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Re: [mythsoc] amazon ps

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  • Elizabeth Apgar Triano
    Yeah, I am getting it partly for the new material and art (I think), and partly to protect my old gift copy from other readers. Hmph I wish my stuff shipped
    Message 1 of 4 , Dec 31 5:35 AM
      Yeah, I am getting it partly for the "new material" and art (I think), and
      partly to protect my old gift copy from other readers. Hmph I wish my
      stuff shipped already. I should check what's holding that order up. Glad
      to be an instigator.

      Elizabeth Apgar Triano
      amor vincit omnia

      > I just ordered two books two days ago and they shipped already, with the
      > free shipping option. BTW, thanks for the discount on the Silmarillion,
      > it will give my UK first printing a rest.
      > Randall
    • tghsaw
      ... a ... in ... in ... Well, then, how about some more brain exercise--have to get you back in shape! ;-) Warning that this entire post is about who gets
      Message 2 of 4 , Jan 2, 2005
        > << More than you wanted to know, I'm sure, but if it helps the Society get
        > few more commissions... 8-) >>
        > Wow! Whew! Thank you.
        > I was only responsible for the second post, not the first one about
        > hardcovers and paperbacks.
        > I read what you pasted, but I still don't quite understand. So if I log
        > to amazon w/o mythsoc link. put stuff in my basket, go out, and later go
        > thru mythsoc, does it get it or no? If I go in thru mythsoc, put stuff in
        > my cart, but check out another time and not thru mythsoc, then it doesn't?
        > And that thing about two purchases on one login is especially interesting.
        > I can't wait until school starts again. I think my brain is completely
        > fried. Happy New Year, everyone.
        > Lizzie
        > Elizabeth Apgar Triano
        > lizziewriter@...
        > amor vincit omnia
        > www.lizziewriter.com
        > www.danburymineralogicalsociety.org
        > >

        Well, then, how about some more brain exercise--have to get you back in
        shape! ;-)

        Warning that this entire post is about who gets credit for an Amazon
        purchase; anyone not interested in that, _please_ skip to the next post!
        And, especially because this stuff takes w-a-y more explaining than it's
        probably worth, if anyone has more questions maybe they should be emailed to
        me (or to whoever is in charge of the mythsoc associate program). I don't
        imagine this is quite on-topic for the list, and a seemingly simple question
        can have anything but a simple answer! 8-)

        Also a big caveat here that I'm neither an attorney nor an Amazon
        employee/spokesperson, but this is how I understand it. If someone spots
        something they know is wrong, please post a correction or let me know!

        I just re-read what I pasted, and I think I might contact Amazon suggesting
        they change one word in the first paragraph. They use the word "purchases"
        in a place where it seems they're talking about items being put into the
        shopping cart. Whether they mean that or something else, "purchases" is
        really ambiguous there.

        But the answer to your question would be in the second paragraph:

        "It is of course possible that a customer may arrive at Amazon.com via your
        Associates link, add an item to his Shopping Cart, and then leave Amazon.com
        without placing an order. As long as the item was added to the customer's
        Shopping Cart during this 24-hour window, you will still earn a referral fee
        if the order is placed before the Shopping Cart expires (usually after 90

        So if someone enters Amazon through a mythsoc link, puts an item into his
        shopping cart while still "tagged" with mythsoc's associate ID number (see
        below), and comes back and purchases the item that's in the shopping cart
        within "usually"?? 90 days, mythsoc would be credited _whether or not_ the
        customer entered through mythsoc's link when he actually ordered it.

        OTOH, if someone puts something into the shopping cart while _not_ "tagged"
        with mythsoc's associate ID, mythsoc does not get credit for the sale, _even
        if_ the customer enters through mythsoc's site when he actually orders it.

        Maybe it would help to look at this from the POV of two associates--the one
        JC uses to put something into his shopping cart, and the one he uses to
        actually place the order. When we say "mythsoc doesn't get the credit,"
        that's because a different associate is getting it--and vice versa. They're
        both playing by the same rules. (The exception, of course, is when someone
        doesn't use any affiliate link, but just browses directly to
        http:www.amazon.com, in which case Amazon gets to keep all the money.)

        One reason this is complicated is that we're looking at the system from an
        angle it's not meant to address. The system doesn't consider the idea that a
        _customer_ might be interested in who's getting the commission for a sale.
        Amazon's careful to work things so that _associates_ are all treated the
        same; the program would probably fall apart if they didn't.

        I think another reason it's complicated is that Amazon seems to use its
        usual tracking/cookie system to decide when a customer's session ends, and
        if an associate link is involved that just becomes part of the system, as
        opposed to setting up an entirely separate system for tracking associate
        links; a separate system just for that would be more elegant, scientifically
        speaking--you'd hope! So, for any of this to make sense, it helps to think
        like a computer program (1/0, on/off, yes/no). There are no _people_
        watching and saying, for example, "Oh, he entered through a different site,
        so they don't get credit for this one." The computer simply flips things on
        and off as it's been programmed to do. BTW, I have a feeling this whole
        thing could get completely screwed up if a customer has cookies disabled.


        Joe Customer goes to mythsoc, clicks on a mythsoc associate link to
        Amazon--mythsoc ID is turned on.
        JC shops at Amazon. Anything he puts into his cart while mythsoc ID is
        turned on is "tagged" with the mythsoc ID.

        ID tag is turned off if JC:
        --leaves Amazon and re-enters through a different associate's link (because
        the second associate's ID is turned on, and two ID tags can't be on at the
        same time).
        --actually places an order (because, according to the computer, that ends
        JC's "session" and everything involving that "session" is turned off; this
        one in particular I blame on Amazon's use of their generic tracking system).
        --24 hours elapse (if the mythsoc ID is still "on" after 24 hours, the
        computer turns it off).

        But if an item was tagged with mythsoc's ID when it was placed into the
        shopping cart, _that_ tag stays on (because the computer still sees it as
        being connected with that "session"). The only time that would change is if
        the shopping cart "expires," because that turns off every tag connected with
        that shopping cart. (The equivalent of an employee at a "brick and mortar"
        store seeing a shopping cart sitting for so long that it's assumed to be
        abandoned, so he puts the stuff back on the shelves.) IMHO, the "usually"
        90 days is in the agreement to cover any associate complaints if some factor
        would happen to affect the 90-day length on a particular cart--again, it
        doesn't address the idea that a _customer_ might want to know who's getting
        the commission.

        So if JC enters Amazon through several different affiliates' links over a
        90-day period, puts an item into his cart during each session, and then
        actually orders the items all at the same time, each item would be credited
        to a different affiliate, because the system will "look at" the ID tag on
        each item.

        BTW, pre-orders are treated like orders (that is, there's no 90-day limit),
        _if_ the pre-order is actually placed, and the item isn't just put into the
        shopping cart. If JC clicked on a mythsoc associate link, went to Amazon
        today and pre-ordered HP6 (which isn't due to be released for 6-7 months),
        mythsoc would get the commission on the sale _when_ and _if_the item
        actually ships. If whoever's in charge of mythsoc's associate program checks
        their statistics, they'll see that copy of HP6 sitting in their "ordered
        items" file. If JC cancels the pre-order before the book ships, mythsoc
        gets no commission. That's true with anything ordered from Amazon, though;
        because Amazon doesn't charge JC's credit card until an item ships, mythsoc
        isn't credited with the commission until then.

        Now, if JC goes in through the mythsoc link, doesn't actually pre-order HP6
        but just puts it into his shopping cart thinking he'll come back and
        actually order it when it's released in 6-7 months--tough luck, because the
        shopping cart will have expired. If he wants the book, he has to start all
        over with putting it into his shopping cart, and whichever associate's ID
        he's tagged with when he puts the "new" copy into the cart will get the

        Are we having fun yet?? ;-)



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