
          >>the Green & Hooper. That's the authorized biography, and it does the best
          >>job of discussing the main outlines of his life, works, and career. Although
          >>now more than thirty years old, it's still not been superceded as a whole.
          >>Then if you'd like to read more I'd read the Sayer next, since it's a warm
          >>portrait by a friend, as much memoir as biography; it'll convey why Lewis's
          >>friends thought so highly of him.
          >>
          >>
          >
          >I'd start with Sayer for exactly the same reason. G&H is a valuable
          >source, but much too dry for casual reading. Also, G&H was recently
          >massively rewritten and extended by H, and I haven't studied all the
          >changes; nor are all editions that say "revised" actually the rewritten
          >edition.
          >
          >
          >
          >>P.S.: "Never wrote another word" is White's garbled version of a comment by
          >>Carpenter that, after his mauling by Anscombe, CSL stopped writing
          >>straightforward apologetics for many years and, when he resumed, his
          >>religious books were much more personal in tone (e.g., MIRACLES, THE PROBLEM
          >>OF PAIN, MERE XIANITY vs. REFLECTIONS ON THE PSALMS and LETTERS TO MALCOLM:
          >>CHIEFLY ON PRAYER).
          >>
          >>
          >
          >Thank you; that clarifies the point better than I did.
          >
          >David Bratman
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >The Mythopoeic Society website http://www.mythsoc.org
          >Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Mike Foster
          I finally read the White blurb since the chat about it had been so lively. I stopped counting at 5. Mike
          Message 4 of 18 , Nov 7, 2005
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            I finally read the White blurb since the chat about it had been so lively.

            I stopped counting at 5.

            Mike

            David Bratman wrote:

            >Michael White, author of the most error-ridden book on Tolkien ever
            >published, is now similarly hacking his way around C.S. Lewis.
            >
            ><http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2092-1859141,00.html>
            >
            >David Bratman
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >The Mythopoeic Society website http://www.mythsoc.org
            >Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
          • Stolzi
            Doug Gresham, who spoke at the opening banquet for PAST WATCHFUL DRAGONS, sold copies of his new (rather slight) book JACK S LIFE. I was aggravated to have
            Message 5 of 18 , Nov 7, 2005
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              Doug Gresham, who spoke at the opening banquet for PAST WATCHFUL DRAGONS,
              sold copies of his new (rather slight) book JACK'S LIFE. I was aggravated
              to have bought it bec it is obviously by
              its style - and overtly in so many words, in the conclusion - a bio of Lewis
              for children, yet it was marketed at this conference without ever a word or
              hint to that effect.

              Well, at least it was cheap; and it isn't too =bad=.

              I did think he was rather riding a hobby horse in an excess number of
              paragraphs about How Awful War Is. Sure, it is awful, and the two wars
              surely had a large impact on CSL as well as his friends and family. But I
              don't think Lewis himself would have wanted to dwell on the subject that
              much, - stiff upper lip and all that. And it comes ill from a man like Doug
              who as far as I know has never been in any war. In fact, this morning in
              LETTERS v. 2, I was just reading some wartime snarky comments from Jack
              about high-minded intellectual c.o.'s who have never, he says, been known to
              be troubled by their consciences about anything before.

              It would be great to influence all the children of the world forever against
              war. If it could be ALL the children of the world. I don't see that
              situation today.

              Diamond Proudbrook
            • Mike Foster
              I concur with Diamond s assessment. The book needed a better copy editing job--typos as soon as p. 4--and danced over the difficult bits, but so did Colin
              Message 6 of 18 , Nov 7, 2005
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                I concur with Diamond's assessment. The book needed a better copy
                editing job--typos as soon as p. 4--and danced over the difficult bits,
                but so did Colin D.'s book on CSL & JRRT.

                More later. A salmon calls.

                Stolzi wrote:

                > Doug Gresham, who spoke at the opening banquet for PAST WATCHFUL DRAGONS,
                >sold copies of his new (rather slight) book JACK'S LIFE. I was aggravated
                >to have bought it bec it is obviously by
                >its style - and overtly in so many words, in the conclusion - a bio of Lewis
                >for children, yet it was marketed at this conference without ever a word or
                >hint to that effect.
                >
                >Well, at least it was cheap; and it isn't too =bad=.
                >
                >I did think he was rather riding a hobby horse in an excess number of
                >paragraphs about How Awful War Is. Sure, it is awful, and the two wars
                >surely had a large impact on CSL as well as his friends and family. But I
                >don't think Lewis himself would have wanted to dwell on the subject that
                >much, - stiff upper lip and all that. And it comes ill from a man like Doug
                >who as far as I know has never been in any war. In fact, this morning in
                >LETTERS v. 2, I was just reading some wartime snarky comments from Jack
                >about high-minded intellectual c.o.'s who have never, he says, been known to
                >be troubled by their consciences about anything before.
                >
                >It would be great to influence all the children of the world forever against
                >war. If it could be ALL the children of the world. I don't see that
                >situation today.
                >
                >Diamond Proudbrook
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >The Mythopoeic Society website http://www.mythsoc.org
                >Yahoo! Groups Links
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
              • Hugh Davis
                I had great hopes that _Jack s Life_ would feature more stories like the one Doug Gresham shared in the Q&A at Past Watchful Dragons (about the archer), but,
                Message 7 of 18 , Nov 7, 2005
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                  I had great hopes that _Jack's Life_ would feature more stories like the one
                  Doug Gresham shared in the Q&A at Past Watchful Dragons (about the archer),
                  but, alas, the anecdotes are less salacious.

                  Hugh


                  >From: "Stolzi" <Stolzi@...>
                  >Reply-To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                  >To: <mythsoc@yahoogroups.com>
                  >Subject: Re: [mythsoc] count the errors
                  >Date: Mon, 7 Nov 2005 16:23:18 -0600
                  >
                  > Doug Gresham, who spoke at the opening banquet for PAST WATCHFUL DRAGONS,
                  >sold copies of his new (rather slight) book JACK'S LIFE. I was aggravated
                  >to have bought it bec it is obviously by
                  >its style - and overtly in so many words, in the conclusion - a bio of
                  >Lewis
                  >for children, yet it was marketed at this conference without ever a word or
                  >hint to that effect.
                  >
                  >Well, at least it was cheap; and it isn't too =bad=.
                  >
                  >I did think he was rather riding a hobby horse in an excess number of
                  >paragraphs about How Awful War Is. Sure, it is awful, and the two wars
                  >surely had a large impact on CSL as well as his friends and family. But I
                  >don't think Lewis himself would have wanted to dwell on the subject that
                  >much, - stiff upper lip and all that. And it comes ill from a man like
                  >Doug
                  >who as far as I know has never been in any war. In fact, this morning in
                  >LETTERS v. 2, I was just reading some wartime snarky comments from Jack
                  >about high-minded intellectual c.o.'s who have never, he says, been known
                  >to
                  >be troubled by their consciences about anything before.
                  >
                  >It would be great to influence all the children of the world forever
                  >against
                  >war. If it could be ALL the children of the world. I don't see that
                  >situation today.
                  >
                  >Diamond Proudbrook
                  >
                  >
                • Jay Hershberger
                  Thanks, Mike. Cheers, Jay Hershberger Moorhead, MN ... From: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com [mailto:mythsoc@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Mike Foster Sent: Monday,
                  Message 8 of 18 , Nov 7, 2005
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                    Thanks, Mike.

                    Cheers,

                    Jay Hershberger
                    Moorhead, MN

                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com [mailto:mythsoc@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                    Of Mike Foster
                    Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 3:52 PM
                    To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [mythsoc] count the errors

                    I agree with David. Who better to tell the story of Lewis' life than
                    one who was taught then mentored and then befriended by him? Begin with

                    Sayer.

                    Mike

                    David Bratman wrote:

                    >At 10:46 AM 11/7/2005 -0800, John D. Rateliff wrote:
                    >
                    >
                    >>Actually, of the three main biographies on CSL, I'd recommend starting
                    with
                    >>the Green & Hooper. That's the authorized biography, and it does the
                    best
                    >>job of discussing the main outlines of his life, works, and career.
                    Although
                    >>now more than thirty years old, it's still not been superceded as a
                    whole.
                    >>Then if you'd like to read more I'd read the Sayer next, since it's a
                    warm
                    >>portrait by a friend, as much memoir as biography; it'll convey why
                    Lewis's
                    >>friends thought so highly of him.
                    >>
                    >>
                    >
                    >I'd start with Sayer for exactly the same reason. G&H is a valuable
                    >source, but much too dry for casual reading. Also, G&H was recently
                    >massively rewritten and extended by H, and I haven't studied all the
                    >changes; nor are all editions that say "revised" actually the rewritten
                    >edition.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >>P.S.: "Never wrote another word" is White's garbled version of a
                    comment by
                    >>Carpenter that, after his mauling by Anscombe, CSL stopped writing
                    >>straightforward apologetics for many years and, when he resumed, his
                    >>religious books were much more personal in tone (e.g., MIRACLES, THE
                    PROBLEM
                    >>OF PAIN, MERE XIANITY vs. REFLECTIONS ON THE PSALMS and LETTERS TO
                    MALCOLM:
                    >>CHIEFLY ON PRAYER).
                    >>
                    >>
                    >
                    >Thank you; that clarifies the point better than I did.
                    >
                    >David Bratman
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >The Mythopoeic Society website http://www.mythsoc.org
                    >Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >


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