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Re: On the trail of hobbits?

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  • Stolzi@aol.com
    In a message dated 3/3/00 4:03:46 PM Central Standard Time, ... So was Queen Victoria, if I recall. Geo Washington, on the other hand, was 6 foot three in his
    Message 1 of 11 , Mar 3, 2000
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      In a message dated 3/3/00 4:03:46 PM Central Standard Time,
      jupalffy@... writes:

      > being something under 5 feet,

      So was Queen Victoria, if I recall. Geo Washington, on the other hand, was 6
      foot three in his prime.

      I find that figure about 4-foot Romans hard to believe. We have lots of
      life-size Roman statues remaining, has anyone measured them?

      Granted, of course, that Northern Europeans on the average were taller than
      Mediterraneans. I was told recently on another list that human height is a
      genetic given, with max attainment depending on nutrition; people in bygone
      ages =who got well fed= reached the same heights as their descendants today -
      but of course there were fewer who were well fed. This was from a study
      which measured actual buried bones, surviving clothing, etc.

      Inbreeding in a given smaller population can produce startling results: viz.
      Watusis or Pygmies. And if you want to know, Pygmies measured in the early
      1900's, it says here in my 1911 EB, averaged 4 1/2 feet, though some of 3 1/2
      or even 3 feet were known.

      Just for the record, I measure around 5 ft 7 and 3/4 inches. My mother is 5'
      6", my father topped six feet (as do my sons) and my father's mother was 6 ft
      tall, unusual in her day and age. Husband Conrad is around 5' 10". Racial
      derivation here, on both sides, largely northern European.

      Son John went to Carleton College, in Minnesota, and the dorm beds were
      extra-long twins for which we had to buy special sheets :)

      Mary S
    • Stolzi@aol.com
      In a message dated 3/3/00 2:34:43 PM Central Standard Time, ERATRIANO@aol.com ... True, but I meant you don t get the factual history webpage you are looking
      Message 2 of 11 , Mar 3, 2000
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        In a message dated 3/3/00 2:34:43 PM Central Standard Time, ERATRIANO@...
        writes:

        > << Role-playing games and rock bands are tops for generating false hits for
        > otherwise sensible words. >>
        > Well, uh, some gamers are also history and/or literature buffs. Just a
        > matter of asking the right person.

        True, but I meant you don't get the factual history webpage you are looking
        for on your word-search. I would never demean or impugn the intelligence of
        gamers.

        Mary S
      • David S. Bratman
        ... Somehow this causes me to think of four-footed Romans, and to imagine statues of Roman soldiers in glistening armour, posed awkwardly with their hands on
        Message 3 of 11 , Mar 3, 2000
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          On Fri, 3 Mar 2000 Stolzi@... wrote:

          > I find that figure about 4-foot Romans hard to believe. We have lots of
          > life-size Roman statues remaining, has anyone measured them?

          Somehow this causes me to think of four-footed Romans, and to imagine
          statues of Roman soldiers in glistening armour, posed awkwardly with
          their hands on the ground and their rears sticking up in the air.

          David Bratman
          - not responsible for the following advertisement -
        • Julia Palffy
          Stolzi@aol.com wrote: I find that figure about 4-foot Romans hard to believe. We have lots of life-size Roman statues remaining, has anyone measured them? I
          Message 4 of 11 , Mar 4, 2000
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            Stolzi@... wrote:

            I find that figure about 4-foot Romans hard to believe. We have lots of
            life-size Roman statues remaining, has anyone measured them?

            I remember found it hard to believe it too when I saw those petrified
            bodies... which is why I suggested the possibility of some "shrivelling" -
            but of course, I can't imagine that making more than a couple of inches
            difference. It's many years since I visited Pompeii, so my estimate may be a
            little wide of the mark, but I think not much.

            As to Roman statuary - It would depend on what it was made for in the first
            place.
            I visited the collection in the Vatican museums last November. There were
            too many different sizes to be really sure of which were life-size. Most of
            them, as I remember, were funerary statues. They did seem curiously
            proportioned in that they were just under what I would define as life-size,
            sort of the shape of adults but the height of children.
            I think the function of the statues would also influence their size: the
            statue of a famous consul or of some divinity, meant to be set up as a
            public monument, would be more likely to be carved somewhat oversize to look
            more impressive. And family Lares (statues of ancestors) might also depen on
            the price the sculptor asked for it or what the family could have afforded.
            So I'm not sure statues are a good reference to judge the size of actual
            people.

            Again, when I think of the Etruscan war-chariot I saw in the same museum, I
            think a five-foot man would almost have been too tall for it. I'm not sure
            whether it was meant for a single passenger or a charioteer and a passenger
            (in the latter case, only hobbits could actually have fitted into it without
            falling out at the first jerk!)And yet it certainly wasn't a toy!

            Thinking about it, a lot of historical artefacts I've seen in museums are
            unnervingly barely just too small to seem realistic - I've often wondered
            whether I could really believe what was written on the display label, or
            been tempted to think it must have been some kind of ritual object, not
            meant for actual wear, or been meant for a child, though it isn't anything
            child-like...


            Julia Palffy
            Zug, Switzerland
            jupalffy@...
          • ERATRIANO@aol.com
            I m a naturalized German/English type (thank you for that info on Cousin George), around five and a half feet tall and all the men on my side of the family
            Message 5 of 11 , Mar 4, 2000
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              I'm a "naturalized" German/English type (thank you for that info on Cousin
              George), around five and a half feet tall and all the men on my side of the
              family are 6' or over BUT I married a Northern Irish/Sicilian and most of the
              men on the Sicilian side are shorter than me, and of the Northern Irish some
              seem very short and others very tall (been there to visit the family)... not
              that you care... AND when doing the hitchhiking / train thing in 1985, my
              friend and I noticed, crossing the borders coming up from France into
              Germany, that everyone suddenly got a few inches taller on average. Didn't
              go into Italy and Greece. It's a pretty noticeable trend, if you are just
              blundering around prepared to notice it.

              Lizzie
            • ERATRIANO@aol.com
              In a message dated 03/03/2000 9:39:32 PM Eastern Standard Time, Stolzi@aol.com writes:
              Message 6 of 11 , Mar 4, 2000
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                In a message dated 03/03/2000 9:39:32 PM Eastern Standard Time,
                Stolzi@... writes:

                << True, but I meant you don't get the factual history webpage you are
                looking
                for on your word-search. I would never demean or impugn the intelligence of
                gamers. >>
                ggg. It's so hard to see expressions on this machine. Actually I get a lot
                of false leads when doing web searches. Even using questions. And then the
                search engine has the nerve to question my spelling.

                Lizzie
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