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Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman

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  • Deidre
    ... Neil and Charles collaborated on this graphic novel, if that s one wishes to call it. The pictures and the story just go together perfectly IMHO. I can t
    Message 1 of 22 , Aug 3, 2004
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      At 01:13 PM 8/3/04 -0500, Joan wrote:
      >Matthew Winslow wrote:
      >
      > > Joan, did you read the print-only version or the 'graphic novel'? The Vess
      > > illustrations really bring the story to life.
      >
      >This was the "print-only" version.

      Neil and Charles collaborated on this graphic novel, if that's one wishes
      to call it. The pictures and the story just go together perfectly IMHO. I
      can't imagine the story without those pictures. Please try it again in the
      "illustrated" version. I would like to hope that you would think better of it.

      Btw, Vess is one of my favorite artists and Gaiman is one of my favorite
      writers, so I have always thought that their work together is magical.
      Mythopoeic, *shrugs* I don't know, but their work, together and separately,
      does resonate with me.

      Deidre
    • dianejoy@earthlink.net
      I was on the committee, and gave *High House* a high vote. I don t recall where I placed Gaiman. I remember I liked it, marginally, but liked at least three
      Message 2 of 22 , Aug 4, 2004
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        I was on the committee, and gave *High House* a high vote. I don't recall
        where I placed Gaiman. I remember I liked it, marginally, but liked at
        least three others better: Stoddard, McKillip (one of her good ones) and
        the Kline. I think I liked the Kline better than McKillip and Stoddard
        best of all. (But I may be remembering things wrong.) ---djb

        Original Message:
        -----------------
        From: Jack jack@...
        Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2004 13:01:35 -0400
        To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman


        >I read Stardust while I was in San Diego. I understand that this title
        >won a Mythopoeic Fantasy award. What I don't understand is how it won a
        >Mythopoeic Fantasy Award. I found the novel flat, uninspiring, and not
        >particularly well written.
        >
        >Were the other nominees that year really that bad?

        Actually each was better than Stardust with The High House the most
        mythopoec.

        1999
        (Adult)
        * *Stardust by Neil Gaiman and Charles Vess
        * Someplace to be Flying by Charles de Lint
        * The History of our World Beyond the Wave by R.E. Klein
        * Song for the Basilisk by Patricia A. McKillip
        * The High House by James Stoddard

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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      • Jack
        ... The two Evenmere novels, The High House and The False House, were released in limited editions a few years.
        Message 3 of 22 , Aug 4, 2004
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          >I was on the committee, and gave *High House* a high vote. I don't recall
          >where I placed Gaiman. I remember I liked it, marginally, but liked at
          >least three others better: Stoddard, McKillip (one of her good ones) and
          >the Kline. I think I liked the Kline better than McKillip and Stoddard
          >best of all. (But I may be remembering things wrong.) ---djb

          The two Evenmere novels, The High House and The False House, were released
          in limited editions a few years.

          http://www.greenmanreview.com/book/book_stoddard_highhousesoulwave.html
        • dianejoy@earthlink.net
          ... From: Jack jack@greenmanreview.com Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 12:44:55 -0400 To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman ...
          Message 4 of 22 , Aug 4, 2004
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            Original Message:
            -----------------
            From: Jack jack@...
            Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 12:44:55 -0400
            To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman


            >I was on the committee, and gave *High House* a high vote. I don't recall
            >where I placed Gaiman. I remember I liked it, marginally, but liked at
            >least three others better: Stoddard, McKillip (one of her good ones) and
            >the Kline. I think I liked the Kline better than McKillip and Stoddard
            >best of all. (But I may be remembering things wrong.) ---djb

            >>The two Evenmere novels, The High House and The False House, were
            released
            >>in limited editions a few years.

            >>http://www.greenmanreview.com/book/book_stoddard_highhousesoulwave.html

            Have them both. Thank you. ---djb


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          • Jack
            ... Stoddard s very proud of the job the publisher did on them. He didn t make anything off these editions, but they flew him to Nashville (I believe) and he
            Message 5 of 22 , Aug 4, 2004
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              >>>The two Evenmere novels, The High House and The False House, were
              >released
              >>>in limited editions a few years.
              >
              >>>http://www.greenmanreview.com/book/book_stoddard_highhousesoulwave.html
              >
              >Have them both. Thank you. ---djb

              Stoddard's very proud of the job the publisher did on them. He didn't make anything off these editions,
              but they flew him to Nashville (I believe) and he had a great time discussing the design with the SoulWave
              folks.
            • Stolzi
              I remember being really p.o. ed about STARDUST because he threw in a sex scene I thought was gratuitous, and thinking that for a parent with young children,
              Message 6 of 22 , Aug 4, 2004
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                I remember being really p.o.'ed about STARDUST because he threw in a sex scene I thought was gratuitous, and thinking that for a parent with young children, this would otherwise have been a fun book to share with the kids but now it wasn't.

                At the Mythcon he said he tried to write a pre-Tolkien fairytale in STARDUST, but I don't think he succeeded, as I remember the book, though it's been quite a while now, I think it could well be compared, not with the LOTR, but with Tolkien's shorter fairy tales and seem much like them.

                Diamond Proudbrook.


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Jack
                I remember being really p.o. ed about STARDUST because he threw in a sex scene I thought was gratuitous, and thinking that for a parent with young children,
                Message 7 of 22 , Aug 4, 2004
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                  I remember being really p.o.'ed about STARDUST because he threw in a sex
                  scene I thought was gratuitous, and thinking that for a parent with young
                  children, this would otherwise have been a fun book to share with the kids
                  but now it wasn't.

                  Was Stardust wriiten as anything but an adult novel? I though the sex scene
                  made sense in terms of the plot as it had developed up to that point.

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Stolzi
                  Well, I think it s billed as a fairy tale for adults, but when has that stopped sharing a good book with one s children? How many of you here handed LORD OF
                  Message 8 of 22 , Aug 4, 2004
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                    Well, I think it's billed as a "fairy tale for adults," but when has that stopped sharing a good book with one's children? How many of you here handed LORD OF THE RINGS to the little darlings as soon as you thought they could absorb it? Or how many had children who found it for themselves? :)

                    Diamond Proudbrook
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: Jack
                    To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2004 2:30 PM
                    Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman


                    I remember being really p.o.'ed about STARDUST because he threw in a sex
                    scene I thought was gratuitous, and thinking that for a parent with young
                    children, this would otherwise have been a fun book to share with the kids
                    but now it wasn't.

                    Was Stardust wriiten as anything but an adult novel?


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • dianejoy@earthlink.net
                    Er, I must make a correction; I have both *High* and *False* in regular MMPB editions, not the new ones you referred to, though I d sure like to take a look
                    Message 9 of 22 , Aug 5, 2004
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                      Er, I must make a correction; I have both *High* and *False* in regular
                      MMPB editions, not the new ones you referred to, though I'd sure like to
                      take a look at the illustrations.

                      I love illustrations best when they act as "jumping off points" for the
                      imagination of the reader; I love Ted Nasmith's work for another reason:
                      because it captures as close as humanly possible, the images *I already had
                      in mind* as I read JRRT's work. ---djb

                      Original Message:
                      -----------------
                      From: Jack jack@...
                      Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 12:53:12 -0400
                      To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman


                      >>>The two Evenmere novels, The High House and The False House, were
                      >released
                      >>>in limited editions a few years.
                      >
                      >>>http://www.greenmanreview.com/book/book_stoddard_highhousesoulwave.html
                      >
                      >Have them both. Thank you. ---djb

                      Stoddard's very proud of the job the publisher did on them. He didn't make
                      anything off these editions,
                      but they flew him to Nashville (I believe) and he had a great time
                      discussing the design with the SoulWave
                      folks.



                      The Mythopoeic Society website http://www.mythsoc.org
                      Yahoo! Groups Links






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                    • dianejoy@earthlink.net
                      ... From: Stolzi Stolzi@comcast.net Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 13:58:10 -0500 To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman ... I
                      Message 10 of 22 , Aug 5, 2004
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                        Original Message:
                        -----------------
                        From: Stolzi Stolzi@...
                        Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 13:58:10 -0500
                        To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman


                        >I remember being really p.o.'ed about STARDUST because he threw in a sex
                        >scene I thought was gratuitous, and thinking that for a parent with young
                        >children, this would otherwise have been a fun book to share with the kids
                        >but now it wasn't.

                        I thought it inappropriate. Sometimes I wonder what audience Neil's trying
                        to hit. If it's a "Fairy Tale for Grownups" it should be so labeled,
                        either in a blurb or part of the title. The violence is often quite
                        reminiscent of normal fairy tales (before they got bowdlerized).

                        >At the Mythcon he said he tried to write a pre-Tolkien fairytale in
                        >STARDUST, but I don't think he succeeded, as I remember the book, though
                        >it's been quite a while now, I think it could well be compared, not with
                        >the LOTR, but with Tolkien's shorter fairy tales and seem much like them.

                        Good point. ---djb


                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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                      • Joshua Kronengold
                        ... Me. More to the point, at this point, he s hitting the audince of people who like Neil Gaiman s work, along with anyone who s only been clued in recently.
                        Message 11 of 22 , Aug 5, 2004
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                          dianejoy@... writes:
                          >I thought it inappropriate. Sometimes I wonder what audience Neil's trying
                          >to hit.

                          Me.

                          More to the point, at this point, he's hitting the audince of people
                          who like Neil Gaiman's work, along with anyone who's only been clued
                          in recently.

                          But even with Stardust, I don't think he's going for a child
                          audience--maybe with works like "The Day I Sold My Father For Two
                          Goldfish" or something.

                          --
                          Joshua Kronengold (mneme@(io.com, labcats.org)) |\ _,,,--,,_ ,)
                          --^-- "Get your mind right and you can make a stick /,`.-'`' -, ;-;;'
                          /\\ your wand and the sky your hat and a puddle |,4- ) )-,_ ) /\
                          /-\\\ your magic..." -- Granny Weatherwax '---''(_/--' (_/-'
                        • dianejoy@earthlink.net
                          ... From: Joshua Kronengold mneme@io.com Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 18:04:39 -0500 To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman ... I
                          Message 12 of 22 , Aug 6, 2004
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                            Original Message:
                            -----------------
                            From: Joshua Kronengold mneme@...
                            Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 18:04:39 -0500
                            To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
                            Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Stardust by Neil Gaiman


                            dianejoy@... writes:
                            >I thought it inappropriate. Sometimes I wonder what audience Neil's trying
                            >to hit.

                            >Me.

                            >More to the point, at this point, he's hitting the audince of people
                            >who like Neil Gaiman's work, along with anyone who's only been clued
                            >in recently.

                            >But even with Stardust, I don't think he's going for a child
                            >audience--maybe with works like "The Day I Sold My Father For Two
                            >Goldfish" or something.

                            I need to re-read *Stardust* again. However, in terms of audience, I agree
                            that this is what NG's doing: he's found his target audience, which are
                            essentially "Neil Gaiman fans." I don't consider *Stardust* a child's
                            story, and that was my point.

                            I'm very fond of Gaiman's Sandman, and I also think that he's most powerful
                            when he's writing short stories. His novels are fine, but they don't have
                            that extra "punch," though they do make you think. ---djb

                            --
                            Joshua Kronengold (mneme@(io.com, labcats.org)) |\ _,,,--,,_
                            ,)
                            --^-- "Get your mind right and you can make a stick /,`.-'`' -, ;-;;'

                            /\\ your wand and the sky your hat and a puddle |,4- ) )-,_ ) /\

                            /-\\\ your magic..." -- Granny Weatherwax '---''(_/--' (_/-'




                            The Mythopoeic Society website http://www.mythsoc.org
                            Yahoo! Groups Links






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