Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

A modern concrete lathe

Expand Messages
  • Shannon DeWolfe
    Pat, Here is a modern patent (1987) that references one of Mr. Yeomans patents. It uses concrete throughout, even as bearing surfaces!
    Message 1 of 27 , Aug 3, 2010
    View Source
    • 0 Attachment
      Pat,

      Here is a modern patent (1987) that references one of Mr. Yeomans'
      patents. It uses concrete throughout, even as bearing surfaces!

      http://www.freepatentsonline.com/4657455.html

      Regards,


      --
      Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I've taken to using mister because my name misleads folks on the WWW. I am a 54 year old fat man. ;-)
    • David G. LeVine
      ... Shannon, Great find! It discusses a number of things and gives reference to a number of other patents. If you look at figure 1a, you will see the
      Message 2 of 27 , Aug 3, 2010
      View Source
      • 0 Attachment
        On 08/03/2010 11:27 PM, Shannon DeWolfe wrote:
        > Pat,
        >
        > Here is a modern patent (1987) that references one of Mr. Yeomans'
        > patents. It uses concrete throughout, even as bearing surfaces!
        >
        > http://www.freepatentsonline.com/4657455.html
        >
        > Regards,
        >

        Shannon,

        Great find! It discusses a number of things and gives reference to a
        number of other patents.

        If you look at figure 1a, you will see the cartridge type spindle which
        has been discussed as a means of allowing reasonable changes. Also note
        the three bearing design, this guy really used some great ideas (some of
        which have been independently developed both before and after his patent.)

        The other patents are interesting too, for example, having floating
        tensioning members in the concrete.
      • Shannon DeWolfe
        David, I think the methods outlined in that patent could be the absolute cheapest way to build a lathe. I was particularly interested in his method of using
        Message 3 of 27 , Aug 4, 2010
        View Source
        • 0 Attachment
          David,

          I think the methods outlined in that patent could be the absolute
          cheapest way to build a lathe.

          I was particularly interested in his method of using wax to clearance
          the spindle in the concrete. The wax is used to create clearance and an
          oil galley for bearings as shown. But the method can be used to
          clearance for babbitt bearings in a cylinder too.

          Going back to my idea of using all four cylinders for multiple swings:

          Using his wax clearance method for centering the spindle, I could drill
          an inclined hole through the block to the top and bottom of each
          cylinder to pour babbitt metal to make bearings. Pour the bottom
          cylinder. When the babbitt cools, remove the spindle and dip in wax
          again. Install the waxed spindle in the next cylinder. Pour the babbitt
          metal. Repeat until all four holes have babbitt bearings sized to the
          spindle.

          I think it would work. A method of sealing the three spindle holes not
          used would have to be devised. It could be as simple as duct taping a
          plastic plug in place at each end of the cylinder. I'll figure that out.

          I know for a fact that babbitt bearings need lots of clean oil. I
          destroyed a '51 Chevy six cylinder engine when I was a teenager. I
          didn't stay on top of the oil level. I knew it was leaking and just
          waited too long to top it off. Other than that, my experience with
          babbitt bearings is nil. So, I have some questions regarding the spindle
          and babbitt bearings --

          How much clearance should I start with on the pipe diameter? I haven't
          measured the cylinders yet but the wear is minimal; I cannot catch a
          fingernail on the ridge. I was thinking I could open them up a few
          thousandths with a bottle brush hone. Is 0.003" a good target for
          clearance between the pipe and bore?

          How polished does the spindle need to be? Will spinning the pipe with a
          drill motor and using 600 grit emery cloth give a suitable finish?

          The actual pour seems straightforward enough. But, the next steps are
          unclear to me. When the metal cools, do I lap the bearing with the
          spindle like you would valve seats? Or, should I turn the spindle slowly
          in one direction? How long should the babbitt metal cool before
          disrupting the spindle position? What lapping compound should I use? How
          do I know when enough is enough? Do I use soap and water to clean the
          lapping compound out of the bore?

          I hate to load up questions like this but I need to know before I get
          started. I've read hours worth of material on babbitt bearings and I
          have not found the answers to these basic questions.

          Regards,


          --
          Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I've taken to using mister because my name misleads folks on the WWW. I am a 54 year old fat man. ;-)



          David G. LeVine wrote:
          >
          >
          > Great find! It discusses a number of things and gives reference to a
          > number of other patents.
          >
          > If you look at figure 1a, you will see the cartridge type spindle which
          > has been discussed as a means of allowing reasonable changes.
        • James Bishop
          Hi Shannon, I don t have any experience with Babbit metal, but I do with solder which has a similar melting point (around 200-250c). If I understand your plans
          Message 4 of 27 , Aug 4, 2010
          View Source
          • 0 Attachment
            Hi Shannon,

            I don't have any experience with Babbit metal, but I do with solder which has a similar melting point (around 200-250c).

            If I understand your plans correctly, then you may need to preheat the block and the spindle to a fairly high temperature so that the metal flows through the hole and around the spindle. I know that if molten solder were to hit a cold engine block, it would solidify immediately.

            A propane or oxy torch might help...

            James.

            On Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 12:13 AM, Shannon DeWolfe <sdewolfe@...> wrote:
             

            David,

            I think the methods outlined in that patent could be the absolute
            cheapest way to build a lathe.

            I was particularly interested in his method of using wax to clearance
            the spindle in the concrete. The wax is used to create clearance and an
            oil galley for bearings as shown. But the method can be used to
            clearance for babbitt bearings in a cylinder too.

            Going back to my idea of using all four cylinders for multiple swings:

            Using his wax clearance method for centering the spindle, I could drill
            an inclined hole through the block to the top and bottom of each
            cylinder to pour babbitt metal to make bearings. Pour the bottom
            cylinder. When the babbitt cools, remove the spindle and dip in wax
            again. Install the waxed spindle in the next cylinder. Pour the babbitt
            metal. Repeat until all four holes have babbitt bearings sized to the
            spindle.

            I think it would work. A method of sealing the three spindle holes not
            used would have to be devised. It could be as simple as duct taping a
            plastic plug in place at each end of the cylinder. I'll figure that out.

            I know for a fact that babbitt bearings need lots of clean oil. I
            destroyed a '51 Chevy six cylinder engine when I was a teenager. I
            didn't stay on top of the oil level. I knew it was leaking and just
            waited too long to top it off. Other than that, my experience with
            babbitt bearings is nil. So, I have some questions regarding the spindle
            and babbitt bearings --

            How much clearance should I start with on the pipe diameter? I haven't
            measured the cylinders yet but the wear is minimal; I cannot catch a
            fingernail on the ridge. I was thinking I could open them up a few
            thousandths with a bottle brush hone. Is 0.003" a good target for
            clearance between the pipe and bore?

            How polished does the spindle need to be? Will spinning the pipe with a
            drill motor and using 600 grit emery cloth give a suitable finish?

            The actual pour seems straightforward enough. But, the next steps are
            unclear to me. When the metal cools, do I lap the bearing with the
            spindle like you would valve seats? Or, should I turn the spindle slowly
            in one direction? How long should the babbitt metal cool before
            disrupting the spindle position? What lapping compound should I use? How
            do I know when enough is enough? Do I use soap and water to clean the
            lapping compound out of the bore?

            I hate to load up questions like this but I need to know before I get
            started. I've read hours worth of material on babbitt bearings and I
            have not found the answers to these basic questions.

            Regards,

            --
            Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I've taken to using mister because my name misleads folks on the WWW. I am a 54 year old fat man. ;-)

            David G. LeVine wrote:
            >
            >
            > Great find! It discusses a number of things and gives reference to a
            > number of other patents.
            >
            > If you look at figure 1a, you will see the cartridge type spindle which
            > has been discussed as a means of allowing reasonable changes.


          • David G. LeVine
            ... Nope, wax does not decompose at room temperature, at liquid babbitt temperatures it does. ... The issue is that wax will change to a gas and carbon, and
            Message 5 of 27 , Aug 4, 2010
            View Source
            • 0 Attachment
              On 08/04/2010 10:13 AM, Shannon DeWolfe wrote:
              David,

              <snippage>I was particularly interested in his method of using wax to clearance 
              the spindle in the concrete. The wax is used to create clearance and an 
              oil galley for bearings as shown. But the method can be used to 
              clearance for babbitt bearings in a cylinder too.
                

              Nope, wax does not decompose at room temperature, at liquid babbitt temperatures it does.

              Going back to my idea of using all four cylinders for multiple swings:
              
              Using his wax clearance method for centering the spindle, I could drill 
              an inclined hole through the block to the top and bottom of each 
              cylinder to pour babbitt metal to make bearings. Pour the bottom 
              cylinder. When the babbitt cools, remove the spindle and dip in wax 
              again. Install the waxed spindle in the next cylinder. Pour the babbitt 
              metal. Repeat until all four holes have babbitt bearings sized to the 
              spindle.
                

              The issue is that wax will change to a gas and carbon, and may flash into flame at babbitt temperatures.  Try a coating of carbon (like an acetylene torch to "smoke" it.)  That will work better.

              I think it would work. A method of sealing the three spindle holes not 
              used would have to be devised. It could be as simple as duct taping a 
              plastic plug in place at each end of the cylinder. I'll figure that out.
                

              How about putting a step at the crankshaft end in each bore (can be a ring pressed and loctited in place), and a retainer in place of the head held by the head bolts...

              I know for a fact that babbitt bearings need lots of clean oil. I 
              destroyed a '51 Chevy six cylinder engine when I was a teenager. I 
              didn't stay on top of the oil level. I knew it was leaking and just 
              waited too long to top it off. Other than that, my experience with 
              babbitt bearings is nil. So, I have some questions regarding the spindle 
              and babbitt bearings --
              
              How much clearance should I start with on the pipe diameter? I haven't 
              measured the cylinders yet but the wear is minimal; I cannot catch a 
              fingernail on the ridge. I was thinking I could open them up a few 
              thousandths with a bottle brush hone. Is 0.003" a good target for 
              clearance between the pipe and bore?
                

              I don't know, but that seems a bit large, something like 0.001" on each side seems more desirable.  Take a look at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APmmOIL-CcQ and you will see engine rod bearings being tested at 0.001" total, 0.0005" on each side.  Also look at this thread http://maintenanceforums.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/7161085912/m/5741006572 to get a good idea of the applications today.  More clearance means lower load abilities and lower heating (less oil shear.)

              How polished does the spindle need to be? Will spinning the pipe with a 
              drill motor and using 600 grit emery cloth give a suitable finish?
                

              Take a look at an engine crankshaft, but 600 grit seems too coarse.  The problem is twofold:  The shaft must be round within a few tenths of a thousandth and have minimal taper (within a few tenths of a thousandth.)  Actually, it COULD taper to act as a thrust bearing, but that is beyond my ability to discuss.  And you will need a pretty heavy thrust bearing!

              The actual pour seems straightforward enough. But, the next steps are 
              unclear to me. When the metal cools, do I lap the bearing with the 
              spindle like you would valve seats? Or, should I turn the spindle slowly 
              in one direction? How long should the babbitt metal cool before 
              disrupting the spindle position? What lapping compound should I use? How 
              do I know when enough is enough? Do I use soap and water to clean the 
              lapping compound out of the bore?
                

              You do not use lapping compound, it will destroy the spindle!  Model "T" Fords would use clean oil as a lap and burnish the bearings to size.

              I hate to load up questions like this but I need to know before I get 
              started. I've read hours worth of material on babbitt bearings and I 
              have not found the answers to these basic questions.
                

              I hope the maintenance forum helps you find what you need, but precision machines tend to have slightly different needs than automotive engines.  And, surprise of surprises, I don't know everything!

              Dave  8{)
            • Lance
              Check the files section for the book from Magnolia. It s ALL about babbitt. lance ++++ On Aug 4, 2010, at 10:13 AM, Shannon DeWolfe wrote:
              Message 6 of 27 , Aug 4, 2010
              View Source
              • 0 Attachment
                Check the files section for the book from Magnolia.

                It's ALL about babbitt.

                lance
                ++++
                On Aug 4, 2010, at 10:13 AM, Shannon DeWolfe wrote:
                <snip>

                I hate to load up questions like this but I need to know before I get 
                started. I've read hours worth of material on babbitt bearings and I 
                have not found the answers to these basic questions.

              • Pat
                I always tried to stay out of the babbitt discussion because of the Third World availability problem but could solder be poured over a machined ZA-27 bushing
                Message 7 of 27 , Aug 4, 2010
                View Source
                • 0 Attachment
                  I always tried to stay out of the babbitt discussion because of the Third World availability problem but could solder be poured over a machined ZA-27 bushing without distorting or melting it?

                  Pat

                  --- In multimachine@yahoogroups.com, James Bishop <bishopaj@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Hi Shannon,
                  >
                  > I don't have any experience with Babbit metal, but I do with solder which
                  > has a similar melting point (around 200-250c).
                  >
                  > If I understand your plans correctly, then you may need to preheat the block
                  > and the spindle to a fairly high temperature so that the metal flows through
                  > the hole and around the spindle. I know that if molten solder were to hit a
                  > cold engine block, it would solidify immediately.
                  >
                  > A propane or oxy torch might help...
                  >
                  > James.
                  >
                  > On Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 12:13 AM, Shannon DeWolfe
                  > <sdewolfe@...>wrote:
                  >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > David,
                  > >
                  > > I think the methods outlined in that patent could be the absolute
                  > > cheapest way to build a lathe.
                  > >
                  > > I was particularly interested in his method of using wax to clearance
                  > > the spindle in the concrete. The wax is used to create clearance and an
                  > > oil galley for bearings as shown. But the method can be used to
                  > > clearance for babbitt bearings in a cylinder too.
                  > >
                  > > Going back to my idea of using all four cylinders for multiple swings:
                  > >
                  > > Using his wax clearance method for centering the spindle, I could drill
                  > > an inclined hole through the block to the top and bottom of each
                  > > cylinder to pour babbitt metal to make bearings. Pour the bottom
                  > > cylinder. When the babbitt cools, remove the spindle and dip in wax
                  > > again. Install the waxed spindle in the next cylinder. Pour the babbitt
                  > > metal. Repeat until all four holes have babbitt bearings sized to the
                  > > spindle.
                  > >
                  > > I think it would work. A method of sealing the three spindle holes not
                  > > used would have to be devised. It could be as simple as duct taping a
                  > > plastic plug in place at each end of the cylinder. I'll figure that out.
                  > >
                  > > I know for a fact that babbitt bearings need lots of clean oil. I
                  > > destroyed a '51 Chevy six cylinder engine when I was a teenager. I
                  > > didn't stay on top of the oil level. I knew it was leaking and just
                  > > waited too long to top it off. Other than that, my experience with
                  > > babbitt bearings is nil. So, I have some questions regarding the spindle
                  > > and babbitt bearings --
                  > >
                  > > How much clearance should I start with on the pipe diameter? I haven't
                  > > measured the cylinders yet but the wear is minimal; I cannot catch a
                  > > fingernail on the ridge. I was thinking I could open them up a few
                  > > thousandths with a bottle brush hone. Is 0.003" a good target for
                  > > clearance between the pipe and bore?
                  > >
                  > > How polished does the spindle need to be? Will spinning the pipe with a
                  > > drill motor and using 600 grit emery cloth give a suitable finish?
                  > >
                  > > The actual pour seems straightforward enough. But, the next steps are
                  > > unclear to me. When the metal cools, do I lap the bearing with the
                  > > spindle like you would valve seats? Or, should I turn the spindle slowly
                  > > in one direction? How long should the babbitt metal cool before
                  > > disrupting the spindle position? What lapping compound should I use? How
                  > > do I know when enough is enough? Do I use soap and water to clean the
                  > > lapping compound out of the bore?
                  > >
                  > > I hate to load up questions like this but I need to know before I get
                  > > started. I've read hours worth of material on babbitt bearings and I
                  > > have not found the answers to these basic questions.
                  > >
                  > > Regards,
                  > >
                  > > --
                  > > Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I've taken to using mister because my name misleads
                  > > folks on the WWW. I am a 54 year old fat man. ;-)
                  > >
                  > > David G. LeVine wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > Great find! It discusses a number of things and gives reference to a
                  > > > number of other patents.
                  > > >
                  > > > If you look at figure 1a, you will see the cartridge type spindle which
                  > > > has been discussed as a means of allowing reasonable changes.
                  > >
                  > >
                  >
                • Thomas S. Knutsen
                  Yes, That may work. I have been babitting castings made from ZA-12 and homebrew Zinc-Alu alloy (approx 50/50). Just take care to get the tinning of the bushing
                  Message 8 of 27 , Aug 4, 2010
                  View Source
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Yes, That may work. I have been babitting castings made from ZA-12 and homebrew Zinc-Alu alloy (approx 50/50).
                    Just take care to get the tinning of the bushing complete before casting, the tinning requires some tecnique and an good flux.

                    2010/8/4 Pat <rigmatch@...>
                     

                    I always tried to stay out of the babbitt discussion because of the Third World availability problem but could solder be poured over a machined ZA-27 bushing without distorting or melting it?

                    Pat



                    --- In multimachine@yahoogroups.com, James Bishop <bishopaj@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Hi Shannon,
                    >
                    > I don't have any experience with Babbit metal, but I do with solder which
                    > has a similar melting point (around 200-250c).
                    >
                    > If I understand your plans correctly, then you may need to preheat the block
                    > and the spindle to a fairly high temperature so that the metal flows through
                    > the hole and around the spindle. I know that if molten solder were to hit a
                    > cold engine block, it would solidify immediately.
                    >
                    > A propane or oxy torch might help...
                    >
                    > James.
                    >
                    > On Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 12:13 AM, Shannon DeWolfe
                    > <sdewolfe@...>wrote:

                    >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > David,
                    > >
                    > > I think the methods outlined in that patent could be the absolute
                    > > cheapest way to build a lathe.
                    > >
                    > > I was particularly interested in his method of using wax to clearance
                    > > the spindle in the concrete. The wax is used to create clearance and an
                    > > oil galley for bearings as shown. But the method can be used to
                    > > clearance for babbitt bearings in a cylinder too.
                    > >
                    > > Going back to my idea of using all four cylinders for multiple swings:
                    > >
                    > > Using his wax clearance method for centering the spindle, I could drill
                    > > an inclined hole through the block to the top and bottom of each
                    > > cylinder to pour babbitt metal to make bearings. Pour the bottom
                    > > cylinder. When the babbitt cools, remove the spindle and dip in wax
                    > > again. Install the waxed spindle in the next cylinder. Pour the babbitt
                    > > metal. Repeat until all four holes have babbitt bearings sized to the
                    > > spindle.
                    > >
                    > > I think it would work. A method of sealing the three spindle holes not
                    > > used would have to be devised. It could be as simple as duct taping a
                    > > plastic plug in place at each end of the cylinder. I'll figure that out.
                    > >
                    > > I know for a fact that babbitt bearings need lots of clean oil. I
                    > > destroyed a '51 Chevy six cylinder engine when I was a teenager. I
                    > > didn't stay on top of the oil level. I knew it was leaking and just
                    > > waited too long to top it off. Other than that, my experience with
                    > > babbitt bearings is nil. So, I have some questions regarding the spindle
                    > > and babbitt bearings --
                    > >
                    > > How much clearance should I start with on the pipe diameter? I haven't
                    > > measured the cylinders yet but the wear is minimal; I cannot catch a
                    > > fingernail on the ridge. I was thinking I could open them up a few
                    > > thousandths with a bottle brush hone. Is 0.003" a good target for
                    > > clearance between the pipe and bore?
                    > >
                    > > How polished does the spindle need to be? Will spinning the pipe with a
                    > > drill motor and using 600 grit emery cloth give a suitable finish?
                    > >
                    > > The actual pour seems straightforward enough. But, the next steps are
                    > > unclear to me. When the metal cools, do I lap the bearing with the
                    > > spindle like you would valve seats? Or, should I turn the spindle slowly
                    > > in one direction? How long should the babbitt metal cool before
                    > > disrupting the spindle position? What lapping compound should I use? How
                    > > do I know when enough is enough? Do I use soap and water to clean the
                    > > lapping compound out of the bore?
                    > >
                    > > I hate to load up questions like this but I need to know before I get
                    > > started. I've read hours worth of material on babbitt bearings and I
                    > > have not found the answers to these basic questions.
                    > >
                    > > Regards,
                    > >
                    > > --
                    > > Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I've taken to using mister because my name misleads
                    > > folks on the WWW. I am a 54 year old fat man. ;-)
                    > >
                    > > David G. LeVine wrote:
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > Great find! It discusses a number of things and gives reference to a
                    > > > number of other patents.
                    > > >
                    > > > If you look at figure 1a, you will see the cartridge type spindle which
                    > > > has been discussed as a means of allowing reasonable changes.
                    > >
                    > >
                    >




                    --

                     Please  avoid sending  me  Word  or  PowerPoint  attachments.
                     See  <http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html>
                  • Thomas S. Knutsen
                    Hello Shannon. It seems like you need to read some more about Babbitting metals and how to do the preparations. The Gingery book is excellent. So is old books
                    Message 9 of 27 , Aug 4, 2010
                    View Source
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Hello Shannon.
                      It seems like you need to read some more about Babbitting metals and how to do the preparations.
                      The Gingery book is excellent. So is old books on machining and machine building.

                      I would worry about if the wax melts and contaminates the babbitt. Use acetylene or an used oil lit on fire to lay an even and thick layer of carbon on the spindle. It does require some practice to get the layer even and at the rigth thickness. If it gets to thin you may end up soldering the spindle in to the block.

                      An block as large as this would need soldering of the babbitt in place, and preheating of the block prior to pouring. That may make problems with the bearings already poured.

                      It seems to me like you are trying to just fill the cylinder bore with babitt? You should just have some bearings in the ends of the block, not the whole cylinder. An filled cylinder requires that the spindle is balanced beond what an amateur may be able to do at home, even when using babitt.

                      I would have cast some bearing blocks in Zamak or Alu. and babitted those, It should make the whole process a lot simpler and casting is perhaps one of the most important additions to an home shop and small 3. world machine shop.
                      The babbitt should not be thicker than 0,5" and you would need to drill some shallow holes so that the babits fasten to the bearing block. Make sure you have an thin layer of solder even over the whole surface so that the babbitt fastens to the bearing block. Cast iron bearing blocks would be ideal but it's hard to cast iron at home. You should also consider making the bearing block splitted so that it's easy to remove the spindle.

                      You would need an clearance less than 0.001", perhaps even less than 0.0005". The babitt bearing would need some run-in time and work its way to an excellent fit. Make sure that it have an good supply of oil, but the fit should be so good that the oil don't run out of the machine.

                      DO NOT use an lapping coumpound for babitt, but an scraping tool in order to remove an smal layer of babitt. Remember that you need oil groves and an oil cup so you have to drill some holes in to the babitt to supply the oil. Use an excellent quality oil made for use in babbitt bearings.

                      Scraping the bearings is an skill you would aquire with some practice. You should perhaps make an extra bearing or 2 and practice on fitting the bearing to the spindle.

                      Best regards
                      Thomas.
                      BTW: Sorry for my bad english. Norwegian is my main language.


                      2010/8/4 Shannon DeWolfe <sdewolfe@...>
                       

                      David,

                      I think the methods outlined in that patent could be the absolute
                      cheapest way to build a lathe.

                      I was particularly interested in his method of using wax to clearance
                      the spindle in the concrete. The wax is used to create clearance and an
                      oil galley for bearings as shown. But the method can be used to
                      clearance for babbitt bearings in a cylinder too.

                      Going back to my idea of using all four cylinders for multiple swings:

                      Using his wax clearance method for centering the spindle, I could drill
                      an inclined hole through the block to the top and bottom of each
                      cylinder to pour babbitt metal to make bearings. Pour the bottom
                      cylinder. When the babbitt cools, remove the spindle and dip in wax
                      again. Install the waxed spindle in the next cylinder. Pour the babbitt
                      metal. Repeat until all four holes have babbitt bearings sized to the
                      spindle.

                      I think it would work. A method of sealing the three spindle holes not
                      used would have to be devised. It could be as simple as duct taping a
                      plastic plug in place at each end of the cylinder. I'll figure that out.

                      I know for a fact that babbitt bearings need lots of clean oil. I
                      destroyed a '51 Chevy six cylinder engine when I was a teenager. I
                      didn't stay on top of the oil level. I knew it was leaking and just
                      waited too long to top it off. Other than that, my experience with
                      babbitt bearings is nil. So, I have some questions regarding the spindle
                      and babbitt bearings --

                      How much clearance should I start with on the pipe diameter? I haven't
                      measured the cylinders yet but the wear is minimal; I cannot catch a
                      fingernail on the ridge. I was thinking I could open them up a few
                      thousandths with a bottle brush hone. Is 0.003" a good target for
                      clearance between the pipe and bore?

                      How polished does the spindle need to be? Will spinning the pipe with a
                      drill motor and using 600 grit emery cloth give a suitable finish?

                      The actual pour seems straightforward enough. But, the next steps are
                      unclear to me. When the metal cools, do I lap the bearing with the
                      spindle like you would valve seats? Or, should I turn the spindle slowly
                      in one direction? How long should the babbitt metal cool before
                      disrupting the spindle position? What lapping compound should I use? How
                      do I know when enough is enough? Do I use soap and water to clean the
                      lapping compound out of the bore?

                      I hate to load up questions like this but I need to know before I get
                      started. I've read hours worth of material on babbitt bearings and I
                      have not found the answers to these basic questions.

                      Regards,

                      --
                      Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I've taken to using mister because my name misleads folks on the WWW. I am a 54 year old fat man. ;-)

                      David G. LeVine wrote:
                      >
                      >
                      > Great find! It discusses a number of things and gives reference to a
                      > number of other patents.
                      >
                      > If you look at figure 1a, you will see the cartridge type spindle which
                      > has been discussed as a means of allowing reasonable changes.




                      --

                       Please  avoid sending  me  Word  or  PowerPoint  attachments.
                       See  <http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html>
                    • Pat
                      Thanks Tom You are a jewel! I think that a final machine design is getting down to just a few sticking points, one is this holding of bearing alloys in place
                      Message 10 of 27 , Aug 4, 2010
                      View Source
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Thanks Tom
                        You are a jewel!

                        I think that a final machine design is getting down to just a few sticking points, one is this holding of bearing alloys in place and another is the mention in a post of David's about an electrical measuring device. I think that the tight wire idea is very important if we can find a way of measuring from the wire without making it deflect. Sounds really cheap!

                        Pat

                        --- In multimachine@yahoogroups.com, "Thomas S. Knutsen" <la3pna@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Hello Shannon.
                        > It seems like you need to read some more about Babbitting metals and how to
                        > do the preparations.
                        > The Gingery book is excellent. So is old books on machining and machine
                        > building.
                        >
                        > I would worry about if the wax melts and contaminates the babbitt. Use
                        > acetylene or an used oil lit on fire to lay an even and thick layer of
                        > carbon on the spindle. It does require some practice to get the layer even
                        > and at the rigth thickness. If it gets to thin you may end up soldering the
                        > spindle in to the block.
                        >
                        > An block as large as this would need soldering of the babbitt in place, and
                        > preheating of the block prior to pouring. That may make problems with the
                        > bearings already poured.
                        >
                        > It seems to me like you are trying to just fill the cylinder bore with
                        > babitt? You should just have some bearings in the ends of the block, not the
                        > whole cylinder. An filled cylinder requires that the spindle is balanced
                        > beond what an amateur may be able to do at home, even when using babitt.
                        >
                        > I would have cast some bearing blocks in Zamak or Alu. and babitted those,
                        > It should make the whole process a lot simpler and casting is perhaps one of
                        > the most important additions to an home shop and small 3. world machine
                        > shop.
                        > The babbitt should not be thicker than 0,5" and you would need to drill some
                        > shallow holes so that the babits fasten to the bearing block. Make sure you
                        > have an thin layer of solder even over the whole surface so that the babbitt
                        > fastens to the bearing block. Cast iron bearing blocks would be ideal but
                        > it's hard to cast iron at home. You should also consider making the bearing
                        > block splitted so that it's easy to remove the spindle.
                        >
                        > You would need an clearance less than 0.001", perhaps even less than
                        > 0.0005". The babitt bearing would need some run-in time and work its way to
                        > an excellent fit. Make sure that it have an good supply of oil, but the fit
                        > should be so good that the oil don't run out of the machine.
                        >
                        > DO NOT use an lapping coumpound for babitt, but an scraping tool in order to
                        > remove an smal layer of babitt. Remember that you need oil groves and an oil
                        > cup so you have to drill some holes in to the babitt to supply the oil. Use
                        > an excellent quality oil made for use in babbitt bearings.
                        >
                        > Scraping the bearings is an skill you would aquire with some practice. You
                        > should perhaps make an extra bearing or 2 and practice on fitting the
                        > bearing to the spindle.
                        >
                        > Best regards
                        > Thomas.
                        > BTW: Sorry for my bad english. Norwegian is my main language.
                        >
                        >
                        > 2010/8/4 Shannon DeWolfe <sdewolfe@...>
                        >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > David,
                        > >
                        > > I think the methods outlined in that patent could be the absolute
                        > > cheapest way to build a lathe.
                        > >
                        > > I was particularly interested in his method of using wax to clearance
                        > > the spindle in the concrete. The wax is used to create clearance and an
                        > > oil galley for bearings as shown. But the method can be used to
                        > > clearance for babbitt bearings in a cylinder too.
                        > >
                        > > Going back to my idea of using all four cylinders for multiple swings:
                        > >
                        > > Using his wax clearance method for centering the spindle, I could drill
                        > > an inclined hole through the block to the top and bottom of each
                        > > cylinder to pour babbitt metal to make bearings. Pour the bottom
                        > > cylinder. When the babbitt cools, remove the spindle and dip in wax
                        > > again. Install the waxed spindle in the next cylinder. Pour the babbitt
                        > > metal. Repeat until all four holes have babbitt bearings sized to the
                        > > spindle.
                        > >
                        > > I think it would work. A method of sealing the three spindle holes not
                        > > used would have to be devised. It could be as simple as duct taping a
                        > > plastic plug in place at each end of the cylinder. I'll figure that out.
                        > >
                        > > I know for a fact that babbitt bearings need lots of clean oil. I
                        > > destroyed a '51 Chevy six cylinder engine when I was a teenager. I
                        > > didn't stay on top of the oil level. I knew it was leaking and just
                        > > waited too long to top it off. Other than that, my experience with
                        > > babbitt bearings is nil. So, I have some questions regarding the spindle
                        > > and babbitt bearings --
                        > >
                        > > How much clearance should I start with on the pipe diameter? I haven't
                        > > measured the cylinders yet but the wear is minimal; I cannot catch a
                        > > fingernail on the ridge. I was thinking I could open them up a few
                        > > thousandths with a bottle brush hone. Is 0.003" a good target for
                        > > clearance between the pipe and bore?
                        > >
                        > > How polished does the spindle need to be? Will spinning the pipe with a
                        > > drill motor and using 600 grit emery cloth give a suitable finish?
                        > >
                        > > The actual pour seems straightforward enough. But, the next steps are
                        > > unclear to me. When the metal cools, do I lap the bearing with the
                        > > spindle like you would valve seats? Or, should I turn the spindle slowly
                        > > in one direction? How long should the babbitt metal cool before
                        > > disrupting the spindle position? What lapping compound should I use? How
                        > > do I know when enough is enough? Do I use soap and water to clean the
                        > > lapping compound out of the bore?
                        > >
                        > > I hate to load up questions like this but I need to know before I get
                        > > started. I've read hours worth of material on babbitt bearings and I
                        > > have not found the answers to these basic questions.
                        > >
                        > > Regards,
                        > >
                        > > --
                        > > Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I've taken to using mister because my name misleads
                        > > folks on the WWW. I am a 54 year old fat man. ;-)
                        > >
                        > > David G. LeVine wrote:
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > Great find! It discusses a number of things and gives reference to a
                        > > > number of other patents.
                        > > >
                        > > > If you look at figure 1a, you will see the cartridge type spindle which
                        > > > has been discussed as a means of allowing reasonable changes.
                        > >
                        > >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > --
                        >
                        > Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments.
                        > See <http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html>
                        >
                      • Thomas S. Knutsen
                        In order to hold the spindle in the rigth place you would need to make some support for it, perhaps from wood. Small shafts may be hold by an product named
                        Message 11 of 27 , Aug 4, 2010
                        View Source
                        • 0 Attachment
                          In order to hold the spindle in the rigth place you would need to make some support for it, perhaps from wood.
                          Small shafts may be hold by an product named Babbitrite that is packed around the spindle so that the molten babbitt does not run out of the bearing shell. I some times prefear to use a couple of alu plates that have cut outs for the shaft and with an sligth press fit and coated with soot (carbon) from an acetylene fire. Babbitt have an nasty habit of sticking to all kinds of metal that allows soldering.

                          You should not use any kind of power tool, just an regular round scraping tool. I'l send you some info on making those when I find it again. Often you don't need to remove material alt all.

                          Best regards.
                          Thomas.
                          BTW, I don't think I can fit an block from an MX-5 in my oven, I guess the american ovens are larger. I would like the car tho.

                          2010/8/5 Shannon DeWolfe <sdewolfe@...>
                           

                          Thanks for the information and the links. I was thinking of trying the
                          lost wax method, like pouring a mold. But, I'll bet the spindle would
                          shift trying to do that.

                          Carbon black for the spindle to prevent the babbitt from sticking to it?

                          I do not think I can control the amount of material removed with a drill
                          motor and emery cloth well enough to ensure no taper and .0001 accuracy.
                          Maybe with practice. I'll just have to get enough pipe to screw up on a
                          couple. I don't want to have to buy a lathe to make a lathe. ;-)



                          > You do not use lapping compound, it will destroy the spindle! Model
                          "T" Fords would use clean oil as a lap and burnish the bearings to size.

                          Thanks for setting me straight on that.


                          Regards,

                          --
                          Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I've taken to using mister because my name misleads folks on the WWW. I am a 54 year old fat man. ;-)




                          --

                           Please  avoid sending  me  Word  or  PowerPoint  attachments.
                           See  <http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html>
                        • Shannon DeWolfe
                          ... the block and the spindle to a fairly high temperature Thanks, James. I haven t found any information about heating the box or headstock before
                          Message 12 of 27 , Aug 4, 2010
                          View Source
                          • 0 Attachment
                            > If I understand your plans correctly, then you may need to preheat
                            the block and the spindle to a fairly high temperature

                            Thanks, James. I haven't found any information about heating the "box"
                            or "headstock" before pouring. But that makes sense to me. I will
                            continue reading before I commit to this line of action. If it needs to
                            be heated, the engine block is a 1.6L from a Mazda Miata (or MX5,
                            depending on the market); the whole thing will fit into almost any
                            kitchen oven.

                            Regards,


                            --
                            Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I've taken to using mister because my name misleads folks on the WWW. I am a 54 year old fat man. ;-)



                            James Bishop wrote:
                            >
                            >
                            > Hi Shannon,
                            >
                            > I don't have any experience with Babbit metal, but I do with solder
                            > which has a similar melting point (around 200-250c).
                          • Shannon DeWolfe
                            Thanks for the information and the links. I was thinking of trying the lost wax method, like pouring a mold. But, I ll bet the spindle would shift trying to do
                            Message 13 of 27 , Aug 4, 2010
                            View Source
                            • 0 Attachment
                              Thanks for the information and the links. I was thinking of trying the
                              lost wax method, like pouring a mold. But, I'll bet the spindle would
                              shift trying to do that.

                              Carbon black for the spindle to prevent the babbitt from sticking to it?

                              I do not think I can control the amount of material removed with a drill
                              motor and emery cloth well enough to ensure no taper and .0001 accuracy.
                              Maybe with practice. I'll just have to get enough pipe to screw up on a
                              couple. I don't want to have to buy a lathe to make a lathe. ;-)

                              > You do not use lapping compound, it will destroy the spindle! Model
                              "T" Fords would use clean oil as a lap and burnish the bearings to size.

                              Thanks for setting me straight on that.

                              Regards,


                              --
                              Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I've taken to using mister because my name misleads folks on the WWW. I am a 54 year old fat man. ;-)
                            • Shannon DeWolfe
                              Thanks! Will do. Regards, -- Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I ve taken to using mister because my name misleads folks on the WWW. I am a 54 year old fat man. ;-)
                              Message 14 of 27 , Aug 4, 2010
                              View Source
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Thanks! Will do.

                                Regards,


                                --
                                Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I've taken to using mister because my name misleads folks on the WWW. I am a 54 year old fat man. ;-)



                                Lance wrote:
                                >
                                >
                                > Check the files section for the book from Magnolia.
                                >
                                > It's ALL about babbitt.
                                >
                                > lance
                                > ++++
                                > On Aug 4, 2010, at 10:13 AM, Shannon DeWolfe wrote:
                                > <snip>
                                >
                                >> I hate to load up questions like this but I need to know before I get
                                >> started. I've read hours worth of material on babbitt bearings and I
                                >> have not found the answers to these basic questions.
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                >
                                >
                                > No virus found in this incoming message.
                                > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
                                > Version: 8.5.441 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3049 - Release Date: 08/03/10 14:22:00
                                >
                                >
                              • Shannon DeWolfe
                                Thomas, Can you elaborate or point us to a web site with more information? Regards, -- Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I ve taken to using mister because my name
                                Message 15 of 27 , Aug 4, 2010
                                View Source
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  Thomas,

                                  Can you elaborate or point us to a web site with more information?

                                  Regards,


                                  --
                                  Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I've taken to using mister because my name misleads folks on the WWW. I am a 54 year old fat man. ;-)



                                  Thomas S. Knutsen wrote:
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > Yes, That may work. I have been babitting castings made from ZA-12 and
                                  > homebrew Zinc-Alu alloy (approx 50/50).
                                  > Just take care to get the tinning of the bushing complete before
                                  > casting, the tinning requires some tecnique and an good flux.
                                • Shannon DeWolfe
                                  Thanks again, Thomas. I am a sponge soaking up information before I commit to any course of action. It would be so much easier with a mentor. There is a local
                                  Message 16 of 27 , Aug 4, 2010
                                  View Source
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    Thanks again, Thomas. I am a sponge soaking up information before I
                                    commit to any course of action. It would be so much easier with a
                                    mentor. There is a local club here in Houston (
                                    http://www.homemetalshopclub.org ). I am going to their next meeting. I
                                    hope to meet some folks who do casting, and babbitting. Hopefully there
                                    will be one or two there who won't mind if I ask elementary questions.

                                    Regards,


                                    --
                                    Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I've taken to using mister because my name misleads folks on the WWW. I am a 54 year old fat man. ;-)



                                    Thomas S. Knutsen wrote:
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > Hello Shannon.
                                    > It seems like you need to read some more about Babbitting metals and
                                    > how to do the preparations.
                                  • DennisF M
                                    Dear Shannon, David and Group As I see it, one of the primarry ideas of building a multimachine from an engine block is using the factory built in squareness,
                                    Message 17 of 27 , Aug 4, 2010
                                    View Source
                                    • 0 Attachment
                                      Dear Shannon, David and Group
                                      As I see it, one of the primarry ideas of building a multimachine from an engine block is using the factory built in squareness, the relationship of the lines realized of the outside of the block to the lines of the cylinders. If you were going to use babit in the cylinders, how would you maintain this basic idea?
                                      keep smiling
                                      dennis mac

                                      --- In multimachine@yahoogroups.com, "David G. LeVine" <dlevine@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > On 08/04/2010 10:13 AM, Shannon DeWolfe wrote:
                                      > > David,
                                      >
                                      > > <snippage>I was particularly interested in his method of using wax to clearance
                                      > > the spindle in the concrete. The wax is used to create clearance and an
                                      > > oil galley for bearings as shown. But the method can be used to
                                      > > clearance for babbitt bearings in a cylinder too.
                                      > >
                                      >
                                      > Nope, wax does not decompose at room temperature, at liquid babbitt
                                      > temperatures it does.
                                      >
                                      > > Going back to my idea of using all four cylinders for multiple swings:
                                      > >
                                      > > Using his wax clearance method for centering the spindle, I could drill
                                      > > an inclined hole through the block to the top and bottom of each
                                      > > cylinder to pour babbitt metal to make bearings. Pour the bottom
                                      > > cylinder. When the babbitt cools, remove the spindle and dip in wax
                                      > > again. Install the waxed spindle in the next cylinder. Pour the babbitt
                                      > > metal. Repeat until all four holes have babbitt bearings sized to the
                                      > > spindle.
                                      > >
                                      >
                                      > The issue is that wax will change to a gas and carbon, and may flash
                                      > into flame at babbitt temperatures. Try a coating of carbon (like an
                                      > acetylene torch to "smoke" it.) That will work better.
                                      >
                                      > > I think it would work. A method of sealing the three spindle holes not
                                      > > used would have to be devised. It could be as simple as duct taping a
                                      > > plastic plug in place at each end of the cylinder. I'll figure that out.
                                      > >
                                      >
                                      > How about putting a step at the crankshaft end in each bore (can be a
                                      > ring pressed and loctited in place), and a retainer in place of the head
                                      > held by the head bolts...
                                      >
                                      > > I know for a fact that babbitt bearings need lots of clean oil. I
                                      > > destroyed a '51 Chevy six cylinder engine when I was a teenager. I
                                      > > didn't stay on top of the oil level. I knew it was leaking and just
                                      > > waited too long to top it off. Other than that, my experience with
                                      > > babbitt bearings is nil. So, I have some questions regarding the spindle
                                      > > and babbitt bearings --
                                      > >
                                      > > How much clearance should I start with on the pipe diameter? I haven't
                                      > > measured the cylinders yet but the wear is minimal; I cannot catch a
                                      > > fingernail on the ridge. I was thinking I could open them up a few
                                      > > thousandths with a bottle brush hone. Is 0.003" a good target for
                                      > > clearance between the pipe and bore?
                                      > >
                                      >
                                      > I don't know, but that seems a bit large, something like 0.001" on each
                                      > side seems more desirable. Take a look at
                                      > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APmmOIL-CcQ and you will see engine rod
                                      > bearings being tested at 0.001" total, 0.0005" on each side. Also look
                                      > at this thread
                                      > http://maintenanceforums.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/7161085912/m/5741006572
                                      > to get a good idea of the applications today. More clearance means
                                      > lower load abilities and lower heating (less oil shear.)
                                      >
                                      > > How polished does the spindle need to be? Will spinning the pipe with a
                                      > > drill motor and using 600 grit emery cloth give a suitable finish?
                                      > >
                                      >
                                      > Take a look at an engine crankshaft, but 600 grit seems too coarse. The
                                      > problem is twofold: The shaft must be round within a few tenths of a
                                      > thousandth and have minimal taper (within a few tenths of a
                                      > thousandth.) Actually, it COULD taper to act as a thrust bearing, but
                                      > that is beyond my ability to discuss. And you will need a pretty heavy
                                      > thrust bearing!
                                      >
                                      > > The actual pour seems straightforward enough. But, the next steps are
                                      > > unclear to me. When the metal cools, do I lap the bearing with the
                                      > > spindle like you would valve seats? Or, should I turn the spindle slowly
                                      > > in one direction? How long should the babbitt metal cool before
                                      > > disrupting the spindle position? What lapping compound should I use? How
                                      > > do I know when enough is enough? Do I use soap and water to clean the
                                      > > lapping compound out of the bore?
                                      > >
                                      >
                                      > You do not use lapping compound, it will destroy the spindle! Model "T"
                                      > Fords would use clean oil as a lap and burnish the bearings to size.
                                      >
                                      > > I hate to load up questions like this but I need to know before I get
                                      > > started. I've read hours worth of material on babbitt bearings and I
                                      > > have not found the answers to these basic questions.
                                      > >
                                      >
                                      > I hope the maintenance forum helps you find what you need, but precision
                                      > machines tend to have slightly different needs than automotive engines.
                                      > And, surprise of surprises, I don't know everything!
                                      >
                                      > Dave 8{)
                                      >
                                    • Pat
                                      Hi Dennis You lose easy alignment but can use the tools and techniques we developed over the last 6 years to build a lathe rather than one developed around the
                                      Message 18 of 27 , Aug 4, 2010
                                      View Source
                                      • 0 Attachment
                                        Hi Dennis
                                        You lose easy alignment but can use the tools and techniques we developed over the last 6 years to build a lathe rather than one developed around the idea of a horizontal mill.
                                        We lose versatility but we build on the almost forgotten techniques that could be said to have won a world war. Some battles were preceded by the firing of hundreds of thousands of artillery shells, many of which were turned On Yeomans lathes.

                                        Good Lord! I just remembered that my father was injured in a WW1 gun emplacement (every one else was killed). I wonder if he was firing Yeomans lathe made shells. Maybe he was since most of the shells were made on these lathes.

                                        Anyway, we have the opportunity to save a world changing technology. Few groups have this chance and I think that it is pretty neat!

                                        I hope many of you will join me in this.

                                        Pat


                                        --- In multimachine@yahoogroups.com, "DennisF M" <a1g2r3i@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > Dear Shannon, David and Group
                                        > As I see it, one of the primarry ideas of building a multimachine from an engine block is using the factory built in squareness, the relationship of the lines realized of the outside of the block to the lines of the cylinders. If you were going to use babit in the cylinders, how would you maintain this basic idea?
                                        > keep smiling
                                        > dennis mac
                                        >
                                        > --- In multimachine@yahoogroups.com, "David G. LeVine" <dlevine@> wrote:
                                        > >
                                        > > On 08/04/2010 10:13 AM, Shannon DeWolfe wrote:
                                        > > > David,
                                        > >
                                        > > > <snippage>I was particularly interested in his method of using wax to clearance
                                        > > > the spindle in the concrete. The wax is used to create clearance and an
                                        > > > oil galley for bearings as shown. But the method can be used to
                                        > > > clearance for babbitt bearings in a cylinder too.
                                        > > >
                                        > >
                                        > > Nope, wax does not decompose at room temperature, at liquid babbitt
                                        > > temperatures it does.
                                        > >
                                        > > > Going back to my idea of using all four cylinders for multiple swings:
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Using his wax clearance method for centering the spindle, I could drill
                                        > > > an inclined hole through the block to the top and bottom of each
                                        > > > cylinder to pour babbitt metal to make bearings. Pour the bottom
                                        > > > cylinder. When the babbitt cools, remove the spindle and dip in wax
                                        > > > again. Install the waxed spindle in the next cylinder. Pour the babbitt
                                        > > > metal. Repeat until all four holes have babbitt bearings sized to the
                                        > > > spindle.
                                        > > >
                                        > >
                                        > > The issue is that wax will change to a gas and carbon, and may flash
                                        > > into flame at babbitt temperatures. Try a coating of carbon (like an
                                        > > acetylene torch to "smoke" it.) That will work better.
                                        > >
                                        > > > I think it would work. A method of sealing the three spindle holes not
                                        > > > used would have to be devised. It could be as simple as duct taping a
                                        > > > plastic plug in place at each end of the cylinder. I'll figure that out.
                                        > > >
                                        > >
                                        > > How about putting a step at the crankshaft end in each bore (can be a
                                        > > ring pressed and loctited in place), and a retainer in place of the head
                                        > > held by the head bolts...
                                        > >
                                        > > > I know for a fact that babbitt bearings need lots of clean oil. I
                                        > > > destroyed a '51 Chevy six cylinder engine when I was a teenager. I
                                        > > > didn't stay on top of the oil level. I knew it was leaking and just
                                        > > > waited too long to top it off. Other than that, my experience with
                                        > > > babbitt bearings is nil. So, I have some questions regarding the spindle
                                        > > > and babbitt bearings --
                                        > > >
                                        > > > How much clearance should I start with on the pipe diameter? I haven't
                                        > > > measured the cylinders yet but the wear is minimal; I cannot catch a
                                        > > > fingernail on the ridge. I was thinking I could open them up a few
                                        > > > thousandths with a bottle brush hone. Is 0.003" a good target for
                                        > > > clearance between the pipe and bore?
                                        > > >
                                        > >
                                        > > I don't know, but that seems a bit large, something like 0.001" on each
                                        > > side seems more desirable. Take a look at
                                        > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APmmOIL-CcQ and you will see engine rod
                                        > > bearings being tested at 0.001" total, 0.0005" on each side. Also look
                                        > > at this thread
                                        > > http://maintenanceforums.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/7161085912/m/5741006572
                                        > > to get a good idea of the applications today. More clearance means
                                        > > lower load abilities and lower heating (less oil shear.)
                                        > >
                                        > > > How polished does the spindle need to be? Will spinning the pipe with a
                                        > > > drill motor and using 600 grit emery cloth give a suitable finish?
                                        > > >
                                        > >
                                        > > Take a look at an engine crankshaft, but 600 grit seems too coarse. The
                                        > > problem is twofold: The shaft must be round within a few tenths of a
                                        > > thousandth and have minimal taper (within a few tenths of a
                                        > > thousandth.) Actually, it COULD taper to act as a thrust bearing, but
                                        > > that is beyond my ability to discuss. And you will need a pretty heavy
                                        > > thrust bearing!
                                        > >
                                        > > > The actual pour seems straightforward enough. But, the next steps are
                                        > > > unclear to me. When the metal cools, do I lap the bearing with the
                                        > > > spindle like you would valve seats? Or, should I turn the spindle slowly
                                        > > > in one direction? How long should the babbitt metal cool before
                                        > > > disrupting the spindle position? What lapping compound should I use? How
                                        > > > do I know when enough is enough? Do I use soap and water to clean the
                                        > > > lapping compound out of the bore?
                                        > > >
                                        > >
                                        > > You do not use lapping compound, it will destroy the spindle! Model "T"
                                        > > Fords would use clean oil as a lap and burnish the bearings to size.
                                        > >
                                        > > > I hate to load up questions like this but I need to know before I get
                                        > > > started. I've read hours worth of material on babbitt bearings and I
                                        > > > have not found the answers to these basic questions.
                                        > > >
                                        > >
                                        > > I hope the maintenance forum helps you find what you need, but precision
                                        > > machines tend to have slightly different needs than automotive engines.
                                        > > And, surprise of surprises, I don't know everything!
                                        > >
                                        > > Dave 8{)
                                        > >
                                        >
                                      • Robert
                                        Shannon, David and guys, There is a gent in our area that does Commercial Babbit pouring. The wood yard I worked in while I was much younger employed him
                                        Message 19 of 27 , Aug 5, 2010
                                        View Source
                                        • 0 Attachment
                                          Shannon, David and guys, There is a gent in our area that does Commercial Babbit pouring. The wood yard I worked in while I was much younger employed him several times to pour and bed the chipper blades on our 300 HP tree chipper. It was an maazing piece of equipment that would devour a whole 40 foot 30 to 40 inch diameter tree in less than 9 seconds and blow the resulting chip approximately 50 feet into a parked and waiting 100 cubic yard trailer, it would fill it in less than 10 minutes from completely empty to packed full. The yard jockey tractor had a heck of a time keeping empty trailers spotted in time to avoid having to blow it onto the ground in a huge 80 foot tall pile. WE provided chip material for the local charcoal plant and had a contract to supply 1000 yards a day for their process. The chipper was amazing, it had 24 inch long knives bedded at 60 degrees around it's front face and weighed about 2 tons. It required a surge of about $100.00 worth of electricity to start it on 3 phase power that was phased to prevent melting the wires off the pole to the transformer. If you would like I will try to locate this individual and see if he is intersted in sharing his info or doing a demo in the Gainesville area. I talked to him at length while he was working in our yard and he was a pretty neat guy with some of the old world technologies he provided.
                                          Bob

                                          --- In multimachine@yahoogroups.com, Shannon DeWolfe <sdewolfe@...> wrote:
                                          >
                                          > David,
                                          >
                                          > I think the methods outlined in that patent could be the absolute
                                          > cheapest way to build a lathe.
                                          >
                                          > I was particularly interested in his method of using wax to clearance
                                          > the spindle in the concrete. The wax is used to create clearance and an
                                          > oil galley for bearings as shown. But the method can be used to
                                          > clearance for babbitt bearings in a cylinder too.
                                          >
                                          > Going back to my idea of using all four cylinders for multiple swings:
                                          >
                                          > Using his wax clearance method for centering the spindle, I could drill
                                          > an inclined hole through the block to the top and bottom of each
                                          > cylinder to pour babbitt metal to make bearings. Pour the bottom
                                          > cylinder. When the babbitt cools, remove the spindle and dip in wax
                                          > again. Install the waxed spindle in the next cylinder. Pour the babbitt
                                          > metal. Repeat until all four holes have babbitt bearings sized to the
                                          > spindle.
                                          >
                                          > I think it would work. A method of sealing the three spindle holes not
                                          > used would have to be devised. It could be as simple as duct taping a
                                          > plastic plug in place at each end of the cylinder. I'll figure that out.
                                          >
                                          > I know for a fact that babbitt bearings need lots of clean oil. I
                                          > destroyed a '51 Chevy six cylinder engine when I was a teenager. I
                                          > didn't stay on top of the oil level. I knew it was leaking and just
                                          > waited too long to top it off. Other than that, my experience with
                                          > babbitt bearings is nil. So, I have some questions regarding the spindle
                                          > and babbitt bearings --
                                          >
                                          > How much clearance should I start with on the pipe diameter? I haven't
                                          > measured the cylinders yet but the wear is minimal; I cannot catch a
                                          > fingernail on the ridge. I was thinking I could open them up a few
                                          > thousandths with a bottle brush hone. Is 0.003" a good target for
                                          > clearance between the pipe and bore?
                                          >
                                          > How polished does the spindle need to be? Will spinning the pipe with a
                                          > drill motor and using 600 grit emery cloth give a suitable finish?
                                          >
                                          > The actual pour seems straightforward enough. But, the next steps are
                                          > unclear to me. When the metal cools, do I lap the bearing with the
                                          > spindle like you would valve seats? Or, should I turn the spindle slowly
                                          > in one direction? How long should the babbitt metal cool before
                                          > disrupting the spindle position? What lapping compound should I use? How
                                          > do I know when enough is enough? Do I use soap and water to clean the
                                          > lapping compound out of the bore?
                                          >
                                          > I hate to load up questions like this but I need to know before I get
                                          > started. I've read hours worth of material on babbitt bearings and I
                                          > have not found the answers to these basic questions.
                                          >
                                          > Regards,
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > --
                                          > Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I've taken to using mister because my name misleads folks on the WWW. I am a 54 year old fat man. ;-)
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > David G. LeVine wrote:
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > Great find! It discusses a number of things and gives reference to a
                                          > > number of other patents.
                                          > >
                                          > > If you look at figure 1a, you will see the cartridge type spindle which
                                          > > has been discussed as a means of allowing reasonable changes.
                                          >
                                        • Shannon DeWolfe
                                          Second attempt -- first message rejected by Yahoo Groups. Hello Robert, I saw that machine on some TV show. It was an incredibly violent machine. It actually
                                          Message 20 of 27 , Aug 5, 2010
                                          View Source
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            Second attempt -- first message rejected by Yahoo Groups.

                                            Hello Robert,

                                            I saw that machine on some TV show. It was an incredibly violent
                                            machine. It actually ate trees like some mechanical monster. You got to
                                            work around this thing? Cool. ;-)

                                            Gainesville, Texas, or Gainesville, Florida, or???

                                            If in Texas, I will take time from work to attend such a session. Let us
                                            know if he wants to share what he knows.

                                            I have been reading. I know now that I cannot pour directly into the
                                            block, I must make an armature, bearing shells, and more. I have to
                                            acquire tools that I have never needed before. I must learn several
                                            things that I have never tried before. It will be expensive and time
                                            consuming. Roller bearings would be easier and cheaper.

                                            Regards,


                                            --
                                            Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I've taken to using mister because my name misleads folks on the WWW. I am a 54 year old fat man. ;-)



                                            Robert wrote:
                                            > Shannon, David and guys, There is a gent in our area that does Commercial Babbit pouring.
                                          • keith gutshall
                                            Hello Dennis  You have a good point about alinement of things.  If you a pouring babbitt bearing in the machine , a jig/fixture is is nessesary to hold the
                                            Message 21 of 27 , Aug 5, 2010
                                            View Source
                                            • 0 Attachment
                                              Hello Dennis
                                               You have a good point about alinement of things.
                                               If you a pouring babbitt bearing in the machine , a jig/fixture is
                                              is nessesary to hold the spindle in alinement with the ways
                                               to get it right.
                                               
                                              The headstock on the two block lathe I am working on, I am
                                               haveing a  difficult time geting it "On the money".
                                               It is close, but I am going to need some more adjustment to
                                               get it correct.
                                               
                                               At this point I have a bigger problem, The motor  quit running on  me.
                                               I have to get a new motor, this will be a 3/4HP one.
                                               
                                               I have not done much lately, the heat wave here in Florida is been a
                                              out rageous . The heat index is 95* at 9:00 AM  CDT already this morning.
                                               
                                               Keith

                                              Deep Run Portage
                                              Back Shop
                                              " The Lizard Works"

                                              --- On Wed, 8/4/10, DennisF M <a1g2r3i@...> wrote:

                                              From: DennisF M <a1g2r3i@...>
                                              Subject: [multimachine] Re: Was; A modern concrete lathe--Now; Has anyone experience with babbitt metal?
                                              To: multimachine@yahoogroups.com
                                              Date: Wednesday, August 4, 2010, 8:22 PM

                                               
                                              Dear Shannon, David and Group
                                              As I see it, one of the primarry ideas of building a multimachine from an engine block is using the factory built in squareness, the relationship of the lines realized of the outside of the block to the lines of the cylinders. If you were going to use babit in the cylinders, how would you maintain this basic idea?
                                              keep smiling
                                              dennis mac

                                              --- In multimachine@yahoogroups.com, "David G. LeVine" <dlevine@...> wrote:
                                              >
                                              > On 08/04/2010 10:13 AM, Shannon DeWolfe wrote:
                                              > > David,
                                              >
                                              > > <snippage>I was particularly interested in his method of using wax to clearance
                                              > > the spindle in the concrete. The wax is used to create clearance and an
                                              > > oil galley for bearings as shown. But the method can be used to
                                              > > clearance for babbitt bearings in a cylinder too.
                                              > >
                                              >
                                              > Nope, wax does not decompose at room temperature, at liquid babbitt
                                              > temperatures it does.
                                              >
                                              > > Going back to my idea of using all four cylinders for multiple swings:
                                              > >
                                              > > Using his wax clearance method for centering the spindle, I could drill
                                              > > an inclined hole through the block to the top and bottom of each
                                              > > cylinder to pour babbitt metal to make bearings. Pour the bottom
                                              > > cylinder. When the babbitt cools, remove the spindle and dip in wax
                                              > > again. Install the waxed spindle in the next cylinder. Pour the babbitt
                                              > > metal. Repeat until all four holes have babbitt bearings sized to the
                                              > > spindle.
                                              > >
                                              >
                                              > The issue is that wax will change to a gas and carbon, and may flash
                                              > into flame at babbitt temperatures. Try a coating of carbon (like an
                                              > acetylene torch to "smoke" it.) That will work better.
                                              >
                                              > > I think it would work. A method of sealing the three spindle holes not
                                              > > used would have to be devised. It could be as simple as duct taping a
                                              > > plastic plug in place at each end of the cylinder. I'll figure that out.
                                              > >
                                              >
                                              > How about putting a step at the crankshaft end in each bore (can be a
                                              > ring pressed and loctited in place), and a retainer in place of the head
                                              > held by the head bolts...
                                              >
                                              > > I know for a fact that babbitt bearings need lots of clean oil. I
                                              > > destroyed a '51 Chevy six cylinder engine when I was a teenager. I
                                              > > didn't stay on top of the oil level. I knew it was leaking and just
                                              > > waited too long to top it off. Other than that, my experience with
                                              > > babbitt bearings is nil. So, I have some questions regarding the spindle
                                              > > and babbitt bearings --
                                              > >
                                              > > How much clearance should I start with on the pipe diameter? I haven't
                                              > > measured the cylinders yet but the wear is minimal; I cannot catch a
                                              > > fingernail on the ridge. I was thinking I could open them up a few
                                              > > thousandths with a bottle brush hone. Is 0.003" a good target for
                                              > > clearance between the pipe and bore?
                                              > >
                                              >
                                              > I don't know, but that seems a bit large, something like 0.001" on each
                                              > side seems more desirable. Take a look at
                                              > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APmmOIL-CcQ and you will see engine rod
                                              > bearings being tested at 0.001" total, 0.0005" on each side. Also look
                                              > at this thread
                                              > http://maintenanceforums.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/7161085912/m/5741006572
                                              > to get a good idea of the applications today. More clearance means
                                              > lower load abilities and lower heating (less oil shear.)
                                              >
                                              > > How polished does the spindle need to be? Will spinning the pipe with a
                                              > > drill motor and using 600 grit emery cloth give a suitable finish?
                                              > >
                                              >
                                              > Take a look at an engine crankshaft, but 600 grit seems too coarse. The
                                              > problem is twofold: The shaft must be round within a few tenths of a
                                              > thousandth and have minimal taper (within a few tenths of a
                                              > thousandth.) Actually, it COULD taper to act as a thrust bearing, but
                                              > that is beyond my ability to discuss. And you will need a pretty heavy
                                              > thrust bearing!
                                              >
                                              > > The actual pour seems straightforward enough. But, the next steps are
                                              > > unclear to me. When the metal cools, do I lap the bearing with the
                                              > > spindle like you would valve seats? Or, should I turn the spindle slowly
                                              > > in one direction? How long should the babbitt metal cool before
                                              > > disrupting the spindle position? What lapping compound should I use? How
                                              > > do I know when enough is enough? Do I use soap and water to clean the
                                              > > lapping compound out of the bore?
                                              > >
                                              >
                                              > You do not use lapping compound, it will destroy the spindle! Model "T"
                                              > Fords would use clean oil as a lap and burnish the bearings to size.
                                              >
                                              > > I hate to load up questions like this but I need to know before I get
                                              > > started. I've read hours worth of material on babbitt bearings and I
                                              > > have not found the answers to these basic questions.
                                              > >
                                              >
                                              > I hope the maintenance forum helps you find what you need, but precision
                                              > machines tend to have slightly different needs than automotive engines.
                                              > And, surprise of surprises, I don't know everything!
                                              >
                                              > Dave 8{)
                                              >


                                            • Pat
                                              Hi guys Hardwood or (better) steel wedges should should work as well as a jig and would be much easier to make. Pat
                                              Message 22 of 27 , Aug 5, 2010
                                              View Source
                                              • 0 Attachment
                                                Hi guys
                                                Hardwood or (better) steel wedges should should work as well as a jig and would be much easier to make.

                                                Pat

                                                --- In multimachine@yahoogroups.com, keith gutshall <drpshops@...> wrote:
                                                >
                                                > Hello Dennis
                                                >  You have a good point about alinement of things.
                                                >  If you a pouring babbitt bearing in the machine , a jig/fixture is
                                                > is nessesary to hold the spindle in alinement with the ways
                                                >  to get it right.
                                                >  
                                                > The headstock on the two block lathe I am working on, I am
                                                >  haveing a  difficult time geting it "On the money".
                                                >  It is close, but I am going to need some more adjustment to
                                                >  get it correct.
                                                >  
                                                >  At this point I have a bigger problem, The motor  quit running on  me.
                                                >  I have to get a new motor, this will be a 3/4HP one.
                                                >  
                                                >  I have not done much lately, the heat wave here in Florida is been a
                                                > out rageous . The heat index is 95* at 9:00 AM  CDT already this morning.
                                                >  
                                                >  Keith
                                                >
                                                > Deep Run Portage
                                                > Back Shop
                                                > " The Lizard Works"
                                                >
                                                > --- On Wed, 8/4/10, DennisF M <a1g2r3i@...> wrote:
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > From: DennisF M <a1g2r3i@...>
                                                > Subject: [multimachine] Re: Was; A modern concrete lathe--Now; Has anyone experience with babbitt metal?
                                                > To: multimachine@yahoogroups.com
                                                > Date: Wednesday, August 4, 2010, 8:22 PM
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >  
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > Dear Shannon, David and Group
                                                > As I see it, one of the primarry ideas of building a multimachine from an engine block is using the factory built in squareness, the relationship of the lines realized of the outside of the block to the lines of the cylinders. If you were going to use babit in the cylinders, how would you maintain this basic idea?
                                                > keep smiling
                                                > dennis mac
                                                >
                                                > --- In multimachine@yahoogroups.com, "David G. LeVine" <dlevine@> wrote:
                                                > >
                                                > > On 08/04/2010 10:13 AM, Shannon DeWolfe wrote:
                                                > > > David,
                                                > >
                                                > > > <snippage>I was particularly interested in his method of using wax to clearance
                                                > > > the spindle in the concrete. The wax is used to create clearance and an
                                                > > > oil galley for bearings as shown. But the method can be used to
                                                > > > clearance for babbitt bearings in a cylinder too.
                                                > > >
                                                > >
                                                > > Nope, wax does not decompose at room temperature, at liquid babbitt
                                                > > temperatures it does.
                                                > >
                                                > > > Going back to my idea of using all four cylinders for multiple swings:
                                                > > >
                                                > > > Using his wax clearance method for centering the spindle, I could drill
                                                > > > an inclined hole through the block to the top and bottom of each
                                                > > > cylinder to pour babbitt metal to make bearings. Pour the bottom
                                                > > > cylinder. When the babbitt cools, remove the spindle and dip in wax
                                                > > > again. Install the waxed spindle in the next cylinder. Pour the babbitt
                                                > > > metal. Repeat until all four holes have babbitt bearings sized to the
                                                > > > spindle.
                                                > > >
                                                > >
                                                > > The issue is that wax will change to a gas and carbon, and may flash
                                                > > into flame at babbitt temperatures. Try a coating of carbon (like an
                                                > > acetylene torch to "smoke" it.) That will work better.
                                                > >
                                                > > > I think it would work. A method of sealing the three spindle holes not
                                                > > > used would have to be devised. It could be as simple as duct taping a
                                                > > > plastic plug in place at each end of the cylinder. I'll figure that out.
                                                > > >
                                                > >
                                                > > How about putting a step at the crankshaft end in each bore (can be a
                                                > > ring pressed and loctited in place), and a retainer in place of the head
                                                > > held by the head bolts...
                                                > >
                                                > > > I know for a fact that babbitt bearings need lots of clean oil. I
                                                > > > destroyed a '51 Chevy six cylinder engine when I was a teenager. I
                                                > > > didn't stay on top of the oil level. I knew it was leaking and just
                                                > > > waited too long to top it off. Other than that, my experience with
                                                > > > babbitt bearings is nil. So, I have some questions regarding the spindle
                                                > > > and babbitt bearings --
                                                > > >
                                                > > > How much clearance should I start with on the pipe diameter? I haven't
                                                > > > measured the cylinders yet but the wear is minimal; I cannot catch a
                                                > > > fingernail on the ridge. I was thinking I could open them up a few
                                                > > > thousandths with a bottle brush hone. Is 0.003" a good target for
                                                > > > clearance between the pipe and bore?
                                                > > >
                                                > >
                                                > > I don't know, but that seems a bit large, something like 0.001" on each
                                                > > side seems more desirable. Take a look at
                                                > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APmmOIL-CcQ and you will see engine rod
                                                > > bearings being tested at 0.001" total, 0.0005" on each side. Also look
                                                > > at this thread
                                                > > http://maintenanceforums.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/7161085912/m/5741006572
                                                > > to get a good idea of the applications today. More clearance means
                                                > > lower load abilities and lower heating (less oil shear.)
                                                > >
                                                > > > How polished does the spindle need to be? Will spinning the pipe with a
                                                > > > drill motor and using 600 grit emery cloth give a suitable finish?
                                                > > >
                                                > >
                                                > > Take a look at an engine crankshaft, but 600 grit seems too coarse. The
                                                > > problem is twofold: The shaft must be round within a few tenths of a
                                                > > thousandth and have minimal taper (within a few tenths of a
                                                > > thousandth.) Actually, it COULD taper to act as a thrust bearing, but
                                                > > that is beyond my ability to discuss. And you will need a pretty heavy
                                                > > thrust bearing!
                                                > >
                                                > > > The actual pour seems straightforward enough. But, the next steps are
                                                > > > unclear to me. When the metal cools, do I lap the bearing with the
                                                > > > spindle like you would valve seats? Or, should I turn the spindle slowly
                                                > > > in one direction? How long should the babbitt metal cool before
                                                > > > disrupting the spindle position? What lapping compound should I use? How
                                                > > > do I know when enough is enough? Do I use soap and water to clean the
                                                > > > lapping compound out of the bore?
                                                > > >
                                                > >
                                                > > You do not use lapping compound, it will destroy the spindle! Model "T"
                                                > > Fords would use clean oil as a lap and burnish the bearings to size.
                                                > >
                                                > > > I hate to load up questions like this but I need to know before I get
                                                > > > started. I've read hours worth of material on babbitt bearings and I
                                                > > > have not found the answers to these basic questions.
                                                > > >
                                                > >
                                                > > I hope the maintenance forum helps you find what you need, but precision
                                                > > machines tend to have slightly different needs than automotive engines.
                                                > > And, surprise of surprises, I don't know everything!
                                                > >
                                                > > Dave 8{)
                                                > >
                                                >
                                              • David G. LeVine
                                                ... Let us assume that we can measure the babbitt thickness. Given a constant thickness, the block s bore (a cylinder) and the cylinder inside of the babbitt
                                                Message 23 of 27 , Aug 5, 2010
                                                View Source
                                                • 0 Attachment
                                                  On 08/04/2010 09:22 PM, DennisF M wrote:
                                                  > Dear Shannon, David and Group
                                                  > As I see it, one of the primarry ideas of building a multimachine from an engine block is using the factory built in squareness, the relationship of the lines realized of the outside of the block to the lines of the cylinders. If you were going to use babit in the cylinders, how would you maintain this basic idea?
                                                  > keep smiling
                                                  > dennis mac
                                                  >

                                                  Let us assume that we can measure the babbitt thickness. Given a
                                                  constant thickness, the block's bore (a cylinder) and the cylinder
                                                  inside of the babbitt will be parallel. This resolves the issues with
                                                  that alignment.

                                                  One way to do this is to make wooden spacers which hold the spindle's
                                                  shaft in the correct orientation, getting it within less than a
                                                  thousandth will be difficult, but babbitt won't hold a few tenths
                                                  either. The multimachine is a rough tool, it will not hold tenths of a
                                                  thousandth with babbitt bearing surfaces, but it will hold a few
                                                  thousandths, and that is all we can work toward in an environment where
                                                  temperature and power may be variable.
                                                • Robert
                                                  Shannon, that is Gainesville, Fl. I will still attempt to locate the guy just for fun to see if he still does it. Wood processing machinery is some pretty
                                                  Message 24 of 27 , Aug 6, 2010
                                                  View Source
                                                  • 0 Attachment
                                                    Shannon, that is Gainesville, Fl. I will still attempt to locate the guy just for fun to see if he still does it. Wood processing machinery is some pretty tough machinery when it is in action. I have seen it throw a block of wood 300 yards from the back of the wood yard all the way to the truck scales when cleaning out the drum on a tub chipper while prepping it for hammer and grate changes. We had three of those machines and kept them running pretty much constantly. One machine was mobile and powered by a 600 HP cummins diesel and burned 300 gallons of fuel a day. We took it to the Ice Storm clean up in Arkansas and filled a 40 acre hole in the ground to a depth of 40 feet with all of the debris we hauled to a central location. Those were the days, back before I got disabled and unable to do that work any more.
                                                    Bob

                                                    --- In multimachine@yahoogroups.com, Shannon DeWolfe <sdewolfe@...> wrote:
                                                    >
                                                    > Second attempt -- first message rejected by Yahoo Groups.
                                                    >
                                                    > Hello Robert,
                                                    >
                                                    > I saw that machine on some TV show. It was an incredibly violent
                                                    > machine. It actually ate trees like some mechanical monster. You got to
                                                    > work around this thing? Cool. ;-)
                                                    >
                                                    > Gainesville, Texas, or Gainesville, Florida, or???
                                                    >
                                                    > If in Texas, I will take time from work to attend such a session. Let us
                                                    > know if he wants to share what he knows.
                                                    >
                                                    > I have been reading. I know now that I cannot pour directly into the
                                                    > block, I must make an armature, bearing shells, and more. I have to
                                                    > acquire tools that I have never needed before. I must learn several
                                                    > things that I have never tried before. It will be expensive and time
                                                    > consuming. Roller bearings would be easier and cheaper.
                                                    > Regards,
                                                    > Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I've taken to using mister because my name misleads folks on the WWW. I am a 54 year old fat man. ;-)
                                                  • DennisF M
                                                    Dear Keith Perhaps check out Freecycle entering the name of your city before the term in quotes; you might luck out with a treadmill motor or something. It
                                                    Message 25 of 27 , Aug 6, 2010
                                                    View Source
                                                    • 0 Attachment
                                                      Dear Keith
                                                      Perhaps check out "Freecycle" entering the name of your city before the term in quotes; you might luck out with a treadmill motor or something. It is amaizing what folks throw out.
                                                      I have been having to adjust my behaviour re the heat and humidity as well.
                                                      keep smiling
                                                      dennis
                                                      --- In multimachine@yahoogroups.com, keith gutshall <drpshops@...> wrote:
                                                      >
                                                      > Hello Dennis
                                                      >  You have a good point about alinement of things.
                                                      >  If you a pouring babbitt bearing in the machine , a jig/fixture is
                                                      > is nessesary to hold the spindle in alinement with the ways
                                                      >  to get it right.
                                                      >  
                                                      > The headstock on the two block lathe I am working on, I am
                                                      >  haveing a  difficult time geting it "On the money".
                                                      >  It is close, but I am going to need some more adjustment to
                                                      >  get it correct.
                                                      >  
                                                      >  At this point I have a bigger problem, The motor  quit running on  me.
                                                      >  I have to get a new motor, this will be a 3/4HP one.
                                                      >  
                                                      >  I have not done much lately, the heat wave here in Florida is been a
                                                      > out rageous . The heat index is 95* at 9:00 AM  CDT already this morning.
                                                      >  
                                                      >  Keith
                                                      >
                                                      > Deep Run Portage
                                                      > Back Shop
                                                      > " The Lizard Works"
                                                      >
                                                      > --- On Wed, 8/4/10, DennisF M <a1g2r3i@...> wrote:
                                                      >
                                                      > SNIP /dfm
                                                    Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.