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A message from the WISE project

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  • amymainzerjpl
    Hi, folks- I am pleased to announce that the spigots are about to open on the WISE moving object pipeline! As others have mentioned, WISE is an all-sky survey
    Message 1 of 18 , Jan 18, 2010
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      Hi, folks-

      I am pleased to announce that the spigots are about to open on the WISE moving object pipeline! As others have mentioned, WISE is an all-sky survey operating at 3.4, 4.6, 12 and 22 microns. We estimate observing ~300,000 Main Belt Asteroids and ~700 NEOs. Of these, ~100,000 MBAs will be new, and ~300 NEOs will be new. That translates to ~1000 new MBAs per day, and ~1-3 new NEOs per day.

      WISE has just completed its one month in-orbit checkout and begun its survey (Mainzer et al. 2005; Liu et al. 2008). We are in the final phases of tuning the calibration of the pipeline. When the pipeline calibration is complete in another week or two, we will be turning out astrometry equal to or better than 0.5 arcsec. Initial moving object discoveries from WISE will have astrometry residuals as large as 10 arcsec until we switch on the portion of the pipeline that refines the astrometric registration of the images. Tuning up the pipeline consists of comparison of ground-based measurements to actual in-flight data and implementing these results, and we are proceeding on our pre-launch planned schedule for this process.

      WISE is in a sun-synchronous polar orbit with a 47x47 arcmin field of view and an 11 sec exposure cycle. Frame to frame overlap is 10% in the in-scan direction and 90% in the cross-scan direction on the ecliptic, leading to an average of 10-12 detections of a typical solar system object over ~36 hours. Even though our orbit is 95 minutes, we jump back and forth slightly to create extra overlaps, resulting in an average of 3 hours between observations of a typical object. This, combined with our required 0.5 arcsec astrometry, will allow us to generate an arc good for ~2-3 weeks before uncertainties become too large for practical follow-up. We anticipate that the peak of our magnitude distribution for NEOs will be V~21-22 after the pipeline calibration is completed, although our simulations (Grav et al. 2009) suggest that ~36% of WISE NEOs will be brighter than 21st magnitude. As the WISE measurements are made in the mid-infrared, we will compute an estimated visual magnitude for ground-based observers. As WISE always points near the zenith, our observations can be considered approximately geocentric; in general, there is no appreciable topocentric parallax. We are preparing a more detailed explanatory supplement for the WISE data and will have that available shortly. We will begin posting objects to the NEO Confirmation Page very soon, and we look forward to seeing follow up observations from all of you.

      Best regards,
      Amy Mainzer
      WISE Deputy Project Scientist &
      Principal Investigator, NEOWISE
      Jet Propulsion Laboratory
    • Fabrizio Bernardi
      Dear all, I think there is a major problem for the astrometry provided by space telescopes. That is, if we know only the position vector (i.e. X, Y and Z in a
      Message 2 of 18 , Jan 19, 2010
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        Dear all,
        I think there is a major problem for the astrometry provided by space
        telescopes. That is, if we know only the position vector (i.e. X, Y and
        Z in a Cartesian reference frame) and NOT the velocity vector of the
        space telescope (in this case WISE), the astrometric error due to the
        aberration can be several arcseconds. This is even a more serious
        problem than the random astrometric error, because it is systematic.
        The problem is also that the MPC standard format for space telescope
        observations gives ONLY the position vector and not the velocity vector
        of such a telescope. This means that the space observations are
        practically useless.
        I am wondering if the WISE team is aware of it and if it has some solution.
        Regards,
        Fabrizio Bernardi (AstDys and NEODyS team)

        amymainzerjpl wrote:
        >
        > Hi, folks-
        >
        > I am pleased to announce that the spigots are about to open on the
        > WISE moving object pipeline! As others have mentioned, WISE is an
        > all-sky survey operating at 3.4, 4.6, 12 and 22 microns. We estimate
        > observing ~300,000 Main Belt Asteroids and ~700 NEOs. Of these,
        > ~100,000 MBAs will be new, and ~300 NEOs will be new. That translates
        > to ~1000 new MBAs per day, and ~1-3 new NEOs per day.
        >
        > WISE has just completed its one month in-orbit checkout and begun its
        > survey (Mainzer et al. 2005; Liu et al. 2008). We are in the final
        > phases of tuning the calibration of the pipeline. When the pipeline
        > calibration is complete in another week or two, we will be turning out
        > astrometry equal to or better than 0.5 arcsec. Initial moving object
        > discoveries from WISE will have astrometry residuals as large as 10
        > arcsec until we switch on the portion of the pipeline that refines the
        > astrometric registration of the images. Tuning up the pipeline
        > consists of comparison of ground-based measurements to actual
        > in-flight data and implementing these results, and we are proceeding
        > on our pre-launch planned schedule for this process.
        >
        > WISE is in a sun-synchronous polar orbit with a 47x47 arcmin field of
        > view and an 11 sec exposure cycle. Frame to frame overlap is 10% in
        > the in-scan direction and 90% in the cross-scan direction on the
        > ecliptic, leading to an average of 10-12 detections of a typical solar
        > system object over ~36 hours. Even though our orbit is 95 minutes, we
        > jump back and forth slightly to create extra overlaps, resulting in an
        > average of 3 hours between observations of a typical object. This,
        > combined with our required 0.5 arcsec astrometry, will allow us to
        > generate an arc good for ~2-3 weeks before uncertainties become too
        > large for practical follow-up. We anticipate that the peak of our
        > magnitude distribution for NEOs will be V~21-22 after the pipeline
        > calibration is completed, although our simulations (Grav et al. 2009)
        > suggest that ~36% of WISE NEOs will be brighter than 21st magnitude.
        > As the WISE measurements are made in the mid-infrared, we will compute
        > an estimated visual magni tude for ground-based observers. As WISE
        > always points near the zenith, our observations can be considered
        > approximately geocentric; in general, there is no appreciable
        > topocentric parallax. We are preparing a more detailed explanatory
        > supplement for the WISE data and will have that available shortly. We
        > will begin posting objects to the NEO Confirmation Page very soon, and
        > we look forward to seeing follow up observations from all of you.
        >
        > Best regards,
        > Amy Mainzer
        > WISE Deputy Project Scientist &
        > Principal Investigator, NEOWISE
        > Jet Propulsion Laboratory
        >
        >



        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Roy Tucker
        Dear Fabrizio, I must be missing something, I m not quite following your point. It is true that there will be an absolute displacement due to velocity
        Message 3 of 18 , Jan 19, 2010
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          Dear Fabrizio,

          I must be missing something, I'm not quite following your point. It is
          true that there will be an absolute displacement due to velocity aberration
          but this will also affect the background reference stars. As long as the
          astrometric measurement is made relative to the background stars, aberration
          will vanish from the result. Measurements from earth surface show no
          component of aberration even though the effect may be as great as about 20
          arcseconds. Am I misunderstanding your point?

          Best regards,
          - Roy

          ----- Original Message -----
          From: "Fabrizio Bernardi" <bernardi@...>
          To: "amymainzerjpl" <amainzer123@...>; <mpml@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2010 2:04 AM
          Subject: Re: {MPML} A message from the WISE project


          > Dear all,
          > I think there is a major problem for the astrometry provided by space
          > telescopes. That is, if we know only the position vector (i.e. X, Y and
          > Z in a Cartesian reference frame) and NOT the velocity vector of the
          > space telescope (in this case WISE), the astrometric error due to the
          > aberration can be several arcseconds. This is even a more serious
          > problem than the random astrometric error, because it is systematic.
          > The problem is also that the MPC standard format for space telescope
          > observations gives ONLY the position vector and not the velocity vector
          > of such a telescope. This means that the space observations are
          > practically useless.
          > I am wondering if the WISE team is aware of it and if it has some
          > solution.
          > Regards,
          > Fabrizio Bernardi (AstDys and NEODyS team)
          >
        • Andrea Milani
          You might be right on this, at least to first order in the aberration correction, but then, why are the the observations from space telescopes in the MPC
          Message 4 of 18 , Jan 19, 2010
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            You might be right on this, at least to first order in the aberration
            correction, but then, why are the the observations from space
            telescopes in the MPC archives giving very poor residuals? See e.g.
            (120347), the residuals are given both by the MPC and by AstDyS, with
            many observations discarded.

            Why are the observations from Spitzer also quite poor in astrometry? Why
            should WISE be much better than Spitzer?

            (Please do not use as examples the 248 Hipparcos observations: they are
            post-processed data, included in the MPC archives as geocentric
            observations).

            This problem has been bugging me for some time, and for now I have been
            unable to find a solution.

            Andrea Milani


            On Tue, 19 Jan 2010, Roy Tucker wrote:

            > Dear Fabrizio,
            >
            > I must be missing something, I'm not quite following your point. It is
            > true that there will be an absolute displacement due to velocity aberration
            > but this will also affect the background reference stars. As long as the
            > astrometric measurement is made relative to the background stars, aberration
            > will vanish from the result. Measurements from earth surface show no
            > component of aberration even though the effect may be as great as about 20
            > arcseconds. Am I misunderstanding your point?
            >
            > Best regards,
            > - Roy
            >
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: "Fabrizio Bernardi" <bernardi@...>
            > To: "amymainzerjpl" <amainzer123@...>; <mpml@yahoogroups.com>
            > Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2010 2:04 AM
            > Subject: Re: {MPML} A message from the WISE project
            >
            >
            >> Dear all,
            >> I think there is a major problem for the astrometry provided by space
            >> telescopes. That is, if we know only the position vector (i.e. X, Y and
            >> Z in a Cartesian reference frame) and NOT the velocity vector of the
            >> space telescope (in this case WISE), the astrometric error due to the
            >> aberration can be several arcseconds. This is even a more serious
            >> problem than the random astrometric error, because it is systematic.
            >> The problem is also that the MPC standard format for space telescope
            >> observations gives ONLY the position vector and not the velocity vector
            >> of such a telescope. This means that the space observations are
            >> practically useless.
            >> I am wondering if the WISE team is aware of it and if it has some
            >> solution.
            >> Regards,
            >> Fabrizio Bernardi (AstDys and NEODyS team)
            >>
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > ------------------------------------
            >
            > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
            >
            > Posts to this list or information found within may be freely used, with the stipulation that MPML and the originating author are cited as the source of the information.Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >

            ================================================
            Andrea Milani Comparetti
            Dipartimento di Matematica
            Piazzale B. Pontecorvo 5
            56127 PISA ITALY

            tel. +39-050-2213254 fax +39-050-2213224
            cellular phone +39-349-4482751
            E-mail: milani@...
            WWW: http://adams.dm.unipi.it/~milani/
            ================================================
          • Reiner M. Stoss
            ... Maybe the satellite guys forgot to install D4 time service... R.
            Message 5 of 18 , Jan 19, 2010
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              > You might be right on this, at least to first order in the aberration
              > correction, but then, why are the the observations from space
              > telescopes in the MPC archives giving very poor residuals? See e.g.

              Maybe the satellite guys forgot to install D4 time service...

              R.
            • Dave Tholen
              ... But aberration is independent of distance, so the background reference stars suffer the same aberration as the foreground asteroid. Because asteroid
              Message 6 of 18 , Jan 19, 2010
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                > I think there is a major problem for the astrometry provided by space
                > telescopes. That is, if we know only the position vector (i.e. X, Y and
                > Z in a Cartesian reference frame) and NOT the velocity vector of the
                > space telescope (in this case WISE), the astrometric error due to the
                > aberration can be several arcseconds. This is even a more serious
                > problem than the random astrometric error, because it is systematic.

                But aberration is independent of distance, so the background
                reference stars suffer the same aberration as the foreground
                asteroid. Because asteroid positions are measured differentially
                with respect to the background stars, the absolute amount of
                aberration cancels out. For really big fields, there can be
                differential aberration over the field, but that usually gets
                taken out by doing independent scale calibrations in each axis.
              • Dave Tholen
                ... Clock problems? The thing to do is to get your hands on the problem images and have somebody remeasure them using known techniques.
                Message 7 of 18 , Jan 19, 2010
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                  > This problem has been bugging me for some time, and for now I have been
                  > unable to find a solution.

                  Clock problems?

                  The thing to do is to get your hands on the problem images and have
                  somebody remeasure them using known techniques.
                • Christian
                  Hello, Followup of ~1-3 WISE-discovered NEOs per day via NEOCP is understood, but I have two maybe dumb questions: - Will the ~1000 new MBAs discovered per day
                  Message 8 of 18 , Jan 20, 2010
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                    Hello,

                    Followup of ~1-3 WISE-discovered NEOs per day via NEOCP is understood, but I have two maybe dumb questions:
                    - Will the ~1000 new MBAs discovered per day be followed up, too?
                    - How?

                    Best regards,

                    Christian Kjærnet


                    --- In mpml@yahoogroups.com, "amymainzerjpl" <amainzer123@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > We estimate observing ~300,000 Main Belt Asteroids and ~700 NEOs. Of these, ~100,000 MBAs will be new, and ~300 NEOs will be new. That translates to ~1000 new MBAs per day, and ~1-3 new NEOs per day.
                    >
                    > We anticipate that the peak of our magnitude distribution for NEOs will be V~21-22 after the pipeline calibration is completed, although our simulations (Grav et al. 2009) suggest that ~36% of WISE NEOs will be brighter than 21st magnitude. As the WISE measurements are made in the mid-infrared, we will compute an estimated visual magnitude for ground-based observers.

                    > We will begin posting objects to the NEO Confirmation Page very soon, and we look forward to seeing follow up observations from all of you.
                    >
                    > Best regards,
                    > Amy Mainzer
                    > WISE Deputy Project Scientist &
                    > Principal Investigator, NEOWISE
                    > Jet Propulsion Laboratory
                  • Dimitry Chestnov
                    ... No, Main-belt asteroids are not interesting, because they have no threat to the Earth. All NEO surveys (Catalina, Mt. Lemmon, LINEAR,etc.) does not
                    Message 9 of 18 , Jan 20, 2010
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                      --- In mpml@yahoogroups.com, "Christian" <chrisk0304@...> wrote:
                      >
                      >
                      > Hello,
                      >
                      > Followup of ~1-3 WISE-discovered NEOs per day via NEOCP is understood, but I have two maybe dumb questions:
                      > - Will the ~1000 new MBAs discovered per day be followed up, too?
                      > - How?
                      >
                      > Best regards,
                      >
                      > Christian Kjærnet
                      >

                      No, Main-belt asteroids are not interesting, because they have no threat to the Earth. All NEO surveys (Catalina, Mt. Lemmon, LINEAR,etc.) does not follow-up MBAs. They make only single-night observations of MBAs.
                    • Dimitry Chestnov
                      Amy, Will you send the sky coverage of WISE telescope to MPC? http://www.cfa.harvard.edu/iau/info/Coverage.html
                      Message 10 of 18 , Jan 20, 2010
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                        Amy,

                        Will you send the sky coverage of WISE telescope to MPC?
                        http://www.cfa.harvard.edu/iau/info/Coverage.html
                      • Varyonyx
                        ... Hello Dimitry, Unfortunately things are far more complicated... :( Christians´ question is and will be a hot one if you look at this +09.539731
                        Message 11 of 18 , Jan 21, 2010
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                          >No, Main-belt asteroids are not interesting, because they have no >threat to the Earth.

                          Hello Dimitry,

                          Unfortunately things are far more complicated... :(
                          Christians´ question is and will be a hot one if you look at
                          this

                          +09.539731 +08.509034 * AST 2002 WP11 22.43 2.106489 21/01/+2010 06.600000
                          +09.539648 +08.518055 * AST 2008 WY34 21.96 2.106650 21/01/+2010 06.600000

                          Take a very close look on the dataset and you will see that we can´t throw away MBAs. They ARE players on the field... ;/.

                          Best regards

                          Alex (VectorSCOPE)

                          --- In mpml@yahoogroups.com, "Dimitry Chestnov" <chestd@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > --- In mpml@yahoogroups.com, "Christian" <chrisk0304@> wrote:
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > Hello,
                          > >
                          > > Followup of ~1-3 WISE-discovered NEOs per day via NEOCP is understood, but I have two maybe dumb questions:
                          > > - Will the ~1000 new MBAs discovered per day be followed up, too?
                          > > - How?
                          > >
                          > > Best regards,
                          > >
                          > > Christian Kjærnet
                          > >
                          >
                          > No, Main-belt asteroids are not interesting, because they have no threat to the Earth. All NEO surveys (Catalina, Mt. Lemmon, LINEAR,etc.) does not follow-up MBAs. They make only single-night observations of MBAs.
                          >
                        • Jean-Claude MERLIN
                          Is this MBA interesting ? T 2009 Dec. 3.267 TT MPC q 2.00593 (2000.0) P Q n
                          Message 12 of 18 , Jan 21, 2010
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                            Is this MBA interesting ?

                            T 2009 Dec. 3.267 TT MPC
                            q 2.00593 (2000.0) P Q
                            n 0.284276 Peri. 132.714 -0.054071 -0.996817
                            a 2.29074 Node 320.272 +0.887265 -0.021048
                            e 0.12433 Incl. 5.259 +0.458079 -0.076894
                            P 3.47

                            It is a comet : P/2010 A2 (LINEAR)

                            JCM


                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: Dimitry Chestnov
                            To: mpml@yahoogroups.com
                            Sent: Thursday, January 21, 2010 7:58 AM
                            Subject: {MPML} Re: A message from the WISE project



                            --- In mpml@yahoogroups.com, "Christian" <chrisk0304@...> wrote:
                            >
                            >
                            > Hello,
                            >
                            > Followup of ~1-3 WISE-discovered NEOs per day via NEOCP is understood, but I have two maybe dumb questions:
                            > - Will the ~1000 new MBAs discovered per day be followed up, too?
                            > - How?
                            >
                            > Best regards,
                            >
                            > Christian Kjærnet
                            >

                            No, Main-belt asteroids are not interesting, because they have no threat to the Earth. All NEO surveys (Catalina, Mt. Lemmon, LINEAR,etc.) does not follow-up MBAs. They make only single-night observations of MBAs.





                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Dimitry Chestnov
                            ... Hi Alex, What s up with these MBAs? Dimitry
                            Message 13 of 18 , Jan 21, 2010
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                              --- In mpml@yahoogroups.com, "Varyonyx" <vsucom@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > >No, Main-belt asteroids are not interesting, because they have no >threat to the Earth.
                              >
                              > Hello Dimitry,
                              >
                              > Unfortunately things are far more complicated... :(
                              > Christians´ question is and will be a hot one if you look at
                              > this
                              >
                              > +09.539731 +08.509034 * AST 2002 WP11 22.43 2.106489 21/01/+2010 06.600000
                              > +09.539648 +08.518055 * AST 2008 WY34 21.96 2.106650 21/01/+2010 06.600000
                              >
                              > Take a very close look on the dataset and you will see that we can´t throw away MBAs. They ARE players on the field... ;/.
                              >

                              Hi Alex,

                              What's up with these MBAs?

                              Dimitry
                            • Dimitry Chestnov
                              ... It is not possible to follow-up all new detected MBAs. There are hundreds of thousands of them! NEO surveys do follow up only objects with NEO Rating
                              Message 14 of 18 , Jan 21, 2010
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                                --- In mpml@yahoogroups.com, "Jean-Claude MERLIN" <jcmerlin@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > Is this MBA interesting ?
                                >
                                > T 2009 Dec. 3.267 TT MPC
                                > q 2.00593 (2000.0) P Q
                                > n 0.284276 Peri. 132.714 -0.054071 -0.996817
                                > a 2.29074 Node 320.272 +0.887265 -0.021048
                                > e 0.12433 Incl. 5.259 +0.458079 -0.076894
                                > P 3.47
                                >
                                > It is a comet : P/2010 A2 (LINEAR)
                                >
                                > JCM
                                >

                                It is not possible to follow-up all new detected MBAs. There are hundreds of thousands of them! NEO surveys do follow up only objects with NEO Rating > 50%. Routine MBAs are sending as single-nighters. MPC has a huge database of single-night objects, and occasionally link single nights of observations.

                                Dimitry
                              • Varyonyx
                                Hi Dimitry, Well, the dataset includes only one MBA ;) Alex (VectorSCOPE)
                                Message 15 of 18 , Jan 21, 2010
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                                  Hi Dimitry,

                                  Well, the dataset includes only one MBA ;)

                                  Alex (VectorSCOPE)

                                  --- In mpml@yahoogroups.com, "Dimitry Chestnov" <chestd@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > --- In mpml@yahoogroups.com, "Varyonyx" <vsucom@> wrote:
                                  > >
                                  > > >No, Main-belt asteroids are not interesting, because they have no >threat to the Earth.
                                  > >
                                  > > Hello Dimitry,
                                  > >
                                  > > Unfortunately things are far more complicated... :(
                                  > > Christians´ question is and will be a hot one if you look at
                                  > > this
                                  > >
                                  > > +09.539731 +08.509034 * AST 2002 WP11 22.43 2.106489 21/01/+2010 06.600000
                                  > > +09.539648 +08.518055 * AST 2008 WY34 21.96 2.106650 21/01/+2010 06.600000
                                  > >
                                  > > Take a very close look on the dataset and you will see that we can´t throw away MBAs. They ARE players on the field... ;/.
                                  > >
                                  >
                                  > Hi Alex,
                                  >
                                  > What's up with these MBAs?
                                  >
                                  > Dimitry
                                  >
                                • Andrea Milani
                                  We (Z. Knezevic and myself) have linked in one single test run about 25000 single night objects to known asteroids, mostly MBA. Andrea Milani ...
                                  Message 16 of 18 , Jan 21, 2010
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                                    We (Z. Knezevic and myself) have linked in one single test run about 25000
                                    single night objects to known asteroids, mostly MBA.

                                    Andrea Milani


                                    On Thu, 21 Jan 2010, Dimitry Chestnov wrote:

                                    >  
                                    >
                                    > --- In mpml@yahoogroups.com, "Jean-Claude MERLIN" <jcmerlin@...> wrote:
                                    > >
                                    > > Is this MBA interesting ?
                                    > >
                                    > > T 2009 Dec. 3.267 TT MPC
                                    > > q 2.00593 (2000.0) P Q
                                    > > n 0.284276 Peri. 132.714 -0.054071 -0.996817
                                    > > a 2.29074 Node 320.272 +0.887265 -0.021048
                                    > > e 0.12433 Incl. 5.259 +0.458079 -0.076894
                                    > > P 3.47
                                    > >
                                    > > It is a comet : P/2010 A2 (LINEAR)
                                    > >
                                    > > JCM
                                    > >
                                    >
                                    > It is not possible to follow-up all new detected MBAs. There are hundreds of thousands of them! NEO surveys do follow up only
                                    > objects with NEO Rating > 50%. Routine MBAs are sending as single-nighters. MPC has a huge database of single-night objects, and
                                    > occasionally link single nights of observations.
                                    >
                                    > Dimitry
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >

                                    ================================================
                                    Andrea Milani Comparetti
                                    Dipartimento di Matematica
                                    Piazzale B. Pontecorvo 5
                                    56127 PISA ITALY

                                    tel. +39-050-2213254 fax +39-050-2213224
                                    cellular phone +39-349-4482751
                                    E-mail: milani@...
                                    WWW: http://adams.dm.unipi.it/~milani/
                                    ================================================

                                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  • Christian
                                    Dimitry, The point with the dataset is, as I can see it, to illustrate that MBAs sometimes will come close to or collide with another asteroid. The MBA 2008
                                    Message 17 of 18 , Jan 21, 2010
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                                      Dimitry,

                                      The point with the dataset is, as I can see it, to illustrate that MBAs sometimes will come close to or collide with another asteroid. The MBA 2008 WY34 (H=17.5) today at ca 06:40 UTC came as close as about 57 260 km of asteroid 2002WP11 (H=18.035).

                                      What would a collision have generated?

                                      [Data calculated with Horizons today].

                                      Best regards,

                                      Christian Kjærnet

                                      --- In mpml@yahoogroups.com, "Dimitry Chestnov" <chestd@...> wrote:

                                      > Hi Alex,
                                      >
                                      > What's up with these MBAs?
                                      >
                                      > Dimitry
                                      >
                                    • Varyonyx
                                      Hello Christian ... Have a look at the orbit of AST 2002 WP11 with JPLs genius Orbit Diagram tool and think what can happen if things went very wrong :-( . By
                                      Message 18 of 18 , Jan 21, 2010
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                                        Hello Christian


                                        > What would a collision have generated?
                                        Have a look at the orbit of AST 2002 WP11 with JPLs genius Orbit Diagram tool and think what can happen if things went very wrong :-( .
                                        By the way. I´ve only taken "special" encounter 1 of 4 detected "specials" for today!. This dataset is pretty "cool" but by far not the coolest i´ve seen :( . Thanks to running WISE, Pan-STARRS and LSST Survey data could create a new game -> "Asteroid Billard" Tracking ;) .

                                        "Asteroid Billard Tracking" will be an amazing game ;) ... but sometime this sort of "Billard" could have worse consequences...

                                        Specialized simulators can can provide a helping hand. Look at a previous message of mine ;)

                                        Best regards Alex (VectorSCOPE)



                                        --- In mpml@yahoogroups.com, "Christian" <chrisk0304@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > Dimitry,
                                        >
                                        > The point with the dataset is, as I can see it, to illustrate that MBAs sometimes will come close to or collide with another asteroid. The MBA 2008 WY34 (H=17.5) today at ca 06:40 UTC came as close as about 57 260 km of asteroid 2002WP11 (H=18.035).
                                        >
                                        > What would a collision have generated?
                                        >
                                        > [Data calculated with Horizons today].
                                        >
                                        > Best regards,
                                        >
                                        > Christian Kjærnet
                                        >
                                        > --- In mpml@yahoogroups.com, "Dimitry Chestnov" <chestd@> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > > Hi Alex,
                                        > >
                                        > > What's up with these MBAs?
                                        > >
                                        > > Dimitry
                                        > >
                                        >
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