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Re: [mill_drill] Tramming

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  • Stan Stocker
    Yes to all. Loosen the bolts and crack the bondo loose, or better yet remove the fillet before breaking loose the column. Vacuum well, a bit of compressable
    Message 1 of 17 , Mar 7, 2002
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      Yes to all. Loosen the bolts and crack the bondo loose, or better yet
      remove the fillet before breaking loose the column. Vacuum well, a bit
      of compressable bondo under the column will drive you nuts when you go
      to tighten everything down. Clock at 8 positions around a circle,
      writing each number down. Slip in a shim or shims as seems appropriate,
      snug up, and re-indicate. Repeat until within a thou or better, or your
      patience runs out.

      Stan

      steeleeone wrote:
      >
      > I am new to your group and have reciently aquired an Enco Mill Drill.
      >
      > I have found that the table is not perpendicular to the quill in the
      > X
      > direction. Using a dial indicator mounted in the chuck, I have found
      > that the table is out by about .005 in about 8 inches. It appears
      > that the column is bolted to the base and that the seam was filled
      > with putty prior to paint. Can I simply remove the putty and shim
      > the
      > column? Has anyone done this?
      > Thanks
      > Any help is appreciated
      > -Steve
      >
      >
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      >
      >
      >
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    • philteague
      ... Yes, you can do exactly what you are asking. I used an Indicol type holder and a dial test indicator (DTI). I adjusted the holder and DTI so that on the
      Message 2 of 17 , Mar 7, 2002
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        --- In mill_drill@y..., "steeleeone" <steeleeone@y...> wrote:
        > Can I simply remove the putty and shim the column? Has anyone done
        > this?

        Yes, you can do exactly what you are asking. I used an "Indicol" type
        holder and a dial test indicator (DTI). I adjusted the holder and DTI
        so that on the X axis there was 10-12" of difference from left to
        right in or other words the holder was adjusted so there was a
        distance of 5-6" from the center of the spindle on either side. I
        also positioned the table so that the spindle was over the back of
        the table. It is handy to use a 1,2,3 block on the table instead of
        indicating directly off the table. You can then swing the holder and
        DTI from one side to the other and put the 1,2,3 block under the
        point of the indicator. It would also be wise to measure the
        difference on the Y axis and compare it to the X axis. I then shimmed
        my column so there was no more than .001" difference between any one
        of the three points.

        I have to admit that describing this process is difficult. I found a
        drawing somewhere that showed how this is done. I will see if I can
        find it and post it to the files section.
      • Dan Mauch
        I would recommend taking the column off the base. Drill and tap for holes for 3/8” jacking screws. Install the 4 jacking screws into the column base flange
        Message 3 of 17 , Mar 8, 2002
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          I would recommend taking the column off the base. Drill and tap for holes for 3/8” jacking screws. Install the 4 jacking screws into the column base flange leaving the jacking screws about 1/8 below the flange.  Use some Devcon Steel about ¼” thick place over the base flange. Reinstall the column and reinstall the hold down bolts so that the column is snug. Install your dial indicator and tram in the spindle by tighten the bases bolts and loosening the jacking screws until the power head is aligned properly.  Scrape off the excess Devcon . Let the Devcon steel harden and you should have a perfect alignment and full support. The plastic steel has a compressive strength of 25000 PSI .

          Dan

           

           

          .

        • Dave Hills
          Which Devcon product would that be? The plastic steel data sheet I see shows only 10,400 psi compressive strength. Dave
          Message 4 of 17 , Mar 8, 2002
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            Which Devcon product would that be? The plastic steel data sheet I see shows
            only 10,400 psi compressive strength.

            Dave
          • Dan Mauch
            I/m pretty sure that it was Devcon steel and it has been 30 years since I used it but I distinctly remember it a 25000 psi but 10,000 PSI compressive strength
            Message 5 of 17 , Mar 8, 2002
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              I/m pretty sure that it was Devcon steel and it has been 30 years since I used it but I distinctly remember it a 25000 psi but 10,000 PSI compressive strength should be more than enough.

              Dan

               

              -----Original Message-----
              From: Dave Hills [mailto:dhills@...]
              Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 8:39 AM
              To: mill_drill@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [mill_drill] Tramming

               

              Which Devcon product would that be?  The plastic steel data sheet I see shows
              only 10,400 psi compressive strength.

              Dave


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            • ths992001
              I like your trick, Dan! It seems like you d better get it right the first time, though. What about some type of release agent? Any thoughts? - Tom S.
              Message 6 of 17 , Mar 8, 2002
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                I like your trick, Dan! It seems like you'd better get it right the
                first time, though. What about some type of release agent? Any
                thoughts?

                - Tom S.
              • Dan Mauch
                I used the release agent that came with the Devcon. Dan ... From: ths992001 [mailto:thscarince@hotmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 12:01 PM To:
                Message 7 of 17 , Mar 8, 2002
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                  I used the release agent that came with the Devcon.

                  Dan

                   

                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: ths992001 [mailto:thscarince@...]
                  Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 12:01 PM
                  To: mill_drill@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: [mill_drill] Re: Tramming

                   

                  I like your trick, Dan!  It seems like you'd better get it right the
                  first time, though.  What about some type of release agent?  Any
                  thoughts? 

                  - Tom S.





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                • ktarkir
                  Where do you get these screws. I checked McMaster Carr and thyey don t carry them. Dennis ... that ... spindle ... the ... the
                  Message 8 of 17 , Mar 8, 2002
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                    Where do you get these screws. I checked McMaster Carr and thyey
                    don't carry them.

                    Dennis

                    --- In mill_drill@y..., "Dan Mauch" <dmauch@s...> wrote:
                    > I would recommend taking the column off the base. Drill and tap for
                    > holes for 3/8" jacking screws. Install the 4 jacking screws into the
                    > column base flange leaving the jacking screws about 1/8 below the
                    > flange. Use some Devcon Steel about ¼" thick place over the base
                    > flange. Reinstall the column and reinstall the hold down bolts so
                    that
                    > the column is snug. Install your dial indicator and tram in the
                    spindle
                    > by tighten the bases bolts and loosening the jacking screws until
                    the
                    > power head is aligned properly. Scrape off the excess Devcon . Let
                    the
                    > Devcon steel harden and you should have a perfect alignment and full
                    > support. The plastic steel has a compressive strength of 25000 PSI .
                    > Dan
                    >
                    >
                    > .
                  • Dan Mauch
                    Jacking screws are like most bolts except they have a square heavy head. But you can use a grade 8 cap screw in its place. You can get grade 8 cap screws at
                    Message 9 of 17 , Mar 10, 2002
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                      Jacking screws are like most bolts except they have a square heavy head. But you can use a grade 8 cap screw in its place. You can get grade 8 cap screws at most places listed in the yellow pages under fasteners.

                      Dan

                       

                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: ktarkir [mailto:ktarkir@...]
                      Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 7:05 PM
                      To: mill_drill@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: [mill_drill] Re: Tramming

                       

                      Where do you get these screws.  I checked McMaster Carr and thyey
                      don't carry them.

                      Dennis

                      --- In mill_drill@y..., "Dan Mauch" <dmauch@s...> wrote:
                      > I would recommend taking the column off the base. Drill and tap for
                      > holes for 3/8" jacking screws. Install the 4 jacking screws into the
                      > column base flange leaving the jacking screws about 1/8 below the
                      > flange.  Use some Devcon Steel about ¼" thick place over the base
                      > flange. Reinstall the column and reinstall the hold down bolts so
                      that
                      > the column is snug. Install your dial indicator and tram in the
                      spindle
                      > by tighten the bases bolts and loosening the jacking screws until
                      the
                      > power head is aligned properly.  Scrape off the excess Devcon . Let
                      the
                      > Devcon steel harden and you should have a perfect alignment and full
                      > support. The plastic steel has a compressive strength of 25000 PSI .
                      > Dan


                      > .



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                    • steeleeone
                      ... into the ... base ... that ... spindle ... the ... the ... Thanks to all that responded to my tramming query. I have not heard of this Devcon material but
                      Message 10 of 17 , Mar 11, 2002
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                        --- In mill_drill@y..., "Dan Mauch" <dmauch@s...> wrote:
                        > I would recommend taking the column off the base. Drill and tap for
                        > holes for 3/8" jacking screws. Install the 4 jacking screws
                        into the
                        > column base flange leaving the jacking screws about 1/8 below the
                        > flange. Use some Devcon Steel about ¼" thick place over the
                        base
                        > flange. Reinstall the column and reinstall the hold down bolts so
                        that
                        > the column is snug. Install your dial indicator and tram in the
                        spindle
                        > by tighten the bases bolts and loosening the jacking screws until
                        the
                        > power head is aligned properly. Scrape off the excess Devcon . Let
                        the
                        > Devcon steel harden and you should have a perfect alignment and full
                        > support. The plastic steel has a compressive strength of 25000 PSI .
                        > Dan
                        >
                        >
                        > .
                        Thanks to all that responded to my tramming query. I have not heard
                        of this Devcon material but it sounds like an intreguing solution.
                        Where can I find this material? I am in the Seattle area.
                      • Ken
                        Try looking on www.devcon.com to see if they have a list of dealers. Devcon is a division of Illinois Tool Works the parent company of Miller and Hobart
                        Message 11 of 17 , Mar 11, 2002
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                          Try looking on www.devcon.com to see if they have a list of dealers.  Devcon is a division of Illinois Tool Works the parent company of Miller and Hobart welding equipment among others.
                           

                          Ken
                          av8or@...
                          kring@...
                          av8or_cfi@...

                          -----Original Message-----
                          From: steeleeone [mailto:steeleeone@...]
                          Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 11:45 AM
                          To: mill_drill@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: [mill_drill] Re: Tramming

                          --- In mill_drill@y..., "Dan Mauch" <dmauch@s...> wrote:
                          > I would recommend taking the column off the base. Drill and tap for
                          > holes for 3/8" jacking screws. Install the 4 jacking screws
                          into the
                          > column base flange leaving the jacking screws about 1/8 below the
                          > flange.  Use some Devcon Steel about ¼" thick place over the
                          base
                          > flange. Reinstall the column and reinstall the hold down bolts so
                          that
                          > the column is snug. Install your dial indicator and tram in the
                          spindle
                          > by tighten the bases bolts and loosening the jacking screws until
                          the
                          > power head is aligned properly.  Scrape off the excess Devcon . Let
                          the
                          > Devcon steel harden and you should have a perfect alignment and full
                          > support. The plastic steel has a compressive strength of 25000 PSI .
                          > Dan


                          > .
                          Thanks to all that responded to my tramming query.  I have not heard
                          of this Devcon material but it sounds like an intreguing solution. 
                          Where can I find this material?  I am in the Seattle area. 



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                        • Len
                          Guys if you don t want to swing you DI over the table slots, set your parallels across the slots and tram off those. They ll even show you how flat your table
                          Message 12 of 17 , May 6, 2006
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                            Guys if you don't want to swing you DI over the table slots, set your
                            parallels across the slots and tram off those.

                            They'll even show you how flat your table is.
                          • rgsparber@aol.com
                            I m not clear what the parallels are doing for you. If you have a perfectly smooth table, then the parallels bridge the T slots which is nice. But if you have
                            Message 13 of 17 , May 6, 2006
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                              I'm not clear what the parallels are doing for you. If you have a perfectly smooth table, then the parallels bridge the T slots which is nice. But if you have a chewed up table, then traming over parallels may give you a false reading.
                               
                              In the end, what matters is the position of the head with respect to the part being machined. If there is only one ding on the table but it is under a support for the part being cut, then this ding will throw off the cut.
                               
                              IMHO, start by removing all dings. Then use the DTI to see if any of your T slots have been over stressed. This will cause the slot openings to be 1 or 2 thou higher than the rest of the table. If you find that the table has peaks a few thou high, consider stoning or lapping. If that is not practical, at least know where the peaks are and avoid them.
                               
                              Rick Sparber
                              rgsparber@...
                              web site: http://rick.sparber.org
                            • Glenn N
                              ... From: Len To: Sent: Saturday, May 06, 2006 8:34 PM Subject: [mill_drill] Tramming ... I don t mind
                              Message 14 of 17 , May 6, 2006
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                                ----- Original Message -----
                                From: "Len" <qsimdo1@...>
                                To: <mill_drill@yahoogroups.com>
                                Sent: Saturday, May 06, 2006 8:34 PM
                                Subject: [mill_drill] Tramming


                                > Guys if you don't want to swing you DI over the table slots, set your
                                > parallels across the slots and tram off those.
                                >
                                > They'll even show you how flat your table is.
                                >

                                I don't mind swinging the DI over the slots at all. It's just hard to read
                                .. even on the slowest speed ;-)
                                Mostly I just wanted to do a simple project that would let me make chips for
                                an evening. I think I am having withdrawls.

                                Glenn
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