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Re: [mythsoc] Tad Williams: The War of the Flowers

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  • Matthew Winslow
    ... Anyone who is a member of the Society can nominate a book for the award, but it won t be nominated by me. I found the book overly long and ridiculously
    Message 1 of 13 , Sep 3 7:43 AM
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      Olaf Keith [keith@...] wrote:
      > I am new to the list, and I wanted to ask if anyone here is
      > considering to nominate Tad Williams´s new stand-alone novel THE WAR
      > OF THE FLOWERS for the next Mythopoeic Award?

      Anyone who is a member of the Society can nominate a book for the award, but
      it won't be nominated by me. I found the book overly long and ridiculously
      tendentious. Williams, as usual, seemed more fixated with showing how well
      read he was than with making a secondary world that was consistent. And his
      mode of exposition is to have a denizen of faery say something like, 'Beware
      the brownies' and then having the hero echo, 'Brownies?' and then we get a
      paragraph or two of explanation of what brownies are. And it's not just once
      or twice, but page after page after page of this.

      Which is my second big gripe about the book: it was about 300 pages too long.
      But lest I commit the same sin I accuse Williams of, I'll leave it there <g>.

      --
      Matthew Winslow mwinslow@... http://x-real.firinn.org/
      "I hesitate to point out that by the end of this...millennium, we will all
      be dead. This is especially sad to me, as my life seems so much more
      valuable than other people's, what with my love of flowers and poetry."
      --Steve Martin
      Currently reading: The Wedge of Truth by Philip Johnson
    • Jack
      ... You can reas Matthew s review of this book here -- greenmanreview.com/book/book_williams_waroftheflowers.html [Non-text portions of this message have been
      Message 2 of 13 , Sep 3 8:05 AM
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        >Anyone who is a member of the Society can nominate a book for the award, but
        >it won't be nominated by me. I found the book overly long and ridiculously
        >tendentious. Williams, as usual, seemed more fixated with showing how well
        >read he was than with making a secondary world that was consistent. And his
        >mode of exposition is to have a denizen of faery say something like, 'Beware
        >the brownies' and then having the hero echo, 'Brownies?' and then we get a
        >paragraph or two of explanation of what brownies are. And it's not just once
        >or twice, but page after page after page of this.
        >
        >Which is my second big gripe about the book: it was about 300 pages too long.
        >But lest I commit the same sin I accuse Williams of, I'll leave it there <g>.

        You can reas Matthew's review of this book here --
        greenmanreview.com/book/book_williams_waroftheflowers.html

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Olaf Keith
        Well, I disagree with your review, as do many other reviewers and readers, but I see your points and I understand your criticisms. I just don´t share them.
        Message 3 of 13 , Sep 3 9:00 AM
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          Well, I disagree with your review, as do many other reviewers and
          readers, but I see your points and I understand your criticisms. I
          just don´t share them.

          Olaf Keith
        • Stolzi@aol.com
          In a message dated 9/3/2003 7:54:25 AM Central Daylight Time, ... This name sounds extraordinarily like the name Tad Williams, I note. Matt W, you know that
          Message 4 of 13 , Sep 3 2:32 PM
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            In a message dated 9/3/2003 7:54:25 AM Central Daylight Time,
            keith@... writes:


            > Theo Vilmos

            This name sounds extraordinarily like the name "Tad Williams," I note.

            Matt W, you know that WAR OF THE FLOWERS is one of our Butterbur's Woodshed
            topics for the year to come?

            Diamond Proudbrook



            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Olaf Keith
            Williams himself pointed out that there was quite a lot of Theo that would resonate with him, though the book is in no way autobiographical. So, the
            Message 5 of 13 , Sep 3 2:52 PM
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              Williams himself pointed out that there was quite a lot of "Theo" that
              would resonate with him, though the book is in no way
              autobiographical.

              So, the resemblance is not a coincidance.

              Olaf
            • Matthew Winslow
              ... Yep. And I don t think it ll be a positive submission from me . Actually, I didn t detest the book. I just found it way too long and thus it became dry
              Message 6 of 13 , Sep 3 4:01 PM
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                Stolzi@... [Stolzi@...] wrote:
                > Matt W, you know that WAR OF THE FLOWERS is one of our Butterbur's Woodshed
                > topics for the year to come?

                Yep. And I don't think it'll be a positive submission from me <g>.

                Actually, I didn't detest the book. I just found it way too long and thus it
                became dry in places. Olaf (obviously) felt diff'tly about it.

                --
                Matthew Winslow mwinslow@... http://x-real.firinn.org/
                "Where is the wisdom lost in knowledge? Where is the knowledge lost in
                information?"
                --T.S. Eliot
                Currently reading: The Wedge of Truth by Philip Johnson
              • Jack
                ... I looked at when it came into the Green Man mailroom -- I felt it suffered mainly from not being edited properly. There s a good story drowning into too
                Message 7 of 13 , Sep 3 4:09 PM
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                  >Actually, I didn't detest the book. I just found it way too long and thus it
                  >became dry in places. Olaf (obviously) felt diff'tly about it.

                  I looked at when it came into the Green Man mailroom -- I felt it suffered
                  mainly from not being
                  edited properly. There's a good story drowning into too long a novel!

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Stolzi@aol.com
                  In a message dated 9/3/2003 4:53:52 PM Central Daylight Time, ... If it s a guy, it s not a Mary Sue, right? ;) [Non-text portions of this message have been
                  Message 8 of 13 , Sep 3 8:08 PM
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                    In a message dated 9/3/2003 4:53:52 PM Central Daylight Time,
                    keith@... writes:


                    > Williams himself pointed out that there was quite a lot of "Theo" that
                    > would resonate with him, though the book is in no way
                    > autobiographical.

                    If it's a guy, it's not a Mary Sue, right? ;)


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • SusanPal@aol.com
                    In a message dated 9/3/2003 8:11:42 PM Pacific Standard Time, Stolzi@aol.com ... That would make it a Marty Stu. SP [Non-text portions of this message have
                    Message 9 of 13 , Sep 3 9:20 PM
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                      In a message dated 9/3/2003 8:11:42 PM Pacific Standard Time, Stolzi@...
                      writes:

                      > If it's a guy, it's not a Mary Sue, right? ;)
                      >

                      That would make it a Marty Stu.

                      SP


                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Berni Phillips
                      From: ... If it s original universe, is it Mary Sue? I always associate them with not only wish fulfillment fiction but also playing in some
                      Message 10 of 13 , Sep 4 5:35 PM
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                        From: <Stolzi@...>



                        > In a message dated 9/3/2003 4:53:52 PM Central Daylight Time,
                        > keith@... writes:
                        >
                        > > Williams himself pointed out that there was quite a lot of "Theo" that
                        > > would resonate with him, though the book is in no way
                        > > autobiographical.
                        >
                        > If it's a guy, it's not a Mary Sue, right? ;)

                        If it's original universe, is it Mary Sue? I always associate them with not
                        only wish fulfillment fiction but also playing in some already-established
                        source like Star Trek or Darkover or what have you.

                        Berni
                      • Elizabeth Apgar Triano
                        OK OK What is a Mary Sue ? Lizzie Triano lizziewriter@earthlink.net amor vincit omnia
                        Message 11 of 13 , Sep 4 8:15 PM
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                          OK OK What is a Mary Sue ?

                          Lizzie Triano
                          lizziewriter@...
                          amor vincit omnia
                        • Berni Phillips
                          From: Elizabeth Apgar Triano ... I see Wendell s already given you a link, but I m feeling a little whimsical so I ll just sing:
                          Message 12 of 13 , Sep 5 5:42 PM
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                            From: "Elizabeth Apgar Triano" <lizziewriter@...>

                            > OK OK What is a Mary Sue ?

                            I see Wendell's already given you a link, but I'm feeling a little whimsical
                            so I'll just sing:

                            "She's beautiful! She's brilliant! She's an awful lot like me!
                            She's smarter than Spock! She makes men flock --
                            She's the writer's fantasy!"

                            Berni
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