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60,000 Make hits! / need help

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  • Pat
    60,000 hits, 10,000 E4C members and not a single comment/suggestion (except to add wheels) about how to make the concrete lathe better. BEWILDERING!!!!! When
    Message 1 of 4 , Feb 17, 2013
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      60,000 hits, 10,000 E4C members and not a single comment/suggestion (except to add wheels) about how to make the concrete lathe better.
      BEWILDERING!!!!!

      When Jeremmy in Kenya (who fell behind with both malaria and typhoid) gets things going again and sends pics I will do a total revision of the Make plans IF I get some good, alternate ways of doing things.

      After getting away from the Multimachine for awhile, I have come to appreciate it more because:

      It is easy to do reasonably accurate work in the 6" cube space that covers 95% of lathe work (so I have read).

      It is easy to take down and transport without losing accuracy.

      The concrete lathe cross slide and milling attachment design is easy to use with it.

      Costas substituted 8" plate for 12" plate and it both worked and cut costs. He also used smaller engine blocks which are more common in the rest of the world.

      My back is better after surgery but my health is not too good so I have to hustle a little. I really need your suggestions.

      Pat
    • David G. LeVine
      ... I have several, but they have been made before. * Make the spindle so it can take 5C collets and design a collet closer. This will make things more
      Message 2 of 4 , Feb 17, 2013
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        On 02/17/2013 06:18 PM, Pat wrote:
        ...and not a single comment/suggestion (except to add wheels) about how to make the concrete lathe better. 

        I have several, but they have been made before.
        • Make the spindle so it can take 5C collets and design a collet closer.  This will make things more efficient if the lathe ever needs to be used in a production environment.
        • Move the cross slide screw to a better protected location.  Jamming on a single chip can ruin a part.
        • Make a simple ram type tailstock out of concrete with a cast-in-place liner to be machined out when the headstock has been finished.  This is much better for production and is simpler than a screw driven tailstock (which is much more common.)  See http://www.cartertools.com/tailalign.html for some images of one.  A screw driven tailstock can be built using the lathe once this is done.
        • Safety matters!  Move the carriage controls to either the end of the bed or the apron.  Inconvenient controls are MUCH BETTER than controls which maim or kill operators.
        • Consider either pressure lubrication and/or roller element bearings.  A "one-shot" lubrication system is more likely to hit all the lube points than 30 zerk fittings and oil cups.
        • Consider a non-screw cutting lathe as an OPTION, the drive system is much simpler.  A cheap all thread leadscrew and a VSR drill motor makes for a good feed system if well matched.
        • Consider something like John Dammeyer's ELS instead of threading gears, power feed gears, etc.  A set of gears for either metric or imperial threads will cost more than the ELS does.
        • Consider a much smaller lathe (7"x10-12-15" size) as a "build me first" lathe to make parts for the bigger, concrete machine.  It really helps.  Assume it will be discarded once one concrete MM is built.  It won't be, but it can be other than a long lived, high capital investment tool.  It can be used to MORE SAFELY train the operators for the big lathe.  Use the same BASIC design so the builders can see how the big lathe goes together.

        At one point we had discussed using a pair of 300 CID (4.9 Liter) Ford I6 blocks to make a milling machine using automotive jacks to lift and lower the head.  Did anything come of that?  IIRC, Pat had some 4" tubing he was willing to contribute.  The basic plan was 1 block in concrete on the ground, 4" tubes in #1 and #3 or #4, the spindle in #6 cylinder.  The lifting member in #2 cylinder and the XY table under the spindle.  The second block contained the spindle, tube guides and motor/drive system.  No quill, just a fixed spindle, similar to the Seig mini-mills but much bigger.  Nowhere near as elegant as the Bridgeports (and clones), but plenty to cut a keyway or bore a hole for an agricultural attachment.  Power feeds were not (yet) discussed.  A good place to consider a quill which is fitted after the machine is complete and can be used to make the parts.

        Such a "big mill" could significantly ease construction of the "big lathe"...

        Dave  8{)


        --


        "Among the many misdeeds of British rule in India, history will look upon the Act of depriving a whole nation of arms as the blackest."

        Mohandus Ghandi, An Autobiography, Page 446.
      • Pat
        Thanks Dave I was just letting things get me down down. Being barely able to walk gets me down as does the lack of someone like Tyler Disney and the no-show of
        Message 3 of 4 , Feb 19, 2013
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          Thanks Dave

          I was just letting things get me down down.

          Being barely able to walk gets me down as does the lack of someone like Tyler Disney and the no-show of the Make article.

          All your points are good and I will try to get started on them. Both a collet and lever operated tailstock were on the MM and I will use the actual photos when I can find them.

          Pat


          --- In multimachine@yahoogroups.com, "David G. LeVine" <dlevine@...> wrote:
          >
          > On 02/17/2013 06:18 PM, Pat wrote:
          > > ...and not a single comment/suggestion (except to add wheels) about how to make the concrete lathe better.
          >
          > I have several, but they have been made before.
          >
          > * Make the spindle so it can take 5C collets and design a collet
          > closer. This will make things more efficient if the lathe ever
          > needs to be used in a production environment.
          > * Move the cross slide screw to a better protected location. Jamming
          > on a single chip can ruin a part.
          > * Make a simple ram type tailstock out of concrete with a
          > cast-in-place liner to be machined out when the headstock has been
          > finished. This is much better for production and is simpler than a
          > screw driven tailstock (which is much more common.) See
          > http://www.cartertools.com/tailalign.html for some images of one. A
          > screw driven tailstock can be built using the lathe once this is done.
          > * Safety matters! Move the carriage controls to either the end of the
          > bed or the apron. Inconvenient controls are MUCH BETTER than
          > controls which maim or kill operators.
          > * Consider either pressure lubrication and/or roller element
          > bearings. A "one-shot" lubrication system is more likely to hit all
          > the lube points than 30 zerk fittings and oil cups.
          > * Consider a non-screw cutting lathe as an OPTION, the drive system is
          > much simpler. A cheap all thread leadscrew and a VSR drill motor
          > makes for a good feed system if well matched.
          > * Consider something like John Dammeyer's ELS instead of threading
          > gears, power feed gears, etc. A set of gears for either metric or
          > imperial threads will cost more than the ELS does.
          > * Consider a much smaller lathe (7"x10-12-15" size) as a "build me
          > first" lathe to make parts for the bigger, concrete machine. It
          > really helps. Assume it will be discarded once one concrete MM is
          > built. It won't be, but it can be other than a long lived, high
          > capital investment tool. It can be used to MORE SAFELY train the
          > operators for the big lathe. Use the same BASIC design so the
          > builders can see how the big lathe goes together.
          >
          > At one point we had discussed using a pair of 300 CID (4.9 Liter) Ford
          > I6 blocks to make a milling machine using automotive jacks to lift and
          > lower the head. Did anything come of that? IIRC, Pat had some 4"
          > tubing he was willing to contribute. The basic plan was 1 block in
          > concrete on the ground, 4" tubes in #1 and #3 or #4, the spindle in #6
          > cylinder. The lifting member in #2 cylinder and the XY table under the
          > spindle. The second block contained the spindle, tube guides and
          > motor/drive system. No quill, just a fixed spindle, similar to the Seig
          > mini-mills but much bigger. Nowhere near as elegant as the Bridgeports
          > (and clones), but plenty to cut a keyway or bore a hole for an
          > agricultural attachment. Power feeds were not (yet) discussed. A good
          > place to consider a quill which is fitted after the machine is complete
          > and can be used to make the parts.
          >
          > Such a "big mill" could significantly ease construction of the "big
          > lathe"...
          >
          > Dave 8{)
          >
          >
          > --
          >
          >
          > /"Among the many misdeeds of British rule in India, history will look
          > upon the Act of depriving a whole nation of arms as the blackest."/
          >
          > Mohandus Ghandi, An Autobiography, Page 446.
          >
        • David G. LeVine
          ... As I said, they were made before. Recapping the memory of prior discussions can be VERY useful. Dave 8{) -- / Among the many misdeeds of British rule in
          Message 4 of 4 , Feb 19, 2013
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            On 02/19/2013 02:58 PM, Pat wrote:
            Thanks Dave
            
            I was just letting things get me down down.
            
            Being barely able to walk gets me down as does the lack of someone like Tyler Disney and the no-show of the Make article. 
            
            All your points are good and I will try to get started on them. Both a collet and lever operated tailstock were on the MM and I will use the actual photos when I can find them.
            
            Pat

            As I said, they were made before.  Recapping the memory of prior discussions can be VERY useful.

            Dave  8{)

            --


            "Among the many misdeeds of British rule in India, history will look upon the Act of depriving a whole nation of arms as the blackest."

            Mohandus Ghandi, An Autobiography, Page 446.
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