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Milling vise size for a RF-45 type machine?

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  • ilyashor
    Greetings the Enlightened ones, What size milling vise would you use on a RF-45 dovetail column machine (Rong Fu RF-45, DM-45 from Penn Tool, Grizzly G0519,
    Message 1 of 14 , Apr 1 12:42 AM
      Greetings the Enlightened ones,

      What size milling vise would you use on a RF-45 dovetail column
      machine (Rong Fu RF-45, DM-45 from Penn Tool, Grizzly G0519,
      ZAY7045FG from Lathemaster, etc.)?

      Does the "bigger is better" rule work here, too?
      Any specific features/brands you would recommend or avoid?

      I am about to buy one of these machines and necessary accessories.

      Thanks in advance,
      -Ilya.
    • Allen Sparks
      A 5 or 6 Some import vises are junk, and others are ok. If you can find a good used KURT (USA) vise thats the one to get. Sparky ...
      Message 2 of 14 , Apr 1 3:23 AM
        A 5" or 6" Some import vises are junk, and others are
        ok. If you can find a good used KURT (USA) vise thats
        the one to get.

        Sparky


        --- ilyashor <shor@...> wrote:
        > Greetings the Enlightened ones,
        >
        > What size milling vise would you use on a RF-45
        > dovetail column
        > machine (Rong Fu RF-45, DM-45 from Penn Tool,
        > Grizzly G0519,
        > ZAY7045FG from Lathemaster, etc.)?
        >
        > Does the "bigger is better" rule work here, too?
        > Any specific features/brands you would recommend or
        > avoid?
        >
        > I am about to buy one of these machines and
        > necessary accessories.
        >
        > Thanks in advance,
        > -Ilya.
        >
        >
        >


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      • jcameron@foxvalley.net
        Ilya (and Gang :-) I have a 6 rotary compound angle PALMGREN that I love...have had it a couple of months...very accurate and a boatload cheaper than a Kurt.
        Message 3 of 14 , Apr 1 7:13 AM
          Ilya (and Gang :-)

          I have a 6" rotary compound angle PALMGREN that I love...have had it a couple of
          months...very accurate and a boatload cheaper than a Kurt. Before anyone says
          anything, the Kurt is no doubt better, but, I was able to machine a 2x3x5 CRS
          bar to 0.0002 with the PALMGREN, so, seems like it does the job. It weighs 108
          pounds, might be a bit big for ya (I use mine on a Bridgeport Series I so
          that's not an issue with me) but the weight is a lot less without the rotoary
          compound angle feature...just commenting on PALMGREN seeming like a quality
          product.

          John
          Chicago Burbs."Quoting Allen Sparks <sparky4619@...>:

          >
          > A 5" or 6" Some import vises are junk, and others are
          > ok. If you can find a good used KURT (USA) vise thats
          > the one to get.
          >
          > Sparky
          >
          >
          > --- ilyashor <shor@...> wrote:
          > > Greetings the Enlightened ones,
          > >
          > > What size milling vise would you use on a RF-45
          > > dovetail column
          > > machine (Rong Fu RF-45, DM-45 from Penn Tool,
          > > Grizzly G0519,
          > > ZAY7045FG from Lathemaster, etc.)?
          > >
          > > Does the "bigger is better" rule work here, too?
          > > Any specific features/brands you would recommend or
          > > avoid?
          > >
          > > I am about to buy one of these machines and
          > > necessary accessories.
          > >
          > > Thanks in advance,
          > > -Ilya.
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
          >
          > __________________________________
          > Do you Yahoo!?
          > Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway
          > http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/
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          >
          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
        • Sergey Kubushyn
          ... I use 6 vise purchased from pitstools (or something like that) off eBay for less than $100 (69? Don t remember exactly) Its Chinese boat anchor, more than
          Message 4 of 14 , Apr 1 10:45 AM
            --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "ilyashor" <shor@s...> wrote:

            I use 6" vise purchased from pitstools (or something like that) off
            eBay for less than $100 (69? Don't remember exactly) Its Chinese boat
            anchor, more than a hundred pounds. It has a swivel base that can be
            removed although I didn't have such a need.

            The vise itself is surprisingly good. No problems at all getting work
            done with less than 1 thousands precision, easy to work with, good
            holding power. With jaws closed its very difficult to spot the line
            between the jaws, they look and feel like a single solide piece of steel.

            It overhangs a bit on DM-45, but this is not a problem. I would highly
            recommend that vise to everybody.

            N.B. Past performance doesn't guarantee future results, YMMV :)) I
            don't know if all those vise are that good or I just was lucky to get
            a good one...

            > Greetings the Enlightened ones,
            >
            > What size milling vise would you use on a RF-45 dovetail column
            > machine (Rong Fu RF-45, DM-45 from Penn Tool, Grizzly G0519,
            > ZAY7045FG from Lathemaster, etc.)?
            >
            > Does the "bigger is better" rule work here, too?
            > Any specific features/brands you would recommend or avoid?
            >
            > I am about to buy one of these machines and necessary accessories.
            >
            > Thanks in advance,
            > -Ilya.
          • accuratemike
            I have a Harbor Freight 6 44983 on my 45. Good vise (when cleaned and oiled). Seems like the right size. Came with swivel. Box was marked 93#, may not have
            Message 5 of 14 , Apr 1 1:08 PM
              I have a Harbor Freight 6" 44983 on my 45. Good vise (when cleaned and
              oiled). Seems like the right size. Came with swivel. Box was marked
              93#, may not have been that heavy. MIKE

              --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "ilyashor" <shor@s...> wrote:
              > Greetings the Enlightened ones,
              >
              > What size milling vise would you use on a RF-45 dovetail column
              > machine (Rong Fu RF-45, DM-45 from Penn Tool, Grizzly G0519,
              > ZAY7045FG from Lathemaster, etc.)?
              >
              > Does the "bigger is better" rule work here, too?
              > Any specific features/brands you would recommend or avoid?
              >
              > I am about to buy one of these machines and necessary accessories.
              >
              > Thanks in advance,
              > -Ilya.
            • Steve Roberts
              I am of the old school where bigger is better so the Kurt d675 is an ideal solution (6 wide x 7-1/2 opening) check EBay for one as there are always
              Message 6 of 14 , Apr 1 1:58 PM
                I am of the old school where bigger is better so the Kurt d675 is an ideal
                solution (6" wide x 7-1/2" opening) check EBay for one as there are always
                available. Swivel base is handy also.
                Now there is a better make than Kurt in my old opinion and that is "Wilton"
                superb product and unlike Kurt the finish is from a company that really does
                care about their product.
                I have one of each make thus I am entitled to make the comparison
                Steve Roberts~Professional Engineer
                Mississauga/Toronto
              • ilyashor
                Thanks everybody for the info. So the consensus seems to be that 6 is not too large for this machine. As the 6 vises generally weigh about 100lbs I was
                Message 7 of 14 , Apr 1 3:05 PM
                  Thanks everybody for the info. So the consensus seems to be
                  that 6" is not too large for this machine. As the 6" vises
                  generally weigh about 100lbs I was initially a bit afraid
                  the weight may be too much for a DM-45.

                  I'll see if Penn Tool has something that would fit the bill...
                  They promised to combine shipping with the mill.

                  -Ilya.
                • madtownrydr
                  ... shipping in their flyer. It opens to 4.5 and weighs 71 lb. Very nice for the money.
                  Message 8 of 14 , Apr 1 6:10 PM
                    >>>
                    > I got the ENCO 5" precision with swivel base. It was $85 with free
                    shipping in their flyer. It opens to 4.5" and weighs 71 lb. Very nice
                    for the money.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                  • Tove
                    ... Depends what you want to hold in it. Seriously. I have a 6 Kurt for big stuff. And a nice 3 import tiny-Kurt- lookalike for small stuff. Can t
                    Message 9 of 14 , Apr 1 7:29 PM
                      "ilyashor" <shor@...> wrote :
                      >
                      > What size milling vise would you use on a RF-45 dovetail column
                      > machine (Rong Fu RF-45, DM-45 from Penn Tool, Grizzly G0519,
                      > ZAY7045FG from Lathemaster, etc.)?
                      >
                      > Does the "bigger is better" rule work here, too?
                      > Any specific features/brands you would recommend or avoid?
                      >
                      > I am about to buy one of these machines and necessary accessories.

                      Depends what you want to hold in it. Seriously.

                      I have a 6" Kurt for big stuff. And a nice 3" import "tiny-Kurt-
                      lookalike" for small stuff. Can't remember the name offhand, but
                      I bought it at NAMES two years ago. I've also got one of the 4"
                      Phase II rotary tables. So I can have both the 3" vise and the
                      4" RT on the machine at the same time. And I've considered buying
                      another 3" vise so I can have one oriented each way. That'd be
                      very handy sometimes.

                      This works for me. Like I said, it depends on what you want to hold.

                      The Kurt, BTW, is maybe 6" or so longer than the table is deep, so
                      a lot hangs over in front, over the Y-axis handwheel. I don't have
                      the round base allowing angle mounting because I think it's way too
                      big for the mill table. But I've seen pictures of people using them
                      on a RF-45-sized mill.

                      Tove
                    • J.T.Toner
                      ... I m using a 6 Wilton with no problem. True, I loose a bit of Y travel but I found you can put small parts in a large vise, but its really tough to hold
                      Message 10 of 14 , Apr 1 8:15 PM
                        --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, Tove <tove@i...> wrote:
                        > "ilyashor" <shor@s...> wrote :
                        > >
                        > > What size milling vise would you use on a RF-45 dovetail column
                        > > machine (Rong Fu RF-45, DM-45 from Penn Tool, Grizzly G0519,
                        > > ZAY7045FG from Lathemaster, etc.)?
                        > >
                        > > Does the "bigger is better" rule work here, too?
                        > > Any specific features/brands you would recommend or avoid?
                        > >
                        > > I am about to buy one of these machines and necessary accessories.
                        >
                        > Depends what you want to hold in it. Seriously.


                        I'm using a 6" Wilton with no problem. True, I loose a bit of "Y"
                        travel but I found you can put small parts in a large vise, but its
                        really tough to hold large parts in a small vise. I didn't get the
                        rotating base and wish I had. If you can swing the $$, go for a Kurt.
                        THe Chinese ones are not as accurate. I got lucky with my Taiwanese
                        Wilton, but were I do do it over, I'd get the Kurt. Also you'll want
                        a good set of parallels. I bought the 10 pair 1/4" set from Enco.
                        Problem is they aren't parallel. Stick with B&S or equivalent. Be
                        sure to get a clamping set.

                        John
                      • J.T.Toner
                        ... Mike - is that HF vise ground on the sides like the Kurt 688? I recall HF advertised the vise could be used in both the horizantal and vertical positions.
                        Message 11 of 14 , Apr 2 8:58 AM
                          --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "accuratemike" <mike@a...> wrote:
                          > I have a Harbor Freight 6" 44983 on my 45. Good vise (when cleaned and
                          > oiled). Seems like the right size. Came with swivel. Box was marked
                          > 93#, may not have been that heavy. MIKE
                          >
                          >
                          Mike - is that HF vise ground on the sides like the Kurt 688? I
                          recall HF advertised the vise could be used in both the horizantal and
                          vertical positions.

                          Thanks, John
                        • accuratemike
                          No, mine is horizontal only. I do remember seeing the H V somewhere. Not sure if it was HF... The vise is good, great for the money. Free freight was a BIG
                          Message 12 of 14 , Apr 2 1:44 PM
                            No, mine is horizontal only. I do remember seeing the H\V somewhere.
                            Not sure if it was HF... The vise is good, great for the money. Free
                            freight was a BIG factor. MIKE

                            --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "J.T.Toner" <mysnoopybird@y...> wrote:
                            > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "accuratemike" <mike@a...> wrote:
                            > > I have a Harbor Freight 6" 44983 on my 45. Good vise (when cleaned and
                            > > oiled). Seems like the right size. Came with swivel. Box was marked
                            > > 93#, may not have been that heavy. MIKE
                            > >
                            > >
                            > Mike - is that HF vise ground on the sides like the Kurt 688? I
                            > recall HF advertised the vise could be used in both the horizantal and
                            > vertical positions.
                            >
                            > Thanks, John
                          • Torsten
                            A 4. Vise is a good fit for the machine. A 5. Vise is a good compromise when you prefer the ability to hold bigger pices but will slightly reduce Y-travel
                            Message 13 of 14 , Apr 3 7:21 AM
                              A 4." Vise is a good fit for the machine.
                              A 5." Vise is a good compromise when you
                              prefer the ability to hold bigger pices but
                              will slightly reduce Y-travel and Z-clearance.
                              A 6." Vise is very extreme for this machine
                              unless the parts you plan to hold require this
                              size Vise or you allready own one I would not
                              recommend it as the primary Vise.
                              You will trade a significant reduction on Y-travel
                              and Z-clearance for the ability to hold larger parts.
                              If you can visit a store and have them put a vise of
                              the size you want on just to see what it looks like.
                              It will be very obvious.
                              Good Luck



                              --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "ilyashor" <shor@s...> wrote:
                              > Greetings the Enlightened ones,
                              >
                              > What size milling vise would you use on a RF-45 dovetail column
                              > machine (Rong Fu RF-45, DM-45 from Penn Tool, Grizzly G0519,
                              > ZAY7045FG from Lathemaster, etc.)?
                              >
                              > Does the "bigger is better" rule work here, too?
                              > Any specific features/brands you would recommend or avoid?
                              >
                              > I am about to buy one of these machines and necessary accessories.
                              >
                              > Thanks in advance,
                              > -Ilya.
                            • accuratemike
                              My 6 vise causes no loss of Y travel. There are 4 slots in the table of my RF45 (JFC45N2F Rong Fu), and the vise is mounted in the second slot from the front.
                              Message 14 of 14 , Apr 3 9:05 AM
                                My 6" vise causes no loss of Y travel. There are 4 slots in the table
                                of my RF45 (JFC45N2F Rong Fu), and the vise is mounted in the second
                                slot from the front. I just wound Y all the way in, and it crushes the
                                guard and hits the stop, long before the vise hits the column. If
                                there were an odd number of slots, and the vise mounted in the center,
                                you might loose some Y. I also looked at some vise specs, a 5"
                                (Precise Brand) is 1/2" shorter than the same (Precise) 6". Right now
                                the 6" HF is my ONLY vise, but I am looking at some small vises, that
                                I can hold in the 6", for tiny work. The old "you can do a small job
                                in a big machine, but you can't do a big job in a small machine"
                                addage may come into play for you. MIKE

                                --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Torsten" <torsten@g...> wrote:
                                > A 4." Vise is a good fit for the machine.
                                > A 5." Vise is a good compromise when you
                                > prefer the ability to hold bigger pices but
                                > will slightly reduce Y-travel and Z-clearance.
                                > A 6." Vise is very extreme for this machine
                                > unless the parts you plan to hold require this
                                > size Vise or you allready own one I would not
                                > recommend it as the primary Vise.
                                > You will trade a significant reduction on Y-travel
                                > and Z-clearance for the ability to hold larger parts.
                                > If you can visit a store and have them put a vise of
                                > the size you want on just to see what it looks like.
                                > It will be very obvious.
                                > Good Luck
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "ilyashor" <shor@s...> wrote:
                                > > Greetings the Enlightened ones,
                                > >
                                > > What size milling vise would you use on a RF-45 dovetail column
                                > > machine (Rong Fu RF-45, DM-45 from Penn Tool, Grizzly G0519,
                                > > ZAY7045FG from Lathemaster, etc.)?
                                > >
                                > > Does the "bigger is better" rule work here, too?
                                > > Any specific features/brands you would recommend or avoid?
                                > >
                                > > I am about to buy one of these machines and necessary accessories.
                                > >
                                > > Thanks in advance,
                                > > -Ilya.
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