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Re: [mill_drill] Tap and Die set

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  • Bill Stietenroth
    Dennis, It is difficult to give useful info it we don t know how you use taps and dies. Are you in business where you use them heavily or is this for your
    Message 1 of 14 , Mar 20, 2011
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      Dennis,

      It is difficult to give useful info it we don't know how you use taps and dies. Are you in business where you use them heavily or is this for your hobby. I would guess that you only use them only occasionally because you have had the set for that long and it is apparently still a 'set'. For occasional use I'd go with what has served me for 35 years. If I was in the business of tapping holes for a living, then I'd do some research on taps that have been improved for high production over the last 35 years. Hanson has sets in carbon and HSS from $150 to $1050 made in USA.

      Bill

      ---------- Original Message ----------
      From: "zapvss" <zapvss@...>
      To: mill_drill@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [mill_drill] Tap and Die set
      Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2011 15:31:53 -0000

      Hi All,
      I've had my Hanson tap&die set for over 35 years and its time to get a new one. I'm looking to replace it with a 4-40 to 1/2-20 set. I don't want to buy an import set.

      There are so many different styles and material out there, spiral, twist, carbon, HSS...

      Can anyone recommend a good set?

      Thanks
      Denis






      ------------------------------------

      Yahoo! Groups Links
    • Paul Alciatore
      I haven t seen a set (of different sizes) that I have liked. It seems to me that most sets are lesser quality; mostly for maintenance (thread cleaning) and
      Message 2 of 14 , Mar 20, 2011
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        I haven't seen a set (of different sizes) that I have liked.  It seems to me that most "sets" are lesser quality; mostly for maintenance (thread cleaning) and not for shop use (new threads).  I suspect that this is because machinists tend to buy as needed instead of all at once. 

        I have been purchasing individual taps (spiral point for fast threading) or sets (taper, plug, and bottoming) for more difficult materials as I need them.  As for dies, because I have generally used them to clean or finish threads, I haven't had to replace many.  I also buy them as needed, but that is seldom. 

        If you like the set for storage, there are other ways.  Or just use the old Hanson box. 

        One exception to this was a set of metric taps I purchased from Grizzly.  It is good but they were not the standard taper, plug, bottom design.  The taper and plug taps are not full diameter.  So you must use all three to get the full thread, even with a short, through hole.  This is a bit of a pain and I have purchased additional, spiral point metric taps for jobs that required many holes, to get around this.  I can still use the set on difficult materials. 

        Paul A.



        At 10:31 AM 3/20/2011, you wrote:
         

        Hi All,
        I've had my Hanson tap&die set for over 35 years and its time to get a new one. I'm looking to replace it with a 4-40 to 1/2-20 set. I don't want to buy an import set.

        There are so many different styles and material out there, spiral, twist, carbon, HSS...

        Can anyone recommend a good set?

        Thanks
        Denis

      • zapvss
        Bill, I m a hobbiest and yes I use them on occation. But when I do use them I don t want them to break. I guess I ve been lucky with the set I ve got (Hanson),
        Message 3 of 14 , Mar 20, 2011
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          Bill,
          I'm a hobbiest and yes I use them on occation. But when I do use them I don't want them to break. I guess I've been lucky with the set I've got (Hanson), I've never broke one they've just gotten dull and now require alot of force to make threads.

          I would buy another Hanson set but I'm not sure if they're still made in the US. I try to buy US whenever I can find it, its much harder these days. If you look at Stanley Tools the majority of them are made in China, I won't buy Stanley anymore for that reason.

          I just gave away a 29 piece drill bit set made in China. Out of the 29 the 1/8, 1/4, 3/8 and 1/2 bits are the only ones that will cut steel. I don't know what kind of metal the rest are made of but they won't hold an edge.

          Sorry for the brain dump.
          Denis


          --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Stietenroth" <k5zty@...> wrote:
          >
          > Dennis,
          >
          > It is difficult to give useful info it we don't know how you use taps and dies. Are you in business where you use them heavily or is this for your hobby. I would guess that you only use them only occasionally because you have had the set for that long and it is apparently still a 'set'. For occasional use I'd go with what has served me for 35 years. If I was in the business of tapping holes for a living, then I'd do some research on taps that have been improved for high production over the last 35 years. Hanson has sets in carbon and HSS from $150 to $1050 made in USA.
          >
          > Bill
          >
          > ---------- Original Message ----------
          > From: "zapvss" <zapvss@...>
          > To: mill_drill@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: [mill_drill] Tap and Die set
          > Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2011 15:31:53 -0000
          >
          > Hi All,
          > I've had my Hanson tap&die set for over 35 years and its time to get a new one. I'm looking to replace it with a 4-40 to 1/2-20 set. I don't want to buy an import set.
          >
          > There are so many different styles and material out there, spiral, twist, carbon, HSS...
          >
          > Can anyone recommend a good set?
          >
          > Thanks
          > Denis
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > ------------------------------------
          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
        • Bill Stietenroth
          Dennis, I have a Craftsman set purchased in 1979 but it is not much of a Craftsman set anymore. I have done like Paul suggested and bought replacement taps and
          Message 4 of 14 , Mar 20, 2011
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            Dennis,

            I have a Craftsman set purchased in 1979 but it is not much of a Craftsman set anymore. I have done like Paul suggested and bought replacement taps and dies that I have broken or worn out and used the Craftsman case to hold them. The case is nice to keep them organized by size and to know at a glance that I have the one I need or when I see a blank hole, I know I need to either find it in the shop mess or buy another one. There are taps and dies in that set that I have never used, so why buy another set with those sizes in it? Just buy what you use and wear out.
            Hanson is still made in the U.S.. If you are a "Buy USA" guy, you can still find a number of USA brands. If you are concerned with quality of imports, consider some of the Polish, German and English imports. They are very high quality. Find a local machine shop supply company and check their catalog. I use Bass Tool and Supply here in Houston. www.basstool.com

            Bill

            ---------- Original Message ----------
            From: "zapvss" <zapvss@...>
            To: mill_drill@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [mill_drill] Re: Tap and Die set
            Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2011 19:20:13 -0000

            Bill,
            I'm a hobbiest and yes I use them on occation. But when I do use them I don't want them to break. I guess I've been lucky with the set I've got (Hanson), I've never broke one they've just gotten dull and now require alot of force to make threads.

            I would buy another Hanson set but I'm not sure if they're still made in the US. I try to buy US whenever I can find it, its much harder these days. If you look at Stanley Tools the majority of them are made in China, I won't buy Stanley anymore for that reason.

            I just gave away a 29 piece drill bit set made in China. Out of the 29 the 1/8, 1/4, 3/8 and 1/2 bits are the only ones that will cut steel. I don't know what kind of metal the rest are made of but they won't hold an edge.

            Sorry for the brain dump.
            Denis


            --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Stietenroth" <k5zty@...> wrote:
            >
            > Dennis,
            >
            > It is difficult to give useful info it we don't know how you use taps and dies. Are you in business where you use them heavily or is this for your hobby. I would guess that you only use them only occasionally because you have had the set for that long and it is apparently still a 'set'. For occasional use I'd go with what has served me for 35 years. If I was in the business of tapping holes for a living, then I'd do some research on taps that have been improved for high production over the last 35 years. Hanson has sets in carbon and HSS from $150 to $1050 made in USA.
            >
            > Bill
            >
            > ---------- Original Message ----------
            > From: "zapvss" <zapvss@...>
            > To: mill_drill@yahoogroups.com
            > Subject: [mill_drill] Tap and Die set
            > Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2011 15:31:53 -0000
            >
            > Hi All,
            > I've had my Hanson tap&die set for over 35 years and its time to get a new one. I'm looking to replace it with a 4-40 to 1/2-20 set. I don't want to buy an import set.
            >
            > There are so many different styles and material out there, spiral, twist, carbon, HSS...
            >
            > Can anyone recommend a good set?
            >
            > Thanks
            > Denis
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > ------------------------------------
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >




            ------------------------------------

            Yahoo! Groups Links
          • zapvss
            Hi Paul, I beleive you are correct, do you have an American brand of tap & dies that you prefer? Denis
            Message 5 of 14 , Mar 20, 2011
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              Hi Paul,
              I beleive you are correct, do you have an American brand of tap & dies that you prefer?

              Denis


              --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, Paul Alciatore <palciatore@...> wrote:
              >
              > I haven't seen a set (of different sizes) that I
              > have liked. It seems to me that most "sets" are
              > lesser quality; mostly for maintenance (thread
              > cleaning) and not for shop use (new threads). I
              > suspect that this is because machinists tend to
              > buy as needed instead of all at once.
              >
              > I have been purchasing individual taps (spiral
              > point for fast threading) or sets (taper, plug,
              > and bottoming) for more difficult materials as I
              > need them. As for dies, because I have generally
              > used them to clean or finish threads, I haven't
              > had to replace many. I also buy them as needed, but that is seldom.
              >
              > If you like the set for storage, there are other
              > ways. Or just use the old Hanson box.
              >
              > One exception to this was a set of metric taps I
              > purchased from Grizzly. It is good but they were
              > not the standard taper, plug, bottom design. The
              > taper and plug taps are not full diameter. So
              > you must use all three to get the full thread,
              > even with a short, through hole. This is a bit
              > of a pain and I have purchased additional, spiral
              > point metric taps for jobs that required many
              > holes, to get around this. I can still use the set on difficult materials.
              >
              > Paul A.
              >
              >
              >
              > At 10:31 AM 3/20/2011, you wrote:
              > >
              > >
              > >Hi All,
              > >I've had my Hanson tap&die set for over 35 years
              > >and its time to get a new one. I'm looking to
              > >replace it with a 4-40 to 1/2-20 set. I don't want to buy an import set.
              > >
              > >There are so many different styles and material
              > >out there, spiral, twist, carbon, HSS...
              > >
              > >Can anyone recommend a good set?
              > >
              > >Thanks
              > >Denis
              > >
              > >
              >
            • Bruce Johnson
              Denis, I don t normally plug E-bay sellers, but I have had good luck in the last year with Reliable Tools, Irwindale Ca. They have many mixed bag lots that
              Message 6 of 14 , Mar 20, 2011
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                Denis,
                 I don't normally plug E-bay sellers, but I have had good luck in the last year with Reliable Tools, Irwindale Ca.  They have many mixed bag lots that come up every week.  You will have to sort them and organize for storage, but the price is usually right. I am local to Reliable so I don't have to pay shipping which is a big advantage. Some of the lots are quite large (50 or more). Good luck in your search!
                Bruce Johnson
                ----- Original Message -----
                From: zapvss
                Sent: Sunday, March 20, 2011 12:20 PM
                Subject: [mill_drill] Re: Tap and Die set.

                 

                Bill,
                I'm a hobbiest and yes I use them on occation. But when I do use them I don't want them to break. I guess I've been lucky with the set I've got (Hanson), I've never broke one they've just gotten dull and now require alot of force to make threads.

                I would buy another Hanson set but I'm not sure if they're still made in the US. I try to buy US whenever I can find it, its much harder these days. If you look at Stanley Tools the majority of them are made in China, I won't buy Stanley anymore for that reason.

                I just gave away a 29 piece drill bit set made in China. Out of the 29 the 1/8, 1/4, 3/8 and 1/2 bits are the only ones that will cut steel. I don't know what kind of metal the rest are made of but they won't hold an edge.

                Sorry for the brain dump.
                Denis

                --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Stietenroth" <k5zty@...> wrote:
                >
                > Dennis,
                >
                > It is difficult to give useful info it we don't know how you use taps and dies. Are you in business where you use them heavily or is this for your hobby. I would guess that you only use them only occasionally because you have had the set for that long and it is apparently still a 'set'. For occasional use I'd go with what has served me for 35 years. If I was in the business of tapping holes for a living, then I'd do some research on taps that have been improved for high production over the last 35 years. Hanson has sets in carbon and HSS from $150 to $1050 made in USA.
                >
                > Bill
                >
                > ---------- Original Message ----------
                > From: "zapvss" <zapvss@...>
                > To: mill_drill@yahoogroups.com
                > Subject: [mill_drill] Tap and Die set
                > Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2011 15:31:53 -0000
                >
                > Hi All,
                > I've had my Hanson tap&die set for over 35 years and its time to get a new one. I'm looking to replace it with a 4-40 to 1/2-20 set. I don't want to buy an import set.
                >
                > There are so many different styles and material out there, spiral, twist, carbon, HSS...
                >
                > Can anyone recommend a good set?
                >
                > Thanks
                > Denis
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > ------------------------------------
                >
                > Yahoo! Groups Links
                >

              • Starlight Tool Services Ltd
                Denis I picked up a Tap & Die Set from Westward Tools a few years back, model OK3110 it is 110 pcs, in UNC, UNF and Metric. HSS made in Japan. goes from 4-40
                Message 7 of 14 , Mar 20, 2011
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                  Denis
                   
                  I picked up a Tap & Die Set from Westward Tools a few years back, model OK3110 it is 110 pcs, in UNC, UNF and Metric.  HSS made in Japan.  goes from 4-40 up to 3/4" and has covered much of what I have needed.  Any thing else, like NS or LH I pick up seperately as needed.
                   
                  If the set you have now is in a good case, you might want to just look at filling in the blanks.
                   
                  Walter
                   
                   
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: zapvss
                  Sent: Sunday, March 20, 2011 8:31 AM
                  Subject: [mill_drill] Tap and Die set

                   

                  Hi All,
                  I've had my Hanson tap&die set for over 35 years and its time to get a new one. I'm looking to replace it with a 4-40 to 1/2-20 set. I don't want to buy an import set.

                  There are so many different styles and material out there, spiral, twist, carbon, HSS...

                  Can anyone recommend a good set?

                  Thanks
                  Denis

                • Paul Alciatore
                  Oh, OK. You are thinking made in USA . I have been buying from sources that I trust. Many of my taps have come from McMaster. They don t guarantee or even
                  Message 8 of 14 , Mar 20, 2011
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                    Oh, OK.  You are thinking "made in USA". 

                    I have been buying from sources that I trust.  Many of my taps have come from McMaster.  They don't guarantee or even advertise any particular brand but I have always been happy with their taps.  Some were Greenlee, some Hanson, some were other name brands that I can't remember.  No indication of where they were made.  But good quality, always.  The main problem was with storage as different brands came in different size and shape containers. 

                    Places like Enco, Wholesale Tools, KBC, Victor, etc. will advertise import or "made in USA" so you can choose.  Some will advertise brands.  All can be returned if you don't like them. 

                    Drills and taps are different animals when purchasing.  Drill sets are sold at every hardware, home supply, drug store, grocery, thousands of Internet sources, and even gas stations.  They are what is called a commodity and there is great incentive to make cheaper and cheaper sets.  There is some of this with taps, more so with tap sets.  I also have returned drill sets for very poor quality.  Some were so poorly sharpened that they would only cut if turning backwards.  Some were not hardened and dulled upon first contact with mild steel   Taps, in general, are at least of acceptable quality for thread restoration work.  I am sure there are some poor ones out there, but much less so than drills.  My point is that you do not need to be quite as suspicious of tap quality as you DO need to be of drill quality.  You do seem to get what you pay for. 

                    Paul A.



                    At 02:20 PM 3/20/2011, you wrote:
                     

                    Bill,
                    I'm a hobbiest and yes I use them on occation. But when I do use them I don't want them to break. I guess I've been lucky with the set I've got (Hanson), I've never broke one they've just gotten dull and now require alot of force to make threads.

                    I would buy another Hanson set but I'm not sure if they're still made in the US. I try to buy US whenever I can find it, its much harder these days. If you look at Stanley Tools the majority of them are made in China, I won't buy Stanley anymore for that reason.

                    I just gave away a 29 piece drill bit set made in China. Out of the 29 the 1/8, 1/4, 3/8 and 1/2 bits are the only ones that will cut steel. I don't know what kind of metal the rest are made of but they won't hold an edge.

                    Sorry for the brain dump.
                    Denis

                    --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Stietenroth" <k5zty@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Dennis,
                    >
                    > It is difficult to give useful info it we don't know how you use taps and dies. Are you in business where you use them heavily or is this for your hobby. I would guess that you only use them only occasionally because you have had the set for that long and it is apparently still a 'set'. For occasional use I'd go with what has served me for 35 years. If I was in the business of tapping holes for a living, then I'd do some research on taps that have been improved for high production over the last 35 years. Hanson has sets in carbon and HSS from $150 to $1050 made in USA.
                    >
                    > Bill
                    >
                    > ---------- Original Message ----------
                    > From: "zapvss" <zapvss@...>
                    > To: mill_drill@yahoogroups.com
                    > Subject: [mill_drill] Tap and Die set
                    > Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2011 15:31:53 -0000
                    >
                    > Hi All,
                    > I've had my Hanson tap&die set for over 35 years and its time to get a new one. I'm looking to replace it with a 4-40 to 1/2-20 set. I don't want to buy an import set.
                    >
                    > There are so many different styles and material out there, spiral, twist, carbon, HSS...
                    >
                    > Can anyone recommend a good set?
                    >
                    > Thanks
                    > Denis
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > ------------------------------------
                    >
                    > Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >

                  • Paul Alciatore
                    Denis, As I said in the other reply, I do like Hanson and Greenlee. But I can t actually say if they are US made. It s a big, small world. I don t think you
                    Message 9 of 14 , Mar 20, 2011
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                      Denis,

                      As I said in the other reply, I do like Hanson and Greenlee.  But I can't actually say if they are US made. 

                      It's a big, small world.  I don't think you can be hung up on one country of manufacture.  The name brands will insure THEIR level of quality.  Generally, ground taps are better then cut ones: you will see this difference when you handle them. 

                      Paul A.



                      At 02:48 PM 3/20/2011, you wrote:
                       

                      Hi Paul,
                      I beleive you are correct, do you have an American brand of tap & dies that you prefer?

                      Denis

                      --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, Paul Alciatore <palciatore@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > I haven't seen a set (of different sizes) that I
                      > have liked. It seems to me that most "sets" are
                      > lesser quality; mostly for maintenance (thread
                      > cleaning) and not for shop use (new threads). I
                      > suspect that this is because machinists tend to
                      > buy as needed instead of all at once.
                      >
                      > I have been purchasing individual taps (spiral
                      > point for fast threading) or sets (taper, plug,
                      > and bottoming) for more difficult materials as I
                      > need them. As for dies, because I have generally
                      > used them to clean or finish threads, I haven't
                      > had to replace many. I also buy them as needed, but that is seldom.
                      >
                      > If you like the set for storage, there are other
                      > ways. Or just use the old Hanson box.
                      >
                      > One exception to this was a set of metric taps I
                      > purchased from Grizzly. It is good but they were
                      > not the standard taper, plug, bottom design. The
                      > taper and plug taps are not full diameter. So
                      > you must use all three to get the full thread,
                      > even with a short, through hole. This is a bit
                      > of a pain and I have purchased additional, spiral
                      > point metric taps for jobs that required many
                      > holes, to get around this. I can still use the set on difficult materials.
                      >
                      > Paul A.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > At 10:31 AM 3/20/2011, you wrote:
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >Hi All,
                      > >I've had my Hanson tap&die set for over 35 years
                      > >and its time to get a new one. I'm looking to
                      > >replace it with a 4-40 to 1/2-20 set. I don't want to buy an import set.
                      > >
                      > >There are so many different styles and material
                      > >out there, spiral, twist, carbon, HSS...
                      > >
                      > >Can anyone recommend a good set?
                      > >
                      > >Thanks
                      > >Denis
                      > >
                      > >
                      >

                    • zapvss
                      Thanks All for the good information. I guess that most buy quality taps and dies as needed due to the quentionable quality of complete sets. I will hunt
                      Message 10 of 14 , Mar 20, 2011
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                        Thanks All for the good information.
                        I guess that most buy quality taps and dies as needed due to the quentionable quality of complete sets. I will hunt through the catalogs and internet looking for the taps and dies I need to replace.

                        Many years ago a Tool & Die maker gave a few taps made by "Besly". I still use them, they never get dull. I've looked all over for this brand but with no luck. The box is marked:

                        Besly-Welles Corp.
                        South Beloit, ILLinois

                        Regards
                        Denis


                        --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "zapvss" <zapvss@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Hi All,
                        > I've had my Hanson tap&die set for over 35 years and its time to get a new one. I'm looking to replace it with a 4-40 to 1/2-20 set. I don't want to buy an import set.
                        >
                        > There are so many different styles and material out there, spiral, twist, carbon, HSS...
                        >
                        > Can anyone recommend a good set?
                        >
                        > Thanks
                        > Denis
                        >
                      • Larry White
                        Google hit this first shot. http://www.besly.com/aboutus.htm ... From: zapvss To: mill_drill@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, March 20, 2011 6:34 PM Subject:
                        Message 11 of 14 , Mar 20, 2011
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                            Google hit this first shot.
                           
                           
                           
                           
                           
                          ----- Original Message -----
                          From: zapvss
                          Sent: Sunday, March 20, 2011 6:34 PM
                          Subject: [mill_drill] Re: Tap and Die set

                           

                          Thanks All for the good information.
                          I guess that most buy quality taps and dies as needed due to the quentionable quality of complete sets. I will hunt through the catalogs and internet looking for the taps and dies I need to replace.

                          Many years ago a Tool & Die maker gave a few taps made by "Besly". I still use them, they never get dull. I've looked all over for this brand but with no luck. The box is marked:

                          Besly-Welles Corp.
                          South Beloit, ILLinois

                          Regards
                          Denis

                          --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "zapvss" <zapvss@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > Hi All,
                          > I've had my Hanson tap&die set for over 35 years and its time to get a new one. I'm looking to replace it with a 4-40 to 1/2-20 set. I don't want to buy an import set.
                          >
                          > There are so many different styles and material out there, spiral, twist, carbon, HSS...
                          >
                          > Can anyone recommend a good set?
                          >
                          > Thanks
                          > Denis
                          >

                        • Glenn N
                          Well... I have a Hanson set that is about 10 years old and it is no better than the HSS set from Harbor freight. In fact the harbor freight sets are quite a
                          Message 12 of 14 , Mar 20, 2011
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                            Well... I have a Hanson set that is about 10 years old and it is no better
                            than the HSS set from Harbor freight. In fact the harbor freight sets are
                            quite a bit easier to turn and cut nicer than the Hanson set ever did. The
                            greenfields and and such are in a different class altogether. You will have
                            to look closely to be sure you aren't buying an offshore set no matter what
                            brand you buy. (I applaud your desire to buy American if that is what is
                            keeping you from the imports)

                            As to what to look for.. Don't bother with carbon steel. Decide how you
                            will use them. A spiral point is wonderful for through holes but sucks for
                            a close blind hole. The high helix taps are great for machine work on soft
                            material but not so wonderful by hand or for harder stuff.

                            My favorites are Hertel and Greenfield. If any of the Harbor freight sets
                            wear out or break I will replace them with the good USA stuff but I just
                            don't use the odd sizes enough to warrant $400 or so for a tap and die set.

                            YMMV
                            Glenn

                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: "zapvss" <zapvss@...>
                            To: <mill_drill@yahoogroups.com>
                            Sent: Sunday, March 20, 2011 8:31 AM
                            Subject: [mill_drill] Tap and Die set


                            Hi All,
                            I've had my Hanson tap&die set for over 35 years and its time to get a new
                            one. I'm looking to replace it with a 4-40 to 1/2-20 set. I don't want to
                            buy an import set.

                            There are so many different styles and material out there, spiral, twist,
                            carbon, HSS...

                            Can anyone recommend a good set?

                            Thanks
                            Denis






                            ------------------------------------

                            Yahoo! Groups Links
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