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RE: Want Shinies!

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  • dianejoy@earthlink.net
    Ravens, ravens! And little girls, too; I remember how much I loved tiarras as a little girl. You know, the rhinestone ones? Lots of fun. Of course,
    Message 1 of 7 , Apr 23, 2004
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      Ravens, ravens! And little girls, too; I remember how much I loved
      tiarras as a little girl. You know, the rhinestone ones? Lots of fun. Of
      course, dragons love sparklies, too, and I like the idea of being a dragon
      at times. ---djb

      Original Message:
      -----------------
      From: Elizabeth Apgar Triano lizziewriter@...
      Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 16:32:56 -0400
      To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: RE: Want Shinies! Re: [mythsoc] The Silmarillion, condensed...a lot


      Well, that explains my love of shinies, sparklies, and other flashy
      stuff <g>. >>

      Personally I've always considered it an aspect of the dragon blood. I have
      an essay on the subject in fact. Course I try to ignore those skeptics who
      say it's magpie and not dragon. Hmph.

      Lizzie Apgar Triano
      lizziewriter@...
      amor vincit omnia






      The Mythopoeic Society website http://www.mythsoc.org
      Yahoo! Groups Links






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    • Elizabeth Apgar Triano
      Ravens, ravens! And little girls, too; I remember how much I loved tiarras as a little girl. You know, the rhinestone ones? Lots of fun. Of course, dragons
      Message 2 of 7 , Apr 23, 2004
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        Ravens, ravens! And little girls, too; I remember how much I loved
        tiarras as a little girl. You know, the rhinestone ones? Lots of fun. Of
        course, dragons love sparklies, too, and I like the idea of being a dragon
        at times. ---djb >>

        Oh, I know, ravens. But they've become so dreadfully trendy that I wanted
        to use an example that wasn't. Ravens indeed! We have crows and they are
        such a nuisance. I'd like to see real ravens up close someday, indeed I
        would.

        I still collect glass gems. And I asked for (and got) a tiara for
        Christmas a couple of years ago, after all isn't every girl a princess?
        But I'm a dragon princess... I don't do ballet, I have big feet, and I'm
        cranky when I'm hungry. And, of course, any time I discard a piece of my
        hoard I deeply regret it afterward.

        Should we do a poll of how many members are dragons vs. how many are
        idealistic knight types?

        Lizzie Apgar Triano
        lizziewriter@...
        amor vincit omnia
      • Paul Labaki
        ... I m a little out of time, but I just found this set aside to get to later. I find Dragons to be the most fascinating of all fictional creatures, and
        Message 3 of 7 , Jun 20, 2004
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          > Original Message:
          > -----------------
          > From: Elizabeth Apgar Triano
          > lizziewriter@...
          > Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 16:32:56 -0400
          > To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: RE: Want Shinies! Re: [mythsoc] The
          > Silmarillion, condensed...a lot
          >
          >
          > Well, that explains my love of shinies, sparklies,
          > and other flashy
          > stuff <g>. >>
          >
          > Personally I've always considered it an aspect of
          > the dragon blood. I have
          > an essay on the subject in fact. Course I try to
          > ignore those skeptics who
          > say it's magpie and not dragon. Hmph.
          >
          > Lizzie Apgar Triano
          > lizziewriter@...
          > amor vincit omnia
          >

          I'm a little out of time, but I just found this set
          aside "to get to later."

          I find Dragons to be the most fascinating of all
          fictional creatures, and I'm always interested in
          learning how my understanding of them is like and
          differs from what other people think of them. Would
          you be willing to post your essay on the list, Lizzie,
          or at least a bit to get the flavor across?

          Peace,

          Paul



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        • Elizabeth Apgar Triano
          ... Hi, Paul, Dragons can be awesome. I think that, like Man, Woman, God(dess), and Love, they are many things to many people, and can even be many things to
          Message 4 of 7 , Jun 22, 2004
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            >I find Dragons to be the most fascinating of all
            >fictional creatures, and I'm always interested in
            >learning how my understanding of them is like and
            >differs from what other people think of them. Would
            >you be willing to post your essay on the list, Lizzie,
            >or at least a bit to get the flavor across?
            >Peace,
            >Paul

            Hi, Paul,

            Dragons can be awesome. I think that, like Man, Woman, God(dess), and
            Love, they are many things to many people, and can even be many things to
            the same person, at different times or different facets.

            I use the term "essay" in a very loose sense, perhaps it is more an
            "illustrative speech." Since I haven't seen an ixnay to that idea, sure,
            why not? I love getting flogged here, I suppose. But you have to give
            some facets of your understanding of them as well, is that fair? Give me a
            day or so to find it. Thanks,

            Lizzie


            Elizabeth Apgar Triano
            lizziewriter@...
            amor vincit omnia
          • dianejoy@earthlink.net
            I d like to read your essay, too, Lizzie (long as you re sending one out to Paul)! ---djb ... From: Elizabeth Apgar Triano lizziewriter@earthlink.net Date:
            Message 5 of 7 , Jun 22, 2004
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              I'd like to read your essay, too, Lizzie (long as you're sending one out to
              Paul)! ---djb

              Original Message:
              -----------------
              From: Elizabeth Apgar Triano lizziewriter@...
              Date: Tue, 22 Jun 2004 07:20:05 -0400
              To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [mythsoc] RE: Want Shinies!


              >I find Dragons to be the most fascinating of all
              >fictional creatures, and I'm always interested in
              >learning how my understanding of them is like and
              >differs from what other people think of them. Would
              >you be willing to post your essay on the list, Lizzie,
              >or at least a bit to get the flavor across?
              >Peace,
              >Paul

              Hi, Paul,

              Dragons can be awesome. I think that, like Man, Woman, God(dess), and
              Love, they are many things to many people, and can even be many things to
              the same person, at different times or different facets.

              I use the term "essay" in a very loose sense, perhaps it is more an
              "illustrative speech." Since I haven't seen an ixnay to that idea, sure,
              why not? I love getting flogged here, I suppose. But you have to give
              some facets of your understanding of them as well, is that fair? Give me a
              day or so to find it. Thanks,

              Lizzie


              Elizabeth Apgar Triano
              lizziewriter@...
              amor vincit omnia






              The Mythopoeic Society website http://www.mythsoc.org
              Yahoo! Groups Links






              --------------------------------------------------------------------
              mail2web - Check your email from the web at
              http://mail2web.com/ .
            • Paul Labaki
              ... Thanks for sharing, Lizzie. It was fun reading your essay (which I would call a dialog ). Sorry to disappoint you, but no flogging from this quarter
              Message 6 of 7 , Jun 22, 2004
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                --- Elizabeth Apgar Triano
                <lizziewriter@...> wrote:

                >
                > Dragons can be awesome. I think that, like Man,
                > Woman, God(dess), and
                > Love, they are many things to many people, and can
                > even be many things to
                > the same person, at different times or different
                > facets.
                >
                > I use the term "essay" in a very loose sense,
                > perhaps it is more an
                > "illustrative speech." Since I haven't seen an
                > ixnay to that idea, sure,
                > why not? I love getting flogged here, I suppose.
                > But you have to give
                > some facets of your understanding of them as well,
                > is that fair? Give me a
                > day or so to find it. Thanks,
                >
                > Lizzie
                >

                Thanks for sharing, Lizzie. It was fun reading your
                essay (which I would call a "dialog"). Sorry to
                disappoint you, but no flogging from this quarter
                today.

                It's fair to call me out, sure. So here goes a quick
                blurt as I shift from main job to #2. Some of the
                traits I expect when I think Dragon:

                1. Solitary, not necessarily lonely. Where do big
                dragons come from? It is not easy to see where they
                would grow up, (from cute little pet dragon sized, to
                say... Smaug sized). I also think dragons mating
                would devastate the landscape, so I suppose they must
                mate in the air to keep things relatively tidy.

                2. Charasmatic. Dragons have personality, and,
                considering the relative lack of social intercourse
                suggested by the last point, it is quite surprising
                that they can converse and be witty, sly, perceptive
                and charming. Most of course are quite intelligent,
                unlike other lizards, though very few are book
                learned.

                3. Their eyes can mesmerize other critters, including
                most regular joes (and janes).

                4. Dragons can do magic, although they generally show
                restraint.

                5. They have a sense of honor, meaning you can trust
                them not to lie and to try to match deeds to words,
                i.e., they will keep their word if they ever give it.
                This is quite an amazing thing since a person might be
                dinner on a dragon's whim if he hadn't promised safe
                passage, and destruction of a village might just be
                what happens after a bit of indigestion.

                6. They are complex emotionally, but are ruled by
                Greed (and Vengence if wronged).

                7. Of course Dragons can fly and are scaley and
                strong with claws and wings big enough to fly off with
                a yak for an afternoon snack, and they can be
                different colors and breath fire or ice etc. They can
                grow to be BIG. How big, well, maybe as big as your
                average California bungalow, maybe twice as big, but
                not much bigger than a blue whale.

                Now I'm ten minutes late so I have to go.
                Incidentally, I never think of the long skinny
                "Chinese Dragon" as the physical image of dragons. I
                always see what I think of in my minds' eye as
                "Northern" dragons, which are much broader and heavier
                with huge powerful hindquarters, smaller foreclaws and
                impossibly large wings.

                Peace,
                Paul




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              • Elizabeth Apgar Triano
                ... LOL Thassokay Paul, it wasn t from you that I feared it. Doesn t a dialog require more than one voice? I guess someone else would get the same thoughts
                Message 7 of 7 , Jun 23, 2004
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                  >Thanks for sharing, Lizzie. It was fun reading your
                  >essay (which I would call a "dialog"). Sorry to
                  >disappoint you, but no flogging from this quarter
                  >today.

                  LOL Thassokay Paul, it wasn't from you that I feared it. Doesn't a dialog
                  require more than one voice? I guess someone else would get the same
                  thoughts across with words like you use below, involving ancient and
                  knowledge of history and gems and other things, and size, in a nonfiction
                  manner.


                  >It's fair to call me out, sure. So here goes a quick
                  >blurt as I shift from main job to #2. Some of the
                  >traits I expect when I think Dragon:

                  >1. Solitary, not necessarily lonely. Where do big
                  >dragons come from? It is not easy to see where they
                  >would grow up, (from cute little pet dragon sized, to
                  >say... Smaug sized). I also think dragons mating
                  >would devastate the landscape, so I suppose they must
                  >mate in the air to keep things relatively tidy.

                  I think it's pretty classic and traditional to go for the dragon-alone
                  image. We don't know all that much about wolverines and coelacanths
                  either, although I think the former are more solitary and the latter more
                  gregarious. Maybe they have select mating areas, and that's where tundra
                  first emerged, or they bank their flames, or...


                  >2. Charasmatic. Dragons have personality, and,considering the relative
                  lack of social intercourse
                  >suggested by the last point, it is quite surprising
                  >that they can converse and be witty, sly, perceptive
                  >and charming. Most of course are quite intelligent,
                  >unlike other lizards, though very few are book
                  >learned.

                  Yes, charisma and wit and general learning. I would chalk that up to age
                  and intelligence. Thus you have charming ones and grumpy ones. I admit it
                  is hard to work in the literary side of dragons (how do you read with those
                  huge talons?) but that is where a handy-dandy human form comes in.


                  >3. Their eyes can mesmerize other critters, including
                  >most regular joes (and janes).

                  That can be magic or see above for #2, charisma.


                  > 4. Dragons can do magic, although they generally show
                  > restraint.

                  Yes. The fidgety point of many fantasies, how do you keep consistent rules
                  for magic? Why doesn't the dragon (or whomever) just magic the bad things
                  away? Their magic can be limited to things related to fire, for example.


                  >5. They have a sense of honor, meaning you can trust
                  >them not to lie and to try to match deeds to words,
                  >i.e., they will keep their word if they ever give it.
                  >This is quite an amazing thing since a person might be
                  >dinner on a dragon's whim if he hadn't promised safe
                  >passage, and destruction of a village might just be
                  >what happens after a bit of indigestion.

                  Also classic, I think. And the cunning use of this trait makes for many a
                  good tale.


                  > 6. They are complex emotionally, but are ruled by
                  > Greed (and Vengence if wronged).

                  Ah, I would say, not all dragons. Again, classic.


                  > 7. Of course Dragons can fly and are scaley and
                  >strong with claws and wings big enough to fly off with
                  >a yak for an afternoon snack, and they can be
                  >different colors and breath fire or ice etc. They can
                  >grow to be BIG. How big, well, maybe as big as your
                  >average California bungalow, maybe twice as big, but
                  >not much bigger than a blue whale.

                  Depends on the dragon. Yaks are pretty big. I like a dragon with a head
                  about 6' long and body to match, but some prefer them closer to the size of
                  an aircraft carrier. Is that bigger than a blue whale?


                  >Now I'm ten minutes late so I have to go. <

                  Isn't that always how it happens? Thank you !


                  >Incidentally, I never think of the long skinny
                  >"Chinese Dragon" as the physical image of dragons. I
                  >always see what I think of in my minds' eye as
                  >"Northern" dragons, which are much broader and heavier
                  >with huge powerful hindquarters, smaller foreclaws and
                  >impossibly large wings.

                  Yes, that is closer to my standard also, but I keep adding other
                  variations. And then what about critters that aren't really Dragons but
                  could belong to their extended family... winged serpents and the like? And
                  the scaley/heavy thing speaks of cold blooded, sort of... but if you handle
                  a snake, it has a lovely warm muscular feel to it. If you expand on that,
                  and use a seal-like head, like some tales of Nessie, it is closer to some
                  of the modern dino theories, quick and colorful. Not that I'd say dragons
                  were dinos, just it's a handy analogy.

                  C'mon all you dragon lovers, chime in. We don't have to be published
                  novelists like Melanie Rawn or Anne McCaffrey to have legitimate ideas
                  about dragons.

                  Lizzie

                  Elizabeth Apgar Triano
                  lizziewriter@...
                  amor vincit omnia
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