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Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman

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  • dianejoy@earthlink.net
    I was on the committee, and gave *High House* a high vote. I don t recall where I placed Gaiman. I remember I liked it, marginally, but liked at least three
    Message 1 of 22 , Aug 4, 2004
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      I was on the committee, and gave *High House* a high vote. I don't recall
      where I placed Gaiman. I remember I liked it, marginally, but liked at
      least three others better: Stoddard, McKillip (one of her good ones) and
      the Kline. I think I liked the Kline better than McKillip and Stoddard
      best of all. (But I may be remembering things wrong.) ---djb

      Original Message:
      -----------------
      From: Jack jack@...
      Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2004 13:01:35 -0400
      To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman


      >I read Stardust while I was in San Diego. I understand that this title
      >won a Mythopoeic Fantasy award. What I don't understand is how it won a
      >Mythopoeic Fantasy Award. I found the novel flat, uninspiring, and not
      >particularly well written.
      >
      >Were the other nominees that year really that bad?

      Actually each was better than Stardust with The High House the most
      mythopoec.

      1999
      (Adult)
      * *Stardust by Neil Gaiman and Charles Vess
      * Someplace to be Flying by Charles de Lint
      * The History of our World Beyond the Wave by R.E. Klein
      * Song for the Basilisk by Patricia A. McKillip
      * The High House by James Stoddard

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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    • Jack
      ... The two Evenmere novels, The High House and The False House, were released in limited editions a few years.
      Message 2 of 22 , Aug 4, 2004
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        >I was on the committee, and gave *High House* a high vote. I don't recall
        >where I placed Gaiman. I remember I liked it, marginally, but liked at
        >least three others better: Stoddard, McKillip (one of her good ones) and
        >the Kline. I think I liked the Kline better than McKillip and Stoddard
        >best of all. (But I may be remembering things wrong.) ---djb

        The two Evenmere novels, The High House and The False House, were released
        in limited editions a few years.

        http://www.greenmanreview.com/book/book_stoddard_highhousesoulwave.html
      • dianejoy@earthlink.net
        ... From: Jack jack@greenmanreview.com Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 12:44:55 -0400 To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman ...
        Message 3 of 22 , Aug 4, 2004
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          Original Message:
          -----------------
          From: Jack jack@...
          Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 12:44:55 -0400
          To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman


          >I was on the committee, and gave *High House* a high vote. I don't recall
          >where I placed Gaiman. I remember I liked it, marginally, but liked at
          >least three others better: Stoddard, McKillip (one of her good ones) and
          >the Kline. I think I liked the Kline better than McKillip and Stoddard
          >best of all. (But I may be remembering things wrong.) ---djb

          >>The two Evenmere novels, The High House and The False House, were
          released
          >>in limited editions a few years.

          >>http://www.greenmanreview.com/book/book_stoddard_highhousesoulwave.html

          Have them both. Thank you. ---djb


          The Mythopoeic Society website http://www.mythsoc.org
          Yahoo! Groups Links






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        • Jack
          ... Stoddard s very proud of the job the publisher did on them. He didn t make anything off these editions, but they flew him to Nashville (I believe) and he
          Message 4 of 22 , Aug 4, 2004
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            >>>The two Evenmere novels, The High House and The False House, were
            >released
            >>>in limited editions a few years.
            >
            >>>http://www.greenmanreview.com/book/book_stoddard_highhousesoulwave.html
            >
            >Have them both. Thank you. ---djb

            Stoddard's very proud of the job the publisher did on them. He didn't make anything off these editions,
            but they flew him to Nashville (I believe) and he had a great time discussing the design with the SoulWave
            folks.
          • Stolzi
            I remember being really p.o. ed about STARDUST because he threw in a sex scene I thought was gratuitous, and thinking that for a parent with young children,
            Message 5 of 22 , Aug 4, 2004
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              I remember being really p.o.'ed about STARDUST because he threw in a sex scene I thought was gratuitous, and thinking that for a parent with young children, this would otherwise have been a fun book to share with the kids but now it wasn't.

              At the Mythcon he said he tried to write a pre-Tolkien fairytale in STARDUST, but I don't think he succeeded, as I remember the book, though it's been quite a while now, I think it could well be compared, not with the LOTR, but with Tolkien's shorter fairy tales and seem much like them.

              Diamond Proudbrook.


              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Jack
              I remember being really p.o. ed about STARDUST because he threw in a sex scene I thought was gratuitous, and thinking that for a parent with young children,
              Message 6 of 22 , Aug 4, 2004
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                I remember being really p.o.'ed about STARDUST because he threw in a sex
                scene I thought was gratuitous, and thinking that for a parent with young
                children, this would otherwise have been a fun book to share with the kids
                but now it wasn't.

                Was Stardust wriiten as anything but an adult novel? I though the sex scene
                made sense in terms of the plot as it had developed up to that point.

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Stolzi
                Well, I think it s billed as a fairy tale for adults, but when has that stopped sharing a good book with one s children? How many of you here handed LORD OF
                Message 7 of 22 , Aug 4, 2004
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                  Well, I think it's billed as a "fairy tale for adults," but when has that stopped sharing a good book with one's children? How many of you here handed LORD OF THE RINGS to the little darlings as soon as you thought they could absorb it? Or how many had children who found it for themselves? :)

                  Diamond Proudbrook
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: Jack
                  To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2004 2:30 PM
                  Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman


                  I remember being really p.o.'ed about STARDUST because he threw in a sex
                  scene I thought was gratuitous, and thinking that for a parent with young
                  children, this would otherwise have been a fun book to share with the kids
                  but now it wasn't.

                  Was Stardust wriiten as anything but an adult novel?


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • dianejoy@earthlink.net
                  Er, I must make a correction; I have both *High* and *False* in regular MMPB editions, not the new ones you referred to, though I d sure like to take a look
                  Message 8 of 22 , Aug 5, 2004
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                    Er, I must make a correction; I have both *High* and *False* in regular
                    MMPB editions, not the new ones you referred to, though I'd sure like to
                    take a look at the illustrations.

                    I love illustrations best when they act as "jumping off points" for the
                    imagination of the reader; I love Ted Nasmith's work for another reason:
                    because it captures as close as humanly possible, the images *I already had
                    in mind* as I read JRRT's work. ---djb

                    Original Message:
                    -----------------
                    From: Jack jack@...
                    Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 12:53:12 -0400
                    To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman


                    >>>The two Evenmere novels, The High House and The False House, were
                    >released
                    >>>in limited editions a few years.
                    >
                    >>>http://www.greenmanreview.com/book/book_stoddard_highhousesoulwave.html
                    >
                    >Have them both. Thank you. ---djb

                    Stoddard's very proud of the job the publisher did on them. He didn't make
                    anything off these editions,
                    but they flew him to Nashville (I believe) and he had a great time
                    discussing the design with the SoulWave
                    folks.



                    The Mythopoeic Society website http://www.mythsoc.org
                    Yahoo! Groups Links






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                  • dianejoy@earthlink.net
                    ... From: Stolzi Stolzi@comcast.net Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 13:58:10 -0500 To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman ... I
                    Message 9 of 22 , Aug 5, 2004
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                      Original Message:
                      -----------------
                      From: Stolzi Stolzi@...
                      Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 13:58:10 -0500
                      To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman


                      >I remember being really p.o.'ed about STARDUST because he threw in a sex
                      >scene I thought was gratuitous, and thinking that for a parent with young
                      >children, this would otherwise have been a fun book to share with the kids
                      >but now it wasn't.

                      I thought it inappropriate. Sometimes I wonder what audience Neil's trying
                      to hit. If it's a "Fairy Tale for Grownups" it should be so labeled,
                      either in a blurb or part of the title. The violence is often quite
                      reminiscent of normal fairy tales (before they got bowdlerized).

                      >At the Mythcon he said he tried to write a pre-Tolkien fairytale in
                      >STARDUST, but I don't think he succeeded, as I remember the book, though
                      >it's been quite a while now, I think it could well be compared, not with
                      >the LOTR, but with Tolkien's shorter fairy tales and seem much like them.

                      Good point. ---djb


                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




                      The Mythopoeic Society website http://www.mythsoc.org
                      Yahoo! Groups Links






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                    • Joshua Kronengold
                      ... Me. More to the point, at this point, he s hitting the audince of people who like Neil Gaiman s work, along with anyone who s only been clued in recently.
                      Message 10 of 22 , Aug 5, 2004
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                        dianejoy@... writes:
                        >I thought it inappropriate. Sometimes I wonder what audience Neil's trying
                        >to hit.

                        Me.

                        More to the point, at this point, he's hitting the audince of people
                        who like Neil Gaiman's work, along with anyone who's only been clued
                        in recently.

                        But even with Stardust, I don't think he's going for a child
                        audience--maybe with works like "The Day I Sold My Father For Two
                        Goldfish" or something.

                        --
                        Joshua Kronengold (mneme@(io.com, labcats.org)) |\ _,,,--,,_ ,)
                        --^-- "Get your mind right and you can make a stick /,`.-'`' -, ;-;;'
                        /\\ your wand and the sky your hat and a puddle |,4- ) )-,_ ) /\
                        /-\\\ your magic..." -- Granny Weatherwax '---''(_/--' (_/-'
                      • dianejoy@earthlink.net
                        ... From: Joshua Kronengold mneme@io.com Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 18:04:39 -0500 To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman ... I
                        Message 11 of 22 , Aug 6, 2004
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                          Original Message:
                          -----------------
                          From: Joshua Kronengold mneme@...
                          Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 18:04:39 -0500
                          To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman


                          dianejoy@... writes:
                          >I thought it inappropriate. Sometimes I wonder what audience Neil's trying
                          >to hit.

                          >Me.

                          >More to the point, at this point, he's hitting the audince of people
                          >who like Neil Gaiman's work, along with anyone who's only been clued
                          >in recently.

                          >But even with Stardust, I don't think he's going for a child
                          >audience--maybe with works like "The Day I Sold My Father For Two
                          >Goldfish" or something.

                          I need to re-read *Stardust* again. However, in terms of audience, I agree
                          that this is what NG's doing: he's found his target audience, which are
                          essentially "Neil Gaiman fans." I don't consider *Stardust* a child's
                          story, and that was my point.

                          I'm very fond of Gaiman's Sandman, and I also think that he's most powerful
                          when he's writing short stories. His novels are fine, but they don't have
                          that extra "punch," though they do make you think. ---djb

                          --
                          Joshua Kronengold (mneme@(io.com, labcats.org)) |\ _,,,--,,_
                          ,)
                          --^-- "Get your mind right and you can make a stick /,`.-'`' -, ;-;;'

                          /\\ your wand and the sky your hat and a puddle |,4- ) )-,_ ) /\

                          /-\\\ your magic..." -- Granny Weatherwax '---''(_/--' (_/-'




                          The Mythopoeic Society website http://www.mythsoc.org
                          Yahoo! Groups Links






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